Is ESO ready for it's Cataclysm?

SomeDogsAreCops · January 2019

Ok so this will be year 5 of Molag Bal anchors spawning and 40 players zerg rushing it down in 5 minutes. The main questline has been resolved a million times and we have stopped Molag Bal (for now.) The Alliance War has been raging with each faction taking lead and losing lead at different points nothing really changing.

So is it time ZOS uses a Cataclysm like event to change the world spaces we know and add in new main and faction questlines?

This would be the catalyst ZOS could use to overhaul a lot of mechanics and features we can agree need to be freshened up

A new (more threatening) antagonist to the world. Not that Molag Bal was terrible but I only recall a few instances where it felt like his invasion was actually effecting anyone in the world. I could even see these questlines being connected where you need to return to Coldharbour and have to get help from his realm.

A revamped Cyrodiil. New scoring system, more side objectives to capture (the bridges are a good starting point) more items defensive items to use in PVP

Now this is a stretch but a major engine update would be perfect for an event like this. Better animations, flashier abilities, rebalance, better performance, UNIFIED REGIONS ( travel within your factions held regions without loading screens.)

These are just some of things off the top of my head, I think this game seriously need this to mix some of the base content up and make some improvements all at the same time.

Paulington · January 2019

I personally wouldn't mind a large step forward in lore, Molag Bal is defeated and we can move on to the next big danger or threat to face Tamriel.

The issue is, skill points and achievements are tied to this, so they'd have to rework that entire system somehow. Does it mean both have to exist in parallel? You can't just remove and replace the entirety of the base game.

I would enjoy unified regions however, it's something I've wanted since launch and is often requested.

SirAxen · January 2019

Paulington wrote: »

I personally wouldn't mind a large step forward in lore, Molag Bal is defeated and we can move on to the next big danger or threat to face Tamriel.

The issue is, skill points and achievements are tied to this, so they'd have to rework that entire system somehow. Does it mean both have to exist in parallel? You can't just remove and replace the entirety of the base game.

I would enjoy unified regions however, it's something I've wanted since launch and is often requested.

Sadly, I just don't think ZOS has the development team size for something like this.

Cookiestealer · January 2019

First of all, excuse me for my English.

Well, that was the worst thing about Cataclysm for me. I mean burying old good content and stuff so that you can't revisit some places and do some cool and memorable quests. Players need to read wiki, watch YT and play on these "private servers" to enjoy something they missed.
AvAvA is something that people really love about ESO, despite these loading screens and ping. Some of them just bought it for the AvAvA. Personally i'm more into solo PvE and lore, but still.

Yes, it would be nice to see some visual improvements for some of the old locations (fix these dunmer wall meshes and black spots on the terrain, please!). These are beautiful, but new dlc locations just raised the bar of quality, and you can easily see the difference: more foliage, interesting level topology, more architecture sets, more and more.

As for the parallel timeline or something, well, TES universe is flexible enough. If there's a good script - why not?

SomeDogsAreCops · January 2019

Paulington wrote: »

I personally wouldn't mind a large step forward in lore, Molag Bal is defeated and we can move on to the next big danger or threat to face Tamriel.

The issue is, skill points and achievements are tied to this, so they'd have to rework that entire system somehow. Does it mean both have to exist in parallel? You can't just remove and replace the entirety of the base game.

I would enjoy unified regions however, it's something I've wanted since launch and is often requested.

No those achievements will be unobtainable that's part of the world moving a long and changing. However, I do think transferring rewards to new achievements would be fine.

SomeDogsAreCops · January 2019

Cookiestealer wrote: »

First of all, excuse me for my English.

Well, that was the worst thing about Cataclysm for me. I mean burying old good content and stuff so that you can't revisit some places and do some cool and memorable quests. Players need to read wiki, watch YT and play on these "private servers" to enjoy something they missed.
AvAvA is something that people really love about ESO, despite these loading screens and stuff. Some of them just bought it for the AvAvA. Personally i'm more into solo PvE and lore, but still.

Yes, it would be nice to see some visual improvements for some of the old locations (fix these dunmer wall meshes and black spots on the terrain, please!). These are beautiful, but new dlc locations just raised the bar of quality, and you can easily see the difference: more foliage, interesting level topology, more architecture sets, more and more.

