So now that sorcs been nerfed for PvE we need to look at nightblades

Royaji · November 2018

Wait, are you really complaining about someone cloaking past mobs in delves and overland? Really? And I thought I've already seen the stupidest nerf request...

OneKhajiitCrimeWave · November 2018

How dare a NB use a class skill to sneak???

I mean, it's only the rogue class with a cloak, not like they're meant to be stealthy.

Seriously though, if you're that envious grab 3 gold cooldown reduction glyphs on skooma smuggler set and use basic invis pots. Instant stealth and expedition for mag classes not NB's.

Or do the same on jailbreaker and run invis and major exp pots if you're stam. All that speed and invis.... become a vamp and check you out.... SPEEEEEEED and stealth.

evoniee · November 2018

S L O T C L O A K A T P V E

tgrippa · November 2018

Use invisibility pots, get good at the game. If OP is serious about this thread, then this will never be a game that they will excel in. Don’t call for nerfs, instead Learn 2 Play.

ezio45 · November 2018

BLIZZchaos wrote: »

Yo im just gonna be honest.. Sorc shields allowed them ro shield up and atk 2-3 times adn then reapply shield while fighting several enemies at once.... BUT.... they had to fight them.... NightBlades are CLOAKING thru everything, getting to the chest or bosses and fighting them then cloaking away... This gives them a heavy advantage in PvE when im having to run to try and keep up in delves but everything aggros onto me since he is stealth/invis so he kills boss then invis and runs to next one..... And as for skipping mechanics look at AndyS run thru maelstrom on his NB....

I think NB should be giving more sustain and lose some crit buffs THEN instead of giving them invis in PvE make it a CHANCE to not be seen like 1 moreph is 30% chance not to be seen with some speed and the other is like 60% chance to avoid detection but gives recovery

Dont let nightblades keep skipping content that was intended for us to go thru.

NO NO MORE NERFS

im a sorc, I dont like these changes either. personally i want some devs fired over this. BUT NO MORE DAMN NERFS

nightblade is a good class, sorc needs to be fixed, END OF DAMN DISCUSSION

iiYuki · November 2018

"YEAH!!! we ruined Sorcerers lets ruin Nightblades too!"
- *** that, for some reason, cant see the bigger picture or just enjoy QQ'ing on the forums?

Instead of Nerf, Nerf, Nerf how about we buff other classes. Crazy idea I know and might actually involve some thinking by ZO$ about something other than limited time re-skins for the cash grab store and blanket nerfs that destroy abilities, sets and entire classes.

FrancisCrawford · November 2018

kamimark wrote: »

This, exactly. Make Cloak work like Streak, with exponential cost increase until it cools down. 9 seconds of cloak burning out all their Magicka would put them on par with other classes. Cut down the damage and recovery from Drain; they're double-dipping on attack/heal there.

I've played Nightblade & Sorcerer, hybrid, mag, and stam, since launch, Warden main since Morrowind. The Nightblades are absolutely OP, have been since one of the early patches. The other two started weak but competent at one thing, and then got nerfed every patch. I just find NB incredibly boring and trashy to play.

Just because some devs obviously prefer NB, it shouldn't be the all-powerful class it is now.

And, you know, taking the Nightblades' candy away and making them cry for once would be good for the little spoiled brats.

Magblades were nerfed into O/oblivion in Murkmire. I DO love playing my stamblade thief in easy overland content, but he's not a great fighter; he's just good at running around enemies and avoiding fights, and he's good enough to win easy overland fights that he doesn't avoid.

therift · November 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

BLIZZchaos wrote: »

Yo im just gonna be honest.. Sorc shields allowed them ro shield up and atk 2-3 times adn then reapply shield while fighting several enemies at once.... BUT.... they had to fight them.... NightBlades are CLOAKING thru everything, getting to the chest or bosses and fighting them then cloaking away... This gives them a heavy advantage in PvE when im having to run to try and keep up in delves but everything aggros onto me since he is stealth/invis so he kills boss then invis and runs to next one..... And as for skipping mechanics look at AndyS run thru maelstrom on his NB....

I think NB should be giving more sustain and lose some crit buffs THEN instead of giving them invis in PvE make it a CHANCE to not be seen like 1 moreph is 30% chance not to be seen with some speed and the other is like 60% chance to avoid detection but gives recovery

Dont let nightblades keep skipping content that was intended for us to go thru.

NO NO MORE NERFS

im a sorc, I dont like these changes either. personally i want some devs fired over this. BUT NO MORE DAMN NERFS

nightblade is a good class, sorc needs to be fixed, END OF DAMN DISCUSSION

Agree 100%.

It's been said many times that Nightblades should be the model for other classes in terms of synergy between abilities, passives, and playstyles. Sorcerers have been crushed, Templars have been gutted, Dragonknights tinkered to death, and Wardens abandoned, particularly magdens, from the original designs of the classes.

