Advancing Yokeda vs Briarheart

Vermethys · March 2019

Good evening Forumers,

I was running vHRC earlier today and was positively overwhelmed when my second ever AY dagger dropped (which I've been farming semi-regularly for around 2 months now). Since August of last year, I've been using Relequen, Briarheart, and Velidreth for ST on my StamNB, and today was the first time I got the opportunity to change gear -- so it was quite an exciting moment to say the least. I ran a couple of tests on a 6mil dummy (solo buffed) expecting a noticeable step up the DPS ladder, but was left baffled by the results. Now, mind you, I'm a DK tank main in PvE and I also PvP on my main character much more often than I play as my DDs in PvE content -- so, my DD skills could be a bit rusty.

Build: (Pretty standard set-up, but 6 medium 1 heavy instead of the more popular 7 medium)

Relequen + AY + Velidreth:

Relequen + Briarheart + Velidreth:

The second gear set-up (with Briarheart) averaged for slightly higher DPS in my tests for whatever reason (51k-52k vs 49k-51k) and with less variation. Briarheart is also a much easier set to use imo, with a 5-piece bonus that procs very often (thanks to the AoEs and DoTs) and is easier to maintain than 5 stacks of AY in realistic scenarios. The healing from the set is also moderately useful in 4-man content (trashfights) and vMA.

So, what do you guys make of that? I found it rather interesting that AY (the current meta set for all StamDDs) performed worse than Briarheart, which is a much easier set to acquire and use. I personally prefer it because it's more of a "fire and forget" sort of set (much like Burning Spellweave and similar sets). I could be doing something wrong; I'm not sure. But I'm interested in knowing your thoughts about those two sets and if anyone else compared them against one another.

ChunkyCat · March 2019

You’re just trying to sell some gold jewelry.

Vermethys · March 2019

ChunkyCat wrote: »

You’re just trying to sell some gold jewelry.

Lol I think the Briarheart necklace has got a few more hours at the Golden? I assure you though, I'm not trying to sell anything. Just merely sharing some results that made me raise an eyebrow in wonder.

Draxys · March 2019

What percentage did you have for max AY stacks? Could be that it dropped off, I’m working on that myself rn

usmcjdking · March 2019

The test, whilst not meaningless, has no context in actual performance.

In actual application, briarheart will only get subjectively worse in relative performance to AY due to a few factors:

- Major Courage with devalues the proportional damage Briarheart provides to a dummy by a significant amount.
- PA buff (if applicable).
- Non-critical damage scaling with debuffs (pen, vuln, offbalance)

It will hold par for:

-Minor Brutality

On a solo parse dummy none of the above factors are relevant. AY's 10% crit (which is realistically like 8% over time given mechanics for a reasonably experienced player) will scale significantly harder with the inclusion of Courage & PA and Minor Brut as well as the application of Major Force, whilst having minimal losses to non-critical damage.

Vermethys · March 2019

Draxys wrote: »

What percentage did you have for max AY stacks? Could be that it dropped off, I’m working on that myself rn

About 90% uptime on average. Though it required a more dynamic rotation than what I'd use with Briarheart.

@usmcjdking Very insightful response; thank you.

hedna123b14_ESO · March 2019

On a dummy the difference will be small. In raids AY will *** on briarheart harder than the diarrhea you get from bad Mexican food.
P.S.: only true in good groups with good buff uptimes

JinMori · March 2019

How come you have 96 % briar? i thoguht it could proc only every 15 sec with a duration of 10.

Tried it on the pts, and it's definitely a good set.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · March 2019

JinMori wrote: »

How come you have 96 % briar? i thoguht it could proc only every 15 sec with a duration of 10.

Tried it on the pts, and it's definitely a good set.

Just a bug with combat metrics.

zvavi · March 2019

You ay parse has a missed EH. And less bow la. Bring more consistent info

rampant_cake · March 2019

Funnily enough I did the same as you got my daggers and compared Briarheart vs AY and came to the same conclusion, until group buffs were brought brought up.

If you want an easy rotation you could consider Tzogvin, as it allows you to run an extra main surprise attack (or whatever) instead of reapplying rearming trap. Maybe slot camo hunter for the major savagery and run Cyrodiil weapon potions for a budget high dps

ATomiX96 · March 2019

as people already stated, once you have optimized raid setups and very high major force uptimes from warhorn, the gap between AY and Briar will massively increase.

thorwyn · March 2019

Eventually, someone is going to ask this anyway, so it might as well be me:
What AddOn are you using for your sets and stats in the first screenshot?

