Looking for a tank set up?

psychotic13 · February 2019

What are some good tank combinations for specifically 4 man content (DLC Dungeons, DSA and blackrose prison)

Have tanked before just not for a long time so im behind on whats good in that department these days. I know alkosh i best in trials, is it the same for 4 man? Or is it more about being self reliant cause will more than likely run with 3 dps and no healer.

Thanks.

starkerealm · February 2019

psychotic13 wrote: »

I know Alkosh i best in trials, is it the same for 4 man?

Alkosh is a DPS set. @Woeler ran it on a tank years ago because it seemed like a fun thing to do, but the metahumpers have chased that one like it's the holy ****ing grail. It's okay-ish on the tank.

Depending on class/race setup, you've got a lot of options. Ebon is dependable and boosts group health. Plague Doctor is selfish, but it's a lot of health for you. You can stack these together if you're so inclined, and get a nice, solid, starting point.

After that, when you're looking for monster sets, it depends on what your tank will be doing exactly. Chudan and Lord Warden are a lot of damage mitigation, if that's what you're looking for. (Chudan is selfish and provides you with two, easy to obtain, buffs, while Lord Warden is an AoE, so you can lose it by stepping out of it, but is shared with anyone close to you, and is an unnamed buff (so it stacks on top of your existing buffs.))

psychotic13 · February 2019

Was thinking dragon/ebon on a sorc, i used to tank on a sorc though i do have other characters i can respec if need be.

Monster set i dont know, i could run alot i guess. Bloodspawn id imagine though.

How much max health should i am for?

psychotic13 · February 2019

starkerealm wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I know Alkosh i best in trials, is it the same for 4 man?

Alkosh is a DPS set. @Woeler ran it on a tank years ago because it seemed like a fun thing to do, but the metahumpers have chased that one like it's the holy ****ing grail. It's okay-ish on the tank.

Depending on class/race setup, you've got a lot of options. Ebon is dependable and boosts group health. Plague Doctor is selfish, but it's a lot of health for you. You can stack these together if you're so inclined, and get a nice, solid, starting point.

After that, when you're looking for monster sets, it depends on what your tank will be doing exactly. Chudan and Lord Warden are a lot of damage mitigation, if that's what you're looking for. (Chudan is selfish and provides you with two, easy to obtain, buffs, while Lord Warden is an AoE, so you can lose it by stepping out of it, but is shared with anyone close to you, and is an unnamed buff (so it stacks on top of your existing buffs.))

Thought it was best cause it adds penetration allowing for more dps? But not sure how good it is on 4 man? I dont recall seeing someone use it there.

starkerealm · February 2019

psychotic13 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I know Alkosh i best in trials, is it the same for 4 man?

Alkosh is a DPS set. @Woeler ran it on a tank years ago because it seemed like a fun thing to do, but the metahumpers have chased that one like it's the holy ****ing grail. It's okay-ish on the tank.

Depending on class/race setup, you've got a lot of options. Ebon is dependable and boosts group health. Plague Doctor is selfish, but it's a lot of health for you. You can stack these together if you're so inclined, and get a nice, solid, starting point.

After that, when you're looking for monster sets, it depends on what your tank will be doing exactly. Chudan and Lord Warden are a lot of damage mitigation, if that's what you're looking for. (Chudan is selfish and provides you with two, easy to obtain, buffs, while Lord Warden is an AoE, so you can lose it by stepping out of it, but is shared with anyone close to you, and is an unnamed buff (so it stacks on top of your existing buffs.))

Thought it was best cause it adds penetration allowing for more dps? But not sure how good it is on 4 man? I dont recall seeing someone use it there.

It reduces the target's resistances. There's a distinction here, because pen is applied to your damage, while reduced resistances apply to everyone. That said, Alkosh only reduces the target's mitigation by about ~4.5%. It a trial, with 8 or 9 DPS burning the target, that's significant, but in a semi-coherant 4 man dungeon, where your group DPS isn't likely to exceed 50k, you're looking at less than 3k damage per second off of the debuff. The DoT from the set is nice, and that's gravy, but not enough to torture yourself.

There is a weirdness with Sorc and Dragonguard, the ult cost discount does not stack the way you'd expect, and it ends up only providing a 27% cost discount. Not sure what's going on there. That said, I'm still an advocate of sorc tanks. If you know what you're doing, they can be very solid, and encase gives them some unique long range CC options that other tanks don't really have, or need to work around to get.