This is due to nerfs in pursuit of an elusive and mutable idea of 'balance' between the classes. There's something wrong when stamina builds dominate PvP. There's something wrong when stamina builds need to fill skill bars with weapon skills over class skills. There's something wrong when magicka builds are forced into heavy armor for damage mitigation. There's something wrong when meta builds change dramatically with every Update.

Nerfs should only be done when a mistake was made... in other words, a correction.

This whack-a-mole approach to balance has got to stop, and calls for nerfs had better be backed up with clear, documented evidence that a design or mathematical error needs to be corrected.

I hate strongly dislike dealing with cloak in PvP. Incap kicks my arse. But there are numerous counters and tactics to deal with Nightblades, so it's on me to l2p and git gud. The first rule is to never let your guard down. Second rule is to react immediately.

tl/dr: Don't nerf Nightblade; use it as model for a well-designed class

Unit117 · November 2018

Entitled sorcs. Come talk to me when your class gets as bad as ice staff warden tanks

TequilaFire · November 2018

Edit - Self deleted because I can't say what I want to say.

usmguy1234 · November 2018

TequilaFire wrote: »

Edit - Self deleted because I can't say what I want to say.

I felt the same way when magsorc got pummeled to the ground. I'm just glad we're no longer the center of attention anymore.

TequilaFire · November 2018

And the it just gets deeper, where are my hip boots?

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

We only need DK for close combat, NB for ranged and magicka and some templars for resing and purgin, sorcs and wardens are too universal and plain for game which is clearly designed around characters with role and not jack-of-all-trades.

alanmatillab16_ESO · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

We only need DK for close combat, NB for ranged and magicka and some templars for resing and purgin, sorcs and wardens are too universal and plain for game which is clearly designed around characters with role and not jack-of-all-trades.

Actually the game is designed around playing the character you want to. If someone wants to make a character with an "inefficient" race/class/skills choice combo they are welcome to.

If you want to minimax World of Warcraft is over there ---->

It needs the help...

Mettaricana · November 2018

Sum up i got nerfed so im gonna retaliate call nerfs on someone else rather that suckitup buttercup and moving on with my life.

Aeladiir · November 2018

alanmatillab16_ESO wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

We only need DK for close combat, NB for ranged and magicka and some templars for resing and purgin, sorcs and wardens are too universal and plain for game which is clearly designed around characters with role and not jack-of-all-trades.

Actually the game is designed around playing the character you want to. If someone wants to make a character with an "inefficient" race/class/skills choice combo they are welcome to.

If you want to minimax World of Warcraft is over there ---->

It needs the help...

The belief that this game is designed around playing the character you want to make and, as advertised, playing however you want, is absolutely wrong and if you actually believe it you are being purposefully ignorant. Humans are competitive by nature, humans seek to become better and better by nature, and these things inherently translate to video games, an interactive medium, as well.

This game promotes mechanics built around animation canceling, rotations, DPS races and "hard" content that requires your character to be incredibly strong, but enables that only through following a certain set of rules placed upon you by ZOS.

Want to be a stamina sorcerer healer with a destruction staff? Well, sucks to be you, you will never finish that veteran Maw of Lorkhaj and you will even be a liability in the normal version.
Want to be a hybrid nightblade who uses a restoration staff on one bar and two daggers on the other? Yeah, good luck.
Want to be a battlemage with heavy armor who can also tank, meaning that you invest both in magicka and health? Not gonna work, sir.
Want to be a meat shield with infinite amounts of health, only fighting people with bare fists? You know the answer.
And so on, and so on... let's not even bring races into this, because that's a whole another dimension of how ZOS destroyed their most advertised mantra.

You can play however you want only if you decide to limit yourself to insultingly easy content such as the overland zones and some normal dungeons. While that is most of the content, your character will eventually stop growing entirely until you get bored (and let me tell you, most will get bored BEFORE they finish all of the content) and move on to some other game that provides you with much greater depth.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

alanmatillab16_ESO wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

We only need DK for close combat, NB for ranged and magicka and some templars for resing and purgin, sorcs and wardens are too universal and plain for game which is clearly designed around characters with role and not jack-of-all-trades.

Actually the game is designed around playing the character you want to. If someone wants to make a character with an "inefficient" race/class/skills choice combo they are welcome to.

If you want to minimax World of Warcraft is over there ---->

It needs the help...

I'm not saying i like what's going on in ESO, i've played previous TES games for enormous time and I am used to fluid and adjustable characters, not min-maxed. But now all top content is about min-maxing, and not-top content is about grinding. So since sorc lost some of his powerful and unique sided in last patches he turned out to be like Warden now.. jack-of-all trades.

Aeladiir · November 2018

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

Sorc players are degenerates. Using shields (again: shields, not utilitizing defensive stats) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing shields in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals. (/s)

That’s how dumb you sound

Butthurt.

As it was meant to sound, I did quote you after all

If you’d like to present some actual discussion points instead of crying about a different combat strategy, especially when Cloak is probably the most easily countered defensive ability in the game, then go ahead and say so.

