Random guy executes ponzi scheme across 5 PC guilds then nukes guilds and discord

SFDB · March 2019

Na0cho wrote: »

Hold up:

Haven’t been on in a few days BUT I am in that guild.

I don’t know anything about “nuking” the guild and will look into it HOWEVER I will say this: since joining the guild and seeing their tutorials I went from having like 200k at any given time to A mutiple millionaire.

They have taught me how to easily make money in this game. Even if this is true(I’m also in another guild run by same people which isn’t named here so I’m skeptical) then my 60k 6 month buy in was a golden *** investment.

The Tamriel marketplace owners didn’t give me dinner. They taught me how to fish.

I’ll be forever great full to them irregardless of the outcome.

The key thing to remember, though, is that there was the GM, and there was the main (only?) officer. The GM did the stealing. The officer was the one who worked to educate people, organize events, etc. The reason this can be confusing is that the GM acted more like a recruiter and whip than a leader, while the officer acted more like the guild leader in trying to forge a functioning community. Naturally, he was the most outraged at the situation. At the time, it had seemed like the two were co-partners since the one was super-focused on our prosperity (so we thought) and the other upon building camaraderie, but the GM was indeed the one in charge and the other just someone who was used for his knowledge and energy and then tossed aside.

This is why there's confusion, two people working hard on the guild, one to benefit the guild, the other to benefit themselves. So be grateful to the right person, not the wrong one; don't thank Joffrey Lannister when it was Tywin that was educating people.

starkerealm · March 2019

SFDB wrote: »

Na0cho wrote: »

Hold up:

Haven’t been on in a few days BUT I am in that guild.

I don’t know anything about “nuking” the guild and will look into it HOWEVER I will say this: since joining the guild and seeing their tutorials I went from having like 200k at any given time to A mutiple millionaire.

They have taught me how to easily make money in this game. Even if this is true(I’m also in another guild run by same people which isn’t named here so I’m skeptical) then my 60k 6 month buy in was a golden *** investment.

The Tamriel marketplace owners didn’t give me dinner. They taught me how to fish.

I’ll be forever great full to them irregardless of the outcome.

The key thing to remember, though, is that there was the GM, and there was the main (only?) officer. The GM did the stealing. The officer was the one who worked to educate people, organize events, etc. The reason this can be confusing is that the GM acted more like a recruiter and whip than a leader, while the officer acted more like the guild leader in trying to forge a functioning community. Naturally, he was the most outraged at the situation. At the time, it had seemed like the two were co-partners since the one was super-focused on our prosperity (so we thought) and the other upon building camaraderie, but the GM was indeed the one in charge and the other just someone who was used for his knowledge and energy and then tossed aside.

This is why there's confusion, two people working hard on the guild, one to benefit the guild, the other to benefit themselves. So be grateful to the right person, not the wrong one; don't thank Joffrey Lannister when it was Tywin that was educating people.

Some of this was strictly pragmatic. You cannot be the leader of multiple guilds. If you could, this situation would be much messier.

Trikie_Dik · March 2019

So back in November 2018, the main GM in place here roped me into helping out with his previous trading guild - which ended with him losing the bid sevearl times and then taking a little under 10m from the GB and bailing with a msg he was gonna buy a dope house and gold all his sets etc. He offered to let me take over the guild - but with no funds, bailing memebrs, and a *** rep who wants that baggage - not me!

Not more the FIVE DAYS LATER he messaged me in discord saying that the fires were lit again and a new guild was started and that i should come on board.... how about no thanks. Fast forward over the last 4 months, i see him spamming chat for recruitment like normal and then BAMB - this hits today. By no means am i shocked, happens once before, no surprise it happened once again - however now it really sucks how multiple guilds were effected rather then just the one like before.

I saw the writing on the wall after the November experience, but not like i can go around warning everyone of what may come some day.... ughhh just sad! Sorry to all that lost in this *** fest, hope things rebuild and move on!!

starkerealm · March 2019

mystkldrgnb14_ESO wrote: »

I've been in several trade guilds - two currently which are successful and support their trader (and have for years+). INcluding one that has a "sister" trade guild for players who can't afford the higher dues. ALL have traders.

