Buying Skyshards with crowns

RottingAlien · April 2019

Hello All!
So, most of you know by now that there will be something called "Skyshard Achievements for Alternate Characters", where if you unlock "a Skyshard Hunter" Achievement, you can unlock those skyshards in an alt character using the crown store. You can read about it in the patchnotes
I want to make it clear, that this is not a discussion on whether it is P2W or not. I'm not saying it is and I do not think it is.
But, being or not being P2W, i think everyone can agree that it is a hell of a shortcut.

Don't get me wrong. I have Eso+, I have crowns, I'm lucky I can click and simply buy stuff. But the fact that people can only get these with crowns worries me about the future of ESO. Not the future of the crown store, but the future of ESO's health and community.
It worries me that this will open doors to more crown bought achievements or "shortcuts".
And most of all, It worries me that it will start to scare people off.

I would say ESO is at its prime right now. Lots of people coming in from other game(s), lots of content, new class coming up. All is great. And I'm really happy that ESO is finally getting the attention it deserves.
But this crown thing might just be what will turn people away. And I don't like the sound of it.
The problem is not this isolated SkyShard thing but if it will start happening with other stuff too.
I would suggest and would like to know how everyone would feel about this, that you'd have something like the Shrine of Srendarr or Shrine of Stuhn but for SkyShards. Where you could unlock skyshards by using the Shrine (or something else) and you would still have the Crown Store option. This would be much more like how ESO does things. This would give everyone a most equal chance to get those skill points. I've always praised ESO on how they treat their paid stuff, but this time... Well this time doesn't really sound like ESO.

TLDR; Being able to buy skyshards with crowns only, can open the precedent to future bought "shortcuts". If this is to be implemented, at least players should be able to buy the skyshards with Gold also. Like when using the shrine of Srendarr or Stuhn.

What are your thoughts on this?

After 4 years, It's the first time I really feel the need to start a discussion on the forums. So this has had some thought put into it. It is something that really worries me as a fan of ESO. I want it to be healthy for many more years to come.

Sorry if formatting could be better.

Happy Adventuring!

EDIT: Typos and added a TLDR

Trueblue · April 2019

NO for skyshard for crown. This will be big P2W becaus "normal" player need to sped alot of time to get all skyshard and you buy then via cash.
They don't give ESO premium member faster login (queue same like ppl wichout ESO plus) so why give shard for cash.

Siohwenoeht · April 2019

Well... I hope that they're a dismal failure in the crown store. Zos is using skyshards as a test run for other things. If it's successful, then you can be prepared to find skill lines for sale at a later date.

I've been opposed to this from the start. I would have preferred a way point unlock after you find them, then you can take your alts straight for them if that's what you want. This kind of monetization is not good imo.

r34lian · April 2019

No this shouldve been free like champion points and not crowns store.

starkerealm · April 2019

RottingAlien wrote: »

And most of all, It worries me that it will start to scare people off.

Yeah, I realize I'm cherry picking out one line, but this a real concern.

Tandor · April 2019

I don't believe it to be P2W for a moment, but it is nonetheless a terrible step in the wrong direction for the game, and I fear for future extensions of it that will simply result in the game becoming another dumbed down clone for the instant gratification crowd rather than the outstanding MMORPG of its generation which is what has led to its present level of success.

Tryxus · April 2019

Trueblue wrote: »

NO for skyshard for crown. This will be big P2W becaus "normal" player need to sped alot of time to get all skyshard and you buy then via cash.
They don't give ESO premium member faster login (queue same like ppl wichout ESO plus) so why give shard for cash.

It's more Pay for Convenience than P2W: you're paying for Skyshards and skill points that every player has access to, even those that don't pay

Deathlord92 · April 2019

I don’t like it micro transactions is what pissing gamers off why do you think eso and final fantasy has so many wow refugees

RottingAlien · April 2019

Normalhazard wrote: »

All I hear is a bunch of broke pansies complaining about how they cant afford ***.

Well, that is not the issue here. And even if it was it would still be a valid point given ESO is B2P.

Normalhazard wrote: »

When idiots confuse QoL changes with a p2w model<

Quality of Life improvements should not be paid. Especially not when the only option to get those QoLs is by paying.

DLM · April 2019

This is a precedent that I don't like either. The feature is seriously needed but it should be available to purchase through the game, with gold.

Just for example, The Old Republic has (if that's still the case, I haven't played for years) what they call a Legacy system, where all characters are basically part of the same family and can share various perks. Some are automatically unlocked and free for all characters, like class buffs that can be shared to other classes, some are purchasable with the ingame money and unlocked for all characters or on a character basis (like mount speed), ranging from cheap to expansive costs.