>cloak
>strategy
Yikes.

Here, take this:

https://youtu.be/vt1Pwfnh5pc

Jhalin · November 2018

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

Sorc players are degenerates. Using shields (again: shields, not utilitizing defensive stats) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing shields in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals. (/s)

That’s how dumb you sound

Butthurt.

As it was meant to sound, I did quote you after all

If you’d like to present some actual discussion points instead of crying about a different combat strategy, especially when Cloak is probably the most easily countered defensive ability in the game, then go ahead and say so.

>cloak
>strategy
Yikes.

Here, take this:
https://youtu.be/vt1Pwfnh5pc

Alright so I see you’re committed to being a nuisance with nothing of value to put toward the discussion. If you can’t be assed to slot a single AoE that will permanently render Cloak useless during the fight, then you’re not equipped to talk about strategy at all.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Let's list unique, signature features of each class, which can be achieved only but that class without sacrificing overall efficiency:
DK - flame lash, chains, leap, wings, battle roar, extended melee reach, igneous shards, helping hands, magma armor, molten armaments
Templar - jabs, spear shards, backlash, rite, ritual, rune focus, super-resurrection
NB - incap, assassin blade, grim focus, veiled strike, cloak, terror, shadow, protection from shadow, offering, siphonin', catalyst
Sorc - frags, cage, blood magic,ward (all directly or indirectly nerfed to mediocrity), bound armor (was in "synergy" with shields-protection, now just dps boost and limited use for heavy blocks).. bolt escape (nerfed) overload 3rd bar (rip), hurricane, pets
Warden - bear (nerfed), predator (nerfed with speed nerf), swarm (nerfed), scorch, netch (kewl), grove, mushrooms, frost cloak, impaling shards (ditched this patch), portals (eh?)

So while sorc has amazing passives and can stack great base parameters, his signature tactical abilities were nerfed or removed, while warden has unique but non-meta (i.e. limited use) features and some very powerful stamina abilities which allow stamwarden to shine now, but they are not-unique.. compare that with mass amount of tactical opportunities of DK and NB and clear healing superiority of Templar.

Juhasow · November 2018

kypranb14_ESO wrote: »

Ramber wrote: »

Cloak is a real joke in pvp. so lets start there, it should cost like 9k stam or something. sounds funny bot for what they get there should be a huge cost associated with the best ability in the game by far... next is an ulti that basically charges itself lol.

DK's Wings, Sorc's Ball of Lightning, Warden's Crystallized Shield, all have very similar functionality. If ZoS were to take your poor advice and make cloak cost OVER 9000! Then I'd expect to see similar costs for the similar abilities.

Also, there is an Ulti that charges itself. It's called Onslaught. lol

Comparing cloak to all other mentioned defenses is a joke.

Jhalin wrote: »

for the last time

Nightblades have not gotten a single significant buff to their playstyle for YEARS. The ONLY thing that got buffed was Spectral Bow not dropping stacks if recast early, and ability to cast Shade without a target.

Everything else has gotten nerfs! Everything from damage to utility to cc to sustain! Everything got nerfs! It only seems “”“OP””” because every other class has been beaten down since Morrowind so much that it seems that way to people who don’t understand what context is

That is not entirely correct. The state where everything is nerfed and nightblade is nerfed by the smallest amount or gets small improvements is what's happening lately but since You've used term "for years" then we also need to remember times where nightblades were actually getting lot of decent buffs that in longer terms bringed them to the current state.

Juhasow · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

It seems OP does not do serious PvE. No strong Pve NB build uses cloak.

OP just seems to be raging because he is upset their class got nerfed. Really lacks logic to call for nerfs like this. Most of what is said in the OP just does not make sense either.

Beat me to it. Came to ask what PvE nightblade slots cloak? Certainly not in any vet content.

I think when it comes to PvE , discussion was more about use of cloak in solo content where cloak allows to save hours when exploring maps just by allowing to avoid any fight and get straight to the objective. Not every PvE discussion is about game end vet content.

Then instead of "nerf everything that isn't my class", why not call out to be brought up in line with what you perceive the shortcomings of your class are?
The incessant call of nerfs is going to leave this game in shambles.

Stop asking to nerf others, ask to buff your class instead. It's getting meme worthy levels of ridiculous in this forum....

Too much buffs brings more issues then to many nerfs. Look at current state of PvE. Despite of nerfs that we're reciving from morrowind still we're doing 2-3 times more DPS then required to complete the content only because we've been overbuffed for too long before Morrowind and even now despite that many nerfs people are crying about lot of buffs is happening in the meantime. Also thinking that people want nerfs for everything that isnt their class is huge simplification of the issue with community.

