The hypocrisy of the forums...(dk wings)

Ayastigi · April 2019

So many people saying it's a buff to 1vx lmaooo those people do not 1vx. It's a definite nerf and i'm not asking to revert the proposed changes it's just funny how everybody we stomped with wings is so behind the nerf. Sorcs are the biggest crybabies on the forums. We all remember murkmire and how you all spammed the forums with 100's (not an exaggeration) of threads qq'ing about shield changes and most of us actually backed your complaints. Now sorcs are top dog in pvp and every time somebody brings this up you guys bring up the "nerf sorc" meme to discredit and deter the conversation. Mag nb's are still upset about the healing ward nerf that gutted the class but we need to be honest and say that it was the healing ward change that was responsible for mag nb losing a lot of viability and not forget that mag nb were a top dueling class for a long time because of that burst heal from ward. Basically, the point is that everybody is coming for dks which is fine but be honest about other classes too.

Kikke · April 2019

Adapt.

BreakingBats · April 2019

Well I 1vX, and the three things annoying me in cyrodiil right now are DK wing spammers, Sorc pet builds and bleed builds.

Now I'm not calling for any nerfs...just saying I wouldn't be mad if they were. 😏

Onefrkncrzypope · April 2019

I main a dk. It will be useful but still think just another resistance buff makes for the true identity of the dk. Boring. Also this is just a whine thread if you don't bring anything to the table.

Skwor · April 2019

And again having mained a Templar since beta I just can't see why this change is causing such a big deal.

I have a max DK and this is no where near a nerf many are trying to make it out as

Tan9oSuccka · April 2019

I don’t know why they continually mess with DKs.

Snipe scrubs, Mag NBs and Sorc superstars will rejoice if wings get clipped.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2019

Kikke wrote: »

Adapt.

Meanwhile.......

Kikke: Snipe, snipe, snipe, poison injection, snipe, snipe, snipe......

Ayastigi · April 2019

BreakingBats wrote: »

Well I 1vX, and the three things annoying me in cyrodiil right now are DK wing spammers, Sorc pet builds and bleed builds.

Now I'm not calling for any nerfs...just saying I wouldn't be mad if they were. 😏

Everybody has class defensive skills though. Dk has wings, nightblade has cloak, sorcs have a ward, wardens have shimmering and templars have a purge. They can all be annoying but they all have a place in the game. Pet builds can be irritating but they offer a nice challenge and bleed builds don't bother me as much but mag classes could probably benefit from irresistible mag damage too(not oblivion but something separate). The thing is we all see op things in the game but I like the challenge and am pretty much against the nerf hammer. Example, everybody knows harness magicka from the light armor skill line is OP and has been for awhile due to the protection and sustain it offers but that skill makes so many builds possible and the game would be worse off if they ever changed it. This post is just me being annoyed with all the hypocrites lol.

cheifsoap · April 2019

If they keep nerfing DKs I may just shelf mine and go dps or healer. Good luck queuing for your randoms without another tank - oh wait, crap DPS is queuing as tank nvm!

GrumpyDuckling · April 2019

It is kinda ridiculous that a skill exists that completely reflects light attacks from staves and bows. This game very much encourages light attack weaves, and the current version of wings 100% discourages that. At least the shield skill only does it once on magicka attacks, and the other is an ultimate.

jaws343 · April 2019

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Kikke wrote: »

Adapt.

Meanwhile.......

Kikke: Snipe, snipe, snipe, poison injection, snipe, snipe, snipe......

I love how all of the people complaining about this also failed to read that Snipe is getting nerfed. Not to mention, there are a ton of other balance changes that are most likely coming alongside these two skills being changed. It's not that hard to wait until Monday to see what is actually happening before having an aneurysm.

MaxwellC · April 2019

Issue with DK wing change is the following.

Nearly destroys closing the gap as damage will hit you hard before you make it to them.
Poisons will now be stacked on you from a distance
DoTs will do 100% of the damage and stack on you from a distance
Any ranged slowing abilities will now drag you down further reducing your combative prowess
DKs are close ranged combative classes.

