How would you change the champion system?

Tasear · December 2018

josiahva wrote: »

CrimsonGTX wrote: »

Probably make it more role base. If your desire role is DPS then the constellations points that represent your role should only appear, same with Healers and Tanks. Maybe this way they can expand the constellation system with new perks for each role. This may also help people who like to play stamina race as a magicka class and in vice versa. If ZOS want hybrids builds to be possible then this idea won't work, but as it stands now hybrid builds don't work much and Zos likes separating skills such as Path of Darkness/Strife.

This isn't a thought-out idea but it is the only thing I thought about that could make more sense than people saying "remove it".

jainiadral wrote: »

Any MMORPG that requires four years to max out its endgame systems is a MMORPG that's going to end up shut down long before the first player hits the finish line

Most endgame systems don't require years-- they require months. The most heinous example I can think of is SWTOR's Galactic Command. Even as a solo player who hates grinding, and who burned out multiple times trying to get to rank 300, I still managed in about five or six months. They were sucky, awful, terrible months that made me hate my main, but they did end-- eventually. The legacy system required a similar amount of time to max out, except that happened passively in leveling both mains and alts. GW2's PoF masteries took me a couple of weeks. Max leveling my first character there took a couple of months, I think, right about the time HoT was released.

This game's leveling process is extremely long by comparison.

BDO would like to say hello lol, That game is a journey to reach "end-game". I don't mind and like it but the Devs are meh and the lack of PvE content stops it from reaching it's full potential imo. ESO leveling process is not long to me, it's overall a VERY casual friendly and easy to get into to do end-game content...whether that's PvE or PvP.

NO! Enough pigeonholing people into certain roles...this would make the problem even worse.

How do you give people diversity when everyone can do everything?

kypranb14_ESO · December 2018

Upon a quick brainstorm, this is what I have come up with.

The Warrior trees would contain everything related to Health Recovery, Healing Received, Blocking, and Heavy Armor, as well as Thick Skinned and Ironclad.

The Thief trees would contain everything related to roll dodge, sneak, Physical Penetration, Weapon Critical Damage, Stamina Recovery, and Medium Armor, as well as Hardy.

The Mage trees would contain everything related to Damage Shields, Healing Done, Spell Penetration, Spell Critical Damage, Magicka Recovery, and Light Armor, as well as Elemental Defender.

In addition to this, I think that you should have to pick 1 branch of each tree to use. For instance, if I choose to put points into Elfborn in The Apprentice branch under The Mage "tree", I would not be able to put points into Master-At-Arms in The Atronach branch. I would however be able to put points into one "branch" of each of the other "trees".

I'd also like to see the "Armor Specialty" nodes/stars redesigned to be useful. A few ideas:
Light Armor Expert- Increase the potency of your light armor passives while wearing 7 pieces of light armor by X%
Medium Armor Expert- Increase the potency of your medium armor passives while wearing 7 pieces of medium armor by X%
Heavy Armor Expert- Increase the potency of your heavy armor passives while wearing 7 pieces of heavy armor by X%

Trees: The Warrior, The Thief, The Mage.
Branches: The Steed, The Lady, The Lord, The Tower, The Lover, The Shadow, The Apprentice, The Atronach, The Ritual.

I may add more to this later...

Nolic1 · December 2018

First off not to sound rude but if you look at were we are with CP we are at 810 to max all the tree's you will need 3600cp in total or 24 years from now there about at the 120cp a year. CP does one thing it makes the cookie cutter easier to use and to max out with its systems now. Most of the passive stars you unlock do little to nothing but help to where to point stars make the power creep and there is not really that much of a creep if you look at the time it takes to reach the total max CP 3600.

At 300cp you get the 20% increase to your stats that is health, magicka and stamina and then you get the passive point increases that at varying degrees of points used cap at 100cp per star so you could have 15% to 35% or 5280 and the one thats 3640 I believe for crit damage reduction so yeah there is power creep ther but with everyone running cookie cutter cp placement the creep is based on how much CP you have to the cap of 810 for now.