Gilvoth · November 2018

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

SO, You think us people whom use stealth are cowards and immoral low lifes?
well, we here at the US Millitary thinks differently!
Stealth - Army, Navy, Military, Air Force, Marines, Coast ...
using prevailing weather – the tactical use of weather as a force multiplier has influenced many important battles throughout history, such as the Battle of Waterloo.[2]
Fire attacks – reconnaissance by fire is used by apprehensive soldiers when they suspect the enemy is nearby.
Force concentration – the practice of concentrating a military force against a portion of an enemy force.[3]
Night combat – combat that takes place at night. It often requires more preparation than combat during daylight and can provide significant tactical advantages and disadvantages to both the attacker and defender.[4]
Reconnaissance – a mission to obtain information by visual observation or other detection methods, about the activities and resources of the enemy or potential enemy, or about the meteorologic, hydrographic, or geographic characteristics of a particular area.[5]
Smoke screening - the practice of creating clouds of smoke positioned to provide concealment, allowing military forces to advance or retreat across open terrain without coming under direct fire from the enemy

Individual movement techniques
Fire and movement (also known as leapfrogging) – working in 'fire teams', one team attempts to suppress the enemy while the other moves either toward the enemy or to a more favourable position.
Basic drill – a standard drill that all individual soldiers are supposed to perform if they come under fire.
Contact drill
Immediate ambush drill
Counter ambush drill
Hull-down (in armored warfare)
Shoot-and-scoot
Infiltration tactics
Marching fire
Four Fs: find, fix, flank, finish
Overwatch
Bounding overwatch
Center peel
Patrolling
Reconnaissance patrol
Fighting patrol
Standing patrol (OP/LP)
Ambush
Linear ambush
L ambush
Area ambush
Guerrilla

Penetration of the center: This involves the creation of a gap in the enemy line and its exploitation. Two ways of accomplishing this are separating enemy forces and using a reserve to exploit the gap that forms between them (e.g. Battle of Chaeronea (338 BC), the first recorded use of the penetration of the center) or having fast, elite forces smash at a specific point in the enemy line (an enemy weak spot or an area where your elites are at their best in striking power) and, while reserves and holding forces hold your opponent, drive quickly and immediately for the enemy's command or base (i.e., blitzkrieg).

Battle of Issus, a classic example of the single envelopment
Attack from a defensive position: Establishing a strong defensive position from which to defend and attack your opponent. However, the defensive can become too passive and result in ultimate defeat (e.g., Siege of Alesia and the Battle of the Granicus).

Battle of Maling, the earliest known use of the feigned retreat
Single envelopment: A strong flank beating its opponent opposite and, with the aid of holding attacks, attack an opponent in the rear. Sometimes, the establishment of a strong, hidden force behind a weak flank will prevent your opponent from carrying out their own single envelopment (e.g., Battle of Rocroi).
Double envelopment: Both flanks defeat their opponent opposite and launch a rear attack on the enemy center. Its most famous use was Hannibal's tactical masterpiece, the Battle of Cannae and was frequently used by the Wehrmacht on the Eastern Front of World War II.
Attack in oblique order: This involves placing your flanks in a slanted fashion (refusing one's flank) or giving a vast part of your force to a single flank (e.g., Battle of Leuthen). The latter can be disastrous, however, due to the imbalance of force.
Feigned retreat: Having a frontal force fake a retreat, drawing the opponent in pursuit and then launching an assault with strong force held in reserve (such as the Battle of Maling and the Battle of Hastings). However, a feigned retreat may devolve into a real one, such as in the Battle of Grunwald.
Indirect approach: Having a minority of your force demonstrate in front of your opponent while the majority of your force advance from a hidden area and attack the enemy in the rear or flank (e.g., Battle of Chancellorsville).
Crossing the "T": a classic naval maneuver which maximizes one side's offensive firepower while minimizing that of the opposing force.

Rapid dominance
Blitzkrieg – a method of warfare whereby an attacking force is spearheaded by a dense concentration of armoured and motorized or mechanized infantry formations, and heavily backed up by close air support.[6]
Carpet bombing – also known as saturation bombing, is a large aerial bombing done in a progressive manner to inflict damage in every part of a selected area of land.[7]
Human wave attack
Shock tactics
Swarming (military)
Planned attack
Use of supporting fire
Ambush
Indirect fire support
Base of fire
Flying wedge (used by Alexander the Great)
Armoured spearhead
Encirclement
Hammer and anvil
Inverted wedge
Frontal assault
Holding attack – to hold the enemy in position while other offensive or defensive activity takes place[citation needed].
Penetration or infiltration
Pincer movement – an army assaults an enemy by attacking two sides at opposite locations, often planning to cut off the enemy from retreat or additional support in preparation for annihilation.
Bull horn formation – an army assaults an enemy force by sending troops to the enemy's flanks and by attacking their front attacking three areas at once, often planning to cut off any retreat or support as well as confusing the enemy in preparation for annihilation.
Flanking maneuver
Interdiction – severing or disrupting lines of communication and supply
Air interdiction
Control MSR (main supply routes)
Envelopment tactics
Circumvallation
Finnish motti tactics
Siege (For attacking fortified places)
Vertical envelopment
Airborne forces
Air mobile forces
Rapid deployment
Capturing key points
Airborne operations
Air mobile operations
Amphibious operations
Motorized operations
Tank desant
Mechanized operations
Armored operations
Raiding – a small team is inserted deep behind enemy lines to capture a high-value individual or destroy a vital enemy installation then extracted before the enemy can respond.
Decapitation strike
Preemptive war
Disrupting communications
Electronic countermeasures
Radar jamming
Radio jamming
Defensive tactics