Seriously I'm pretty fair when it comes to balance and people can check my threads for proposed changes for DKs, heck I've got one in my head right now that'll finally benefit Stam DKs while also giving Mag DKs a little bump but not too much. The problem with ZOS is it balances around CP/Armor rather than the class themselves and also it listens to some vocal minority who complains about everything in mob force.

Kagukan · April 2019

One of the few nerfs I actually agree with. Wings are a little ridiculous right now.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2019

MaxwellC wrote: »

Issue with DK wing change is the following.

Nearly destroys closing the gap as damage will hit you hard before you make it to them.
Poisons will now be stacked on you from a distance
DoTs will do 100% of the damage and stack on you from a distance
Any ranged slowing abilities will now drag you down further reducing your combative prowess
DKs are close ranged combative classes.

Seriously I'm pretty fair when it comes to balance and people can check my threads for proposed changes for DKs, heck I've got one in my head right now that'll finally benefit Stam DKs while also giving Mag DKs a little bump but not too much. The problem with ZOS is it balances around CP/Armor rather than the class themselves and also it listens to some vocal minority who complains about everything in mob force.

Thing is, you don’t like a counter to your combo. You still have a window to do it, but you’ll have to adjust.

Most NBs will lead off with Poison injection, into gap to fear/incap.

I’d like people here to actually run a DK before passing any kind of advice.

Sanguinor2 · April 2019

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

It is kinda ridiculous that a skill exists that completely reflects light attacks from staves and bows. This game very much encourages light attack weaves, and the current version of wings 100% discourages that. At least the shield skill only does it once on magicka attacks, and the other is an ultimate.

Depending on the Situation wings actually encourage weaving to make them drop faster so that the dk either has to recast quicker or he might miss one recast and is fully vulnerable to stronger projectiles.
Ofc if you are a melee stamblade with an ice staff you might not want to weave or if you are a pure ranged build which only has reflectable light attacks and absolutely Nothing else that can be reflected.
If you are a templar that runs total dark wings actually encourage you to weave to use the dks defense against him as much as you can before he cc breaks.
So weaving not being encouraged depends on the Situation you find yourself in, your build, class etc., if you know wings is bugged and want to abuse said bug and other factors.

This also adds a dynamic component to pvp Encounters, so you are not encouraged to Always use the exact same strategy regardless of Opponent, just like absorb magic might encourage you to try avoiding throwing a projectile or light attack at it so your target does not get healed.

SoLooney · April 2019

Everyone whined when sorcs were nerfed because of the shield nerfs

We all complain about nerfs whether it affects pvp or pve and still play

Adapt or play another class

Kikke · April 2019

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Kikke wrote: »

Adapt.

Meanwhile.......

Kikke: Snipe, snipe, snipe, poison injection, snipe, snipe, snipe......

I'm a magsorc? since when did we use bows... Something I've missed?

joseayalac · April 2019

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

It is kinda ridiculous that a skill exists that completely reflects light attacks from staves and bows. This game very much encourages light attack weaves, and the current version of wings 100% discourages that. At least the shield skill only does it once on magicka attacks, and the other is an ultimate.

Yeah weaving is a big part of dealing damage, but it shouldn't be made mindlessly, you should be able to stop weaving when facing this kind of opponent.

Weaving is not fun if you just do it mindlessly.

GrumpyDuckling · April 2019

joseayalac wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

It is kinda ridiculous that a skill exists that completely reflects light attacks from staves and bows. This game very much encourages light attack weaves, and the current version of wings 100% discourages that. At least the shield skill only does it once on magicka attacks, and the other is an ultimate.

Yeah weaving is a big part of dealing damage, but it shouldn't be made mindlessly, you should be able to stop weaving when facing this kind of opponent.

Weaving is not fun if you just do it mindlessly.