So no matter how they changed it there would always be cookie cutter builds and CP allocation and the only way to fix the lack of diversity this game has would be to rework or make a whole new game that does not allow for cookie cutter set ups or builds but that will never happen cause if there is a will there is a way. Look at games like League of Legends that game is poorly balanced cause there is a meta and even games like Call of Duty and even Fortnite have metas why because the game has stats that are inflated but certain values that offer the best end results and the player flock to it thats why ESO's meta has not changed sense one Tamril there is not reason when it works like it does and has the best results and thats why this game is and will always be in the state it is cause you can not balance what has a value to it.

So yeah they could change it but no matter what they changed it to it would always have a cookie cutter meta that the community would want you to follow and that is why we have all this fake tank healer damage grips on the forums is it is the meta players mostly complaining people are not playing the meta and ruining the game for them while there doing the same in return. Yeah go ahead say I am wrong but the truth is games will never be truly balanced unless you make it Minecraft and even that game has a meta.

Tholian1 · December 2018

I want to make and save different cp presets. I have no problem with it still costing gold to change between them. Other than that, the system is fine for me.

Rake · December 2018

block it for enemies

max_only · December 2018

The solution to power creep is better level design not getting rid of the cp system.

Or like I said, if you go down one route to the end you can’t go down the other routes as far. So if there is a defense tree and you get all the way to the end you can only go 1/3 of the way down the healing tree and damage tree.

Currently the structure of the trees let you be well rounded. In each constellation you can have all there is that is worth having.

If they restructure it so you can’t be well rounded, you’d have to specialize.

Then you can have people who go partway down the 3 trees (healing, defense, damage) and recieve no big bonus (which is good for content like vMA).

You’d have people who want to hybrid (go 2/3 the way down damage and down defense but 0 in healing, which would be good for pvp for example).

And you’d have people who specialize and get the boomtastic bonus from going all the way down one tree and only the first few points in the other two, (which is what we do now for content like vet trials, ain’t no hybrid main tanks in trials for example, trial tanks don’t give a snip about damage).

munster1404 · December 2018

max_only wrote: »

The solution to power creep is better level design not getting rid of the cp system.

Or like I said, if you go down one route to the end you can’t go down the other routes as far. So if there is a defense tree and you get all the way to the end you can only go 1/3 of the way down the healing tree and damage tree.

Currently the structure of the trees let you be well rounded. In each constellation you can have all there is that is worth having.

If they restructure it so you can’t be well rounded, you’d have to specialize.

Then you can have people who go partway down the 3 trees (healing, defense, damage) and recieve no big bonus (which is good for content like vMA).

You’d have people who want to hybrid (go 2/3 the way down damage and down defense but 0 in healing, which would be good for pvp for example).

And you’d have people who specialize and get the boomtastic bonus from going all the way down one tree and only the first few points in the other two, (which is what we do now for content like vet trials, ain’t no hybrid main tanks in trials for example, trial tanks don’t give a snip about damage).

Reminds me of my LotRO Guardian's trait tree.

TheDarkoil · December 2018

I want to see a real diverse leveling system that allows an either or option, not one that has been going for so long that there are enough points to carpet nearly every single node without absolute min maxing. I run my own build and I'm fine with that but as far as the bigger community goes there seems to be either the meta way or gtfo way.

Valrien · December 2018

Delete it. Not even joking, I would delete it. It has caused more harm to the game than good

Tasear · January 2019

... opps wrong post

RebornV3x · January 2019

My idea is just like Skyrim have different paths based on weapons, schools of magic, professions, and other things that the more you spec into let say Destruction you will pretty much be a glass cannon you'll have highest magic dps but little to no defense etc. They'll have to do something eventually once we hit about 1200 CP things will really get out of hand.

Tasear · January 2019

Now that you all know! How would adjust the system.

Ysbriel · February 2019

The only thing i would change about CP is some of the unlockable passives, like the amount of points it takes you to unlock treasure hunter or relocate it to a more accessible tree. Other than that i always see some people complain that “CP ruined the game”, Well for PVP there 3 non CP opinions Battlegrounds, Sotha Sil and Shor and in PvE you can simply not allocate any points in the champion system and play NORMAL dungeos and the Overland content and also make a “unique and diverse” build while at it.

