Any NB tanks out there or all Wardens/DKs?? (pve)

BejaProphet · November 2018

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

NightAngel690 · November 2018

Tbh nb tanks are op. I main a tank in pve and I have so much fun with it! My sustain is amazing! It’s going to be even better come murkmire.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.

Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

dovakiin5574 · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

jypcy · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part

In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Jim_Pipp wrote: »

Hi. I am experimenting with some NB tank builds and have no trouble pugging vet dungeons or normal trials.

My current build is unconventional for a tank but works better than a dk for the content I am doing!

It is based around having high stamina Regen, so you can spam bone shield to avoid most damage, and if you need to block through mechanics your Stam regenerates back so quickly you don't ever need to rely on your healer (although using synergies is still nice). Because I am mostly weaving abilities it plays more like a dps build than the perma-block meat shield tank meta.

My current set up is 1h+s front bar (32k health) and 2 handed on back bar (to use the brawler ability for a powerful damage shield when overwhelmed with mobs). Gear is Ebon body, bone pirates tatters jewels and weapons, and 2 x monster 1 pieces giving extra resistance so I am at the resistance cap (to make your 10k damage shields more powerful).

30k stamina and 3.5k Stam Regen on my back bar because I am a bosmer werewolf. This morning I pugged vet darkshade caverns 2, and it isn't the hardest dungeon but there were 3 points that showed how this build excells.

The netch boss - high Stam Regen means I can spam inner fire and taunt all of the trash mobs that give unco-ordinated groups trouble, but this wasn't enough because the dps was too low during the brief periods you can damage the boss, so I went werewolf while my group surrounded the healer, I would jump between trash mobs putting down dots while my team sniped from safety, and during the window when we could damage the boss I contributed 30% of the damage!

The swarms of dwemer constructs. Similar strategy, my three team members bunched together and dealt with any mobs that targeted them, I ran into the crowd dropping caltrops and spamming brawler - against so many mobs I am unkillable, although the damage isn't great.

Against the engine guardian - my group had trouble with this, and they kept dieing, when the boss was at 60% health they had all died so I went werewolf and finished the boss myself.

Honestly the Stam Regen I have is higher than necessary, so the next version of the build will be torugs pact with powerful assault on a dual wield back bar, but it is still in the design phase.

I will plus this partially and i had almost the same build in medium armor bosmer reaching 3.5k regen and even 4k with WW, so I blocked only HA and all other time i was just spamming bonewalls, leashes, taunts and cc with bombard... i completed majority of dlc vets with this, though wipes were quite usual if healer or dps were not good.. also I relied heavily on passive dodge and Nocturnal's favor which gave amazing survival against hordes of weak mobs.. since last patch I was forced to return to heavy armor and more common tanking play-style. I still don't use permablock but everything is so much easier and i have way more time and resources to help the group, so now I can complete vet dlc even with average group, and not with real good ones like before... what to say? meta build is notably more effective, but unconventional is so much fun. It may seem that selection is obvious, but dlc dungeons have it's own opinion on this. So I'll recommend to keep another set of gear in inventory.. so in easy and average dungeons you may run interesting build and in difficult dungeons meta.
Try to remember how many times you were wiped at 300-400k HP of boss - that's where you group support was deciding factor.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

DoobZ69 wrote: »

You can pick the worst race for tanking and any class and just build it for tanking and you can get carried through endgame vet with only a single taunt ability on your bar. This is why people say its "viable" any time anyone asks.
The only difference is that a DK is built for tanking and therefore has the best tools for it. So you will run around taunting everything while its running away from you EVERY. SINGLE. PULL. on an NB or unlock and use a non-NB skill. A DK has talons. So buy Summerset and do the Psijic quest and do the Psijic grinding before you have a skill SOMEWHAT resembling the talons skill.
Viable? My ass. Through a lake of *** to get to the other side while the DK sips on his Pina Coladas on a Hawaiian beach. Viable. Pffft. Don't even bother with the forums, no idea here. The only time anything is "viable" is when its used to break through the new content and/or attempt high scores. Currently non-DK is an afterthought in both of those instances and just a follow-up for fun purposes.
If its your main and you want it to be a viable tank and that really matters to you then roll a DK Argonian. Currently everything else is just fluffy clouds and stuff.