As for the parallel timeline or something, well, TES universe is flexible enough. If there's a good script - why not?

I did not say I wanted to remove PVP I said I wanted it reworked and filled with new content to put some life back into it

Vasoka · January 2019

This isn't WoW.

Nor do they have the resources/money/team size to remake the world like Blizzard did during Cataclysm.

That's actually for the AAA companies, not small indie studios.

Tabbycat · January 2019

I think they need to fill in all the blank spaces in the map before even considering something like that.

Sylvermynx · January 2019

As someone who "lived through" Blizz's Cataclysm.... it's not something I'd advise. It was actually awful.

Cookiestealer · January 2019

SomeDogsAreCops wrote: »

I did not say I wanted to remove PVP I said I wanted it reworked and filled with new content to put some life back into it

Yeah, excuse me. Just gathered some thoughts about what i've read in other forums and topics. I agree with you, by the way.

SomeDogsAreCops · January 2019

Vasoka wrote: »

This isn't WoW.

Nor do they have the resources/money/team size to remake the world like Blizzard did during Cataclysm.

That's actually for the AAA companies, not small indie studios.

ZOS is not a small indie studio and bigger team sizes and more money only increases the speed at which things are made. These changes could easily take up an expansion slot.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

As someone who "lived through" Blizz's Cataclysm.... it's not something I'd advise. It was actually awful.

So did I, I wasn't suggesting taking a pickaxe to the world and making it messy just a new main questline and progression of the world because right now nothing is happening and these segregated chapters are nice but we need something to push the game forward.

Facefister · January 2019

Reworking older motifs and polishing up vanilla areas would be a start.

Odnoc · January 2019

If you mean you want them to completely redesign the classes with the expansion like they do EVERY expansion with WoW, no thanks. That's why I left that game. Seems like they can't make their mind up.

If you mean add mechanics like swimming, then yes 100%

mwo1480 · January 2019

Odnoc wrote: »

If you mean you want them to completely redesign the classes with the expansion like they do EVERY expansion with WoW, no thanks. That's why I left that game. Seems like they can't make their mind up.

If you mean add mechanics like swimming, then yes 100%

u mean diving? that would be cool, like hidding things under water and stuff

Iluvrien · January 2019

No, not Cataclysm. Extension.

For example, Bleakrock has been burning for almost 5 years in my game. ZOS should give the triumphant Vestige a chance to return to the island, expell the invaders and help rebuild. We can revisit a base-game area that suffered a lot of damage. We get additional quests and content there. ZOS has a chance to update the assets of the buildings/towns that were damaged or destroyed. Time moves forwards in a believable continuity from previous situations, rather than in a discontinuous jump.

That could apply to any settlement that saw significant damage (there were a lot), I mean just in Stonefalls they could replace sections of Davon's Watch and Senie with possible extensions to Hrogar's Hold, Fort Virak, the Sathram Plantation and Iliath Temple. The same goes for almost any other zone in the game.

We don't need to throw away the basic structure of the base game zones to make them interesting again. We just need to breathe a bit of life back into them.

Sylvermynx · January 2019

Iluvrien wrote: »

No, not Cataclysm. Extension.

For example, Bleakrock has been burning for almost 5 years in my game. ZOS should give the triumphant Vestige a chance to return to the island, expell the invaders and help rebuild. We can revisit a base-game area that suffered a lot of damage. We get additional quests and content there. ZOS has a chance to update the assets of the buildings/towns that were damaged or destroyed. Time moves forwards in a believable continuity from previous situations, rather than in a discontinuous jump.

That could apply to any settlement that saw significant damage (there were a lot), I mean just in Stonefalls they could replace sections of Davon's Watch and Senie with possible extensions to Hrogar's Hold, Fort Virak, the Sathram Plantation and Iliath Temple. The same goes for almost any other zone in the game.

We don't need to throw away the basic structure of the base game zones to make them interesting again. We just need to breathe a bit of life back into them.

That's a really awesome idea. But how would you mesh that with the base game for new players? I mean people who've never played the game at all before - but might like to start at the beginning, not after the "not-cataclysm"....

Iluvrien · January 2019

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

No, not Cataclysm. Extension.

