How ESO killed PVP

tchahin · December 2018

PVP means player versus player.

It means that you are fighting against another player but in order to be considered a fight, the other player must be able to defend and fight back.
Else, it is just assassination, not a fight.

There are so many instant kill builds out there, specially by NB, Sorc, Templars who already have the highest damage potential skills plus execute skills.

The damage of some builds 15k + 15k + 15k, on a Heavy Armor makes healers completely useless in Cyrodiil or Battlegrounds.
Theres not much a healer can do to help a player who is undergoing an enemy burst.

And if you think that damage only happens in CP Cyrodiil, you're wrong. That burst happens all the time in NO CP Cyrodiil and NO CP Battlegrounds.

Where is the enjoyment of fighting when there is no fight to be fought?

One thing is instantly dying to a zerg of 10 players aiming at you, which is justifiable, but it is not justifiable instantly dying to 1 player who has the damage of 10 players.

I am unable to propose, though, a solution to this problem, so I would like you as experienced ESO players to educate me on this matter.

Enemy-of-Coldharbour · December 2018

There is no such thing as a fair fight. You fight to win...period. If you enter any form of ESO PVP expect other players to use everything at their disposal to kill you as quickly as possible. Chose your fights wisely and get good.

TequilaFire · December 2018

Yes there are a few OP builds, but stop to remember there was a time when the strong player that kills you took his licks and died just as quickly till he/she gained experience and a good build.

Shadow-Fighter · December 2018

I see. You missed the era of softcaps with 1000 players around...

The time has changed, there is no way to go back. Adopt to the changes and git gud, or leave...

ArchMikem · December 2018

PvPers are obsessed with the phrase "git gud".

Latios · December 2018

I think you are confusing PvP with Duels. Dueling is a fair fight, the best wins, etc. PvP, on the other hand, is war. There is no fairness in war. Take detect pots with you, use all impenetrable gear, be on guard at all times, keep buffs up. That's how you should remain alive.

Rohamad_Ali · December 2018

Someone gets gankered a lot .

Emmagoldman · December 2018

You will see a big difference in cp. Non cp requires more resource control and has better balance imo

Also, stick to a class for awhile. stamnb with time become a highly predictable class. LA, p inject, ambush, la suprise attack, suprise attack, execute. if no kill, repeat. once you learn what they are doing they become a class that is generally easier to counter.

what are you playing?

Vapirko · December 2018

I haven’t encountered any insta kill builds this patch, aside from snipe lag. Also what does 15k, 15k, 15k on a heavy armor mean? If you’re getting hit for 15k then something seriously wrong with your build and/or CP distribution.

Haquor · December 2018

Its an alliance war. Not an alliance duel.

technohic · December 2018

I'm not sure what the instakill abilities are these days. Thought it was bleeds and oblivion damage these days that ignore armor but takes some setup

lucky_Sage · December 2018

Yeah the balance is bad but alot is still L2P

idk · December 2018

ESO killed PvP well over 4 years ago. For a long time Cyrodiil has been a pale from of how it was originally and for none of the reasons OP has mentioned. Many of the PvP players went back to PvP games.

ochsinator · December 2018

TequilaFire wrote: »

Yes there are a few OP builds, but stop to remember there was a time when the strong player that kills you took his licks and died just as quickly till he/she gained experience and a good build.

This is very true I used to get molly wopped in pvp but I kept playing with sets and skills and learned how to time my skills better and it makes a huge difference. Yes sometimes I get wrecked but I also wreck people sometimes. Really rewarding when you burst someout down and execute them on a stam dk especially because we are lacking burst capabilities -__- but besides the small rate yes get gear that compliments each other and the way you want to play and find skill rotations that work.

Duukar · December 2018

Proc sets and weapon enchants are to blame for this absurd burst. plus general power creep.

The biggest burst in the game right now is coming from stam warden. If they time it properly, and build properly, I don't see a lot of players eating this to their face and surviving. They honestly dont even need to have a proc set in order to pull it off. Helps tho.

Basically Oblivion enchant and phys dmg for stam enchant add another approx 3-5k to the burst which is like 15% of players life in BGs. Pair that wth sub assault - crit rush - light attack - dawnbreaker - executioner You wont see individual hits for 15k 15k and 15k but the burst can be 23-30k even in the BGs vs a properly build opponent. Thats one dead player.

MetalHead4x4 · December 2018

I don't get the people who run the same class as me, but say their Flame Reach hits for damn near 5k and mine is lucky to hit for 2k, its usually more like 1k. Sorcs being in a weak spot right now I see Sorcs (now) literally taking on 5 guys at once taking little to no damage against heavy hitters like Cripple and Frags. They shrug them off with seemingly endless sustain and hit like trucks running a heal pet (which heals for *** really). Even with near 50k magicka I couldn't survive using a pet heal it was just never enough. It's weird how these "top" player seem to have these unusual builds that look like *** on paper but they can somehow out gun even good players on them. There's no way they can just be "better" than everyone else. It's fishy.

Mayrael · December 2018

Latios wrote: »

I think you are confusing PvP with Duels. Dueling is a fair fight, the best wins, etc. PvP, on the other hand, is war. There is no fairness in war. Take detect pots with you, use all impenetrable gear, be on guard at all times, keep buffs up. That's how you should remain alive.

