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Lost in finding the right gear for tanks

Saber91
Saber91
Hey everyone,
The title says it all, I am a 180 CP DK Tank as of right now. I am being told so many different sets to go for and it is a little overwhelming to me. I currently have plague doctor chest, shield and sword, Ebon helmet and boots and the rest is all non finished. I am being told that I should be changing things, shadowrend stuff from undaunted, lord warden etc.

I really don't know where to go about it, I wish there was like 2-3 clear sets to go for but there seems to be like 5-6.

What really is the best to start with and what is the final goal sort of gear I need to aim for?

Much appreciated if you could guide me at this time.
  • zvavi
    zvavi
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    Ebon is a great set to start with. You want to have the 5 bonus with it. Don't use ebon on weapons, it is still bugged.
    Plague doc is fine.
    Another option is torug's pact with crusher enchantment (lowering the enemy resists by 2700 when everything is upgraded).

    Generally. For every build in eso. You want to have two 5 pieces sets and one monster set(2 pieces).

    You have 7 equipment slots on body, 3 more Jewelry, and two more on EACH weapon bar (when you bar swap the bonus doesn't count from the other bar, so usually when you don't have yet maelstrom weapons it will be the same set).

    The easy way to remember it is "one set on Jewelry and weapons" " one set on chest leg waist hands feet" and one monster set on shoulders/head.

    It is not only for tanks. I know a bit confusing, but the 12 slots makes it easy to wear 2 whole sets with a monster set as well pretty well.

    You can also have it more complicated and change where is what (monster sets are always head and shoulders) like 2 jewelry +weapons +1 body piece for one set, and 4 body pieces +1 jewelry for the other. Just make sure all the sets are active.
  • Moloch1514
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    After the mag shield nerf in Murkmire, I like running Imperium with Ebon to give HP and provide a nice shield to group members. I run Bloodspawn for now until I can get a Thorvukan head piece.
    PC-NA
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    So, the current three main sets for end-game tanks are Ebon Armory, Alkosh, and Torug's Pact. This might change a bit as the PTS hashes out the new meta, especially with the enchantment changes, so keep an eye on that.

    Torug's is crafted, so easy to acquire. Ebon Armory comes from the Crypt of Hearts dungeon and is strongest when used in a trial group. Alkosh is acquired from doing a trial.

    So obviously, that puts new tanks in a position where they need tanking gear to get tanking gear. Hence the other suggestions like Plague Doctor or Brands of the Imperium, Knightmare, or Livewire, what have you. There's also the fact that dungeons are more forgiving content than Trials, so theres not really a meta on the level of dungeons beyond "can you tank it or not."

    In short, there's a lot of sets that work for tanks depending on how you want to play, and you won't narrow it down to 2-3 must haves until you hit trials. I'll try to lay out some thoughts about how choosing tank sets works below.

    Typically, what you'll see in tank builds is an emphasis on being selfish or unselfish. "Selfish" sets aim to maximize the ability of the tank to do the job of a tank without providing much in the way of group support. "Unselfish" sets aim to give the tank the minimum resources/tankiness to do their job while maximizing group support. For example, a Green Pact/Plague Doctor Tank ought to have no trouble staying alive, while another tank might run Ebon Armory so their usual DDs can min-max for health. Trials tanks usually run support-oriented sets like Ebon, Alkosh, and Torugs because its a team effort - they min-max their tank role to add support for the whole group, allowing other members to min-max for higher DPS. Dungeon tanks can do whatever they want as min-maxing for group support is much less important.

    So my suggestion is this:
    Use whatever gear you need to in order to acquire your set of Ebon Armory. This is less potent in 4 man dungeons, but still useful and its a good set to have. Don't get it in weapons/shield because it's periodically bugged to reset health on bar swap which sucks when it effects the whole group. Plague Doctor is the "selfish" version of this set and is fine for dungeons if you find you prefer that level of content.

    Then start looking at monster sets and your second set.