This is the right way of doing it.

evivnada · April 2019

They should be account wide just like champion points. I have 14.. soon to be 16 characters. Yes I have one that has gotten every single one, but most of my alts have the all the zone ones cleared, but not delves/craglorn.
What if CP was on single characters and not account wide, and they announce it's going in the crown store yall would lose your minds... just make it all account wide and be done with it.

Tsar_Gekkou · April 2019

It's not pay-to-win because it doesn't unlock skills, gear, and weapons for you. My main problem is that it's not giftable, meaning the only way to get them without breaking the ToS is to pay with your own money. Obviously, if there are codes for crown packs that can be bought online, people will be trading gold for them, which I assume is agains ToS since they only allow you to trade gold for things bought in-game, but it's looking like the only valid option since I know i'm not paying a dime of real cash for what should be free like champion points.

Jhalin · April 2019

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

It's not pay-to-win because it doesn't unlock skills, gear, and weapons for you. My main problem is that it's not giftable, meaning the only way to get them without breaking the ToS is to pay with your own money. Obviously, if there are codes for crown packs that can be bought online, people will be trading gold for them, which I assume is agains ToS since they only allow you to trade gold for things bought in-game, but it's looking like the only valid option since I know i'm not paying a dime of real cash for what should be free like champion points.

If people buy these, it’s been stated on live stream that skill lines (and by extension, skills themselves) will be the next things to end up in the crown store

Lumenn · April 2019

Perhaps I'm just an old, cynical piece of....sugar, but the time to worry about the crown store items was before the crown store opened. I'm flabbergasted that it's been this good(meaning cosmetics and pay for convenience) this long. It's a quick grab scheme that, despite many gamers hating it, WORKS. Bad for the long haul, awesome for quarterly investments.

Even if the people running it were saints and will only implement cosmetics etc it doesn't mean their bosses are. Maybe quarterly profits aren't going to meet plan, maybe an unforseen expense(maybe "new" servers. Maybe someone wants a new boat. Could be anything). I certainly don't see where they can cut payroll. But they will bend (and eventually break)the balance just far enough to encourage buying more crowns as they see fit. I don't see buying shards any different than crafting or horse training scrolls, it's pay for convenience. But the days of "worrying about the direction" the crown store goes was gone when they introduced it to begin with.

max_only · April 2019

This is the monkeys paw that console gets for asking and wishing so hard for just this thing.

When you don’t have map pin addons and are already being nickeled and dimed by not only the game but also the platform, “a few tokens” to skip it the second, third, fourth etc time becomes a “no brainer”. I’m just surprised that it took Zos so long to come up with it.

As for your suggestion that it should be bought with gold. SIGH I don’t care at this point. All the skill points in the world can only make one a more twinked out under 50 pvper, it’s not going to transform a potato into bacon cheese fries.

FierceSam · April 2019

It’s a stalking horse for selling you fully specced characters. And the total commercialisation of in-game advancement and achievement. It encourages the development of hugely tedious quest lines like the Psijiic Order because players will pay for the privilege of bypassing it.

This implementation is clearly P2W for those who can’t be bothered to play.

If it was QoL, they’d implement it for everyone for in-game gold. Which would be a great idea.

Facefister · April 2019

A glimpse to the future monetizations of ESO.

NeillMcAttack · April 2019

On PS4 I collected every sky shard on my main. And about 6-7 zones worth for all of my Alts. Without add-ons this was a gruelling process. You were forever coming out of game, checking the position on the map, marking it in game, and continuing on, for every single shard.

I started a fresh account (fresh since beta at least) on Sunday night on PC, at which point I didn’t do anything except create a character and mess around. So since Monday night, with about 3-5 hours grinding each night (Note that I would have much more done if I wasn’t stopping to open chests and farm resources). I have already cleared 4 and a half zones of skyshards AND lore books.

I can honestly say, even with how much more efficient it has been on PC, if I wasn’t aware that I could forego this grind on alt toons later, I prob never would have started again.

The main concern I have now, is just how extortionate the cost of these skyshard zones is going to be. I’m guessing around 100 quid for all zones. No joke.

Tsar_Gekkou · April 2019

Jhalin wrote: »

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

It's not pay-to-win because it doesn't unlock skills, gear, and weapons for you. My main problem is that it's not giftable, meaning the only way to get them without breaking the ToS is to pay with your own money. Obviously, if there are codes for crown packs that can be bought online, people will be trading gold for them, which I assume is agains ToS since they only allow you to trade gold for things bought in-game, but it's looking like the only valid option since I know i'm not paying a dime of real cash for what should be free like champion points.