Peekachu99 · February 2019

The problem is that CP are so firmly entrenched in game design and difficulty (of vet content) that a complete excision would cause more damage than it’s worth. We’d be looking at a year or more of patches to get the game back into shape.

I like some of the suggestions of an either/ or mentality, where you can pick a damaging perk—let’s say—but then can’t take the healing perk in the same constellation. That would prevent builds that are capable of anything and everything with no drawbacks, and bring “meaningful choices” (ugg, that buzzword) into the game.

Demonhunter · February 2019

If you take out the champion system, then your going to have tons of re-balancing issues that will probably take an extra year to find the right balance again. It's almost like losing real life skills and learning all over again.
What I suggest is to keep the CP and don't raise it anymore but allow players to play around with distributing the points.
Second, introduce another system of reward that relates to the gear sets. For example, any future DLC's will have the following formula ;

Every New DLC

> CP 810 requirement

Novice Dungeon 1 = Set 1A (normal) --> stamina based , Set 2A (normal) --> magicka based
must complete
Expert Dungeon 2 = Set 1B (perfected) --> stamina based , Set 2B (perfected) --> magicka based
must complete
Hardcore Dungeon 3 = Set 1C (mastered) --> stamina based, Set 2C (mastered) --> magicka based

Example:
Normal set --> Frozen Watcher
(2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(3 items) Adds 1206 Max Health
(4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
(5 items) Summon a blizzard around you while blocking, inflicting 1000 Frost Damage every 1 second to enemies within your blizzard. Your blizzard has a 15% chance of inflicting Chilled on enemies damage.

Perfected ---> Frozen Watcher
(2 items) Adds 2096 Max Stamina
(3 items) Adds 2206 Max Health
(4 items) Adds 2096 Max Stamina
(5 items) Summon a blizzard around you while blocking, inflicting 2000 Frost Damage every 1 second to enemies within your blizzard. Your blizzard has a 20% chance of inflicting Chilled on enemies damage.

Mastered ---> Frozen Watcher
(2 items) Adds 3096 Max Stamina
(3 items) Adds 3206 Max Health
(4 items) Adds 3096 Max Stamina
(5 items) Summon a blizzard around you while blocking, inflicting 3000 Frost Damage every 1 second to enemies within your blizzard. Your blizzard has a 25% chance of inflicting Chilled on enemies damage.

Now this is just example on how they can proceed, the same set can be found buffed for each level of a different dungeon each more difficult than the other through a story-line (by completing the 1st dungeon so you can gain access to the 2nd and so on). Now you might say how is this more different than other mmos? Well, it's not copy and paste if that's what you think.

This does force more coop play and require more focus on specialized group play, instead of using the dungeon finder. Basically the dungeon finder will be useful for Novice Dungeon 1 but anything harder will require a coordinated group to handle but without making the dungeon finder totally obsolete.

Now the crafters can also craft these sets but they still have to run those dungeons to find the high level mats and have to be the required level. But those mats can be found by grinding. It will be possible for a high level crafters to craft "mastered" sets without completing the Hardcore dungeons with a combination of purchasing them on the guild stores and running them.

SirSilver · February 2019

Tasear wrote: »

If you could alter champion system then what would you do?

QOL improvements would be nice, such as wayshrines in houses.

However, I do not feel that the champion point system has to be replaced.

It appears that a number of people complain about power creep. 30 points really doesn't add a ton of power creep once a player is already at CAP. I actually believe that it is positive that players slowly get stronger, as it makes it more likely that they will eventually be able to complete the tougher content. Are players concerned that too many people have completed trials or arenas? I still see groups that have plenty of difficulty completing older content. Is it really necessary that dungeons that have been out a year are just as tough to complete?

Another complaint I see is the difficulty of reaching cap. To start off, I remember when it was VR, and every few patches they increased the VR requirement, which I felt was much worse. However, with the CP cap, if a player simply uses up enlightenment between each quarter they will earn at least 90 CP, currently at 700 CP it takes about 390K xp to level up. A friend started playing a year ago and really just uses enlightenment and is at 700CP. Also, you currently do not need to replace gear. If you want BIS gear, then yes, however the older gear really doesn't lose strength.