Defensive trenches were used commonly during World War I
Basic principles
Defence in depth
Mutual support (e.g., by crossfire)
Echelon formation
Phalanx formation
All round defence
Force dispersal
Fire Trap
Fighting withdrawal
Reserved demolitions
Scorched earth
Booby traps
Minefields
Trench warfare
Counter attack
Breakout
Counter battery fire
Rapid reaction force
Delaying defence
Break contact
Hedgehog defence
military bottleneck
Pakfront
Fortification
Field works (entrenchments)
Over head protection
Revetting
Sangars
Shell scrapes
Foxholes
Manholes
Spider holes
Strong points
Use and improvement of terrain
High ground
Protection
Natural barriers – e.g., rivers
Reverse slope defence
Obstacles and barriers – man made
Barbed wire
Anti-vehicle ditches
Anti-vehicle berms (knife edges)
Multiple axis of movement

STEALTH is a valid millitary tactic known WORLD WIDE as not only VALID but also as a fair playstyle!

Drdeath20 · November 2018

Cloak involves no strategy. It will be nerfed hard next.

Gilvoth · November 2018

Fighting withdrawal
IS a valid tactic that does involve strategy
see above list if your in confusion about its placement in the fighting scene.

Jhalin · November 2018

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

Sorc players are degenerates. Using shields (again: shields, not utilitizing defensive stats) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing shields in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals. (/s)

That’s how dumb you sound

Butthurt.

As it was meant to sound, I did quote you after all

If you’d like to present some actual discussion points instead of crying about a different combat strategy, especially when Cloak is probably the most easily countered defensive ability in the game, then go ahead and say so.

>cloak
>strategy
Yikes.

Here, take this:
https://youtu.be/vt1Pwfnh5pc

Alright so I see you’re committed to being a nuisance with nothing of value to put toward the discussion. If you can’t be assed to slot a single AoE that will permanently render Cloak useless during the fight, then you’re not equipped to talk about strategy at all.

[edited to removed deleted content]

I’m offended by your ignorance. Clearly you’ve never played the class or you’d know that it does require timing and clever movement choices to avoid detection while cloaking. In melee range Cloak provide little to no value since every player has an AoE on their bar that has no loss of combat effectiveness to them that will completely negate the use of Cloak.

Cloak does not get partial values ever. Shields can be pressured off with CP, or partially circumvented with oblivion damage and bleeds, but it will always mitigate its values in some way.

Cloak will mitigate no damage if it’s broken.

Healing can be reduced with Defile, but it still gets partial value.

Cloak duration is reduced to zero if it’s broken.

DK wings can be circumvented with certain spells and most melee attacks, but will still return their full amount of projectiles.

Cloak’s utility stops existing if it’s broken.

And allllll those other defensive measures still allow players to attack, heal themselves, and use sprint and dodge roll while using them.

It’s no more cowardly than you hiding your health behind a shield

Malmai · November 2018

BLIZZchaos wrote: »

Yo im just gonna be honest.. Sorc shields allowed them ro shield up and atk 2-3 times adn then reapply shield while fighting several enemies at once.... BUT.... they had to fight them.... NightBlades are CLOAKING thru everything, getting to the chest or bosses and fighting them then cloaking away... This gives them a heavy advantage in PvE when im having to run to try and keep up in delves but everything aggros onto me since he is stealth/invis so he kills boss then invis and runs to next one..... And as for skipping mechanics look at AndyS run thru maelstrom on his NB....

I think NB should be giving more sustain and lose some crit buffs THEN instead of giving them invis in PvE make it a CHANCE to not be seen like 1 moreph is 30% chance not to be seen with some speed and the other is like 60% chance to avoid detection but gives recovery

Dont let nightblades keep skipping content that was intended for us to go thru.

Im glad i left this game 2 years ago but still cant help myself and say to people like youself whining about pointless nerfs haha.