Bombard is better then talons if you have ton of stamina. You may don't believe it, but you may just stay, press one button once in 3 seconds and mobs will be rooted strict for anytime.. immobilization don't had "cc immunity" period. I played a lot with both and talons are widely overrated - problem is that for bombard you should carry a bow and it's bad when on really nasty HA you will be not on your blocking bar.
Also in new dungeons all this cc and chains really s...ks - good half of mobs are immune to both and by mechanics it's considered that they should be nuked on the move by dps, like a special burst dps check.

So main reason for DK superiority is it's sustain and group support, not talons or chains.

BejaProphet · November 2018

Owl, we are not rehashing that argument because I’m not addressing you. The @ sign was the indication.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:

7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime
Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like
Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP
Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)
Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.
Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.
Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant
Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.
Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar
Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)
You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Murkmire):

RED:

37 Quick Recovery
13 Heavy Armor
51 Thick Skinned
37 Hardy
37 Ele Defender
81 Ironclad
14 Spellshield

BLUE:

31 Precise Strikes
13 Physical Weapon Expert
26 Master-at-Arms
100 Elfborn
100 Blessed

GREEN:

81 Shadow Ward
28 Tumbling
37 Arcanist
43 Tenacity
23 Bashing Focus
21 Sprinter
37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

DoobZ69 · November 2018

Love the staff and bow back bar suggestions for a blatant broken class design workaround. Pure sterile lack of understanding of what's at stake here.

DK is the best for tanking in every aspect - dungeons, trials. Do you know why you don't have to come up with workarounds for the DK? Because you DONT NEED TO. Simple as that. Every.other.class.you.do.

My main is a Sorc and its a tank. For years I've been under the impression that ZOS intended for all 5 classes to tank or heal or dps. And I've been patiently waiting for them to get this sorted. With shitmire I can see I have been wrong and it will NOT happen. Now I HAVE TO roll an Argonian DK, revisit all the skyshards and wait for 180 days to get my mount sorted and over 1000 days to get my crafting up and researched and grind PvP and all the other skill trees. THIS IS NOT THE TOON I LOVE PLAYING. And I feel it for the other players who I can see will have to eventually do the same IF THEY CARE.

Now stop coming up with *** excuses for why 99% of the tanks that matter are DKs and support your fellow players to get their classes fixed. Do you know why the dungeon queue for a DPS is 45 minutes? Its because only 1 class is considered for tanking and the others are just staff/bow/dungeon/non-DK pretenders. Within minutes of levelling the DK is grabbed and shoved into a trial guild and is reserved for running with guildies only. Its only the selfish players - ie. YOU - that have a guild DK tank that runs *** for them, that don't want this nonsense to end.

DK don't need talons? Go ahead, I dare you to run a decent DLC vet with a pug without talons. Yes, it can be done. I've already said all you need is a taunt on your bar to do any content. But you can also sleep on a concrete mattress. Do you?? No, because its a pain in the ass and you'd be stupid to do so. So running a serious non-DK tank is doable but its also a pain in the ass and stupid. Just plain stupid.

DoobZ69 wrote: »

Don't even bother with the forums, no idea here.

@xI_The_Owl_Ix you have proven me wrong on that one. Keep up the fight against this ignorance and backwardness. 👌

DoobZ69 · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

Since you keep misrepresenting my views based on your angst over past threads, i’ll Give the sum of them here so as to accurately represent myself. Keep in mind I have no illusion that explaining this will in any way reconcile the two of us. A person doesn’t stay salty for months then suddenly listen to reason. This is for the benefit of other readers.

My view can be summarized in two thoughts.

