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What killed the Magicka Nightblade?
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OrdoHermetica✭✭✭✭✭
✭The combat balance team killed it. Maybe they were trying to to tone down stamblade, which they did, but magblade and saptanks suffered more.
Not sure they really did tone down stamblades all that much, to be honest. My stamblade has a much easier time with the whole murder business now, especially given that my targets when stamblading tend to be light armor users who now have squishy shields and limited stamina for dodge rolling.
I mean, yeah, there were some nerfs, but honestly nothing too terribly significant on the stam side of things. Unlike the mag side.0 -
milesrodneymcneely2_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You touched on something critical here, I think, particularly with your mention of Concealed Weapon.The mageblade 'kit' is inconsistent and synergizes within poorly. Instacast Fear, Soul Harvest, Concealed Weaon are all melee range abilities, but Impale and Assassin's will are slow and easily evaded ranged abilities. It's not difficult for a heavy armor user to get outside of impale's 25% execute range by the time it hits; other executes scale differenty.
Did I mention wings wings wings wings wings everywhere?
Am I the only one who thinks this ability needs to be adjusted? I think the 25% stealthed speed boost was probably overlooked when they normalized the speed bonuses a few patches ago. I REALLY think they should consider adding Major or Minor Breach to this skill to bring it in line with Surprise Attack. If not Spell Penetration, I think another secondary effect is warranted, though I'm not sure what.
What do y'all think?0 -
russelmmendoza✭✭✭✭✭
✭Nerf killed the magblade.
Zenimax killed the magblade.
Just bury it and let it rest.
Time to move on.0 -
OrdoHermetica✭✭✭✭✭
✭OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?Edited by OrdoHermetica on January 21, 2019 3:23AM0 -
SiAScORCH✭✭✭✭OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.0 -
Na0cho✭✭✭I’ve noticed the aw change has got me the most. I’m a potato and all but my build was always built around that burst and now it’s too easy (for me) to miss.
Now I’m looking for a build that doesn’t rely so much on that one skill( and I’m also worried about losing my fire damage because Dunmer)
Also I only do no cp pvp. Anyone got any suggestions?0 -
Exodium✭✭✭✭Since healing ward is now useless... Don't use it.
Mutagen, swallow, siphoning attacks, and degeneration is enough healing paired with troll king. Put cloak where your shield used to be.
Have you guys tried healing ward with the BRP resto? is the 30% a huge difference in terms of survivability in PvP environments? Maybe that can save the Magnb?0 -
zyk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭milesrodneymcneely2_ESO wrote: »
You touched on something critical here, I think, particularly with your mention of Concealed Weapon.The mageblade 'kit' is inconsistent and synergizes within poorly. Instacast Fear, Soul Harvest, Concealed Weaon are all melee range abilities, but Impale and Assassin's will are slow and easily evaded ranged abilities. It's not difficult for a heavy armor user to get outside of impale's 25% execute range by the time it hits; other executes scale differenty.
Did I mention wings wings wings wings wings everywhere?
Am I the only one who thinks this ability needs to be adjusted? I think the 25% stealthed speed boost was probably overlooked when they normalized the speed bonuses a few patches ago. I REALLY think they should consider adding Major or Minor Breach to this skill to bring it in line with Surprise Attack. If not Spell Penetration, I think another secondary effect is warranted, though I'm not sure what.
What do y'all think?
I don't think the invis movement buff of Concealed Weapon was overlooked the buff normalization period. Not not all buffs were affected by that.
I think Concealed Weapon itself is a strong ability, but it synergizes poorly with a class spec that has been pigeon-holed into using ranged weapons while concealed weapon feels best in a Dual Wield configuration. It's a melee spammable for a spec that can't stay in melee range for very long. I use it mainly as a setup and as a cloak speed buff.
Personally, I would love to see melee magblade to get attention. Staff attacks are slow and clunky and don't fit in with Magblade IMO.
The Healing Ward nerf affected most LA Magicka specs, but arguably Magblade most of all. Its heal was essential for getting out of execute range.
I tend to think both Healing Ward and Swallow Soul were nerfed because of the BR Resto Staff as they would be OP with it had they not been changed. We've seen this from ZOS before: nerf things that already exist to introduce something new.
I really miss Malefic Wreath. It provided a small, but useful, damage layering option and really helped enable an outside-in playstyle. It was central to my last brawly melee magblade build which is no longer at all viable.1 -
ScruffyWhiskers✭✭✭✭✭Concealed weapon is essential for a melee magblade. No need to mess with that. Even if you want to pew pew you need some melee options.0 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.