For example, Bleakrock has been burning for almost 5 years in my game. ZOS should give the triumphant Vestige a chance to return to the island, expell the invaders and help rebuild. We can revisit a base-game area that suffered a lot of damage. We get additional quests and content there. ZOS has a chance to update the assets of the buildings/towns that were damaged or destroyed. Time moves forwards in a believable continuity from previous situations, rather than in a discontinuous jump.

That could apply to any settlement that saw significant damage (there were a lot), I mean just in Stonefalls they could replace sections of Davon's Watch and Senie with possible extensions to Hrogar's Hold, Fort Virak, the Sathram Plantation and Iliath Temple. The same goes for almost any other zone in the game.

We don't need to throw away the basic structure of the base game zones to make them interesting again. We just need to breathe a bit of life back into them.

That's a really awesome idea. But how would you mesh that with the base game for new players? I mean people who've never played the game at all before - but might like to start at the beginning, not after the "not-cataclysm"....

Leave the base game as is, but add this as quests that become available after the events of Coldharbour. The game already uses phased instances in those areas to start off with. After al, there is a non-broken instance of Bleakrock and then one with it in flames. The player is moved from one to the other as they progress through the quest. This would just mean adding a couple more to that location, say a third one "rebuilding-in-progress" and a fourth "rebuilding complete". ZOS can make changes to each of these other instances to reflect changes in in both art capability and story progress.

That way ZOS don't break their "don't change asset in game" rule, and those areas get updates anyway as extensions to the existing content, rather than destructive replacement.

It also fosters greater connection with the game world and narrative.

Sylvermynx · January 2019

Iluvrien wrote: »

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

No, not Cataclysm. Extension.

For example, Bleakrock has been burning for almost 5 years in my game. ZOS should give the triumphant Vestige a chance to return to the island, expell the invaders and help rebuild. We can revisit a base-game area that suffered a lot of damage. We get additional quests and content there. ZOS has a chance to update the assets of the buildings/towns that were damaged or destroyed. Time moves forwards in a believable continuity from previous situations, rather than in a discontinuous jump.

That could apply to any settlement that saw significant damage (there were a lot), I mean just in Stonefalls they could replace sections of Davon's Watch and Senie with possible extensions to Hrogar's Hold, Fort Virak, the Sathram Plantation and Iliath Temple. The same goes for almost any other zone in the game.

We don't need to throw away the basic structure of the base game zones to make them interesting again. We just need to breathe a bit of life back into them.

That's a really awesome idea. But how would you mesh that with the base game for new players? I mean people who've never played the game at all before - but might like to start at the beginning, not after the "not-cataclysm"....

Leave the base game as is, but add this as quests that become available after the events of Coldharbour. The game already uses phased instances in those areas to start off with. After al, there is a non-broken instance of Bleakrock and then one with it in flames. The player is moved from one to the other as they progress through the quest. This would just mean adding a couple more to that location, say a third one "rebuilding-in-progress" and a fourth "rebuilding complete". ZOS can make changes to each of these other instances to reflect changes in in both art capability and story progress.

That way ZOS don't break their "don't change asset in game" rule, and those areas get updates anyway as extensions to the existing content, rather than destructive replacement.

It also fosters greater connection with the game world and narrative.

ZOS needs to hire you. You make a lot more sense than others I could (but won't) name.

Jameliel · January 2019

As long as people continue buying crowns and crown store items, there is no incentive for the business to spend money on upgrades. Viewing their patterns over the past 4-5 years, we can reasonably conclude they will do as little as possible.

zyk · January 2019

It would cost a fortune to revise the base game because of voice acting. I doubt it's going to happen. I can see a visual refresh at some point though.

I want to criticize Zenimax for their lack of ambition compared to Blizzard, but there are important differences. At that time, wow was at or close to its peak as a phenom and had already earned billions of dollars.

Meanwhile, the ESO base game can be found for under $10 and is B2P, so new content development must be paywalled somehow.

Wifeaggro13 · January 2019

SomeDogsAreCops wrote: »

Ok so this will be year 5 of Molag Bal anchors spawning and 40 players zerg rushing it down in 5 minutes. The main questline has been resolved a million times and we have stopped Molag Bal (for now.) The Alliance War has been raging with each faction taking lead and losing lead at different points nothing really changing.