Juhasow · November 2018

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

SO, You think us people whom use stealth are cowards and immoral low lifes?
well, we here at the US Millitary thinks differently!
Stealth - Army, Navy, Military, Air Force, Marines, Coast ...
using prevailing weather – the tactical use of weather as a force multiplier has influenced many important battles throughout history, such as the Battle of Waterloo.[2]
Fire attacks – reconnaissance by fire is used by apprehensive soldiers when they suspect the enemy is nearby.
Force concentration – the practice of concentrating a military force against a portion of an enemy force.[3]
Night combat – combat that takes place at night. It often requires more preparation than combat during daylight and can provide significant tactical advantages and disadvantages to both the attacker and defender.[4]
Reconnaissance – a mission to obtain information by visual observation or other detection methods, about the activities and resources of the enemy or potential enemy, or about the meteorologic, hydrographic, or geographic characteristics of a particular area.[5]
Smoke screening - the practice of creating clouds of smoke positioned to provide concealment, allowing military forces to advance or retreat across open terrain without coming under direct fire from the enemy

Individual movement techniques
Fire and movement (also known as leapfrogging) – working in 'fire teams', one team attempts to suppress the enemy while the other moves either toward the enemy or to a more favourable position.
Basic drill – a standard drill that all individual soldiers are supposed to perform if they come under fire.
Contact drill
Immediate ambush drill
Counter ambush drill
Hull-down (in armored warfare)
Shoot-and-scoot
Infiltration tactics
Marching fire
Four Fs: find, fix, flank, finish
Overwatch
Bounding overwatch
Center peel
Patrolling
Reconnaissance patrol
Fighting patrol
Standing patrol (OP/LP)
Ambush
Linear ambush
L ambush
Area ambush
Guerrilla

Penetration of the center: This involves the creation of a gap in the enemy line and its exploitation. Two ways of accomplishing this are separating enemy forces and using a reserve to exploit the gap that forms between them (e.g. Battle of Chaeronea (338 BC), the first recorded use of the penetration of the center) or having fast, elite forces smash at a specific point in the enemy line (an enemy weak spot or an area where your elites are at their best in striking power) and, while reserves and holding forces hold your opponent, drive quickly and immediately for the enemy's command or base (i.e., blitzkrieg).

Battle of Issus, a classic example of the single envelopment
Attack from a defensive position: Establishing a strong defensive position from which to defend and attack your opponent. However, the defensive can become too passive and result in ultimate defeat (e.g., Siege of Alesia and the Battle of the Granicus).

Battle of Maling, the earliest known use of the feigned retreat
Single envelopment: A strong flank beating its opponent opposite and, with the aid of holding attacks, attack an opponent in the rear. Sometimes, the establishment of a strong, hidden force behind a weak flank will prevent your opponent from carrying out their own single envelopment (e.g., Battle of Rocroi).
Double envelopment: Both flanks defeat their opponent opposite and launch a rear attack on the enemy center. Its most famous use was Hannibal's tactical masterpiece, the Battle of Cannae and was frequently used by the Wehrmacht on the Eastern Front of World War II.
Attack in oblique order: This involves placing your flanks in a slanted fashion (refusing one's flank) or giving a vast part of your force to a single flank (e.g., Battle of Leuthen). The latter can be disastrous, however, due to the imbalance of force.
Feigned retreat: Having a frontal force fake a retreat, drawing the opponent in pursuit and then launching an assault with strong force held in reserve (such as the Battle of Maling and the Battle of Hastings). However, a feigned retreat may devolve into a real one, such as in the Battle of Grunwald.
Indirect approach: Having a minority of your force demonstrate in front of your opponent while the majority of your force advance from a hidden area and attack the enemy in the rear or flank (e.g., Battle of Chancellorsville).
Crossing the "T": a classic naval maneuver which maximizes one side's offensive firepower while minimizing that of the opposing force.

Rapid dominance
Blitzkrieg – a method of warfare whereby an attacking force is spearheaded by a dense concentration of armoured and motorized or mechanized infantry formations, and heavily backed up by close air support.[6]
Carpet bombing – also known as saturation bombing, is a large aerial bombing done in a progressive manner to inflict damage in every part of a selected area of land.[7]
Human wave attack
Shock tactics
Swarming (military)
Planned attack
Use of supporting fire
Ambush
Indirect fire support
Base of fire
Flying wedge (used by Alexander the Great)
Armoured spearhead
Encirclement
Hammer and anvil
Inverted wedge
Frontal assault
Holding attack – to hold the enemy in position while other offensive or defensive activity takes place[citation needed].
Penetration or infiltration
Pincer movement – an army assaults an enemy by attacking two sides at opposite locations, often planning to cut off the enemy from retreat or additional support in preparation for annihilation.
Bull horn formation – an army assaults an enemy force by sending troops to the enemy's flanks and by attacking their front attacking three areas at once, often planning to cut off any retreat or support as well as confusing the enemy in preparation for annihilation.
Flanking maneuver
Interdiction – severing or disrupting lines of communication and supply
Air interdiction
Control MSR (main supply routes)
Envelopment tactics
Circumvallation
Finnish motti tactics
Siege (For attacking fortified places)
Vertical envelopment
Airborne forces
Air mobile forces
Rapid deployment
Capturing key points
Airborne operations
Air mobile operations
Amphibious operations
Motorized operations
Tank desant
Mechanized operations
Armored operations
Raiding – a small team is inserted deep behind enemy lines to capture a high-value individual or destroy a vital enemy installation then extracted before the enemy can respond.
Decapitation strike
Preemptive war
Disrupting communications
Electronic countermeasures
Radar jamming
Radio jamming
Defensive tactics

