Why are Imperials always the bad guys in ESO?

rexagamemnon · January 2019

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Lawrence_Schick if you could pass this concern of mine onto whom it would concern, it would be greatly appreciated.
It seems that when ever there is story content introduced in eso that has anything to do with Imperials, they are always potrayed as the bad guys. In the DC storyline they are portayed as the enemy, in craglorn they are portrayed as the bad guys, in the main story line of the game where you have to stop the plainmeld they are potrayed as the bad guys. And those are the ones i can think off the top my head, im sure there are more examples. The only example of Imperials being portrayed in a good light is the Imperial city DLC, and even that only shows a few individuals as good. Even the latest chapter set to come out; Elswyr, the premise of the story is the Imperials are invading with a necromatic army. Don’t get me wrong i am super excited to go to Elswyr. But im concerned how the Imperials are always potrayed in ESO. I’d like to think the Imperials are not all bad now, especially since the vestige defeated Molag Bal and Minamarco. I would like to see some future content where the Imperials are shown to be good or are not the bad guys outright like every other storyline in the game. Perhaps Imperial based DLC/Chapter that talks about Imperials from their perspective. Even if this said DLC is about invading another province, maybe it could be about Imperials rising to greatness again. Now one can tell from this thread that clearly my favorite race in tamriel are the Imperials, so please dont rip on me for that. But i am very anxious to hear what every one thinks about my supposition.
Respectfully Submitted,
@RexAgamemnon

adriant1978 · January 2019

ESO takes place during a time when the Empire has broken apart and been infiltrated by Daedric cultists and necromancers, so I guess they are just too easy to use as bad guys.

As someone with several Imperial characters though I would like to see some more examples of people keeping the more noble ideals of Cyrodiil alive.

VaranisArano · January 2019

Probably because the premise of ESO is that the Imperial elite were daedra - worshippers whose emperor tried to

ritual fake Akatosh into making him a dragonborn

at the advice of a necromancer, and thereby kicked off the Planemeld? Also, most of the "bad guy" imperials are relatives of Abnur Tharn, who's only a "good guy" because he's sorta kinda on our side because of common enemies.

Oberstein · January 2019

I agree naturally imperials are good guys with their hero Pelinal Whitestrake saved humans from dirty elf slavers. So as a human you support imperials and oppose those subhuman race like elfs. But ESO creators happens to be elf worshippers so only thing you can do is send job application and change this absurd thing from inside, no need to wait those elf worshippers.
We can get rid of all elfs like Dwarves and we have perfect example.

VaranisArano · January 2019

adriant1978 wrote: »

ESO takes place during a time when the Empire has broken apart and been infiltrated by Daedric cultists and necromancers, so I guess they are just too easy to use as bad guys.

As someone with several Imperial characters though I would like to see some more examples of people keeping the more noble ideals of Cyrodiil alive.

Captain Caudex and his soldiers in the Nobles District are pretty awesome. Most of the Imperial City questline has good characters like this, particularly the Drake of Blades, though I'm not sure she'd see it that way.

adriant1978 · January 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

adriant1978 wrote: »

ESO takes place during a time when the Empire has broken apart and been infiltrated by Daedric cultists and necromancers, so I guess they are just too easy to use as bad guys.

As someone with several Imperial characters though I would like to see some more examples of people keeping the more noble ideals of Cyrodiil alive.

Captain Caudex and his soldiers in the Nobles District are pretty awesome. Most of the Imperial City questline has good characters like this, particularly the Drake of Blades, though I'm not sure she'd see it that way.

I love the Imperial City quest line, and even as someone who generally detests PvP I made a point of getting both my main Imperial characters through it for the RP value.

Ghanima_Atreides · January 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

Probably because the premise of ESO is that the Imperial elite were daedra - worshippers whose emperor tried to
ritual fake Akatosh into making him a dragonborn
at the advice of a necromancer, and thereby kicked off the Planemeld? Also, most of the "bad guy" imperials are relatives of Abnur Tharn, who's only a "good guy" because he's sorta kinda on our side because of common enemies.

I don't think

Emperor Varen

was a Daedra worshipper, nor did he know that his adviser was a necromancer. He merely fell victim to hubris into believing he could become something he was not.

Mannimarco

tricked him into breaking the Covenant with Akatosh.

So arrogant, foolish, yes, but not a Daedra worshipper.