1. From its foundation the classes were designed to be able to do anything but excell at something. This is just reality. DK was meant to excell at tanking. Templar healing. Nightblade and Sorc various DPS styles. You may hate this. It may have been a mistake, but it’s reality. Mag DKs as case in point. One slight shift and they are out of trial meta for months. We just weren’t as robustly designed for dps as a Nightblade even though we can do Dps. Wardens as late comers are the exception that proves the rule.

2. If you simply step in and equalise tanking, but you do nothing to revamp the entire class system, then you haven’t created balance, you have murdered the DK class by robbing us of our niche while leaving every other class their niche. Tanking might then be more balanced, but DKs will be the casualty.

So yes. I while I am a big advocate of giving needed tanking tools, I cheered for leash, for time stop, for mending, for the recent stamina changed to templars etc. Just last week in tank discords I advocated equalising leash and chains because it’s so important to tanking. I am FOR lifting the other classes up as tanks. But if you COMPLETELY equalise them without revisiting the core concepts of eso classes in their entirety, then you are killing the DK class.

I don’t personally think that opinion is all that radical.

So if somebody wants to spin that like I’m some DK supremacist, whatev.

But, heck. All I wanted to actually say is that silver leash is pretty good.

Also THIS. WHY? For the love of God WHY would you want any one class to EXCEL at a role?? What is the purpose of that?????? Tell me how that helps ANYTHING. All it does is it says play this class for this role. Then this needs to be specified when creating a character and picking a class. This is not. The saying is PLAY HOW YOU WANT. The reality is PLAY THIS WAY. You love tanking on a DK? Great, let's not change that, *** all the others that don't? Great, you want to balance Silver Leash. A skill that DOES NOT SYNERGIZE WITH ANY OTHER CLASS LIKE FIERY GRIP DOES FOR YOUR PRECIOUS DK - AKA. *** YOU OTHER CLASSES. Good on you mate, you're a good Samaritan by making it.... cheaper?? And all those other non-class skills so YOU can consider them as well???? Shame on you, selfish and dishonest.

jypcy · November 2018

My current tankblade main
Race: Argonian
Mundus: Lady
Attribute Spread: 48 health, 16 stam, 0 magicka
Sets: heavy earthgore, 5pc ebon on body, 5 pc alkosh for jewels/weapons (can run 1 ebon jewel and alkosh belt if you want a minor bump to mag/stam pools at little cost to tankiness)
Traits: infused on large pieces, infused shield, sturdy smaller pieces, infused jewelry, infused 1h, infused staff
Enchants: I currently run all health on armor except for 1 large stamina enchant, prism on shield, potion cooldown on jewels, crusher on staff and weakening on 1h (prism on all large pieces is probably best but I haven't bothered with it and haven't needed it)
SnB skills: pierce armor, silver leash (flex), healthy offering (flex), heroic slash, dark cloak, aggressive warhorn
Destro skills: time freeze (flex), inner rage, blockade of elements (lightning or frost), leeching strikes, dark shade (flex), soul siphon
CP: 76 blessed, 73 elfborn, 81 thaumaturge, 40 precise strikes, 81 ironclad, 17 spell shield, 52 thick skinned, 32 hardy, 56 ele defender, 32 quick recovery, 31 warlord, 27 sprinter, 64 arcanist, 64 tenacity, 40 tumbling, 44 shadow ward (adjust cp according to your playstyle/content– I haven't tested whether this is perfectly optimal, but it works)
Food: purple tri-stat
Potions: regular health pots work fine

BejaProphet · November 2018

DoobZ69 wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

Since you keep misrepresenting my views based on your angst over past threads, i’ll Give the sum of them here so as to accurately represent myself. Keep in mind I have no illusion that explaining this will in any way reconcile the two of us. A person doesn’t stay salty for months then suddenly listen to reason. This is for the benefit of other readers.

My view can be summarized in two thoughts.

1. From its foundation the classes were designed to be able to do anything but excell at something. This is just reality. DK was meant to excell at tanking. Templar healing. Nightblade and Sorc various DPS styles. You may hate this. It may have been a mistake, but it’s reality. Mag DKs as case in point. One slight shift and they are out of trial meta for months. We just weren’t as robustly designed for dps as a Nightblade even though we can do Dps. Wardens as late comers are the exception that proves the rule.

