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Rearranging/Changing Animal Companion Skills in 3 Steps
GrumpyDuckling
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I would like to see the Warden's Animal Companion skill line 1) feel better to use, and 2) play more like the user actually has animal companions. I propose a mostly rearranged skill line that looks like the following:
Step 1 - Move the minor berserk passive to the bear ultimate. If you are going to force us to double-slot an ultimate, then at least give us a little more value there. The re-summoning morph, in particular, is pretty pathetic now that pets can't be killed.
Step 2 - Move the sustain from netch to falcon's swiftness. Tanks would love to have the utility of extra speed while maintaining the sustain that they currently get from netch (without the need to slot two skills).
Step 3 - Replace netch with a permanent wolf summon that provides Major Brutality/Major Sorcery for being slotted. This move makes the skill line feel more like the player actually has animal companions, and offers a stamina option for those who like using pets.
Edited by GrumpyDuckling on April 16, 2019 12:53PM Step 1 - Move the minor berserk passive to the bear ultimate. If you are going to force us to double-slot an ultimate, then at least give us a little more value there. The re-summoning morph, in particular, is pretty pathetic now that pets can't be killed.
Step 2 - Move the sustain from netch to falcon's swiftness. Tanks would love to have the utility of extra speed while maintaining the sustain that they currently get from netch (without the need to slot two skills).
Step 3 - Replace netch with a permanent wolf summon that provides Major Brutality/Major Sorcery for being slotted. This move makes the skill line feel more like the player actually has animal companions, and offers a stamina option for those who like using pets.
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FoxrunSoul ShrivenI would LOVE to have anything other then a netch following me around, especially if I could disable the green beam of obviousness.7 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't see how any of these changes actually helps magwarden's PvE performance. No thank you to all 3.3 -
Wuuffyy✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't see how any of these changes actually helps magwarden's PvE performance. No thank you to all 3.
Not just about you. I agree with OP!Wuuffyy,
WW/berserker playstyle advocate (I play ALL classes proficiently in PvP outside of WW as well)
ESO player since 2014 (Xbox and PC for PTS)
-DM for questions1 -
JadeCoin✭✭✭✭I like these ideas as well.
Netch is clunky and makes me feel like a child trailing a birthday balloon.
Swiftness needs a refresh + some added purpose since the expedition was nerfed.
I agree with the point about the bear re-summon, and I would certainly love some permanent companions other than the bear.3 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
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I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.2 -
Wuuffyy✭✭✭✭✭
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I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.Wuuffyy,
WW/berserker playstyle advocate (I play ALL classes proficiently in PvP outside of WW as well)
ESO player since 2014 (Xbox and PC for PTS)
-DM for questions2 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
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Literally none of the proposed changes improves gameplay in any way though. #1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. #2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road. #3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring.Wolf_Watching wrote: »
I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.
I'd much rather ZOS just offer an option to reskin the Warden pets because they're ugly af. But the changes OP is proposing are bad.4 -
JadeCoin✭✭✭✭I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
I've never quite understood why people conflate theme with roleplay. After all, there's a reason Templar abilities are yellow and Nightblade abilities are red. I don't roleplay, but I do find it satisfying for my characters to have an aesthetic and a feel that fits their class identity.
I personally don't know anyone who actually likes using the Netch, beyond the buff it gives them. Making a class more pleasurable and satisfying to play is a valid goal worth discussing. The style of the necromancer, for example, was a huge part of why people kept demanding it as a class: it sounded fun.
Now, it's possible that the changes the OP suggests would be too limiting or wouldn't work for other reasons. That's a separate issue.2 -
JadeCoin✭✭✭✭#1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. #2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road. #3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring.
These three are very good points.
Could you possibly clarify in what way Falcon's Swiftness would be overloaded? I have to say I'm quite disappointed in the ability since the nerf to expedition, although I still slot it. I'd love for something to happen that would make it interesting to use again. (Not sure what that would be.)Edited by JadeCoin on April 16, 2019 6:08PM0 -
ccmedaddy✭✭✭✭✭
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Did you check the PTS patch notes? With 6 seconds of major expedition Falcon's Swiftness is now one of the two abilities in the game that grant more than 4 seconds of the speed buff, not to mention the cost reduction. Bird of Prey is also the only ability in the game that passively grants minor berserk. It is already a great skill--giving it the netch treatment will put it over the top imo.#1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. #2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road. #3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring.
These three are very good points.
Could you possibly clarify in what way Falcon's Swiftness would be overloaded? I have to say I'm quite disappointed in the ability since the nerf to expedition, although I still slot it. I'd love for something to happen that would make it interesting to use again. (Not sure what that would be.)0 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
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Did you check the PTS patch notes? With 6 seconds of major expedition Falcon's Swiftness is now one of the two abilities in the game that grant more than 4 seconds of the speed buff, not to mention the cost reduction. Bird of Prey is also the only ability in the game that passively grants minor berserk. It is already a great skill--giving it the netch treatment will put it over the top imo.#1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. #2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road. #3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring.
These three are very good points.
Could you possibly clarify in what way Falcon's Swiftness would be overloaded? I have to say I'm quite disappointed in the ability since the nerf to expedition, although I still slot it. I'd love for something to happen that would make it interesting to use again. (Not sure what that would be.)
Giving Falcon's Swiftness the resource return from the netch coincides with the proposal to move minor berserk elsewhere, so that the skill would not be overloaded.1 -
Starlight_Knight✭✭✭✭✭
✭To address the visual concern.. Lets just have some actual animal companions that we can choose. we need pet skins, or the ability to tame pets from the wild to use.
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GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
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Literally none of the proposed changes improves gameplay in any way though. #1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. #2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road. #3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring.Wolf_Watching wrote: »
I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.