VaranisArano · January 2019

Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Probably because the premise of ESO is that the Imperial elite were daedra - worshippers whose emperor tried to
ritual fake Akatosh into making him a dragonborn
at the advice of a necromancer, and thereby kicked off the Planemeld? Also, most of the "bad guy" imperials are relatives of Abnur Tharn, who's only a "good guy" because he's sorta kinda on our side because of common enemies.

I don't think
Emperor Varen
was a Daedra worshipper, nor did he know that his adviser was a necromancer. He merely fell victim to hubris into believing he could become something he was not.
Mannimarco
tricked him into breaking the Covenant with Akatosh.

So arrogant, foolish, yes, but not a Daedra worshipper.

Varen wasn't. The rest of the Imperial elite who wound up in charge? Yeah. We mostly see it through the Tharn family. There are other members of the elites in the Alliance bases who presumably didn't, but they've clearly been forced into exile and for the moment, control of the empire's forces is in the hands of daedra worshippers as far as we know.

So, Clivia Tharn marries Emperor Leovic, who legalizes daedric worship. That kicked off a rebellion, led by Varen who marries Clivia. Then the Soulburst happens, and Clivia winds up in charge because Varen disappears. Then during the Three Banners War, a Dark Anchor opens over the Imperial City and Daedra overrun the place as the loyal legions are betrayed and then corrupted. At some point, Clivia gets

killed and replaced by the daedra Molag Kena.

We've also got Javad Tharn who's invading Reaper's March and allied with the Stonefire Cult and Molag Bal. Septima Tharn in Bangkorai is also allied with Molag Bal.

The only non-daedra worshipper commanding substantial Imperial Forces I can think of is the rather ineffectual Count of Kvatch in the DB DLC.

adriant1978 · January 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

At some point, Clivia gets
killed and replaced by the daedra Molag Kena.

I don't think there's any concrete proof of this, is there? Admittedly it seems like the most likely answer to the question of her whereabouts, but I still hold onto a little bit of hope that we might see her again.

Maybe we'll get some more information in the new chapter.

FakeFox · January 2019

Why are tyrannical empires trying to take over the world always the bad guys in real history?

VaranisArano · January 2019

adriant1978 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

At some point, Clivia gets
killed and replaced by the daedra Molag Kena.

I don't think there's any concrete proof of this, is there? Admittedly it seems like the most likely answer to the question of her whereabouts, but I still hold onto a little bit of hope that we might see her again.

Maybe we'll get some more information in the new chapter.

I suppose its possible that when Molag Kena does this in White Gold Tower:

Before taking her true form, Molag Kena will taunt you as the Empress Regent.

Empress-Regent Clivia Tharn: "Do you fools still believe you are dealing with Clivia Tharn? She is as lost to you as the White-Gold Tower!"
Molag Kena: "Lord Bal, I have the Elder Scroll! The Planemeld Obverse begins!"
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Molag_Kena

That she's not dead. After all, we didn't see the body. I'd still argue that its pretty heavily implied that Clivia is dead or worse than dead.

Ajaxandriel · January 2019

FakeFox wrote: »

Why are tyrannical empires trying to take over the world always the bad guys in real history?

I was wondering !!... 🤣

Gadamlub14_ESO · January 2019

Allesia, Pelenial whitestrake, Reman Cyrodill, "Emperor" Varen, Abnar tharn, Uriel Septim the V, Uriel Septim the VII (oblivion) Martin Septim, Chancellor Ocato, Titus mede the I, Atrubus Mede, Titus mede the II (Arguable, Skyrim/ legends).

those above, with maybe up to five more i may have forgotten, are the only good rulers and 2 other people of major note within the entirety of the empires history since its founding in 1E 242, till Skyrim in 4E 201. a total of about 4209 years.

What happens during these thousands of years when the above people take up less than 25% of this time? either just existing, or simply Brutal conquest. the imperials arent quite "good guys" for the vast majority of the empire's history and in many cases, most definitely being the bad guys.

And yes, I didnt forget Tiber Septim/Talos. I dont consider him to be a good guy by any means. His abuse of the Numidium (Vivec wtf u doin m8?) in the conquest of the summerset isles is a prime example of this, utilizing the dragonbreak the Numidium caused to outright erase or change noble families opposed, or even just neutral to him within the empire.

This is all just off the top of my head so not really in much detail, but i Implore you to study the History of the Elder scrolls and its lore. Doing so will give you the answer far better than i can.