Woeler · February 2019

starkerealm wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I know Alkosh i best in trials, is it the same for 4 man?

Alkosh is a DPS set. @Woeler ran it on a tank years ago because it seemed like a fun thing to do, but the metahumpers have chased that one like it's the holy ****ing grail. It's okay-ish on the tank.

Depending on class/race setup, you've got a lot of options. Ebon is dependable and boosts group health. Plague Doctor is selfish, but it's a lot of health for you. You can stack these together if you're so inclined, and get a nice, solid, starting point.

After that, when you're looking for monster sets, it depends on what your tank will be doing exactly. Chudan and Lord Warden are a lot of damage mitigation, if that's what you're looking for. (Chudan is selfish and provides you with two, easy to obtain, buffs, while Lord Warden is an AoE, so you can lose it by stepping out of it, but is shared with anyone close to you, and is an unnamed buff (so it stacks on top of your existing buffs.))

I ran it on a tank years ago, and still today because it is the strongest set related offensive group boost in the game. That’s not even a debatable point. It just is.

Had nothing to do with “fun”, it was a well thought out decision.

That being said its effectiveness obviously increases when there are more damage dealers present. Which is only 2 in dungeons, and mostly 8/9 in trials.

Krayl · February 2019

I will still run Alksoh/Torug's in most 4-mans up until you start to talk about the DLCs and hard modes and things, then I will go Ebon and something like Battalion Defender. Something I appreciate is that the newer DLC's have been more mechanics-heavy with short periods where burn is good, but having insane dps isn't really a necessity (and in some cases makes the fight harder). This is of course if I know im running with a good healer who's throwing plenty of synergies, otherwise alkosh is useless.

If you're learning something, Plague & Ebon is forgiving. But in most cases for the new DLC's if you miss a block on a heavy on the 2hander mobs and above you're dead anyways so the extra HP from plague isn't all that useful.

Dragon is a good set for more ultimates so if you're on a DK tank you can get those resources back faster, if not for as much.

One set I'm farming is Draugr's rest, it's a light set but makes a 5m radious big heal when you heavy attack - so if you run with a group that has a couple melee DPS this can be nice. Pair it up with leeching plate and earthgore and you dont need a healer necessarily, though im a fan of keeping the traditional roles for the group.

There are a lot of options for tanking 4 mans. If you know mechanics and what to block and such, it's more about how you can compliment your group makeup.

Veinblood1965 · February 2019

I just started a tank about two months ago, did a lot of research. I ended up running Ebon and Fortified Brass and switch out the brass to Turog's sometimes. Not sure which I like so far. I'm running Bloodspawn monster set. Running Prismatic Glyphs on all my armor. I don't tend to die much and can take hits. I went the help the group way. I can tell you my DPS sucks and takes me a week to kill a skeever which is the drawback.

I specifically run four man dungeons and DLC's vet when possible. Not much into trials yet. I read different trials require different sets and being a new toon I don't have all the gear yet.

MartiniDaniels · February 2019

Power assault is very nice for 4-man content imo.

Royaji · February 2019

There is no easy answer to your question. It is all based on your group and specific dungeon/arena you are running.

You have two stamblades? There will not be enough synergies to keep reasonable uptime on Alkosh. At this point torug's or PA will be much better choices. But in a group with a magsorc and a warden healer? Alkosh is the way to go.

You are in a 3 DDs run and feeling a little bit on the squishy side? Put on a more defensive set like Battalion Defender to help you stay alive since DPS is not an issue at this point.

And as my last example I want to point out that a set like NMG can be BiS in a place with high amount of adds like BRP or DSA, where puncturing every single add is not an option.

My personal favourites will be PA/Alkosh for base games dungeons, Ebon/PA for more difficult ones and Ebon/Battalion Defender for fights away from healer. But the list of decent sets is a lot longer.

Emmagoldman · March 2019

@MartiniDaniels im trying ebon and powerful assualt jewlery/back bar. That freed up for melstrom s/b

ZeroXFF · March 2019

psychotic13 wrote: »

Was thinking dragon/ebon on a sorc, i used to tank on a sorc though i do have other characters i can respec if need be.

Monster set i dont know, i could run alot i guess. Bloodspawn id imagine though.

How much max health should i am for?

