@Class Reps, Stamina Morphs or Stamina Scaling for Sorcerer Pets?

GrumpyDuckling · March 2019

Hi Class Reps,

Now that pets no longer need to be shielded in PVE to stay alive (a change that we much appreciate), can you please inquire, next meeting, about the possibility of providing stamina morphs for Sorcerer pets? I'm sure many players would like to see oft-talked about stamina morphs such as an Air Atronach ultimate, or a Spider Daedra morph that spits poison.

In case that is too much of an ask, could you inquire about if ZOS would be willing to at least consider giving the pets the Flames of Oblivion treatment (allowing the damage to scale with highest stat pool)? Thanks.

Tasear · March 2019

What about Magicka dps who use the morphs already. These changes will make someone unhappy in expense of another.

Other suggestion is what we should of did it first place instead of stamina vs Magicka

GrumpyDuckling · March 2019

Tasear wrote: »

What about Magicka dps who use the morphs already. These changes will make someone unhappy in expense of another.

Other suggestion is what we should of did it first place instead of stamina vs Magicka

See the second part of the post where I talk about giving the pets the Flames of Oblivion treatment. I'd be willing to settle for that, and that would leave magicka dps Sorcs untouched.

MashmalloMan · March 2019

Just need to make the clanfear more viable for sta dps. It hits next to nothing and it's scaling is a combination of max magicka + physical dmg/penetration/weapon crit chance/ weapon crit dmg.

The tooltip is low even if it scaled off max sta properly however. (I tested by making my max magicka about 32k, easy to achieve on a sta DD setup, the clanfear could barely break 1k dps with 8k penetration) Updating the tooltip scaling and the base damage is required and in no way OP, it wouldn't effect tanks or mag dd. It doesn't need to be as stong as the matriarch for passive damage, but it should be somewhat competitive.

Don't even get me started on how dumb it is that they tied this skill in to a tank % heal. While it's a pretty potent Tank heal, they need more bar space, it's such a crappy design to begin with like the change to bound armor and block mitigation. Why was a damage skill changed to accommodate tanks as an afterthought. Why do tanks need 11% light attack damage? It was always a damage skill and they wasted an opportunity to make bound armor something active or dynamic for DD's.

The twilight tormentor is perfect for the FoO treatment IMO. Most mag dd use matriarch anyway. It would also be a bit op to have a strong burst heal from the matriarch for sta dd's, but the reverse execute from twilight makes sense.

Tasear wrote: »

What about Magicka dps who use the morphs already. These changes will make someone unhappy in expense of another.

The entire sorc tool kit has completely disregarded Sta DD, Tank and Healer in favour of Mag DD at almost every turn for years. I think it's about time other specs got something actually interesting and useful to use. As a healer main, I would think you would agree. At this point, if they want to give those roles a better feel like they were talking about in class rep meetings in 2018, mag sorcs are bound to lose something, unless they give the FoO treatment to multiple abilities, but I doubt it.

RogueShark · March 2019

Something should be done about/with pets for Stam. Considering there are passives tied to the pets that stam will never really be able to make use of, it's ridiculous that so much of the class abilities/identity is realistically off-limits for stamsorcs.

Moloch1514 · March 2019

Seems like a nerf Pet Sorc thread.....

cpuScientist · March 2019

I'm a petSorc for pve and I would welcome this change. As was said, simply giving the Clanfear the matriarch treatment of good passive damage and a heal would be a good step. Giving the tormentor the FoO treatment would also work. Obviously an air atro is easy and would simply be moving the AoE to the base and having the air morph change to physical and an added ability or just the same longer time.

StamSorc is in need of an identity and a reason for being. there are many wasted skills/morphs in the sorc kit that could be going to use as stamMorphs. Overload, crystal blast, mages wrath morphs could be combined and reworked to make space and finally the debacle that is bound armor. Sorc has room to grow stamSorc has room to grow. Simply stating that someone somewhere will be annoyed at a change to morphs is not enough. Unless the game is going back to launch and not prioritizing pure stam or pure mag for dps then there needs to be room for both in the skill-lines.

Tasear · March 2019

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Just need to make the clanfear more viable for sta dps. It hits next to nothing and it's scaling is a combination of max magicka + physical dmg/penetration/weapon crit chance/ weapon crit dmg.

The tooltip is low even if it scaled off max sta properly however. (I tested by making my max magicka about 32k, easy to achieve on a sta DD setup, the clanfear could barely break 1k dps with 8k penetration) Updating the tooltip scaling and the base damage is required and in no way OP, it wouldn't effect tanks or mag dd. It doesn't need to be as stong as the matriarch for passive damage, but it should be somewhat competitive.