    On Live, I'd say Torug's is a solid choice for 2nd set, but again, I'm not quite sure how that will shake down on the PTS. For normal dungeons, this second set can be whatever you want. On my MagDK, I've run Worm Cult, Knightmare, Dragonguard, Livewire, Torug's, Whitestrake's Retribution, Silks of the Sun, etc. Normal dungeons are forgiving enough that it doesnt really matter so much. For Veteran, you'll want to test out whether you like sets that buff you (extra health, resistances, damage, whatever you feel your build needs) vs buff the group. Some of this depends on the quality of your groups. If you PUG it, you may find that a little extra group buff doesnt actually help much and you are better with using a "selfish" build. Whereas a guild group might be able to take advantage of better group support. That goes for skills as well - Warhorns are great for a group that's doing well, but a low DPS PUG wont get as much benefit.

    When you get ready to do trials, get with a trials group and ask what they want from their tanks. If your team has specific things they want you to have, they'll let you know.

    Hope this helps!
    Edited by VaranisArano on January 25, 2019 12:43AM
  • Saber91
    Saber91
    I am going to say right now thank you for those posts, you've all given very valuable insight in terms of gear and I will look about how to get the bits I need.

    I am by all means not the best tank as I have a lot to learn but I am suffering from frustration from time to time. I am sometimes depending on the group having moments where there are a lot of ads and I can't aggro them all away and I am trying to bundle them together yet the DPS are taking their sweet time.

    Selenes web is a fine example, a little while ago I was doing the boss with the spirit beasts (The archer) I didn't have time to say but in that fight I was like I can take the beasts just focus on him because the beasts will just keep spawning. This however was not working and the fight took a very long time and they blamed me for not tanking them all. I was like I didn't have time to say I can handle damage from the beasts and boss but I need you to hit hard and fast.

    I am having a harder time with healers somehow not healing (I have tons of health and I wish I could type saying focus on healing dps I'll be fine) and DPS even with high CP players just not killing things fast enough.

    Is there a trick on how to aggro multiple people? I am used to like FF14 which has good AOE aggro options for tanks. I have my inner fire for range single target and the stab move. I assume talons don't aggro?

    I have joined a guild and they have put me in a trials chat to train me in the long haul and guide me but I need to build my CP for their main content. But they are going to do normal trials etc to get me into the swing of it all.

  • El_Borracho
    El_Borracho
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    @VaranisArano Awesome stuff. Out of curiosity, how do you feel about Defending Warrior, aka Resilient Yokeda? Love running it in PVP, but don't see it too often in PVE. Obviously, there are better sets for trials, but it seem like it has utility in group dungeons.
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    @VaranisArano Awesome stuff. Out of curiosity, how do you feel about Defending Warrior, aka Resilient Yokeda? Love running it in PVP, but don't see it too often in PVE. Obviously, there are better sets for trials, but it seem like it has utility in group dungeons.

    I haven't used it myself, but it certainly seems like it could be effective in dungeons. It seems to me that it would fit in with the same sort of builds that use Bahraha's Curse, Livewire, or Leeching Plate. So definitely a set with some utility, but not one that makes a lot of tank set lists. I suspect that's due to the lack of group support and difficulty of acquiring it.
  • Draxys
    Draxys
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    When you’re ready to start mixing in the undaunted monster sets, the end-game standards are Lord Warden, Earthgore, and 2 different pieces that grant magicka recovery (i.e. shadowrend + chokethorn). Magicka recovery is extremely important, and while you should be slotting Balance for major defense buffs/mag return, you may find yourself in situations where it’s not a good idea to trade away health.
    2013

    rip decibel
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    Saber91 wrote: »
    I am going to say right now thank you for those posts, you've all given very valuable insight in terms of gear and I will look about how to get the bits I need.

    I am by all means not the best tank as I have a lot to learn but I am suffering from frustration from time to time. I am sometimes depending on the group having moments where there are a lot of ads and I can't aggro them all away and I am trying to bundle them together yet the DPS are taking their sweet time.