Defensive trenches were used commonly during World War I
Basic principles
Defence in depth
Mutual support (e.g., by crossfire)
Echelon formation
Phalanx formation
All round defence
Force dispersal
Fire Trap
Fighting withdrawal
Reserved demolitions
Scorched earth
Booby traps
Minefields
Trench warfare
Counter attack
Breakout
Counter battery fire
Rapid reaction force
Delaying defence
Break contact
Hedgehog defence
military bottleneck
Pakfront
Fortification
Field works (entrenchments)
Over head protection
Revetting
Sangars
Shell scrapes
Foxholes
Manholes
Spider holes
Strong points
Use and improvement of terrain
High ground
Protection
Natural barriers – e.g., rivers
Reverse slope defence
Obstacles and barriers – man made
Barbed wire
Anti-vehicle ditches
Anti-vehicle berms (knife edges)
Multiple axis of movement

STEALTH is a valid millitary tactic known WORLD WIDE as not only VALID but also as a fair playstyle!

Hmm so You're saying there are soldiers in real armies that are trained to use cloak type abilities and can vanish from combat at any given time even after they were noticed ?

Real stealth combat tactics have nothing to do with the ones presented in video games and bringing above wall of text as an argument is laughable.

kypranb14_ESO · November 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

kypranb14_ESO wrote: »

DK's Wings, Sorc's Ball of Lightning, Warden's Crystallized Shield, all have very similar functionality. If ZoS were to take your poor advice and make cloak cost OVER 9000! Then I'd expect to see similar costs for the similar abilities.

Also, there is an Ulti that charges itself. It's called Onslaught. lol

Comparing cloak to all other mentioned defenses is a joke.

Not really. All those abilities counter projectile builds, but are absolutely useless against anybody within melee range, and an IQ over 70.

The only thing that gives cloak an advantage over those other abilities is that is has greater defensive value against scrubs, through becoming invisible.

However, we could argue that Wings have greater offensive value as they reflect damage.

Or that Ball of Lightning has greater offensive value as it's stuns targets around you.

Or that Crystallized Shield has greater balanced value, as it has ridiculous Ulti regen, and costs almost nothing if hit with 3 projectiles.

Each of those abilities has it's advantages and disadvantages. I urge anyone who thinks anyone of those abilities is overpowered to go play a few hundred hours with each class.

Gilvoth · November 2018

Juhasow wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Aeladiir wrote: »

Nightblade players are degenerates. Using invisibility (again: invisibility, not utilizing lack of vision) in order to gain an advantage over your opponent is a display of cowardice and beta status. Utilizing invisibility in any PVP game is a display of low skill, self-humiliation, non-existant honour, and low morals.

SO, You think us people whom use stealth are cowards and immoral low lifes?
well, we here at the US Millitary thinks differently!
Stealth - Army, Navy, Military, Air Force, Marines, Coast ...
using prevailing weather – the tactical use of weather as a force multiplier has influenced many important battles throughout history, such as the Battle of Waterloo.[2]
Fire attacks – reconnaissance by fire is used by apprehensive soldiers when they suspect the enemy is nearby.
Force concentration – the practice of concentrating a military force against a portion of an enemy force.[3]
Night combat – combat that takes place at night. It often requires more preparation than combat during daylight and can provide significant tactical advantages and disadvantages to both the attacker and defender.[4]
Reconnaissance – a mission to obtain information by visual observation or other detection methods, about the activities and resources of the enemy or potential enemy, or about the meteorologic, hydrographic, or geographic characteristics of a particular area.[5]
Smoke screening - the practice of creating clouds of smoke positioned to provide concealment, allowing military forces to advance or retreat across open terrain without coming under direct fire from the enemy

Individual movement techniques
Fire and movement (also known as leapfrogging) – working in 'fire teams', one team attempts to suppress the enemy while the other moves either toward the enemy or to a more favourable position.
Basic drill – a standard drill that all individual soldiers are supposed to perform if they come under fire.
Contact drill
Immediate ambush drill
Counter ambush drill
Hull-down (in armored warfare)
Shoot-and-scoot
Infiltration tactics
Marching fire
Four Fs: find, fix, flank, finish
Overwatch
Bounding overwatch
Center peel
Patrolling
Reconnaissance patrol
Fighting patrol
Standing patrol (OP/LP)
Ambush
Linear ambush
L ambush
Area ambush
Guerrilla

Penetration of the center: This involves the creation of a gap in the enemy line and its exploitation. Two ways of accomplishing this are separating enemy forces and using a reserve to exploit the gap that forms between them (e.g. Battle of Chaeronea (338 BC), the first recorded use of the penetration of the center) or having fast, elite forces smash at a specific point in the enemy line (an enemy weak spot or an area where your elites are at their best in striking power) and, while reserves and holding forces hold your opponent, drive quickly and immediately for the enemy's command or base (i.e., blitzkrieg).