Weaving is not fun at all.

frostz417 · April 2019

DK’s are upset they won’t be able to completely shut down entire playstyles now.
No ability in the entire game shuts down playstyles like wings does. GL if you’re a magblade, magsorc, or magden because as soon as a dk flaps its wings you’re most likely to lose. Especially if the dk can keep their wings up.
Dk’s are honestly the most annoying class to 1vx against.
Heaven forbid you’re playing solo on a magblade Magsorc or magden and 3 wing spammers fight you. Might as well sheathe your weapons.
No other ability can shut down an entire playstyle like wings can.
And before someone cries about snipe. As much as I despise snipe, it’s being nerfed so rejoice.

StormeReigns · April 2019

Never really understood the hate against wings or the overwhelming lust behind it.
Honestly, when i first started way back on my magsorc took a few frags to understand it was a reflective ability, switched to using Inevitable Detonation and Haunting curse. Majority of the time, the dk will always flee back to thier group and blow up, get a few angry whispers about cheating and repeat.

The change doesn't really matter to me, doesn't change my play style.

Joy_Division · April 2019

Kikke wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Kikke wrote: »

Adapt.

Meanwhile.......

Kikke: Snipe, snipe, snipe, poison injection, snipe, snipe, snipe......

I'm a magsorc? since when did we use bows... Something I've missed?

You're just kicking dirt in people's face.

Juhasow · April 2019

Ayastigi wrote: »

BreakingBats wrote: »

Well I 1vX, and the three things annoying me in cyrodiil right now are DK wing spammers, Sorc pet builds and bleed builds.

Now I'm not calling for any nerfs...just saying I wouldn't be mad if they were. 😏

Everybody has class defensive skills though. Dk has wings, nightblade has cloak, sorcs have a ward, wardens have shimmering and templars have a purge. They can all be annoying but they all have a place in the game. Pet builds can be irritating but they offer a nice challenge and bleed builds don't bother me as much but mag classes could probably benefit from irresistible mag damage too(not oblivion but something separate). The thing is we all see op things in the game but I like the challenge and am pretty much against the nerf hammer. Example, everybody knows harness magicka from the light armor skill line is OP and has been for awhile due to the protection and sustain it offers but that skill makes so many builds possible and the game would be worse off if they ever changed it. This post is just me being annoyed with all the hypocrites lol.

That doesnt mean every "defining" skill is ok the way it is. There was actually lot of changes to class defining skills during the existance of the game. Literally every class defining skill You've mentioned above had something already changed. Fact that some skill is defining doesnt mean it cannot be touched and even if it's touched it can still have that thing that defines the class.

mcagatayg · April 2019

It shows crying works, keep crying maybe they will revert it.

Kikke · April 2019

Joy_Division wrote: »

Kikke wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Kikke wrote: »

Adapt.

Meanwhile.......

Kikke: Snipe, snipe, snipe, poison injection, snipe, snipe, snipe......

I'm a magsorc? since when did we use bows... Something I've missed?

You're just kicking dirt in people's face.

What did the DK community say when every patch nerfed sorcs? I guess the word was "adapt". So we did.

Now, it's your turn

Blinkin8r · April 2019

Tbh I agree that sorcs have to be some of the biggest whiners on the forums, but the potential changes to wings don't even compare to a 1 second cast time on shields.

EdoKeledus · April 2019

I know english is not the native language for everyone like it's the case for myself, but take the time to read before posting like a bot seriously, the OP is not against the change but puts forward something else according to its topic title.

As regards to the topic I do understand the OP since my main is Magdk for PvP, like him/her I'm not against the idea to adapt if the change becomes real, but it's still funny to see these same people unable to adapt and defeatist, about their class (remember the craft class magsorc) during Murkmire give arrangement lesson for Dks.

For us Dks, we just have to wait for the PTS and incremental patch, a lot of thing can change until the final day, meanwhile let kill some bowtard and destructive touch lover.

Sanguinor2 · April 2019

frostz417 wrote: »

DK’s are upset they won’t be able to completely shut down entire playstyles now.
No ability in the entire game shuts down playstyles like wings does. GL if you’re a magblade, magsorc, or magden because as soon as a dk flaps its wings you’re most likely to lose. Especially if the dk can keep their wings up.