    Selenes web is a fine example, a little while ago I was doing the boss with the spirit beasts (The archer) I didn't have time to say but in that fight I was like I can take the beasts just focus on him because the beasts will just keep spawning. This however was not working and the fight took a very long time and they blamed me for not tanking them all. I was like I didn't have time to say I can handle damage from the beasts and boss but I need you to hit hard and fast.

    I am having a harder time with healers somehow not healing (I have tons of health and I wish I could type saying focus on healing dps I'll be fine) and DPS even with high CP players just not killing things fast enough.

    Is there a trick on how to aggro multiple people? I am used to like FF14 which has good AOE aggro options for tanks. I have my inner fire for range single target and the stab move. I assume talons don't aggro?

    I have joined a guild and they have put me in a trials chat to train me in the long haul and guide me but I need to build my CP for their main content. But they are going to do normal trials etc to get me into the swing of it all.

    Hey, its awesome that you are learning to tank!


    So, here's the thing with aggro and taunting in dungeons. There is no AOE taunt. Only single target. You've already got the tools you'll need (Inner Fire and Pierce Armor) for 99% of your taunting needs. So you can't taunt all the enemies, and actually, you shouldn't try. Trying to taunt everything (and retaunting because it only lasts 15 seconds) usually leaves you less able to do what you need to do, which is Crowd Control adds, taunt priority minibosses, and buff the group.

    Here's how I approach that. The goal is not 100% aggro management, the goal is battlefield control.

    You can generally grab the initial aggro of most enemies by hitting them first with an AOE ability. This initial aggro will only last for about 4-5 seconds before they refocus on someone else, so this does mean that Healers and DDs have to be able to take a hit from regular mobs. That's just how ESO tanking is designed - the tank can't 100% take all aggro from everything. (This also assumes that the DDs don't rush ahead and actually let you get the first AOE in. I long ago adopted the mantra of "If you aggro it, you can tank it until I get there.")

    Then, Crowd Control the mob (talons is perfect for this), taunt priority adds (minibosses and two-handers who can one-shot a DD), and if there's time, then I look to DK chains the ranged mobs into the group so they start taking AOE damage.

    If the fight is still going on at this point, I renew my crowd control and/or taunts and start buffing or DPSing as needed.

    Generally, the goal is to clump all the enemies into one tight group so the DDs can mow them down with AOEs. Again, the DDs and the Healer ought to be able to take some hits as long as you are tanking the big hits from minibosses and the like. A good tank positions the enemies so the group can do maximum DPS and focuses on controlling the serious threats.

    In a low DPS group, this gets rather more interesting. There have been some groups where, like you did in the Selene's fight, I will pull the miniboss out of the mob and tank it by myself until my DDs can wipe the adds and then deal with the miniboss. In your particular case, well, sometimes low DPS is just low DPS and no amount of battlefield control will make that go faster. I had a very similar experience to yours while running Vet Fang Lair with my friends on the Undead Menagerie.


    As for healers not healing and DDs not doing great damage, I can't speak to your groups, except to note that fake healers are a thing and that if you are looking for DDs that hit hard and burn bosses quickly, random groupfinder PUGs are not where I'd look. Even, or perhaps especially, the Vet Dungeon Groupfinder has a lot of people who queue as DD without doing great damage and a Vet Dungeon will take forever with 15k DPS in my experience.

    Guild groups tend to be better if you want faster runs. Barring that, asking in zone chat for the type of run you want may yield better results than random groups.

    Hope this helps!
  • Saber91
    Saber91
    Saber91 wrote: »
    I am going to say right now thank you for those posts, you've all given very valuable insight in terms of gear and I will look about how to get the bits I need.

    I am by all means not the best tank as I have a lot to learn but I am suffering from frustration from time to time. I am sometimes depending on the group having moments where there are a lot of ads and I can't aggro them all away and I am trying to bundle them together yet the DPS are taking their sweet time.