None of them ever needed "investment" over and above the regular member dues/sales requirements. Did they benefit from charity from rich guild players - sure; but there was never an investor call out. Discussions about raising dues to get better traders - sure! But never "investors".

That's the point of having dues/sales requirements.

Can't undo the past - but please people - tell your friends - if your trade guild is asking/requiring for money above and beyond their dues or you can't stay - just leave.

If the dues/sales requirements aren't enough to pay for whatever trader the guild is wanting - they don't know what they're doing to begin with so get out anyway. There are craptons of trader guilds you can join that don't require extra "investment" - just join those.

Feel bad for everyone who, in good faith, supported their guilds and just got scammed. This isn't EVE. And this behavior is Not welcome or ok here.

But yea reading that whole "trading alliance needs investors" WTH? No... just no. They don't.

Yeah, I'm sure he had an explanation for what his plans were with those investments. But, that was clearly a setup from the word go.

starkerealm · March 2019

Trikie_Dik wrote: »

So back in November 2018, the main GM in place here roped me into helping out with his previous trading guild - which ended with him losing the bid sevearl times and then taking a little under 10m from the GB and bailing with a msg he was gonna buy a dope house and gold all his sets etc. He offered to let me take over the guild - but with no funds, bailing memebrs, and a *** rep who wants that baggage - not me!

Not more the FIVE DAYS LATER he messaged me in discord saying that the fires were lit again and a new guild was started and that i should come on board.... how about no thanks. Fast forward over the last 4 months, i see him spamming chat for recruitment like normal and then BAMB - this hits today. By no means am i shocked, happens once before, no surprise it happened once again - however now it really sucks how multiple guilds were effected rather then just the one like before.

I saw the writing on the wall after the November experience, but not like i can go around warning everyone of what may come some day.... ughhh just sad! Sorry to all that lost in this *** fest, hope things rebuild and move on!!

Sounds, kinda, like he didn't even bother bidding on that trader for a couple weeks, then scampered off with the cash.

usmcjdking · March 2019

As long as said player isn't being protected by features ZOS has -

LOOKS GOOD TO ME BOYS!

TairenSoul · March 2019

Flares wrote: »

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

How much was actually stolen, do you guys think? And are the accounts you suspect of being the thieves still active?

Unless the answers to those questions are really surprising, I don't see the point from a simple greed standpoint; there are easier ways to make money in the game. The motivation would more likely be the joy of thievery itself, a desire to hurt fellow players, or something like that.

I was in 2 of the guilds, more context, he was an officer in the big one, poached members for his 4 guilds secretly, including me, kept a very ACTIVE discord with farm tips and routes. Each guild was bringing in 10~ mill a week, and main was 40-60mill. In the end the total gold "stolen" was 300~mill across all. Hes been at it since November

Its ALOT of money

Yep. Just talked to someone who said he made off with another guild's funds to the tune of 10 mil+! Something should be done about him.

Gargis · March 2019

Difference between you and I, is that I would never give my money to a thief.

You set your self up by the whispers of a charlatan. Shame, too bad. Blame me if it makes you feel better.

There is no way to retrieve funds in game through a 3rd party legal system. You did not have a contract that could be enforced through the confiscation of assets.

So....exactly why did you give your gold away? Who is to blame?

Saucy_Jack · March 2019

I guess the thing that continually surprises/saddens me the most about people like this is that they could aspire to be anything they could imagine, and then out of all those choices, they make the purposeful choice to be a dickhead. Way to set the bar high for yourself, guild leader.

ArchangelIsraphel · March 2019

Gargis wrote: »

If you got scammed, you had it coming!

No, not sorry.

Thieves abound! Beware!

Be glad you only lost artificial money. Let be a lesson and don't let it happen to you in RL.

Seriously, WTF up.

There's something inherently wrong when people think its okay say things like this. It seems they have a total absence of compassion.

Just because someone got scammed, doesn't mean they AREN'T aware that theives are out there or that they needed to "learn their lesson". You can be the most watchful person and -still get cheated- by someone who presents themselves as honest and forthright but secretly has it out for you. And apparently, this guy had it out for not one, but -many- people.

