Ouch magblade sap tanking 2019

Fellwitch · April 2019

Dusted off my magblade for a round of tanking.. ouch! Sap Essence is really bad now. The amount healed is quite negligible. Yeah in a giant pack it is okay but with 1-2 mobs it's not even worth casting it due to the cost.

Has anyone had some success with this in 2019? Thank you

For instance with my warden tank I can put some CP into the +healing done and received areas, cast living trellis or vines, and I am getting 2k back every second for only a small amount of mana invested. I guess the trade-off is the horrible targeting.

Iskiab · April 2019

I just posted this in another thread asking, I’ll repost here:

‘I NB heal and have done all the vet dungeons, blah blah blah. Anyways, I noticed while healing dungeons on trash I like to sap essence spam, but the agro I get is ridiculous. It’s so bad I typically wear iceheart as my monster set and face tank all the trash mobs.

I’ve done some non-DLC vets with 3 dps too and ended up tanking the entire run without using taunt. It got me thinking, why not just use sword and board and ‘officially’ become a tank with wicked aggro with sap essence? No need for a taunt.

I’m relatively new to the game, and I’ve only been playing for 9 months but people mentioned sap essence was nerfed making this unplayable?

However, anyone tried a magblade build with 64 points in magicka, S&B plus... ice staff maybe, plague doctor and maybe light fortified brass and stay 5x light NB sap tank? 3x block reduction cost transmutations on jewellery? I don’t know if it’d be as effective with the required health buffing for tanking.

I’m also pretty noob about tanking in general so I’m not sure what difficulties I’d come across if I tried.’

Anyways, I was wondering about sap essence too. Unless there’s a lot of mobs the healing is decent, but the aggro is ridiculous. Why not just use it for aggro?

Rex-Umbra · April 2019

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

Iskiab · April 2019

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

For sure, I was thinking PvE. As nice as it is to have a typical tank who never needs healing, I’d actually prefer a tank in vets who could hold aoe aggro.

Narvuntien · April 2019

I am hoping that nerfing grim focus will allow them to buff the funnel health

idk · April 2019

I have not tried Sap tank since Morrowind. It used to be such a fun way to tank. I could handle managing my resources fine after morrowing, it just was not as fun.

Iskiab · April 2019

Maybe I’ll give it a spin with 5x light and load up on block reduction. Idk if it’s possible to tank with perma blocking where synergies only give magicka.

Taunt if necessary, hold block, spam magicka abilities with magicka recovery. If absolutely required switch to ice so blocking uses magicka instead.

Non-DLC vets are easy enough, you can do them without a tank and just a healer, so as long as the fundamentals are okay for resource management I’ll be happy. Try a DLC vet once I’ve worked out some kinks, and never do trials with it. The appeal would be aggro and healing, not mitigation, so it’d be useless for trials.

For those who tank what do you think?

Stx · April 2019

You can definitely build a tank with good block cost reduction and high spell power/magicka. You just wont be able to use the meta group support armor sets but that's okay for dungeons.

Ice staff back bar would definitely be a good idea.

Iskiab · April 2019

Stx wrote: »

You can definitely build a tank with good block cost reduction and high spell power/magicka. You just wont be able to use the meta group support armor sets but that's okay for dungeons.

Ice staff back bar would definitely be a good idea.

Any tips you could give me? I like making builds in general because it helps me learn about mechanics, but I'm too noob about tanking to know what I'll need or not. Messing around just to get an idea of what I'd need I came up with this:

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=132662

Didn't even spend my CPs because I wasn't sure where to put them.

_Salty_ · April 2019

They have systematicly killed this class with every update. I've played one since console launch its dead dead dead in PvP. And a shred of its former self.

Iskiab · April 2019

_Salty_ wrote: »

They have systematicly killed this class with every update. I've played one since console launch its dead dead dead in PvP. And a shred of its former self.

You sound salty.

imredneckson · April 2019

Use to love playing a Sap Tank. I miss it :'(

FleetwoodSmack · April 2019

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

Sap tanking by itself? It's pretty unviable in PvP. But if you're a Sap Tank-Healer? Doors open everywhere. You're the distraction again. You get hatetells, you get aggro. You get called out and focused in guild groups. I will say it's no where near as trolly as some of the other Tank-Troll playstyles out there, but there's some wiggle room if you know what you're doing and what fits your way of playing.

Iskiab · April 2019

FleetwoodSmack wrote: »

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

Sap tanking by itself? It's pretty unviable in PvP. But if you're a Sap Tank-Healer? Doors open everywhere. You're the distraction again. You get hatetells, you get aggro. You get called out and focused in guild groups. I will say it's no where near as trolly as some of the other Tank-Troll playstyles out there, but there's some wiggle room if you know what you're doing and what fits your way of playing.