So is it time ZOS uses a Cataclysm like event to change the world spaces we know and add in new main and faction questlines?

This would be the catalyst ZOS could use to overhaul a lot of mechanics and features we can agree need to be freshened up

A new (more threatening) antagonist to the world. Not that Molag Bal was terrible but I only recall a few instances where it felt like his invasion was actually effecting anyone in the world. I could even see these questlines being connected where you need to return to Coldharbour and have to get help from his realm.

A revamped Cyrodiil. New scoring system, more side objectives to capture (the bridges are a good starting point) more items defensive items to use in PVP

Now this is a stretch but a major engine update would be perfect for an event like this. Better animations, flashier abilities, rebalance, better performance, UNIFIED REGIONS ( travel within your factions held regions without loading screens.)

These are just some of things off the top of my head, I think this game seriously need this to mix some of the base content up and make some improvements all at the same time.

they already had their cataclysm . it was called Tam one it completely overhauled the game. what we have now is the result of them going to far in one direction then doubling down then giving up

Vapirko · January 2019

Well, we’ll know for sure soon enough. Imo? Don’t expect too much.

Danikat · January 2019

It would be really helpful if people could remember when posting a suggestion that there will be people reading it who have not played all the same games they have. I had to give up on replying this last night because I couldn't work out why the OP was calling new quests in some (or even all) the base game areas a cataclysm - which to me implies an apocalypse level event that completely changes everything in it's path - and it was only after reading the replies this morning that I realised that's not a statement about the level of change suggested and just the name of a WoW expansion which included a similar kind of re-work.

Back on topic now I understand what's actually being suggested I like the idea, but I agree that it shouldn't prevent new players from doing the existing content. Or existing players for that matter - I imagine it would be very unpopular if starting these new quests made it impossible to ever do a dolmen ever again.

It would be great if the existing phasing mechanic (or even something like the old veteran maps) could be used to give us a reason to return to existing maps for updated stories that follow on from the end of the main story and let us see some of the areas rebuild, change etc.

Peekachu99 · January 2019

Base engine enhancements we’ll probably see when next gen consoles arrive. There’s no point when PCs can already tweak a lot of variables.

Elsonso · January 2019

Iluvrien wrote: »

No, not Cataclysm. Extension.

For example, Bleakrock has been burning for almost 5 years in my game. ZOS should give the triumphant Vestige a chance to return to the island, expell the invaders and help rebuild. We can revisit a base-game area that suffered a lot of damage. We get additional quests and content there. ZOS has a chance to update the assets of the buildings/towns that were damaged or destroyed. Time moves forwards in a believable continuity from previous situations, rather than in a discontinuous jump.

That could apply to any settlement that saw significant damage (there were a lot), I mean just in Stonefalls they could replace sections of Davon's Watch and Senie with possible extensions to Hrogar's Hold, Fort Virak, the Sathram Plantation and Iliath Temple. The same goes for almost any other zone in the game.

We don't need to throw away the basic structure of the base game zones to make them interesting again. We just need to breathe a bit of life back into them.

My impression of ZOS and how they do things suggests that there are no plans to do a Cataclysm event that massively changes the world. This would be "heads down" work for more than a year and would divert resources from other work the studio is doing.

As for an "extension" on events in the world... For a while, I thought they might continuously update all the zones, a little bit at a time, but that turned out to be a relatively small effort to re-design a few delves. My hope was that they would revisit zones frequently and update the game in place. The delve rework effort stopped before they really finished, which is why there are still so many of the old rubber stamp delves around. Outside of One Tamriel re-scaling work and a few special quests and events, they really have not spent any significant time in the older zones.

That suggests to me that they still have it in mind to leave the original game where it is for new players.