Battle of Issus, a classic example of the single envelopment
Attack from a defensive position: Establishing a strong defensive position from which to defend and attack your opponent. However, the defensive can become too passive and result in ultimate defeat (e.g., Siege of Alesia and the Battle of the Granicus).

Battle of Maling, the earliest known use of the feigned retreat
Single envelopment: A strong flank beating its opponent opposite and, with the aid of holding attacks, attack an opponent in the rear. Sometimes, the establishment of a strong, hidden force behind a weak flank will prevent your opponent from carrying out their own single envelopment (e.g., Battle of Rocroi).
Double envelopment: Both flanks defeat their opponent opposite and launch a rear attack on the enemy center. Its most famous use was Hannibal's tactical masterpiece, the Battle of Cannae and was frequently used by the Wehrmacht on the Eastern Front of World War II.
Attack in oblique order: This involves placing your flanks in a slanted fashion (refusing one's flank) or giving a vast part of your force to a single flank (e.g., Battle of Leuthen). The latter can be disastrous, however, due to the imbalance of force.
Feigned retreat: Having a frontal force fake a retreat, drawing the opponent in pursuit and then launching an assault with strong force held in reserve (such as the Battle of Maling and the Battle of Hastings). However, a feigned retreat may devolve into a real one, such as in the Battle of Grunwald.
Indirect approach: Having a minority of your force demonstrate in front of your opponent while the majority of your force advance from a hidden area and attack the enemy in the rear or flank (e.g., Battle of Chancellorsville).
Crossing the "T": a classic naval maneuver which maximizes one side's offensive firepower while minimizing that of the opposing force.

Rapid dominance
Blitzkrieg – a method of warfare whereby an attacking force is spearheaded by a dense concentration of armoured and motorized or mechanized infantry formations, and heavily backed up by close air support.[6]
Carpet bombing – also known as saturation bombing, is a large aerial bombing done in a progressive manner to inflict damage in every part of a selected area of land.[7]
Human wave attack
Shock tactics
Swarming (military)
Planned attack
Use of supporting fire
Ambush
Indirect fire support
Base of fire
Flying wedge (used by Alexander the Great)
Armoured spearhead
Encirclement
Hammer and anvil
Inverted wedge
Frontal assault
Holding attack – to hold the enemy in position while other offensive or defensive activity takes place[citation needed].
Penetration or infiltration
Pincer movement – an army assaults an enemy by attacking two sides at opposite locations, often planning to cut off the enemy from retreat or additional support in preparation for annihilation.
Bull horn formation – an army assaults an enemy force by sending troops to the enemy's flanks and by attacking their front attacking three areas at once, often planning to cut off any retreat or support as well as confusing the enemy in preparation for annihilation.
Flanking maneuver
Interdiction – severing or disrupting lines of communication and supply
Air interdiction
Control MSR (main supply routes)
Envelopment tactics
Circumvallation
Finnish motti tactics
Siege (For attacking fortified places)
Vertical envelopment
Airborne forces
Air mobile forces
Rapid deployment
Capturing key points
Airborne operations
Air mobile operations
Amphibious operations
Motorized operations
Tank desant
Mechanized operations
Armored operations
Raiding – a small team is inserted deep behind enemy lines to capture a high-value individual or destroy a vital enemy installation then extracted before the enemy can respond.
Decapitation strike
Preemptive war
Disrupting communications
Electronic countermeasures
Radar jamming
Radio jamming
Defensive tactics

Defensive trenches were used commonly during World War I
Basic principles
Defence in depth
Mutual support (e.g., by crossfire)
Echelon formation
Phalanx formation
All round defence
Force dispersal
Fire Trap
Fighting withdrawal
Reserved demolitions
Scorched earth
Booby traps
Minefields
Trench warfare
Counter attack
Breakout
Counter battery fire
Rapid reaction force
Delaying defence
Break contact
Hedgehog defence
military bottleneck
Pakfront
Fortification
Field works (entrenchments)
Over head protection
Revetting
Sangars
Shell scrapes
Foxholes
Manholes
Spider holes
Strong points
Use and improvement of terrain
High ground
Protection
Natural barriers – e.g., rivers
Reverse slope defence
Obstacles and barriers – man made
Barbed wire
Anti-vehicle ditches
Anti-vehicle berms (knife edges)
Multiple axis of movement

STEALTH is a valid millitary tactic known WORLD WIDE as not only VALID but also as a fair playstyle!

Hmm so You're saying there are soldiers in real armies that are trained to use cloak type abilities and can vanish from combat at any given time even after they were noticed ?

Real stealth combat tactics have nothing to do with the ones presented in video games and bringing above wall of text as an argument is laughable.

yes that is what i am saying and yes they have developed invisibility and use it and every time i am asked that question i show the link to it and its use.
im no longer going to be doing that.
because, there is such a thing as google search, if you want to see the videos and the proof invisibility is in use now for the past 10 years+ then do a google search, it is easy to find.