I'd much rather ZOS just offer an option to reskin the Warden pets because they're ugly af. But the changes OP is proposing are bad.
"#1 is simply a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear."
No it's not a nerf for all builds that don't use the bear. Does every tank and healer slot minor berserk? Maybe you just meant to say DPS, but it is clearly not "all builds" like you claim.
"#2 is a meaningless change that only makes Falcon's Swiftness an unnecessarily overloaded skill that ZOS will eventually nerf down the road."
No, it's not overloaded. Minor Berserk is removed, and sustain is added.
"#3 actually makes gameplay worse because permanent pets require double-barring."
I don't think another permanent pet makes gameplay "worse," but that is my opinion.1 -
JadeCoin✭✭✭✭Did you check the PTS patch notes?
Well, I can't say I'm ready to pass a test on them yet.With 6 seconds of major expedition Falcon's Swiftness is now one of the two abilities in the game that grant more than 4 seconds of the speed buff, not to mention the cost reduction. Bird of Prey is also the only ability in the game that passively grants minor berserk. It is already a great skill--giving it the netch treatment will put it over the top imo.
Good to know that the major expedition is one of the best choices out there, at least. Thank you for the clarification!
I suppose part of the disappointment for me personally is how many of the Warden's skills are simply buffs (hence more like passives) than active abilities. Expedition is one of the few buffs you actually feel or experience while playing. Other class abilities (the Nightblade's Spectral Bow, for instance, before the current PTS changes, or the DK's Flames of Oblivion) both buff and do something active. Again, not saying anything about combat effectiveness here. These points are just about the pleasure we might get playing a class, independent of its effectiveness.0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Wolf_Watching wrote: »
I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.
it's not just the nature class. it's the nature and ice class and we need more than even just 5 damage skills like OP is suggesting. Winter's Embrace is the place, i'm sorry.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 17, 2019 2:18PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Wolf_Watching wrote: »
I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.
it's not just the nature class. it's the nature and ice class and we need more than even just 5 damage skills like OP is suggesting. Winter's Embrace is the place, i'm sorry.
I would absolutely love to see more ice damage skills. I don't know if ZOS would be game to put it in the ice line because they seem intent on keeping it as a mostly tanky skill line.
Maybe we could meet halfway and have the wolf summon have an ice wolf that does ice damage for the magicka morph?0 -
zTrok✭✭✭This is either very poorly thought out, or very premium quality bait.
Either way, this would make no sense to want because it results in 3 nerfs to dps wardens and a singular "buff" to tanks, if you could even call it a buff.
Regardless, your rp should not be making balance changes.2 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭This is either very poorly thought out, or very premium quality bait.
Either way, this would make no sense to want because it results in 3 nerfs to dps wardens and a singular "buff" to tanks, if you could even call it a buff.
Regardless, your rp should not be making balance changes.
My post is the one that is very poorly thought out? You are telling me that it doesn't make sense to want what I want because (according to you) it would result in nerfs. Good one. I'm convinced.0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭GrumpyDuckling wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »Wolf_Watching wrote: »
I mean... who are these changes supposed to help other than the few who just want to have a wolf pet following them around for (I'm guessing) RP reasons?Wolf_Watching wrote: »
Also, a permanent wolf pet that will have to be double barred in the place of the netch? Yikes.
People who want the nature class to play like one. Gameplay not just aesthetics.
it's not just the nature class. it's the nature and ice class and we need more than even just 5 damage skills like OP is suggesting. Winter's Embrace is the place, i'm sorry.
I would absolutely love to see more ice damage skills. I don't know if ZOS would be game to put it in the ice line because they seem intent on keeping it as a mostly tanky skill line.
Maybe we could meet halfway and have the wolf summon have an ice wolf that does ice damage for the magicka morph?
Nope. It needs to be winter's embrace. There are so many underperforming morphs in it. When we need damage skills and a group buff. Frost is destruction magic. Frost for tanking only is an idea that doesn't work and they've broken the rule for the last 2 patches. Icy conjuror set, Glacial Collosus and Boneyard.PvE Frost Warden Main and teacher for ESO-U. Frost Warden PvE Build Article: https://eso-u.com/articles/nightingales_warden_dps_guide__frost_knight. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX0 -
AcadianPaladin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't really play my warden and the primary reason is that nearly all the skills (except the bear) look like neon cartoon silliness to me. The skill aesthetics really make the class unenjoyable to me.
Skill aesthetics are important to me and that is the same reason my magsorc won't use the purple monkey.PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo0 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If we have to double bar these...no thanks. (obviously bear is double barred but it's terrible in PvP)Edited by DisgracefulMind on April 18, 2019 12:24AMUnfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.0 -
all these ideas are to do pve i guess, and for pvp? 5 warden with 5 bear and 5 wolf?? serious??? ...
maybe you never used the warden ...0 -
Luckylancer✭✭✭✭✭Nust remove the squid. Wasp, pixie, falcon, wolf etc. Make is customisable and that would be fun.
New prey seems good. Netch is nice other than animations, bear can have a damage buff. That will force them to slot bear tho.0 -
RavenSworn✭✭✭✭✭Luckylancer wrote: »Nust remove the squid. Wasp, pixie, falcon, wolf etc. Make is customisable and that would be fun.
New prey seems good. Netch is nice other than animations, bear can have a damage buff. That will force them to slot bear tho.
True that but if pets don't die, and you have a morph that resummons... It's just makes that a moot morph isn't it? Taking minor berserk from falcon and putting it in the bear makes for a good compromise.
As for the Netch being a wolf, that's an excellent idea but the summon mechanics should stay, rather than it becoming a permanent pet.Ingame: RavenSworn, Pc / NA.
Of Wolf and Raven
Solo / Casual guild for beginners and new players wanting to join the game. Pst me for invite!0