Now I know you are a troll. I'd really love to see Sap Essence in PvP action doing anything significantly more than providing Major Sorcery.
Or are you still playing on a version that's several years old?2 -
Unfadingsilence✭✭✭✭✭
✭Magic NB is beautiful
https://youtu.be/8KEUFKhq9uc
https://youtu.be/HC_MKcOau44
https://youtu.be/t6tTl8wU4QE
0 -
GeneralSezme✭✭✭✭The lack of a snare removal, with that, cloak being useless in an unfair fight.
Single target spammable, concealed is worse than its morph, suprise attack, the lack of damage and the risk a magblade has to put itself in to use the abillity, with that, most other mag classes either can put pressure on from range, sorc, or melee mag classes like mag Dk heals from its melee skills.
Soul harvest worse than its morph, incap, and soul tether, is worse than its closest cheap aoe comparison, dawnbreaker. The problem being the range of tether is so small that it doesn’t hit anyone that is moving and bugs out constantly if the caster jumps or does any weird maneuver while casting it.
Ganking on magblade is probably at its best right now. Bombing could be better but its not much good at anything else and adds no group utillity if it is not a bomber.
Notable toons:
Pact Corsair- Breton Magblade Former Emperor BWB Prolly Stole your scroll and bombed you
Lack of Aoe caps: Prolly bombed u
Neraz Gulio- Stamplar- Former Empress BWB
Paints-Her-Face - prolly painted your face
Zealot of the Great Sun- Blazeplar, frmr Emp Vivec3 -
SiAScORCH✭✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.
Now I know you are a troll. I'd really love to see Sap Essence in PvP action doing anything significantly more than providing Major Sorcery.
Or are you still playing on a version that's several years old?
I'm not trolling. Nobody was directing the convo towards PvP. He said heal, I'm not saying it's the best heal but sorc's dont get heals either. Each class has it's strength and weakness. My whole original reason for posting was because the OP said they were dead, which I thought he's got 0 knowledge if he believes that. Your two top PvP options right now are stam warden and mag blade, if we're getting technical here. So yes, mag blades don't have breath of life, big deal. I'm just sick of people who know nothing trying to make posts to make it seem like this class is dead or that class is dead.0 -
mb10✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭As a grand overlord nightblade who has finally put him to rest:
Increase in cost of swallow soul
Removal of healing ward heal
Mark target being reduced to 5 seconds from 30
Changes to siphoning strikes (was still viable after though)
Refreshing path being heal only and no damage
For solo play, those were quite bad for the mag NB
Also completely killing off the sap tank playstlye never helped5 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I’m thinking of retiring from the forums after seeing people argue that Magblade is strong. Even go as far as to say it’s one of the “Top Options”. It just baffles me.
The class is absolutely terrible in Open World. It was already bad before, but the healing ward nerf and cap on shields absolutely decimated the only viable playstyle it had left.Edited by templesus on January 21, 2019 7:43AM4 -
Oberstein✭✭✭Was there one nerf in particular which you feel was the final nail in the nightblade's coffin?
Personally I think the healing ward nerf was the thing that did it.
Magicka nightblade killed itself for being magicka.History, like a human being, is thirsty when it wakes from its slumber…History wants to drink up an enormous amount of blood. And even if history has tired of drinking blood, that’s only in regards to the amount. But what about quality? The larger the sacrifice is, the more delighted the cruel gods will be.1 -
SiAScORCH✭✭✭✭I’m thinking of retiring from the forums after seeing people argue that Magblade is strong. Even go as far as to say it’s one of the “Top Options”. It just baffles me.
The class is absolutely terrible in Open World. It was already bad before, but the healing ward nerf and cap on shields absolutely decimated the only viable playstyle it had left.
Go ahead and retire than. I can solo some of the vet dungeons on my magblade. Now granted in PvP I have a magblade bomber. My only brawler I have is my stam warden.0 -
Yuffie91✭✭✭✭✭Whaaaaat...but but..i made a thread asking for a good mag dps and ppl told me magblade! Sigh..guess i must delete her now
0 -
Tirps✭✭✭✭Whaaaaat...but but..i made a thread asking for a good mag dps and ppl told me magblade! Sigh..guess i must delete her now
No need to delete anything, it's still strong in PvE. Magblades still got good damage, sustain and heals (if using swallow soul as spammable). But in PvP it's differend story because of you are usually squishy af and you dont really have any heals and almost every attack in yours kit is reflectable or easy to avoid.cp1k+ ( ´•౪•`)1 -
WoppaBoem✭✭✭✭✭The current meta killed magblade's. Heavy armor , subterean assualt, dawn breaker, Spin.