The victim blaming when it comes to things like this really needs to stop, because it only enables thieves.

TairenSoul · March 2019

Gargis wrote: »

Difference between you and I, is that I would never give my money to a thief.

You set your self up by the whispers of a charlatan. Shame, too bad. Blame me if it makes you feel better.

There is no way to retrieve funds in game through a 3rd party legal system. You did not have a contract that could be enforced through the confiscation of assets.

So....exactly why did you give your gold away? Who is to blame?

I didn't "know" he was a thief. If I "knew" that, I would never have given him anything. No whispering. He posted in chat that it was a new guild with great people and aspirations to be one of the best guilds, etc. He stated he needed the original 20k investment to help secure a good trade spot. It costs millions for the spots, so that was quite legit. I'm not blaming you at all. I know I took a risk and thank goodness it's not real money. I have lots in my game bank, so it's hardly a burden for me. It's the principle that he stole. He did it before and I'm sure he'll do it again. I wish there was a way to more effectively warn people for the next group that gets ripped off.

Gargis · March 2019

" Dude, it's a game. A contract in force? Listed for seizure? Ok, no more feeding the trolls for me. *drops mic* "

Be as thick headed as you want. I am trying to save you serious pain in RL.

Play this drop the mic attitude in RL and see the consequences.

You really believe that your behavior in game is that different in compared to RL? From your attitude, I doubt it.

How do I know? Your complaining about losing artificial gold.

TairenSoul · March 2019

Well, I guess I've been schooled. Thank goodness for words of wisdom from kind individuals. TGIF!

Na0cho · March 2019

All I ever paid was an initial “investment” which was a paltry sum and that was to over 6 months of dues etc. all I ever paid was that initial up front payment ( like I have for other guilds because I’m not always on and like to pay In advance in case I don’t feel like playing next week.) and made tons of gold just using the trader.

I feel as though I got more than I gave and met some cool people in the process.

I now have an open guild slot! Gonna go for one of the big boy traders now 🤘

ZonasArch · March 2019

@ZOS_RogerJ do you mind giving a second moderation pass? Someone here definitely victim shaming, borderline harassing them. Doesn't look good for our community to have this kind of people commenting so freely. Thanks.

TairenSoul · March 2019

Feel free to delete my comments. I apologize for being snarky. I didn't appreciate getting called "thick-headed" and went about this the wrong way. Hope everything regarding this situation works out for everyone involved!

Ackwalan · March 2019

ZonasArch wrote: »

@ZOS_RogerJ do you mind giving a second moderation pass? Someone here definitely victim shaming, borderline harassing them. Doesn't look good for our community to have this kind of people commenting so freely. Thanks.

No let him talk. His kind of behavior thrives in an environment where such acts are hushed up.

RouDeR · March 2019

This is why when the weekly donation in trading guild is 5k i send only 3 ^^.

DOn`t worry, the guy is just Role-Playing (hardcore) xD

Inarre · March 2019

Someone here has a good dose of karma waiting. I can't wait for the day they get scammed and zos refuses to reimburse them.

Trikie_Dik · March 2019

Gargis wrote: »

Difference between you and I, is that I would never give my money to a thief.

Giving money for no reason is one thing, but contributions to a group or org your passionate about and interested in growing is another. If someone at the red-cross embezzled tons of money from the trust, did you knowingly give your donations to a thief? Not at all!

There is a difference between loaning someone money in a the deal for repayment, and another to throw in funds to get an organization on its feat and get going. In this context specifically, the members donated various amounts to get a good starting pool to afford a quality guild trader spot - the repayment was not defined in terms of direct repayment but rather in the usage of the service that org would provide. I see the two totally different, but maybe its just how im looking at the situation.

ZOS_RogerJ · March 2019

Greetings! We've closed this thread as it began spiraling after an in-thread notice. While we completely understand everyone has their own opinions, thoughts, feelings and even frustrations, we want the forums to be a civil and constructive platform for the game and it's community as a whole.