    Selenes web is a fine example, a little while ago I was doing the boss with the spirit beasts (The archer) I didn't have time to say but in that fight I was like I can take the beasts just focus on him because the beasts will just keep spawning. This however was not working and the fight took a very long time and they blamed me for not tanking them all. I was like I didn't have time to say I can handle damage from the beasts and boss but I need you to hit hard and fast.

    I am having a harder time with healers somehow not healing (I have tons of health and I wish I could type saying focus on healing dps I'll be fine) and DPS even with high CP players just not killing things fast enough.

    Is there a trick on how to aggro multiple people? I am used to like FF14 which has good AOE aggro options for tanks. I have my inner fire for range single target and the stab move. I assume talons don't aggro?

    I have joined a guild and they have put me in a trials chat to train me in the long haul and guide me but I need to build my CP for their main content. But they are going to do normal trials etc to get me into the swing of it all.

    Hey, its awesome that you are learning to tank!


    So, here's the thing with aggro and taunting in dungeons. There is no AOE taunt. Only single target. You've already got the tools you'll need (Inner Fire and Pierce Armor) for 99% of your taunting needs. So you can't taunt all the enemies, and actually, you shouldn't try. Trying to taunt everything (and retaunting because it only lasts 15 seconds) usually leaves you less able to do what you need to do, which is Crowd Control adds, taunt priority minibosses, and buff the group.

    Here's how I approach that. The goal is not 100% aggro management, the goal is battlefield control.

    You can generally grab the initial aggro of most enemies by hitting them first with an AOE ability. This initial aggro will only last for about 4-5 seconds before they refocus on someone else, so this does mean that Healers and DDs have to be able to take a hit from regular mobs. That's just how ESO tanking is designed - the tank can't 100% take all aggro from everything. (This also assumes that the DDs don't rush ahead and actually let you get the first AOE in. I long ago adopted the mantra of "If you aggro it, you can tank it until I get there.")

    Then, Crowd Control the mob (talons is perfect for this), taunt priority adds (minibosses and two-handers who can one-shot a DD), and if there's time, then I look to DK chains the ranged mobs into the group so they start taking AOE damage.

    If the fight is still going on at this point, I renew my crowd control and/or taunts and start buffing or DPSing as needed.

    Generally, the goal is to clump all the enemies into one tight group so the DDs can mow them down with AOEs. Again, the DDs and the Healer ought to be able to take some hits as long as you are tanking the big hits from minibosses and the like. A good tank positions the enemies so the group can do maximum DPS and focuses on controlling the serious threats.

    In a low DPS group, this gets rather more interesting. There have been some groups where, like you did in the Selene's fight, I will pull the miniboss out of the mob and tank it by myself until my DDs can wipe the adds and then deal with the miniboss. In your particular case, well, sometimes low DPS is just low DPS and no amount of battlefield control will make that go faster. I had a very similar experience to yours while running Vet Fang Lair with my friends on the Undead Menagerie.


    As for healers not healing and DDs not doing great damage, I can't speak to your groups, except to note that fake healers are a thing and that if you are looking for DDs that hit hard and burn bosses quickly, random groupfinder PUGs are not where I'd look. Even, or perhaps especially, the Vet Dungeon Groupfinder has a lot of people who queue as DD without doing great damage and a Vet Dungeon will take forever with 15k DPS in my experience.

    Guild groups tend to be better if you want faster runs. Barring that, asking in zone chat for the type of run you want may yield better results than random groups.

    Hope this helps!

    No, thank you! Very helpful and it will allow me to adapt my approach in the long haul. I think I definitely experienced fake healers. A lot of the issues I have which you have stated already is that some people who are ranged dps just attack without me going in. So I am frantically trying to get the aggro off because they rushed in. When it comes to big groups I did go for as many people as possible, I will now try and take the mini bosses and whatever add I can get my hands on. Thank you for this.
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