Don't even get me started on how dumb it is that they tied this skill in to a tank % heal. While it's a pretty potent Tank heal, they need more bar space, it's such a crappy design to begin with like the change to bound armor and block mitigation. Why was a damage skill changed to accommodate tanks as an afterthought. Why do tanks need 11% light attack damage? It was always a damage skill and they wasted an opportunity to make bound armor something active or dynamic for DD's.

The twilight tormentor is perfect for the FoO treatment IMO. Most mag dd use matriarch anyway. It would also be a bit op to have a strong burst heal from the matriarch for sta dd's, but the reverse execute from twilight makes sense.

Tasear wrote: »

What about Magicka dps who use the morphs already. These changes will make someone unhappy in expense of another.

The entire sorc tool kit has completely disregarded Sta DD, Tank and Healer in favour of Mag DD at almost every turn for years. I think it's about time other specs got something actually interesting and useful to use. As a healer main, I would think you would agree. At this point, if they want to give those roles a better feel like they were talking about in class rep meetings in 2018, mag sorcs are bound to lose something, unless they give the FoO treatment to multiple abilities, but I doubt it.

Don't get me wrong we simply need more skills is what I am saying. We are fighting over 4 roles with 3 skill lines.

Zekka · March 2019

I don't understand, ZOS rework a skill once in a blue moon and people keep asking for an air atronach they will use every 10 minutes for a class with ONE damage class skill.
Ask for a decent spammable like nightblades' surprise attack or stamplars' jabs, or a good big damage skill like relentless focus/subterranean assault/power of the light that would make the stamsorcs rotation more interesting, something you will use every couple seconds... really, anything but more pets...

cpuScientist · March 2019

Zekka wrote: »

I don't understand, ZOS rework a skill once in a blue moon and people keep asking for an air atronach they will use every 10 minutes for a class with ONE damage class skill.
Ask for a decent spammable like nightblades' surprise attack or stamplars' jabs, or a good big damage skill like relentless focus/subterranean assault/power of the light that would make the stamsorcs rotation more interesting, something you will use every couple seconds... really, anything but more pets...

No I agree. I can't melee frag proc. And air overload. Like you say something useful. Not just a reskin of atro. Melee frag would be the first darn step into something good

Pulque · March 2019

Marshall1289 wrote: »

Just need to make the clanfear more viable for sta dps. It hits next to nothing and it's scaling is a combination of max magicka + physical dmg/penetration/weapon crit chance/ weapon crit dmg.

The tooltip is low even if it scaled off max sta properly however. (I tested by making my max magicka about 32k, easy to achieve on a sta DD setup, the clanfear could barely break 1k dps with 8k penetration) Updating the tooltip scaling and the base damage is required and in no way OP, it wouldn't effect tanks or mag dd. It doesn't need to be as stong as the matriarch for passive damage, but it should be somewhat competitive.

Don't even get me started on how dumb it is that they tied this skill in to a tank % heal. While it's a pretty potent Tank heal, they need more bar space, it's such a crappy design to begin with like the change to bound armor and block mitigation. Why was a damage skill changed to accommodate tanks as an afterthought. Why do tanks need 11% light attack damage? It was always a damage skill and they wasted an opportunity to make bound armor something active or dynamic for DD's.

The twilight tormentor is perfect for the FoO treatment IMO. Most mag dd use matriarch anyway. It would also be a bit op to have a strong burst heal from the matriarch for sta dd's, but the reverse execute from twilight makes sense.

Tasear wrote: »

What about Magicka dps who use the morphs already. These changes will make someone unhappy in expense of another.

The entire sorc tool kit has completely disregarded Sta DD, Tank and Healer in favour of Mag DD at almost every turn for years. I think it's about time other specs got something actually interesting and useful to use. As a healer main, I would think you would agree. At this point, if they want to give those roles a better feel like they were talking about in class rep meetings in 2018, mag sorcs are bound to lose something, unless they give the FoO treatment to multiple abilities, but I doubt it.

Too selfish. Sorc tank needs clannfear.

DoobZ69 · March 2019

What this crafter class needs is the ability to do more writs crafting quests per day just for them to have something useful to do in the game.

Alucardo · March 2019

What about that crystal frag morph that barely anyone uses, and the people who do use it probably wouldn't miss when it's gone? Change it to a stamina morph and a crystal sword or something.

Harrdarrzarr · March 2019

Isn't it weird though, that Flames of Oblivion also scales with max stamina. In no way does it look like a stamina skill, and neither would the sorc pets. While it would give the stamsorc something funny, your character would no longer feel like a STAMsorc.
And I don't think stamsorcs have the barspace to slot them anyway. Maybe do something to the other morph of liquid lightning, like placing a small tornado somewhere, I'd prefer we get a nice aoe dot over a spammable anyway.