Not enough dagame to kill the heavy armor builds fast and killed in 1 second when caught in the above combo.
I stored mine not good enough anymore.Edited by WoppaBoem on January 21, 2019 10:34AMXbox EU & NA - PVP Only0 -
Datthaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.
I love this guy, he thinks sap is a viable heal LOL2 -
Datthaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.
Now I know you are a troll. I'd really love to see Sap Essence in PvP action doing anything significantly more than providing Major Sorcery.
Or are you still playing on a version that's several years old?
I'm not trolling. Nobody was directing the convo towards PvP. He said heal, I'm not saying it's the best heal but sorc's dont get heals either. Each class has it's strength and weakness. My whole original reason for posting was because the OP said they were dead, which I thought he's got 0 knowledge if he believes that. Your two top PvP options right now are stam warden and mag blade, if we're getting technical here. So yes, mag blades don't have breath of life, big deal. I'm just sick of people who know nothing trying to make posts to make it seem like this class is dead or that class is dead.
Lol this guy again, "sorcs don't have heals" common cry I hear. You mean like crit surge, dark deal, and a burst heal pet? Yeah they def don't have heals0 -
Itzmichi✭✭✭✭✭I think core players are dead and casuals are on the rise problemo solved.Here, have a chill pill 💊!0 -
Datthaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭Magnb main since forever here.
What killed magnb is over time nerfs...
Healing ward and shade "invalid location" imo killed light armor shield builds
Massively nerfed healing over a few patches has destroyed the heavy armor brawler style, even building around hp and dark cloak you melt to bleeds and oblivion damage.
The only way to play magnb in cyro anymore is a calu ganker, or a bomber. If you play in large groups you will not notice this as much because alot of things seem viable in numbers.1 -
SiAScORCH✭✭✭✭OrdoHermetica wrote: »OrdoHermetica wrote: »
...what? How is it a different issue? Healing Ward was the go-to burst heal for most magblades, because they don't have one in-class. Combined with the shield it provided an opportunity to disengage heal out of execute range. Without that, magblades are seriously lacking in burst heal options. That seems like a pretty directly related issue to me.
They have other viable options. Magblades are far from dead. Far far far from it.
...such as?...
No, seriously. They have no class burst heals. Most of them are relying on the Resto ulti at this point. What options are you talking about? Combat Prayer? Healing Springs?
This tells me you have either little to no experience with the game or the class. Nightblades get more health because of class passives.
But since you lack knowledge, let's see off the top of my head you have Sap Essence and Swallow Soul/Funnel Health which heal. Sure NB has it's weaknesses but anybody who considers it useless or non existent knows absolutely nothing. You have other skills you can use for shields, do they heal no, but you have ways to regenerate health, not to mention critical strikes which heal you from the CP.
Anyways, if you don't know something do some research, I'm not about to hold anybody's hand because they're clueless.
I love this guy, he thinks sap is a viable heal LOL
It's a heal. I never said it was great.0 -
Gorilla✭✭✭Magnb main since forever here.
What killed magnb is over time nerfs...
Healing ward and shade "invalid location" imo killed light armor shield builds
Massively nerfed healing over a few patches has destroyed the heavy armor brawler style, even building around hp and dark cloak you melt to bleeds and oblivion damage.
The only way to play magnb in cyro anymore is a calu ganker, or a bomber. If you play in large groups you will not notice this as much because alot of things seem viable in numbers.
Dude, you absolutely nailed it. I know some hotshot magblades but they are at very low latency. The rest of us seem to be forced into ganker and bomber roles...There are others, but this really rings true.
I run high proc Calu build sometimes and it irritates the hell out of people, and I actually feel bad using it until I go to a more traditional magblade build and the arrow never lands due to dodge, etc. Also proccing it on high latency is like using a jelly umbrella.
If I could make one change to the class it would be...well...a total re-design.
That said, if you run a heavy and cloak-based build with high recovery the class is manageable.
I see it as a utility class now outside of ganking and bombing.0