Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
With a new class on the horizon, let's check how wardens are doing (spoiler alert: not well)
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Karmanorway✭✭✭✭✭
✭#Buff wardens for pve
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#Nerf wardens in BGs , Making my game 70pct slower, spin2win me to death , oh and being immortal in their pool of earthgore0 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Karmanorway wrote: »#Buff wardens for pve
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#Nerf wardens in BGs , Making my game 70pct slower, spin2win me to death , oh and being immortal in their pool of earthgore
That should be the goal. I'm really not sure why ZOS is struggling so much with this.1 -
Emmagoldman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp0 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Emmagoldman wrote: »Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp
A class should be good in PvE and PvP. Warden is only good in PvP.Edited by MLGProPlayer on March 30, 2019 7:07PM0 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Emmagoldman wrote: »Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp
A class should be good in PvE and PvP. Warden is only good in PvP.
Again, I disagree. It appears they are not quite up to the leaderboard, but that does NOT make them unfit for PvE.1 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bouldercleave wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Emmagoldman wrote: »Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp
A class should be good in PvE and PvP. Warden is only good in PvP.
Again, I disagree. It appears they are not quite up to the leaderboard, but that does NOT make them unfit for PvE.
Leader board underrepresentation means they need PvE buffs. If you balance around the lowest common denominator, every class would be fine and there would be no need for balance adjustments. That's why we balance around endgame performance.Edited by MLGProPlayer on March 30, 2019 7:13PM0 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Emmagoldman wrote: »Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp
A class should be good in PvE and PvP. Warden is only good in PvP.
Again, I disagree. It appears they are not quite up to the leaderboard, but that does NOT make them unfit for PvE.
Leader board underrepresentation means they need PvE buffs. If you balance around the lowest common denominator, every class would be fine and there would be no need for balance adjustments. That's why we balance around endgame performance.
No it does not. Only a VERY small portion of the player base chase the leaderboard. I guarantee you that they have a much better metric for determining the overall viability of a class than it is under represented on the top 20 list.
That's just dumb and elitist.1 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bouldercleave wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Bouldercleave wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Emmagoldman wrote: »Should a class be fully centered on one aspect of the game?
Its pprobably one of the best group classes you can play in pvp
A class should be good in PvE and PvP. Warden is only good in PvP.
Again, I disagree. It appears they are not quite up to the leaderboard, but that does NOT make them unfit for PvE.
Leader board underrepresentation means they need PvE buffs. If you balance around the lowest common denominator, every class would be fine and there would be no need for balance adjustments. That's why we balance around endgame performance.
No it does not. Only a VERY small portion of the player base chase the leaderboard. I guarantee you that they have a much better metric for determining the overall viability of a class than it is under represented on the top 20 list.
That's just dumb and elitist.
That doesn't make any sense.
A class that underperforms at the top will underperform at any level.
A magden parsing 5k below the competition in leader board groups will be parsing 5k behind the competition in a progression group too. I'm not a score pusher, but my magden still parses 5k behind my magplar at my skill level.
That's why you balance from the top down. The effects trickle down.
Again, if ZOS balanced around a class' ability to run overland content or solo normal dungeons, there wouldn't be any need for balance adjustments as every class can do that effectively. You need to balance around the most difficult content.Edited by MLGProPlayer on March 30, 2019 7:26PM1 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭And just because they don't make the leaderboard doesn't mean they are ineffective. They balance around a much bigger example than the leaderboard. Especially THIS game that balances around PvE AND PvP together.
Just because you parse 5k below in a progression group doesn't mean you are in a bad place or need buffing.1 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bouldercleave wrote: »And just because they don't make the leaderboard doesn't mean they are ineffective. They balance around a much bigger example than the leaderboard. Especially THIS game that balances around PvE AND PvP together.
Just because you parse 5k below in a progression group doesn't mean you are in a bad place or need buffing.
Yes it does mean you need buffs. You're dealing less damage than everyone else while providing no utility.
You'll often get asked to switch to a more useful class if you have one available. You are making content objectively more difficult for your team by playing a magicka warden DPS.Edited by MLGProPlayer on March 30, 2019 7:38PM0 -
Bouldercleave wrote: »And just because they don't make the leaderboard doesn't mean they are ineffective. They balance around a much bigger example than the leaderboard. Especially THIS game that balances around PvE AND PvP together.
Just because you parse 5k below in a progression group doesn't mean you are in a bad place or need buffing.
Comparing Magden to other classes, it’s currently lowest in terms of its dps ceiling. 5k less than other classes does mean it’s in a bad place. In PVE particularly, and some players would just like that gap closed a bit.
I’m not a leaderboard pusher, but I’d still like some improvements to its kit. There’s nothing wrong with that, and it doesn’t take away from those who don’t feel the same. If anything, it adds to their playstyle.1 -
Bouldercleave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I guess I'm just not as concerned about being on the leaderboard or dealing with the elitist *** that would ask that I change characters to a "more useful" class.
The group that asks me to change characters is a group that I don't want to be a part of. If the 1%ers act like that, I'll stick to the 99% crowd that is fun to hang out with.1 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
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And this is an problem for classes as you can not buff them much and they get loads of nerf requests.MLGProPlayer wrote: »
Is it still true that an Altmer will do better as stam warden than magic one
I found warden pretty clunky to heal on compared to templar and sorcerer, granted sorcerer is an dungeon healer
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Bouldercleave wrote: »I guess I'm just not as concerned about being on the leaderboard or dealing with the elitist *** that would ask that I change characters to a "more useful" class.
The group that asks me to change characters is a group that I don't want to be a part of. If the 1%ers act like that, I'll stick to the 99% crowd that is fun to hang out with.
I feel your pain. I’m not particularly keen on players with limited viewpoints. But feels like displaced anger in this topic.
The point is that warden has some key flaws in an area that could use some improvement and streamlining. That’s not an elitist point of view, it’s just logistics. The class doesn’t need to be made the next nightblade, but boosting its dps output would be helpful to those who play it.1 -
Vandril✭✭✭✭Bouldercleave wrote: »I guess I'm just not as concerned about being on the leaderboard or dealing with the elitist *** that would ask that I change characters to a "more useful" class.
The group that asks me to change characters is a group that I don't want to be a part of. If the 1%ers act like that, I'll stick to the 99% crowd that is fun to hang out with.
Welcome to why I don't do PvE group content in MMOs, anymore. The meta culture has ruined MMO PvE and needs to die, and I say this as someone who loves build designing, number crunching, and min-maxing. MMOs have become more about efficiency and less about enjoyment, and people wonder why they burn out so fast.1 -
SydneyGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I love my warden healers so much that I have three of them now.
But I don't use them for DPS. They're fun to play, though.0