I also believe that the CP system encourages alts.

Maybe one point would be to have players receive 160 CP after reaching 50, because that is when gear actually stays constant.

Hiruda · February 2019

i'll go back to the old veteran rank, without cp

carlos424 · February 2019

I’m not sure how to fix the system, but the mistake ZOS made was increasing 30 points like every 3 months. Just too much too fast. If they had done maybe 15 points twice a year, the CP system would have lasted 10 or more years.
I guess they could start giving fewer points and limiting the amount of CP raises each year, but seems a little late to start this.

Starlight_Knight · February 2019

i would tie achievements to it in some way. for example if you kill x amount of x mobs you do more damage to said mob. like 3% extra or something..

same with pvp alliance ranks - a grand overlord for instance should deal more damage to players say 5% or so.

Also add more build diversity in the CP tree. eg. if you spend x points in this tree your attacks will deal x kind of damage.
or adding x amount of points into say the "shadow" tree when you crouch you immediately enter stealth.

Basically add diversity and reward. for pve and pvp. instead of everyone pretty much running carbon copies in their cp tree

bardx86 · February 2019

just get rid of it

bardx86 · February 2019

Just make it PVE only?

Girl_Number8 · February 2019

I think they should go back to the vet system like it use to be. It wouldn't take very long for everyone who didn't experience that to cry for the cp system to come back in full. I think they should create an additional constellation to add buffs to crafting and other interesting things for us to add our unused cp to.

Since we have cp and non cp campaigns, I don't see a reason to nerf it or remove it.

Sevalaricgirl · February 2019

Remove it entirely.

jainiadral · February 2019

Now that the system has a cap (YES!), the only tweaks I'd like to see would be;

a) the percentage boosts move to a simple rounding system-- .6% and above rounds to the next percent up, while .5% and below remains at the current percent (really want this)

b) slightly lower the XP required per point (would be nice)

Otherwise, leave the system alone.

Girl_Number8 · February 2019

Starlight_Knight wrote: »

i would tie achievements to it in some way. for example if you kill x amount of x mobs you do more damage to said mob. like 3% extra or something..

same with pvp alliance ranks - a grand overlord for instance should deal more damage to players say 5% or so.

Also add more build diversity in the CP tree. eg. if you spend x points in this tree your attacks will deal x kind of damage.
or adding x amount of points into say the "shadow" tree when you crouch you immediately enter stealth.

Basically add diversity and reward. for pve and pvp. instead of everyone pretty much running carbon copies in their cp tree

This is horrible idea because a lot of people just get their ranks from zerging and mindless ap farming, much like the dolmen groups for leveling up. And if people are copying and pasting cp, then they are not taking the time to have learned anything for themselves. Granted, there will be similarities since there are limited areas that cp can be put. What will add diversity is Zos buffing certain class skills and passive so classes can be on par with each other in someway. Rather then just having two to three fav classes that always become the meta because Zos creates it that way cp or not.

tspecherb14_ESO · February 2019

I think hey need to keep some sort of alternative advancement. They could diversify by breaking out the damage and defense types. Instead of a straight increase to all when you add your CP, add it to specific lines like fire, ice, disease, blunt, sharp. Same with defense. This would slow the power creep and add diversity. Could keep or diversify the power points as well (30/75/etc). Spice it up a bit for some more unique builds the deeper you go into a branch (fire burst, bleeds, concussion, crowd control).

Probably should have some CP save slots to quick swap (out of combat, dps v. tank or dps/defense types). While at it do the same for armor set-ups

Give some free CP save slots, maybe allow some new ones gained as CP increases. Maybe crown store some extra slots, or would that be considered pay to win?

Red_Feather · February 2019

I'd make every node have a positive and negative. And putting points into a node raises the positive and the negative. Then it is specialization and not power creep.

Iskiab · February 2019

Change it so as soon as someone hits 50 they start with 160 cp points. The time between cp 1-160 is silly, you can’t gear up and you’re thrown into the same pool other level 50s. It’s a limbo land that should just be removed.