Is the tank-healer playstyle using dark cloak or shadowy disguise?

MagNB pvp healing is good but IDK about the damage, I was considering a tanky brawler type using short range rather than melee abilities, but always get stumped when I look at the stamina side. Stamina is definitely required for break free and dodge rolling, the closer your playstyle to the enemy the more you need.

russelmmendoza · April 2019

Wtf, sap essence gets aggro?

So I can use nb as tank now, what would be good cc for nb, like dk got talons.

FleetwoodSmack · April 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

FleetwoodSmack wrote: »

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

Sap tanking by itself? It's pretty unviable in PvP. But if you're a Sap Tank-Healer? Doors open everywhere. You're the distraction again. You get hatetells, you get aggro. You get called out and focused in guild groups. I will say it's no where near as trolly as some of the other Tank-Troll playstyles out there, but there's some wiggle room if you know what you're doing and what fits your way of playing.

Is the tank-healer playstyle using dark cloak or shadowy disguise?

MagNB pvp healing is good but IDK about the damage, I was considering a tanky brawler type using short range rather than melee abilities, but always get stumped when I look at the stamina side. Stamina is definitely required for break free and dodge rolling, the closer your playstyle to the enemy the more you need.

I run Dark Cloak indeed. It helps if you're stuck in the middle of something and can't get out! But the build doesn't do too much damage unless they're at an executable level (I run Impale to help get people down). If I need to stealth, I'll pop an Essence of Immovability (with invisibility) to get out of potentially bad situations.

I double-bar restos, which sweeten the pot a little and people are all like "Oh it doesn't work", but I based a lot of my build from Goodness Sake's original restoration nightblade build (though they didn't mention any kind of build, just based it on what I seen).

If I find the video, I'll throw it in a message so it doesn't get lost in ninja-edits. The main thing is, the damage lower than what you'd expect, but I pretty much endure through a lot of those long PvP keep fights. In BGs, Capture the Relic is often pretty fun being that if you're protecting the relic you can keep them off the relic and bash where necessary.

As far as Stamina goes, Argonian with the potion passive helps, but if you're not an Argonian, I'd say throw some CPs into Break Free reduction, Dodge Roll reduction, and some Stamina Regen. You might also use things like tri-pots or something with Immovable, Health, and Stamina. You definitely have to fiddle with it for sure though.

FleetwoodSmack · April 2019

russelmmendoza wrote: »

Wtf, sap essence gets aggro?

So I can use nb as tank now, what would be good cc for nb, like dk got talons.

It doesn't get aggro like taunt, but generally speaking it tends to pull things toward you. Some people will use Blockade of Ice for CCs in PvE (though I personally never tried it so I can't say), but PvP I don't have a real need for CCs unless it's single target, a quick pick me up along with stun (Soul Tether), or to get people off my back (fear).

NightAngel690 · April 2019

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

I can second this. Rex is a very credible source and is helpful highly knowledgeable about saptanks. If you look at his channel,I’m pretty sure all of his videos are about pvp saptank.

Iskiab wrote: »

FleetwoodSmack wrote: »

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Sap tank play style is not viable in pvp atm.

Sap tanking by itself? It's pretty unviable in PvP. But if you're a Sap Tank-Healer? Doors open everywhere. You're the distraction again. You get hatetells, you get aggro. You get called out and focused in guild groups. I will say it's no where near as trolly as some of the other Tank-Troll playstyles out there, but there's some wiggle room if you know what you're doing and what fits your way of playing.

Is the tank-healer playstyle using dark cloak or shadowy disguise?

MagNB pvp healing is good but IDK about the damage, I was considering a tanky brawler type using short range rather than melee abilities, but always get stumped when I look at the stamina side. Stamina is definitely required for break free and dodge rolling, the closer your playstyle to the enemy the more you need.

dark cloak if you’re not a vamp or want to run snb. Shadowy disguise if you are. Just cloak and spam your heals. and refreshing path are your main heals. I get like 3k tics on my refreshing path but vigor out heals them both. I just use it for the major resolve and ward. You can honestly get away with running 64 points into magic. You’re main source of stam recovery comes from a heavy attack here and there.

Iskiab · April 2019

russelmmendoza wrote: »

Wtf, sap essence gets aggro?

So I can use nb as tank now, what would be good cc for nb, like dk got talons.

I don’t know if it’s intended or not, but when I NB heal I spam it on trash and notice I end up tanking most of the mobs. It’s so bad I always run iceheart for my pve monster set. When I did the skoria vet dungeon (can’t recall the name) with 3 dps I basicly tanked most of it unintentionally, so I thought to myself why not use it on a tank build?