I love this comment

That's exactly my way of thinking about Cyrodiil. It's war babe! Everything that's not a hack/bug/exploit is allowed, better get used to it. That's why I love Cyrodiil the most. You just can't adjust your build before each fight, you need find the most universal build. When we are at it, IC is even better because you need to count PvE to.

Gnozo · December 2018

I like how its always said that there are "op builds " wich makes players immortal or killing others with just one skill.

Its not all about the build you know.... Its the player that makes the build good. A bad player is still free AP even when he has bis gear.

Claudman · December 2018

ESO killed PvP? I think PvP in ESO was dead from the start...

Don't get me wrong, I like PvP, but...PvP felt like a last addition for the sake of pleasing higher-ups because it'll draw in a big crowd to make "exciting DLC stories" for, but didn't realize that this is an Elder Scrolls game where people are going to care more about the crazy world-building and stories...And not the PvP. I mean, Imperial City was one of the most unpopular DLCs, there is a reason why they hadn't continued the story from Imperial City like they originally intended and went for a whole other and new story.

Plus the balancing trying desperately to cater to both PvP and PvE doesn't help at all. You kinda need to flip a coin to see whether the next update is going to prioritize PvP or PvE in terms of balancing and it seems that the recent one catered to PvP in some aspects considering the damage shield nerf which hindered those trying to attempt no death.

Glurin · December 2018

Shadow-Fighter wrote: »

I see. You missed the era of softcaps with 1000 players around...

The time has changed, there is no way to go back. Adopt to the changes and git gud, or leave...

What do you mean there is no way back? You just turn softcaps back on and hand everyone drinking goblets for all the tears that will soon flow from the min/maxers using brute force as a crutch.

Iorek_Nhuvasarim · January 2019

This guy is right, it's a simple solution but to keep all the chavs saying "get good" happy they won't do anything, you see they don't work they just play games all day so that's Bethesda's main income right there... Ars*h*les

zaria · January 2019

Glurin wrote: »

Shadow-Fighter wrote: »

I see. You missed the era of softcaps with 1000 players around...

The time has changed, there is no way to go back. Adopt to the changes and git gud, or leave...

What do you mean there is no way back? You just turn softcaps back on and hand everyone drinking goblets for all the tears that will soon flow from the min/maxers using brute force as a crutch.

Problem was not softcap, it was all the cheating going on as so much calculations was done client side.
So you could hack the game and say give you 500 ultimate second.
Cheating is an serious problem in lots of PvP games.
ZoS moved calculations to server who become overloaded and it has to be far more communication between server and client.
Think it should be possible to solve other ways but far more complex and not so safe.
Have both do the calculations but server just do it on a few random players and compare the data, to much difference and flag. Problem is that this would probably get lots of errors because of lag. Enemy drop an ultimate against you while moving.
Server see an hit, your client get the ultimate later so it missed you.

TequilaFire · January 2019

nvm

Kadoin · January 2019

Most hard hitting skills can be rolled or blocked. There's your answer. For everything else, use a healing + lingering + invis pot. Works well...

ChunkyCat · January 2019

tchahin wrote: »

The damage of some builds 15k + 15k + 15k, on a Heavy Armor makes healers completely useless in Cyrodiil or Battlegrounds.

Theres not much a healer can do to help a player who is undergoing an enemy burst.

Anrose · January 2019

Thought this was going to be a thread about how PvP is discouraged and people resort to PvDoor... was disappointed.

WillhelmBlack · January 2019

As a healer you should be using a Templar or Nightblade. A class that can mark the biggest threats. It's your job to coordinate the group not just spam BoL. Use weakening enchantments, HoT's, healing and defensive ultimates but above all wear sets that will keep them alive.

Earthgore
Bogdan
Bloodspawn
Sanctuary
Healing Mage
Transmutation
Masters Resto
Black Rose Resto

All Impenetrable traits.

Here:

https://youtu.be/XjsDMgGCtBg

WillhelmBlack · January 2019

And PvP in ESO is not dead. It's so unique it's why I keep coming back.

Haashhtaag · January 2019

Latios wrote: »

I think you are confusing PvP with Duels. Dueling is a fair fight, the best wins, etc. PvP, on the other hand, is war. There is no fairness in war. Take detect pots with you, use all impenetrable gear, be on guard at all times, keep buffs up. That's how you should remain alive.

Currently dueling is more reliant on sets and etc now more than ever before

Brrrofski · January 2019

This is the least fun PvP has ever been.

Main reason is Stam warden. Shalks, dawnbreaker and spin to win groups are seriously ruining PvP for me right now. It's the most boring, most effective meta yet. Xbox eu is full of them.

Kuramas9tails · January 2019

PVP use to be worse. There's three things I can see as this being an issue:

1. The players animation canceling was on point
2. Lag was not on your side (or desynced)
3. If none of the above two then I hate to say it but you need to get good

Let me explain #3. I use to be a n00b who screamed "ONE HIT! UNFAIR!" and cry about animation cancelers but the longer I small scaled PVP and two maned PVP, I realized I was starting to understand and learn builds and rotations. As soon as I hear a "plat" from a bow, I know immediately the bow user is going to switch bars and gap close and probably incap or dawn breaker so as soon as I hear that noise, I roll dodge and immediately dodge their attacks and get the upper hand. When I see wings, I simply just stop because my build can't do much on that and I count down until their wings expire. The light cast on me from a templar, I create as much distance as possible because templars need to be close to use their jabby jabs and that's their healy heals.

You can't just sit on one build and cry "unfair" about others without knowing the other build and the weakness around them.