nightblades and templars 10% crit
rogenep360
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So nightblades and templars get 10% more crit damage than the other 3 classes, Do the other classes get something in return?
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Czirne✭✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »So nightblades and templars get 10% more crit damage than the other 3 classes, Do the other classes get something in return?
What are you proposing? To make all classes identical, everyone has everything to the point there is no difference between classes whatsoever? yeaaa.... no.Edited by Czirne on February 22, 2019 8:00PMI believe in lagless Cyrodiil!6 -
rogenep360✭✭Well they get 10% more crit damege that is a free minor force, maybe other classes should get 10% in other areas ( hp, resists, spell-weapon damage, etc.) so they are not the same but have that something extra that at the moment only those 2 classes have out of 50
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dangutang✭✭Yep, they do. Look it up on the build editor or somewhere else if you're curious. For example, sorcs and wardens get a % bonus to certain damage stats per ability slotted. Dks get minor brutality. All sorts of stuff.5
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Aznox✭✭✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »So nightblades and templars get 10% more crit damage than the other 3 classes, Do the other classes get something in return?
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:SkillsAznox
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Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭Every class does something unique / differently to other classes. For an example DK's have major mending or wardens have the 10% hp buff. Well almost every class, I'm not too sure what the purpose of stam sorc is right now other than for dark deal / streak, but hopefully that gets fixed for Elsweyr.Overload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.1 -
rogenep360✭✭I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring0
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Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
We also don't have major sorcery and no extra DMG in our passives. Nightblades don't haveburst healing either.
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Vajrak✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
Well this is blatantly false...
All level one, no passives or gear, Templar and Nightblade will have....50% crit damage.
the 10% crit damage from Templar comes from the Piercing Spear passive, in the Aedric Spear line, first able to put a point into at at rank 8 (5%) and the second point at rank 18 (10%) --- not sure where you are seeing level 1 with no passives giving 2 ranks in a PASSIVE, and requires an Aedric Spear skill to be slotted.
As for Nightblade, it is, again, a passive, Hemorrhage, in the Assassination skill line, the first point opening at rank 39 (5%) and the second at rank 50 (10%), AND requires an Assassination ability to be slotted.
So, let's for a second assume you have an actually functioning mind, and compare apples to apples:
Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, at 8/18 gets: 25% bonus to Burning/Poisoned (1 rank) 250(1 rank)/500(2 ranks) Stamina restore (5s CD) for applying poisoned, OR 500 Magicka restore for applying Burning. So bonus damage on a high influence DoT effect, AND resource management.
At 39/50, Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, gets: Flame/Poison AoE increase 3/6%, and 12/25% cost reduction on poison abilities.
Not enough?
Sorc, Dark Magic: 8/18 cost reductions 3/5% All abilities, 39/50 on activation spell crit (657) self and party for 20s
Sorc, Storm Calling: 8/18 recovery 10% Magicka, 39/50 Spell AND Weapon damage 1/2% increase per sorcerer ability slotted
Not enough?
Warden, Animal Companion 39/50 1/3% Damage Done per Animal companion ability slotted
Warden, Winters Embrace 39/50 3/6% Increase to magic/frost damage done
So, what you are referring to is not only blatantly false, as in it has multiple requirements (a MINIMUM of 3 skill points spent, the levels required to get those skill points AND the ability ranking in the respective tree, along with slotting a skill of that tree), but also outright ignorant as EVERY CLASS has not only a way to boost it's damage, but to do so on a rather more consistent basis, minimizing reliance on RNG to smile on you for crits to get a 10% bonus, which in turn means getting more efficiency out of crit gear to minimize the RNG impact while still being able to boost damage across the board whether or not a crit lands.
When it comes to CP adjustments taken into consideration, it just gives Templar/Nightblade a few more points to put into the relevant damage type % bonus to their spec vs the crit % damage bonus.
Do the other classes get something in return:
Sorc with the capability to boost their damage spell/weapon damage an extra 12% (Both, not one or the other)---Stam Sorc can actually push it higher with a mix of class skills and Flawless Dawnbreaker
Dragonknight with a 25% boost to 2 extremely relevant DoT effects combined with resource restore
Warden with a capability to boost damage up to 18%, or just a flat damage increase of 6% with no prerequisite outside of type, and if you think that isn't much, I'd like to remind you Ice Comet (Mages Guild) does frost damage, Elemental Weapon (Psijic) is Magic Damage, Force Pulse has a frost/cold component so will be slightly higher than others using it.
