Man, I just can’t believe they’ve made Dark Elves absolutely useless. Literally any magicka spec now has to roll Altmer.

I will still use my Imperial most when playing. I wasn't expecting much for Imperials, as if they got a massive buff people would be crying "pay to win class".

Compared to other tanking races (after the changes go through) Imperials will have the most max resources, but I agree that they don't have much else going for them. The Red Diamond passive got a tiny buff if you play an Imperial in PvP -- which I do -- and the bash/block cost reduction is also nice in PvP since I bash weave (S&B StamDK). But I also play my Imperial mainly as a DK Tank in PvE, and I think both Argonian and Nord would have better sustain if the changes go through. Honestly, I think Nord would be a clear victor in DK tanking versus Imperial since DK sustain is tied to ultimate generation/consumption and because of the importance of Aggressive Warhorn as a tank.

Looking at the current stamina sustain of my Imperial DK Tank, 5% bash/block cost reduction is way too underwhelming. I run 1 magicka cost reduction glyph and 2 magicka recovery glyphs on my Vet Dungeons set-up and my stamina drain is the least of my concerns -- Even the Earthgore Amalgam fight in vBF HM, where you spend a lot of time blocking (block weaving), is smooth on my stamina sustain. Imperials need something else to make them standout, and not only as tanks. I believe they should get the Orc sustain passive (380 health and stam every 4 seconds) instead of bash/block cost reduction. Or maybe 380 stam and magicka returned upon dealing direct damage, since we have the Red Diamond passive for health return.

I posted this on the original thread about the race changes but I am gonna post it again here cause I strongly believe that imperial should not remain like this:
I was expecting a way to spec your race to the desired role while having some standard lore based passives. But hey, I didn't have that before, I don't have it now so I gained and lost nothing.
Overall I like the changes except from two.
1. The 20% bosmer move speed is a bit too much imo and I suspect that it will be toned down before release.
2. The imperial. Imperial is lacking compared to other races. It lacked before, it lacks even more now. I am not even gonna talk about the max stat loss difference compared to the other class percentages cause now everyone got the same nerf. Red diamond change is nice I guess but the new passives for imperial are very very situational compared to the other race changes. It's neither a versatile race (like dunmer or khajiit) nor a solid one (like breton or orc) anymore. It's just for one and only role. Block focused tanking.
So I think that imperial should have something extra added to their passives to balance it with the other races. For instance add a medium value of mag and stam return with red diamond. Or make red diamond like engine guardian so that it has a 15% chance to return 1750 hp or mag or stam on direct attack (luck was a major element on imperial perks on tes games). Just don't leave imperial like that it is not a good change imo as it is.

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

Aluneth wrote: »

First of all, I want to say that I'm happy with the direction of the racial changes. I'm happy that each race is unique. Now for the negative feedback.

The Imperial race has always been BORING when it came to racials, but at least it had the 12%/10% resources. The one thing I wanted from the changes to the Imperial race, was to give them something unique that made them stand out. This was the perfect chance for ZoS to rework their racials and give them something that wasn't so bland or boring. What did we get? We got a race that was just as boring, with a massive nerf to the resources. The Imperial used to be a versatile, jack of all trades, with a good spot when it came to tanking, this isn't the case anymore.

Mag DPS : Useless
Stam DPS : Khajiit, Redguard and Orc are better
Healer: Useless
Tank: Argonian and Nord are both better

The best place an Imperial has at the moment is THIRD, in TANKING.

I don't want the Imperial to become the new Argonian, and I don't care if they're not the best pick for anything. If this is the case though, at least make the race INTERESTING.

why you consider them bad at tanking ? A flat +4000 resource increase topped off with an additional 5% block cost reduction sounds pretty solid to me for any tank

It's still worse than what Argonians and Nords get.

Nords get 500 less stamina and 1000 less health. Instead they get 4 000 resistance and an ult generation passive.

Mundus stones:

Lord: 2231 Health
Tower: 2028 Stamina
Lady: 4196 Resistance

So if the Imperial picked the Lady mundus stone, and the Nord picked the Lord Mundus stone. They would have the same resistances, BUT the Nord would have 700 more resources than the Imperial. This isn't even taking into consideration the ult generaton passive.

I would gladly trade in 500 stamina and 1000 health for 4000 resistance and that ult generation passive.

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

agreed, Nords seem to get the best deal in raw stats, but thanks to the cp system resistance become trivial at high level making 5% blocking/bashing cost reduction more interesting in order to maximize a tank's potential...

5% block/bashing reduction is in no way interesting. It's just as bland and boring as everything else with the Imperial, and it's just as easy to get from CP. I'll gladly pick 4 000 resistance over 5% block/bash. Never once during my time as an Imperial tank, did I think "Damn, I wish I had more % Block".

Please take this conversation to https://forums.elderscrollsonline.co...r-update-21/p1

We don't need the entire General Sub Forum to be filled with this topic.

Aluneth wrote: »

James-Wayne wrote: »

Dont forget the heal on direct attacks with no cool down is pretty sweet on Imperial. Not all bad.

It's useless when you're at full health. I personally like it for soloing, and I'm happy that we have it, but it was bad back before the changes, and it'll still be bad unless you're into PvP. It's also a nerf for tanks, as the 6% with a tank health pool was higher than the base 1750.