2. If you simply step in and equalise tanking, but you do nothing to revamp the entire class system, then you haven’t created balance, you have murdered the DK class by robbing us of our niche while leaving every other class their niche. Tanking might then be more balanced, but DKs will be the casualty.

So yes. I while I am a big advocate of giving needed tanking tools, I cheered for leash, for time stop, for mending, for the recent stamina changed to templars etc. Just last week in tank discords I advocated equalising leash and chains because it’s so important to tanking. I am FOR lifting the other classes up as tanks. But if you COMPLETELY equalise them without revisiting the core concepts of eso classes in their entirety, then you are killing the DK class.

I don’t personally think that opinion is all that radical.

So if somebody wants to spin that like I’m some DK supremacist, whatev.

But, heck. All I wanted to actually say is that silver leash is pretty good.

Also THIS. WHY? For the love of God WHY would you want any one class to EXCEL at a role?? What is the purpose of that?????? Tell me how that helps ANYTHING. All it does is it says play this class for this role. Then this needs to be specified when creating a character and picking a class. This is not. The saying is PLAY HOW YOU WANT. The reality is PLAY THIS WAY. You love tanking on a DK? Great, let's not change that, *** all the others that don't? Great, you want to balance Silver Leash. A skill that DOES NOT SYNERGIZE WITH ANY OTHER CLASS LIKE FIERY GRIP DOES FOR YOUR PRECIOUS DK - AKA. *** YOU OTHER CLASSES. Good on you mate, you're a good Samaritan by making it.... cheaper?? And all those other non-class skills so YOU can consider them as well???? Shame on you, selfish and dishonest.

I’ve interacted with enough hissy fits for one day. But for clarification in regards to my post that you quoted. I was by no means advocating point one as something that ought to be the case. It simply is the case. And because it is the case, I therefore believe the second thought.

I am willing to clarify that one thing. Beyond that I have no interest in interacting with your drama.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

DoobZ69 wrote: »

Love the staff and bow back bar suggestions for a blatant broken class design workaround. Pure sterile lack of understanding of what's at stake here.

DK is the best for tanking in every aspect - dungeons, trials. Do you know why you don't have to come up with workarounds for the DK? Because you DONT NEED TO. Simple as that. Every.other.class.you.do.

My main is a Sorc and its a tank. For years I've been under the impression that ZOS intended for all 5 classes to tank or heal or dps. And I've been patiently waiting for them to get this sorted. With shitmire I can see I have been wrong and it will NOT happen. Now I HAVE TO roll an Argonian DK, revisit all the skyshards and wait for 180 days to get my mount sorted and over 1000 days to get my crafting up and researched and grind PvP and all the other skill trees. THIS IS NOT THE TOON I LOVE PLAYING. And I feel it for the other players who I can see will have to eventually do the same IF THEY CARE.

Now stop coming up with *** excuses for why 99% of the tanks that matter are DKs and support your fellow players to get their classes fixed. Do you know why the dungeon queue for a DPS is 45 minutes? Its because only 1 class is considered for tanking and the others are just staff/bow/dungeon/non-DK pretenders. Within minutes of levelling the DK is grabbed and shoved into a trial guild and is reserved for running with guildies only. Its only the selfish players - ie. YOU - that have a guild DK tank that runs *** for them, that don't want this nonsense to end.

DK don't need talons? Go ahead, I dare you to run a decent DLC vet with a pug without talons. Yes, it can be done. I've already said all you need is a taunt on your bar to do any content. But you can also sleep on a concrete mattress. Do you?? No, because its a pain in the ass and you'd be stupid to do so. So running a serious non-DK tank is doable but its also a pain in the ass and stupid. Just plain stupid.

DoobZ69 wrote: »

Don't even bother with the forums, no idea here.