Only one that this is fully true for is magblade, magsorcs and magdens have Options that work against wings that can do enough pressure to force a dk on the defensive or in case of sorc can use a burst Combo to burst a dk (obviously depends on how tanky said dk is) unlike magblade with only force pulse/concealed or aoe dots.
Shimmer also does the same in Terms of survivability but is better sustainable.

frostz417 wrote: »

Dk’s are honestly the most annoying class to 1vx against.

Entirely subjective.

frostz417 wrote: »

Heaven forbid you’re playing solo on a magblade Magsorc or magden and 3 wing spammers fight you. Might as well sheathe your weapons.

Can replace your sentence with literally anything else and it is still true,
3 reactive, earthgore, heavy armor magplars? GL HF
3 Stamdens that all use shimmer, stack vigors and rotate trees/Permafrost? GL HF
3 Magsorcs that Shield use matriarch, hide inside pets to become nearly untargetable and rotate restos? GL HF
3 Nightblades that cloak and heal to full whenever you could land a burst and can rotate healing ultimates, stack vigor, Refreshing path and whatnot? GL HF
3 magdens that use shimmer, heal each other and rotate trees/Permafrost? GL HF
You get the idea.
Edit: One could almost come to the conclusion that People that account for survivability and know how to defend themselves and others on their current build and class are more difficult to 1vX than your average bow light attack spam potato.

frostz417 wrote: »

No other ability can shut down an entire playstyle like wings can.
And before someone cries about snipe. As much as I despise snipe, it’s being nerfed so rejoice.

Cloak and shimmer can shut down ranged builds really well too, especially if you consider that both work against more ranged abilities and one allows you to even ignore dots that might have hit you.

Onefrkncrzypope · April 2019

frostz417 wrote: »

DK’s are upset they won’t be able to completely shut down entire playstyles now.
No ability in the entire game shuts down playstyles like wings does. GL if you’re a magblade, magsorc, or magden because as soon as a dk flaps its wings you’re most likely to lose. Especially if the dk can keep their wings up.
Dk’s are honestly the most annoying class to 1vx against.
Heaven forbid you’re playing solo on a magblade Magsorc or magden and 3 wing spammers fight you. Might as well sheathe your weapons.
No other ability can shut down an entire playstyle like wings can.
And before someone cries about snipe. As much as I despise snipe, it’s being nerfed so rejoice.

I mean back before they started adding things to the list of non reflecting, ye ability to reflect meteor and impower it was op. But since then the list got long.

A dk has to play mini games to even sustain, has no execute, no disengagement tactics but yeah it's a hassle to slot a skill that doesn't reflect. If there is a skill that locks you out of using skills, idk maybe should change your build to idk adapt?

Just saying, that instead of wings sword and bored ulti spam will be the next thing to lock out your build. There is also sets and weapon skills, I mean seriously it's not the only reflect in game. Your nightblade will still be "shut out" so yeah maybe wings isn't the problem.

Rake · April 2019

BreakingBats wrote: »

Well I Xv1, and the three things annoying me in cyrodiil right now are DK wing spammers, Sorc pet builds and bleed builds.

Now I'm not calling for any nerfs...just saying I wouldn't be mad if they were. 😏

FTFY

Undefwun · April 2019

Remember all those sorcs that cried shield changes will be the end of the class.. and that they are totally useless.... all they were gonna be good for is being mules etc etc etc.. all those oceans of salty tears...

Well... while all those loud mouths were tearing all over their keyboards making rage and quit posts... some ppl went to work... figured it out... and voila.. shield stackers are stronger than ever... and even worse that change has spawned a new breed of zoo sorcs... the most cowardly of all play styles... (you know it.. don't even try)

The wings things is one change...one of many many changes coming, which we know nothing about. No real in depth testing has been done by the player base yet. I have a stamDK too... i love watching ppl suicide on the wings.. so I don't know how I feel about this change yet.

Lets see what the changes are on a whole...