I'm using Dragon+Ebon on my DK, and with that setup I tanked basically everything. For monster set, if you aren't a DK, Templar or a Nord, Lord Warden would be best option IMO as it brings you to the resist cap without having to think about resistances in any other part of your build. On DK you would be way over spell resist cap when Lord Warden procs, so unless you're also a Nord, I think Chudan is best there as it saves you 2.7k mag every 20s.

And if you are a Nord, you can basically choose any gear you want. Probably the best monster set in that case would be Stonekeeper. It's like free automatic 3-stat pots with 20s cool down. Thurvokun is a good option too, as well as Blood Spawn (the last one especially on DKs as it helps with sustain too while allowing better horn uptime).

Now I personally don't like Alkosh in general, but in trials it's a big DPS boost for the group. In 4-man content not so much as there are a lot of trash fights that don't last long enough to justify it, and unless you run with a group actively supplying you with synergies, or you have a magsorc and magplar as DDs with you, it's not really worth it. Torugs is probably better in 4-mans (with Crusher enchant on back bar ice staff with blockade now that 1h enchants were nerfed). Another good buff set for 4-mans is Galenwe (not so good for trials because it doesn't scale with group size).

Other sets that allow for interesting builds are Werewolf Hide (running it with Blood Spawn and Dragon on my Warden, and I basically never leave the forest), and Hunt Leader, with the latter giving insane amounts of stam on tanks that run with a pet (i.e. Sorcs and NBs with shades) and also healing you.

BejaProphet · March 2019

As a note, the Alkosh giving 4.5% damage is wrong.

First, monster resistances are weighted differently such that 500 resistance equals 1% mitigation. So Alkosh’s 3000 debuff equals 6% resistance, not 4.5%.

Second, stripping 6% resistance does not equal a flat 6% boost to the group’s damage output. The math doesn’t work like that.

The max monster resistances is 18,500. That is resisting 37% of the damage. Meaning my team is doing only 63% of their potential damage.

When I give 6% back through Alkosh they are now doing 69% of their potential damage. That is actually about a 9.5% increase in the amount they were doing.

6 / 63= 0.095

Now Alkosh will almost never be the only penetration being applied, so that is only a max case.

So Alkosh, while up, boosts DPS varying between 6% and 9.5%.

Whether that changes your opinion on the set is for you to decide.

MartiniDaniels · March 2019

Emmagoldman wrote: »

@MartiniDaniels im trying ebon and powerful assualt jewlery/back bar. That freed up for melstrom s/b

Yep, power assault allows to use 2-piece s&b which are nice and interesting to use. So i now have both setups in dressing room alkosh+PA+Asylum s&b or ebon+PA+Asylum s&b and I like both. Though in organised groups it's still ebon+alkosh, a lot of people can't bear the thought to be without ebon bonus even with new extra HP from food.

MartiniDaniels · March 2019

OP, anyway alkosh is VERY situational in dungeons, especially in those where tank is direly needed. It increases chances to nuke but if dps is not enough to nuke, then it all turns to a lot of running to do mechanics, boss teleporting by scripts across all the battlefield, rare synergies and so on, which turns alkosh completely useless. So best way is to keep several interchangeable sets in backpack (ideally saved in dressing room) and changing them depending on group dps/next boss/healer abilities.
For me it's like:
Alkosh+PA if dps are rocking
Ebon+PA if dps are below 16k HP
Cyrodiil's crest+PA if healer sucks
Cyrodiil's crest+Battalion defender if there is no healer at all
Ebon+Alkosh if people need to see red balls to feel comfortable

MattT1988 · March 2019

As long as this discussion is going, what do people think of Galanwe? Keep in mind I’m asking this not knowing exactly how many different ways to get Empowered.

Tasear · March 2019

psychotic13 wrote: »

Was thinking dragon/ebon on a sorc, i used to tank on a sorc though i do have other characters i can respec if need be.

Monster set i dont know, i could run alot i guess. Bloodspawn id imagine though.

How much max health should i am for?

Maybe try new tank set storekeeper was it?

Tasear · March 2019

MattT1988 wrote: »

As long as this discussion is going, what do people think of Galanwe? Keep in mind I’m asking this not knowing exactly how many different ways to get Empowered.

Doesn't proc very often or so it's been said.

MattT1988 · March 2019

Tasear wrote: »

MattT1988 wrote: »

As long as this discussion is going, what do people think of Galanwe? Keep in mind I’m asking this not knowing exactly how many different ways to get Empowered.

Doesn't proc very often or so it's been said.

Is 50% considered low for an empower proc? Legit question, I’m not sure.