HEBREWHAMMERRR · April 2019

The nerf to siphoning coupled with some cost increases on skills and the loss of minor vitality really hurt the capabilities of a “sap tank”. Your best bet is just traditional tanking but the rework of mirage really hurt this as well. I used to love ulti regen tank builds with heavy tavas and that set is useless as a football bat.

Iskiab · April 2019

HEBREWHAMMERRR wrote: »

The nerf to siphoning coupled with some cost increases on skills and the loss of minor vitality really hurt the capabilities of a “sap tank”. Your best bet is just traditional tanking but the rework of mirage really hurt this as well. I used to love ulti regen tank builds with heavy tavas and that set is useless as a football bat.

Yea, I went a different direction with it in my link. Any tips you can give me to try it? I’m paranoid about trying it in case it sucks.

Basicly block reduction as high as possible, only monster and drain stam enchant to sustain the blocking. Higher magicka recovery to spam magicka attacks. Harness magicka if I feel the magicka recovery isn’t enough to spam abilities. Ice so if I do run out of stamina I can block using magicka instead and wait for my monster to proc or drain stamina weapon procs..

Completely different from traditional tanking and I don’t have a lot of tanking experience. Intent is to rip through vets.

RavenSworn · April 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

I just posted this in another thread asking, I’ll repost here:

‘I NB heal and have done all the vet dungeons, blah blah blah. Anyways, I noticed while healing dungeons on trash I like to sap essence spam, but the agro I get is ridiculous. It’s so bad I typically wear iceheart as my monster set and face tank all the trash mobs.

I’ve done some non-DLC vets with 3 dps too and ended up tanking the entire run without using taunt. It got me thinking, why not just use sword and board and ‘officially’ become a tank with wicked aggro with sap essence? No need for a taunt.

I’m relatively new to the game, and I’ve only been playing for 9 months but people mentioned sap essence was nerfed making this unplayable?

However, anyone tried a magblade build with 64 points in magicka, S&B plus... ice staff maybe, plague doctor and maybe light fortified brass and stay 5x light NB sap tank? 3x block reduction cost transmutations on jewellery? I don’t know if it’d be as effective with the required health buffing for tanking.

I’m also pretty noob about tanking in general so I’m not sure what difficulties I’d come across if I tried.’

Anyways, I was wondering about sap essence too. Unless there’s a lot of mobs the healing is decent, but the aggro is ridiculous. Why not just use it for aggro?

It is possible, as long as you get your resistance right. The problem comes with the fact that in almost all aspects, the frost staff is not as good as the sword and board in terms of pure tanking. It is getting better though but still not as good as the snb.

Fellwitch · April 2019

Speaking of refreshing path and sap essence, I tried those lately and tried to boost them as much as possible - for example, going from 20k magicka to 40k, increasing spellpower, etc.

I could not get the tool-tip to go over 3.5k damage. Maybe someone else has better luck? I was also thinking of downloading a combat logging program because it feels like the crit % is much less than a normal attack. I have 40% in my LA fortified brass with the mage guild spell.

All of this is still on my NB magicka tank, with around 415 CP.

DHale · April 2019

Sap tanking is not a thing anymore.... move on. It is still great for leveling via trash mobs though.

Iskiab · April 2019

Fellwitch wrote: »

Speaking of refreshing path and sap essence, I tried those lately and tried to boost them as much as possible - for example, going from 20k magicka to 40k, increasing spellpower, etc.

I could not get the tool-tip to go over 3.5k damage. Maybe someone else has better luck? I was also thinking of downloading a combat logging program because it feels like the crit % is much less than a normal attack. I have 40% in my LA fortified brass with the mage guild spell.

All of this is still on my NB magicka tank, with around 415 CP.

Usually you get more bang for your buck mixing sp and magicka. Sp is the best if you use sp pots for major sorcery, if not magicka is better with a Siphoning ability and inner light. I’m not sure how to balance it as a tank, you’ll want magicka recovery glyphs and resistances for tanking. If you’re using sap essence it’ll give you major sorc so sp will be the way to go.

Magicka dps builds typically only use 4 ability slots plus inner light for the buff, cast time psijiic ability for minor force on your back bar.

I’m also not sure how Sap functions. I can’t recall. If it’s purely based on damage done then pen should help to put you at the cap. Otherwise I’d look into +healing modifiers for refreshing path. The way it works is if you boost one really high; magicka or sp vs healing modifiers, then you get a bigger bang from boosting the other. The +healing ritual is really strong with high sp/magicka pools, might want to look there.

Never noticed the crit difference, but didn’t pay attention too.

SoLooney · April 2019

People still try to sap tank after morrowind, sounds like a rough life