@xI_The_Owl_Ix you have proven me wrong on that one. Keep up the fight against this ignorance and backwardness. 👌

What's your problem so you are so aggressive? It was confirmed that any class tank can complete any content, confirmed by yourself lol. It's easier with DK, but not everybody receive pleasure to run what is easier. Bulky tank with only taunt can be carried, but also second dps with 5k dps or heal which only cast few spells can be carried too, if other 3 players are up to snuff.

Also tell what of the latest dungeons require talons that much? mobs spawn from all sides, half of them are immune to chains/taunt, talons have miserable radius etc.. from what i see tactics that work is that tank enters, range taunt all dangerous mobs and boss, and then turtle with them, while dps fast kill all smaller mobs and start to nuke that mass around tank. Repeat few times through boss rotation and mechanics. And majority of bosses have very few mobs because there is too much sets that exploit ton of mobs..

DoobZ69 · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

DoobZ69 wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

Since you keep misrepresenting my views based on your angst over past threads, i’ll Give the sum of them here so as to accurately represent myself. Keep in mind I have no illusion that explaining this will in any way reconcile the two of us. A person doesn’t stay salty for months then suddenly listen to reason. This is for the benefit of other readers.

My view can be summarized in two thoughts.

1. From its foundation the classes were designed to be able to do anything but excell at something. This is just reality. DK was meant to excell at tanking. Templar healing. Nightblade and Sorc various DPS styles. You may hate this. It may have been a mistake, but it’s reality. Mag DKs as case in point. One slight shift and they are out of trial meta for months. We just weren’t as robustly designed for dps as a Nightblade even though we can do Dps. Wardens as late comers are the exception that proves the rule.

2. If you simply step in and equalise tanking, but you do nothing to revamp the entire class system, then you haven’t created balance, you have murdered the DK class by robbing us of our niche while leaving every other class their niche. Tanking might then be more balanced, but DKs will be the casualty.

So yes. I while I am a big advocate of giving needed tanking tools, I cheered for leash, for time stop, for mending, for the recent stamina changed to templars etc. Just last week in tank discords I advocated equalising leash and chains because it’s so important to tanking. I am FOR lifting the other classes up as tanks. But if you COMPLETELY equalise them without revisiting the core concepts of eso classes in their entirety, then you are killing the DK class.

I don’t personally think that opinion is all that radical.

So if somebody wants to spin that like I’m some DK supremacist, whatev.

But, heck. All I wanted to actually say is that silver leash is pretty good.

Also THIS. WHY? For the love of God WHY would you want any one class to EXCEL at a role?? What is the purpose of that?????? Tell me how that helps ANYTHING. All it does is it says play this class for this role. Then this needs to be specified when creating a character and picking a class. This is not. The saying is PLAY HOW YOU WANT. The reality is PLAY THIS WAY. You love tanking on a DK? Great, let's not change that, *** all the others that don't? Great, you want to balance Silver Leash. A skill that DOES NOT SYNERGIZE WITH ANY OTHER CLASS LIKE FIERY GRIP DOES FOR YOUR PRECIOUS DK - AKA. *** YOU OTHER CLASSES. Good on you mate, you're a good Samaritan by making it.... cheaper?? And all those other non-class skills so YOU can consider them as well???? Shame on you, selfish and dishonest.

I’ve interacted with enough hissy fits for one day. But for clarification in regards to my post that you quoted. I was by no means advocating point one as something that ought to be the case. It simply is the case. And because it is the case, I therefore believe the second thought.

I am willing to clarify that one thing. Beyond that I have no interest in interacting with your drama.

blah blah blah blah blah then don't interact if you can't defend your BS or have it scrutinized. Let the grown-ups discuss problems with the game without your biased input

DoobZ69 · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

DoobZ69 wrote: »

Love the staff and bow back bar suggestions for a blatant broken class design workaround. Pure sterile lack of understanding of what's at stake here.

DK is the best for tanking in every aspect - dungeons, trials. Do you know why you don't have to come up with workarounds for the DK? Because you DONT NEED TO. Simple as that. Every.other.class.you.do.