Vermethys · March 2019

thorwyn wrote: »

Eventually, someone is going to ask this anyway, so it might as well be me:
What AddOn are you using for your sets and stats in the first screenshot?

@thorwyn It's "SuperStar" -- https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info946-SuperStar-CharacterBuilder.html

thorwyn · March 2019

LOL.... it even says so in the upper left corner. I didn't look properly.

Thanks

SaintSubwayy · March 2019

I see that in nearly the same time frame, you got 1 less cast of endlesshail out, which also dropped the berserker uptime...not a big difference, but could end up in about 200 DPS Difference

keep in mind AY is stronger in raids that it is on a dummy, due to major force, while BH only gets a buff of 10% from minor bruality.

if you want to compare the setups on a dummy, do 5 test each (minimum) then compare the avg.
it might be that BH is a little bit stronger on a dummy, but this can turn quite hard in a raid.

BxBourne · April 2019

How much of a difference are we talking in dps between the two?

ShadowKyuubi · April 2019

You let AY drop off three times during the parse, that makes a bit of a difference.

Grianasteri · November 2019

Vermethys wrote: »

Good evening Forumers,

I was running vHRC earlier today and was positively overwhelmed when my second ever AY dagger dropped (which I've been farming semi-regularly for around 2 months now). Since August of last year, I've been using Relequen, Briarheart, and Velidreth for ST on my StamNB, and today was the first time I got the opportunity to change gear -- so it was quite an exciting moment to say the least. I ran a couple of tests on a 6mil dummy (solo buffed) expecting a noticeable step up the DPS ladder, but was left baffled by the results. Now, mind you, I'm a DK tank main in PvE and I also PvP on my main character much more often than I play as my DDs in PvE content -- so, my DD skills could be a bit rusty.

Build: (Pretty standard set-up, but 6 medium 1 heavy instead of the more popular 7 medium)

Relequen + AY + Velidreth:

Relequen + Briarheart + Velidreth:

The second gear set-up (with Briarheart) averaged for slightly higher DPS in my tests for whatever reason (51k-52k vs 49k-51k) and with less variation. Briarheart is also a much easier set to use imo, with a 5-piece bonus that procs very often (thanks to the AoEs and DoTs) and is easier to maintain than 5 stacks of AY in realistic scenarios. The healing from the set is also moderately useful in 4-man content (trashfights) and vMA.

So, what do you guys make of that? I found it rather interesting that AY (the current meta set for all StamDDs) performed worse than Briarheart, which is a much easier set to acquire and use. I personally prefer it because it's more of a "fire and forget" sort of set (much like Burning Spellweave and similar sets). I could be doing something wrong; I'm not sure. But I'm interested in knowing your thoughts about those two sets and if anyone else compared them against one another.

My stamblade still uses Rele and Briarheart - which I love, its a great set. I guess one day I may give AY a try, but if it aint broke I do not feel a burning need to fix it.

Remember that what were comparing here really is crit chance, with weapon damage... so the interplay between these across your skills and rotation will be the main factor in the results you are talking about. Im not technically up on this kind of thing so cant really expand further.

Raudgrani · November 2019

Briarheart adds some slight survivability too. Might be worth mentioning. Used it on a bow/bow StamDK with Relequen and Velidreth. Then tried the AY from my Stamblade on same toon, and I literally couldn't tell the difference in DPS - AY was maybe a liiiiiiittle better DPS on dummy, but hardly possible to determine on a console.

El_Borracho · November 2019

I still run Rele + AY on my stam characters. Briarheart isn't bad, I've just never had a problem keeping the stacks up on AY. No real wrong answer here.

ThePedge · November 2019

And now Lokkestiz is better than both, and normal is easy to acquire doing farm/chest runs.

And0ssus · November 2019

Lokke depends on your Group (when you don't get enough synergies it sucks).
AY only performs better than Briarheart in Group Content (Horn/Major Force Buff) or on the new Raid Dummy.
For NB i would try the new Moon Set.
Sustain on NB is pretty good, so u could maybe Deal with the 5% cost increase and with this Patch your Backbar time isn't that Long anymore.
Try Out 7 medium If you can. With Shadow mundus and NB passives, crit scales pretty good.
Skill wise i only would use poison injection for the execute. It isn't worth it to Cast it on cooldown anymore. Do one more spammable instead.
Thats what i can tell at the First look.