Chilly-McFreeze · March 2019

Harrdarrzarr wrote: »

Isn't it weird though, that Flames of Oblivion also scales with max stamina. In no way does it look like a stamina skill, and neither would the sorc pets. While it would give the stamsorc something funny, your character would no longer feel like a STAMsorc.
And I don't think stamsorcs have the barspace to slot them anyway. Maybe do something to the other morph of liquid lightning, like placing a small tornado somewhere, I'd prefer we get a nice aoe dot over a spammable anyway.

How many more aoe dots do you need? Caltrops, endless, I'd dare to say hurricane fill that role already. It also would do not much outside of pve. A (semi) spam on the other hand...

Morgul667 · March 2019

i think stamsorc could use many things... but please not pets

Anyron · March 2019

sure. make twilight matriarch or clanfear stam morphs and give them acess to strong burst heals

it is completely ballanced with momentum + vigor (sarcasm)

Chilly-McFreeze · March 2019

Anyron wrote: »

sure. make twilight matriarch or clanfear stam morphs and give them acess to strong burst heals

it is completely ballanced with momentum + vigor (sarcasm)

Or it gives freedom to not slot 2h. Who knows? If someone want's to invest 4 slots for 3 heals...

Burtan · March 2019

I think some of the first things I would like see change as a stamsorc main are these;

Either deadric protection becomes a flat passive or Bound Armaments becomes something other than two completely dead skill slots.
More sorcerer skills gain stamina morphs, preferably curse since it would synergise with weapon abilities the most and can fill the gap left by a lack of class spammable to some extent.
More passives/skills that offer useful buffs to both stamina and magicka users and group members. One passive for example gives minor prophesy but not savagery.
Access to usable class ultimates. All three class ultimates deal shock/magic dmg which will scale with weapon dmg/max stamina but not physical penetration which makes these ultimates rather useless with the exception of Negate Magic in some support roles.

One easy solution to a lot of these points would be for already existing sorc skills/ults to scale with the highest stat and also physical penetration. Then we don't need to nerf other specs.

idk · March 2019

The best solution is for the pets to retain their current abilities and have the type of damage they do and what they scale off of be based on the highest of whichever main stat they have.

Have more magicka than stan, it does magicka damage, Have more stam than mag, it does physical damage.

Ladislao · March 2019

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm sure many players would like to see oft-talked about stamina morphs such as an Air Atronach ultimate, or a Spider Daedra morph that spits poison.

And many players wouldn't.

You know stamina sorcerer never meant using class pets. And people chose this class in view of this fact. Such big changes will not only cause bewilderment among stamsorc players, but will most likely lead to negative consequences for magsorcs and hybrids (i.e. tank sorcs).
Moreover, Storm Atronach is a good choice for stamina sorcerer now without any changes.

So if you want to have stamina character with class pets I can only suggest you to play warden (or wait for necromancer). This class will suit you well.

P.S. And please stop saying "many players" when you mean "I".

Donnasnowheart_ESO · March 2019

Somthing super basic that I never understood forever is why energy overload never gave back stam for stam sorcs it's strictly magicka like a bunch of other class abilities.

Can feel it now necromancer is just going to end up being everything a sorc wanted to be for magicka stam tank and heals.

GrumpyDuckling · March 2019

Ladislao wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm sure many players would like to see oft-talked about stamina morphs such as an Air Atronach ultimate, or a Spider Daedra morph that spits poison.

And many players wouldn't.

You know stamina sorcerer never meant using class pets. And people chose this class in view of this fact. Such big changes will not only cause bewilderment among stamsorc players, but will most likely lead to negative consequences for magsorcs and hybrids (i.e. tank sorcs).
Moreover, Storm Atronach is a good choice for stamina sorcerer now without any changes.

So if you want to have stamina character with class pets I can only suggest you to play warden (or wait for necromancer). This class will suit you well.

P.S. And please stop saying "many players" when you mean "I".

Nope, I mean "many players." Many players have talked about stamina morphs for Sorcerer pets. I'm not the only one.

Ragnarock41 · March 2019

Donnasnowheart_ESO wrote: »

Somthing super basic that I never understood forever is why energy overload never gave back stam for stam sorcs it's strictly magicka like a bunch of other class abilities.

Can feel it now necromancer is just going to end up being everything a sorc wanted to be for magicka stam tank and heals.

Sounds exactly like how warden ended up for Dks. Now all they need to do is give implosion to necromancers and find an excuse for it, aaaand boom. Morrowind 2.0 ready for pre-order.