So I think the REAL question here is who left you alone with a Skooma Bubbler?Edited by Vajrak on February 23, 2019 7:07AM9 -
Vajrak✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
We also don't have major sorcery and no extra DMG in our passives. Nightblades don't haveburst healing either.
Extra Damage: Burning Light --- try again please (RNG proc, but is still extra damage)
Extra Damage: Master Assassin -- 10% increase to weapon/spell damage while sneaking OR invisible.
Lack of class based burst heal --- Siphoning Ult morph, initial burst +4s HoT +30% efficiency boost to it. Not one I'd want to rely on but it IS there, so try again please.0 -
juhislihis19✭✭✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, at 8/18 gets: 25% bonus to Burning/Poisoned (1 rank) 250(1 rank)/500(2 ranks) Stamina restore (5s CD) for applying poisoned, OR 500 Magicka restore for applying Burning. So bonus damage on a high influence DoT effect, AND resource management.
At 39/50, Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, gets: Flame/Poison AoE increase 3/6%, and 12/25% cost reduction on poison abilities.
Dragonknight with a 25% boost to 2 extremely relevant DoT effects combined with resource
Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly.
Poison/Flame damage boost to AOE skills is another joke passive, which effects ridiculously few skills.
2 extremely relevant DOTs, you mean Venomous Claw and Noxious Breath? First one is decent, but of course worse than ie. Rending so its easily left out, and the second skill is just plain terrible. Needless to say they were already the least expensive skills before the passive got "buffed"'.
So when comparing passives, just leave DK out. They are not even comparable to anyone else, that hard they've been nerfed.0 -
Vajrak✭✭✭juhislihis19 wrote: »
Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly.
Poison/Flame damage boost to AOE skills is another joke passive, which effects ridiculously few skills.
2 extremely relevant DOTs, you mean Venomous Claw and Noxious Breath? First one is decent, but of course worse than ie. Rending so its easily left out, and the second skill is just plain terrible. Needless to say they were already the least expensive skills before the passive got "buffed"'.
So when comparing passives, just leave DK out. They are not even comparable to anyone else, that hard they've been nerfed.juhislihis19 wrote: »rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, at 8/18 gets: 25% bonus to Burning/Poisoned (1 rank) 250(1 rank)/500(2 ranks) Stamina restore (5s CD) for applying poisoned, OR 500 Magicka restore for applying Burning. So bonus damage on a high influence DoT effect, AND resource management.
At 39/50, Dragonknight, Ardent Flame, gets: Flame/Poison AoE increase 3/6%, and 12/25% cost reduction on poison abilities.
Dragonknight with a 25% boost to 2 extremely relevant DoT effects combined with resource
Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly.
Poison/Flame damage boost to AOE skills is another joke passive, which effects ridiculously few skills.
2 extremely relevant DOTs, you mean Venomous Claw and Noxious Breath? First one is decent, but of course worse than ie. Rending so its easily left out, and the second skill is just plain terrible. Needless to say they were already the least expensive skills before the passive got "buffed"'.
So when comparing passives, just leave DK out. They are not even comparable to anyone else, that hard they've been nerfed.
Weapon enchants 20%
Standard ability 10%
Area of effect abilities 5%
Damage over time abilities 3%
Area of effect damage over time abilities 1%
Not saying DK hasn't been nerfed hard, thus why I made sure to list both; the restore is conditional on a status effect, but it still is extra damage, and with AoE damage, DoTs, standards, i.e multiple ways to proc is still not worth ignoring---and a 25% reduction on poison cost abilities IS still something (I'm still in favor of buff magDK, but the OP's point was that they don't have a clue that other classes have buffs in their passives also).Edited by Vajrak on February 23, 2019 10:42AM0 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭. Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly. .
This is just wrong. As a magdk, you are procing it off cool down.
Weapon enchants 20%
Standard ability 10%
Area of effect abilities 5%
Damage over time abilities 3%
Area of effect damage over time abilities 1%
Light and Heavy Attacks 0%
That is the base chance for ablitys in game. Burning, concussed and chilled chances are doubled when you have a staff equipped. Plus if you have bsw on, you get and 20% chance to proc another, unique burning status effect. It is a great passive for magdks.
Poison is another matter, though if you have a poison enchantment on your weapon, you do get a good deal from it.1 -
Vajrak✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: ». Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly. .
This is just wrong. As a magdk, you are procing it off cool down.