MornaBaine · January 2019

How I would love to see Camlorn actually be rebuilt and looking prosperous! Maybe you return there to AVERT a new threat before it can destroy the place again! What would be really nice is if they do NOT remove old quests but instead add new ones that take place AFTER t hose old quests. Especially if it means you can revisit those areas once all the quests are done. I hate being "locked out" of an area once the quest is over. And I want to SEE the effects of my character's actions. Like, after I've pummeled the Redrooks I want them OUT of those woods! LOL

I HOPE they will have taken this opportunity to fill in a lot of glaring "plot holes" in the game. For instance, if Molag Bal has been defeated then WHY are the anchors still dropping? Why do random daedra still fall from the sky? That doesn't have to stop but we really need a new reason for it to be happening after we've completed the Main Story quests.

I'd also dearly love to see some NEW towns and cities and to see many places where the doors have been chained shut since launch FINALLY BE OPEN!!!! Man I hate a locked door! LOL

psychotrip · January 2019

Vasoka wrote: »

This isn't WoW.

Nor do they have the resources/money/team size to remake the world like Blizzard did during Cataclysm.

That's actually for the AAA companies, not small indie studios.

Since when is zenimax a small indie studio. It's early in the morning. Am I reading this right?

Just once I want to play an mmo where the world actually changes and evolves, instead of remaining stagnant and time-locked. Molag Bal can't be attacking forever. The Alliance War can't remain in a stalemate forever. At some point I want to see the EFFECTS of our actions on the world. I'm all for this if its executed well.

zaria · January 2019

SomeDogsAreCops wrote: »

Vasoka wrote: »

This isn't WoW.

Nor do they have the resources/money/team size to remake the world like Blizzard did during Cataclysm.

That's actually for the AAA companies, not small indie studios.

ZOS is not a small indie studio and bigger team sizes and more money only increases the speed at which things are made. These changes could easily take up an expansion slot.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

As someone who "lived through" Blizz's Cataclysm.... it's not something I'd advise. It was actually awful.

So did I, I wasn't suggesting taking a pickaxe to the world and making it messy just a new main questline and progression of the world because right now nothing is happening and these segregated chapters are nice but we need something to push the game forward.

Yes ZoS is not an indie studio and ESO is among the 20 most revenue bringing games on steam.
However ESO is not WOW and the setting is totally different in multiple ways.
I say One Tamriel was ESO's Cataclysm as it was massive changes in how the game is played.

Also ESO is not sub based so they need to add new content to sell dlc / expansions.
Had ESO stayed sub we would probably get 2 dungeons for many of single version ones rather than dlc dungeons as one example.

Rex-Umbra · January 2019

SomeDogsAreCops wrote: »

Ok so this will be year 5 of Molag Bal anchors spawning and 40 players zerg rushing it down in 5 minutes. The main questline has been resolved a million times and we have stopped Molag Bal (for now.) The Alliance War has been raging with each faction taking lead and losing lead at different points nothing really changing.

So is it time ZOS uses a Cataclysm like event to change the world spaces we know and add in new main and faction questlines?

This would be the catalyst ZOS could use to overhaul a lot of mechanics and features we can agree need to be freshened up

A new (more threatening) antagonist to the world. Not that Molag Bal was terrible but I only recall a few instances where it felt like his invasion was actually effecting anyone in the world. I could even see these questlines being connected where you need to return to Coldharbour and have to get help from his realm.

A revamped Cyrodiil. New scoring system, more side objectives to capture (the bridges are a good starting point) more items defensive items to use in PVP

Now this is a stretch but a major engine update would be perfect for an event like this. Better animations, flashier abilities, rebalance, better performance, UNIFIED REGIONS ( travel within your factions held regions without loading screens.)

These are just some of things off the top of my head, I think this game seriously need this to mix some of the base content up and make some improvements all at the same time.

Would be nice and add a lot to the game but I really don't see Zos having put that much resources into anything that drastic.

Haenk · January 2019

The main issue is - there is no way to fail. Players are always winning. Send a LVL10 to save the world from the worst enemy imaginable, which has previously slain billions of good folks.
Heck, why not allowing the bad guys to take over whole regions, maybe stoppable, maybe not.
Maybe a Cyrodil with badass NPC enemies.

casparian · January 2019

When was the last time ZOS delivered a groundbreaking, feature-rich update that massively overhauled the game experience? Have they ever? The closest I can think of is One Tamriel, which actually removed features (zone levels) from the game.

Temper your expectations, people. This is going to be more of the same kind of thing you’ve seen before, with a few minor additions like new baddies and a new plot hook.