If people buy these, it’s been stated on live stream that skill lines (and by extension, skills themselves) will be the next things to end up in the crown store

I've been hearing people admit already that they'd buy mages guild and psijic skill lines immediately if that's the case. Psijic isn't even bad imo, but getting meteor and spell symetry is a pain.

ErMurazor · April 2019

I Love it. As a dad and full time worker i take any timesaver i can get so i have more time raiding when i actually can play

RottingAlien · April 2019

ErMurazor wrote: »

I Love it. As a dad and full time worker i take any timesaver i can get so i have more time raiding when i actually can play

@ErMurazor What do you love if you don't mind me asking? Is it the buying with crowns part or the suggestion of buying with gold? Do you actually agree with shortcuts paid with real money or are you talking about in-game currency?

sho_nuff · April 2019

I wouldn’t buy skill lines or skyshard. I also don’t think they should be account wide.

Personally, I think if you have found a lore book or a skyshard one character, then it should show up on the zone guide for other characters.

HanzeeBokeem · April 2019

This is an issue that will never be easily solved, impossible to keep everyone happy. The simplified version is that there are 2 types of gamer. Those with plenty of time but little money and those with little time but money. It's a difficult balancing act that no company has yet found an ideal solution for.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2019

It’s not P2W, it’s pay to be lazy.

So many don’t fully understand what P2W is.

DjMuscleboy02 · April 2019

I've always thought you should be able to purchased leveled characters through the crown store under the precedent that you already have leveled a character fully. Re-grinding a character anytime you want to try something is a nightmare, and is frankly one of the largest reason I don't play as much anymore.

Skyshards are a step in the right direction, imo. I hope they open this up to purchasing fully leveled character upgrades. If I don't want to level a character, that's my prerogative. This does not affect anyone else.

This is not P2W at all, skyshards don't affect anyone else. Start selling vMA weapons in the crown store and we'll have an issue.

Sheezabeast · April 2019

Sometimes I think I’m the only person left who likes the xp from discovering wayshrines....I’ve had lowbies level so many times while discovering shrines....it’s nice xp and makes your map feel complete, it’s satisfying....

TheValar85 · April 2019

It is a pay to win, becasue skyshards are actualy givign you benifits by so far if you all forgot, 3skyshards gives you one skill point, and this game is flodoed with them, so basicly buying out the skyshards for alt charcters from teh crownstore, Wich should be an acocunt wide thing once you have collected them all, it those points should be granted to every character on your account once its created, Now it is behind a pay wall. so teh Op is right its a pay to win. Becasue It does gives advatnages.

Kombinator · April 2019

Soul19reaper wrote: »

No this shouldve been free like champion points and not crowns store.

Of course.

Everything should be free.

You should be able to import your character level, and completed quests upon creating new character. Also you should gain a copy of all non-tradeable gear between characters. Also any non-class skills should be learned in an instant on appropiate levels.

We should also be able to have every non-cosmetic items for free. Such as xp scrolls, and potions/food.

Even the game should be entirely free. The servers run on magic anyway, and that's free.

It's a step toward the pay to win, but not a big one. Most of us won't even notice the difference.

Also you still need to level up the skills themselves.

TheValar85 · April 2019

Kombinator wrote: »

Soul19reaper wrote: »

No this shouldve been free like champion points and not crowns store.

Of course.

Everything should be free.

You should be able to import your character level, and completed quests upon creating new character. Also you should gain a copy of all non-tradeable gear between characters. Also any non-class skills should be learned in an instant on appropiate levels.

We should also be able to have every non-cosmetic items for free. Such as xp scrolls, and potions/food.

Even the game should be entirely free. The servers run on magic anyway, and that's free.

It's a step toward the pay to win, but not a big one. Most of us won't even notice the difference.

Also you still need to level up the skills themselves.

Thats a bad joke and sarcasm, he clearly have a point on the skyshard matter. and actualy we can clearly say the whole community would agree on that, becasue it is not alt friendly at all, and putting behind a pay wall is just well tor right

Same goes with mount speed stamina, and inventory space btw. That should be accoutnwide as well considering the game in some point are nothign more then a hrose ridign simulator for expample: Cyrodiil.

RottingAlien · April 2019

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Sometimes I think I’m the only person left who likes the xp from discovering wayshrines....I’ve had lowbies level so many times while discovering shrines....it’s nice xp and makes your map feel complete, it’s satisfying....

Agree 100%

DjMuscleboy02 wrote: »

I hope they open this up to purchasing fully leveled character upgrades. If I don't want to level a character, that's my prerogative. This does not affect anyone else.

This is not P2W at all, skyshards don't affect anyone else. Start selling vMA weapons in the crown store and we'll have an issue.

Oh god please no.
And yes, it might affect someone else if we're talking pvp.

Myrkgrav · April 2019

Oh good another thread about this.