@kathandira

This thread was made to talk about the Imperial.

It's still the same subject. I've already added the same comment to 7 threads about race changes. It's only going to grow from here.

So meta tanks sitting around 40k'ish lost around 2.4k of health on a tank. Many sit around 37k so lost around 2k'ish give or take.
We got extra block and bash cost reduction and a higher proc chance on Red Diamond from more damage sources.

Cry me a river that the meta may have to change a bit to incorporate this hit to health.

Argonian took a 25% hit on their main reason anyone ran them AND lost their healing received buff. So OP.

Nord lost their 6% damage reduction and gained resistances in its place. I get that the ulti gen is great and all but that has a 10 second Cooldown. So equivalent of 1 ult per 2 seconds extra. Oh, so OP. Let's all jump to Nord for 30 ult per minute extra and resistances that are already surplus.

If you want to wear dragon, werewolf hide and Bloodspawn to make best use of it... then maybe you have an argument. Notice no ebon or alkosh in there.

Nah, my Warden Tank will remain an Imperial and will still rock 44k'ish health, more stam and more powerful overall self healing.

kathandira wrote: »

Aluneth wrote: »

James-Wayne wrote: »

Dont forget the heal on direct attacks with no cool down is pretty sweet on Imperial. Not all bad.

It's useless when you're at full health. I personally like it for soloing, and I'm happy that we have it, but it was bad back before the changes, and it'll still be bad unless you're into PvP. It's also a nerf for tanks, as the 6% with a tank health pool was higher than the base 1750.

@kathandira

This thread was made to talk about the Imperial.

It's still the same subject. I've already added the same comment to 7 threads about race changes. It's only going to grow from here.

lets leave the moderation to the moderators shall we; a thread on each race is the most efficient method of discussion

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

So meta tanks sitting around 40k'ish lost around 2.4k of health on a tank. Many sit around 37k so lost around 2k'ish give or take.
We got extra block and bash cost reduction and a higher proc chance on Red Diamond from more damage sources.

Cry me a river that the meta may have to change a bit to incorporate this hit to health.

Argonian took a 25% hit on their main reason anyone ran them AND lost their healing received buff. So OP.

Nord lost their 6% damage reduction and gained resistances in its place. I get that the ulti gen is great and all but that has a 10 second Cooldown. So equivalent of 1 ult per 2 seconds extra. Oh, so OP. Let's all jump to Nord for 30 ult per minute extra and resistances that are already surplus.

If you want to wear dragon, werewolf hide and Bloodspawn to make best use of it... then maybe you have an argument. Notice no ebon or alkosh in there.

Nah, my Warden Tank will remain an Imperial and will still rock 44k'ish health, more stam and more powerful overall self healing.

And you'll be worse than both the Argonian and Nord at tanking, while at the same time being bottom in Magicka DPS and healing. Oh and you're also 4th or 5th on Stamina DPS.

When a race is the lowest tier in both Magicka DPS and healing, while also being B- in Stamina DPS and behind both the Nord and Argonian at tanking, something is wrong.

You sound like the type of person that would defend the Imperial even if they lost the stamina resource and got nothing in return.

Aluneth wrote: »

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

So meta tanks sitting around 40k'ish lost around 2.4k of health on a tank. Many sit around 37k so lost around 2k'ish give or take.
We got extra block and bash cost reduction and a higher proc chance on Red Diamond from more damage sources.

Cry me a river that the meta may have to change a bit to incorporate this hit to health.

Argonian took a 25% hit on their main reason anyone ran them AND lost their healing received buff. So OP.

Nord lost their 6% damage reduction and gained resistances in its place. I get that the ulti gen is great and all but that has a 10 second Cooldown. So equivalent of 1 ult per 2 seconds extra. Oh, so OP. Let's all jump to Nord for 30 ult per minute extra and resistances that are already surplus.

If you want to wear dragon, werewolf hide and Bloodspawn to make best use of it... then maybe you have an argument. Notice no ebon or alkosh in there.

Nah, my Warden Tank will remain an Imperial and will still rock 44k'ish health, more stam and more powerful overall self healing.

And you'll be worse than both the Argonian and Nord at tanking, while at the same time being bottom in Magicka DPS and healing. Oh and you're also 4th or 5th on Stamina DPS.

When a race is the lowest tier in both Magicka DPS and healing, while also being B- in Stamina DPS and behind both the Nord and Argonian at tanking, something is wrong.

You sound like the type of person that would defend the Imperial even if they lost the stamina resource and got nothing in return.

No. I'm just someone who refuses to cry about a tiny bit of health when we got more back. We were not thd hardest hit and we're not the 3rd place in tanks.

You go to be a lizard. Your healing received got hit, your potion passive got hit and your max health got hit by more.
Your only buff was potentially to max Magicka.

You go to be a Nord. You gain more resistances when most tanks hit cap without it (making it much less useful) Also, you lost your 6% damage reduction and your health took a bigger hit. You did get maybe a tiny bit extra stam and 30 ult per minute more. That’s not going to give you amazing horn up time unless you run sets like dragon and werewolf hide and that cost reduction will affect battle roar on a DK

I like the changes to imperial. The loss of percent increases happened to every class and they now heal themselves better.

What I don't like are the orc changes. Wtf with 500? That's absolutely nothing.