Weapon enchants 20%
Standard ability 10%
Area of effect abilities 5%
Damage over time abilities 3%
Area of effect damage over time abilities 1%
Light and Heavy Attacks 0%
That is the base chance for ablitys in game. Burning, concussed and chilled chances are doubled when you have a staff equipped. Plus if you have bsw on, you get and 20% chance to proc another, unique burning status effect. It is a great passive for magdks.
Poison is another matter, though if you have a poison enchantment on your weapon, you do get a good deal from it.
Feel the (Burning) love :P0 -
juhislihis19✭✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: ». Having played all classes except Sorcerer, that DKs "sustain" passive is a joke compared to everyone elses. Applying Poisoned/Burning status from a DOT is ridiculously low. Its 3 or 5% chance if I remember correctly. .
This is just wrong. As a magdk, you are procing it off cool down.
Weapon enchants 20%
Standard ability 10%
Area of effect abilities 5%
Damage over time abilities 3%
Area of effect damage over time abilities 1%
Light and Heavy Attacks 0%
That is the base chance for ablitys in game. Burning, concussed and chilled chances are doubled when you have a staff equipped. Plus if you have bsw on, you get and 20% chance to proc another, unique burning status effect. It is a great passive for magdks.
Poison is another matter, though if you have a poison enchantment on your weapon, you do get a good deal from it.
But for StamDKs, the chance to proc the Poisoned status effect is still 3%, correct? As they only have 2 Poison skills, both DOTs.
Poison enchant unfortunately is very unfavorable compared to Defile and Vulnerability you can get from other Status effects..
Maybe I should reiterate, that StamDKs sustain is certainly worse than anyone elses! But even mDKs have to rely on proc chances, vs. Wardens who just need a slotted skill and NBs who get 15% passively.
I wouldn't nerf NB or Templar. I don't mind the extra 10% crit damage. I just wish they would balance the class passives better!0 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭. But for StamDKs, the chance to proc the Poisoned status effect is still 3%, correct? As they only have 2 Poison skills, both DOTs.
So both claw and poison injection are direct damage followed by a dot. So the first hit is a standard ablity, 10% and then every tick of the dot after has a 3% chance.. Poison enchant unfortunately is very unfavorable compared to Defile and Vulnerability you can get from other Status effects..
Are you talking PvP? Because you are very wrong if you are talking PvE..Maybe I should reiterate, that StamDKs sustain is certainly worse than anyone elses! But even mDKs have to rely on proc chances, vs. Wardens who just need a slotted skill and NBs who get 15% passively.
Stamdks get battle roar and helping hands as well, that counts for a lot. And they get 25% less on poison skills, yes that is just 2-3 skills but it is there.. I wouldn't nerf NB or Templar. I don't mind the extra 10% crit damage. I just wish they would balance the class passives better!
No need to yell man. You can't play each class the same, they all have different strengths and weaknesses, as they ought to otherwise what would be the point of having classes.Edited by Lightspeedflashb14_ESO on February 23, 2019 1:11PM0 -
Vajrak✭✭✭It's also derailing it---magDK may need some adjustment, but the point of this thread was "oh well Templar and Nightblade have this OP ability that costs them nothing!" --- and it costs them quite a bit in terms of passives and bar slots.
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exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭rogenep360 wrote: »I know other classes have those kind of buffs, sorcercers get the minor expedition, but they have to activate an ability, lets say that you create 5 chars with same races, they all at lvl 1 without passives or gear or anything, everyone will have 50% crit damage default except for templar an nightblade that have 60%, thats what im referring
We also don't have major sorcery and no extra DMG in our passives. Nightblades don't haveburst healing either.
Absolutely they do, just not for themselves.0 -
SoLooney✭✭✭✭✭Each class has their own unique buffs.
Are they balanced? Is another questionEdited by SoLooney on February 23, 2019 10:06PM1 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Yep, they do. Look it up on the build editor or somewhere else if you're curious. For example, sorcs and wardens get a % bonus to certain damage stats per ability slotted. Dks get minor brutality. All sorts of stuff.
Except every class also gets a minor buff so minor brutality doesn't really count. But I get your point.
Edited by Ragnarock41 on February 24, 2019 8:19PM0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭What's the complaint here??
Why do dragonknights get extra fire and prison damage??? I want it on a nightblade!!0 -
rogenep360✭✭Nightblades are not balanced against other classes, they have everything and thsts ok, just bring other classes to te same lvl0