My main is a Sorc and its a tank. For years I've been under the impression that ZOS intended for all 5 classes to tank or heal or dps. And I've been patiently waiting for them to get this sorted. With shitmire I can see I have been wrong and it will NOT happen. Now I HAVE TO roll an Argonian DK, revisit all the skyshards and wait for 180 days to get my mount sorted and over 1000 days to get my crafting up and researched and grind PvP and all the other skill trees. THIS IS NOT THE TOON I LOVE PLAYING. And I feel it for the other players who I can see will have to eventually do the same IF THEY CARE.

Now stop coming up with *** excuses for why 99% of the tanks that matter are DKs and support your fellow players to get their classes fixed. Do you know why the dungeon queue for a DPS is 45 minutes? Its because only 1 class is considered for tanking and the others are just staff/bow/dungeon/non-DK pretenders. Within minutes of levelling the DK is grabbed and shoved into a trial guild and is reserved for running with guildies only. Its only the selfish players - ie. YOU - that have a guild DK tank that runs *** for them, that don't want this nonsense to end.

DK don't need talons? Go ahead, I dare you to run a decent DLC vet with a pug without talons. Yes, it can be done. I've already said all you need is a taunt on your bar to do any content. But you can also sleep on a concrete mattress. Do you?? No, because its a pain in the ass and you'd be stupid to do so. So running a serious non-DK tank is doable but its also a pain in the ass and stupid. Just plain stupid.

DoobZ69 wrote: »

Don't even bother with the forums, no idea here.

@xI_The_Owl_Ix you have proven me wrong on that one. Keep up the fight against this ignorance and backwardness. 👌

What's your problem so you are so aggressive? It was confirmed that any class tank can complete any content, confirmed by yourself lol. It's easier with DK, but not everybody receive pleasure to run what is easier. Bulky tank with only taunt can be carried, but also second dps with 5k dps or heal which only cast few spells can be carried too, if other 3 players are up to snuff.

Also tell what of the latest dungeons require talons that much? mobs spawn from all sides, half of them are immune to chains/taunt, talons have miserable radius etc.. from what i see tactics that work is that tank enters, range taunt all dangerous mobs and boss, and then turtle with them, while dps fast kill all smaller mobs and start to nuke that mass around tank. Repeat few times through boss rotation and mechanics. And majority of bosses have very few mobs because there is too much sets that exploit ton of mobs..

I'm not aggressive, I'm eloquent. I also have a concrete mattress to sell you.

NightAngel690 · November 2018

To exapand on an earlier comment, here is why nb tanks are op:
1) shadow ult. Drop this and your group has access to major protection Plus a strong burst heal.
2) execute. Unlike dks, nbs have access to an execute ability. (Impale/killers blade)
3) access to a spammable. If you groups dps is low, and you know you can afford it, you can slot suprise attack or concealed weapon. This happened to me the other night while pugging Selenes. (Too dps under 160cp) the healer (magplar) and I just slotted dps skills (jabs/suprise attack, flawless dawnbreaker) and effectively carried them through the dungeon. (Don’t recommend doing this btw)

In the end, play how you want to play. If you want to be a nb tank or warden tank, be one and show these elitists just how Wrong they are.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

Bow backbar- check.
Caltrops - check.
CP into shattering blows - check.
100 cp into mighty - check.
Execute - check.

This.. this is the new tanking meta Ive been looking for.
Screw Woeler, Liofa and Alcast. They had it wrong all along.

Ive seen the light. I cant close my eyes anymore. This is it!
Thank you guys so much!! I cant believe how wrong I was a along...
Praise the new meta!

I almost had a stroke reading all these things, I honestly wish I would have died. Because then I wouldnt have to live with the knowledge that people run this trash and say stuff like

You have to build to the NB strengths. The main issue is no one really knows how to build a NB tank, a lot try too hard to make it just like the DK.

Big yikes.

cbb

max_only · November 2018

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

What is the tank test?

Speaking of I need to download the taunt addon. What’s the name again? I could’ve done better tanking the Axes in AA.. (Warden tank).

ccfeeling · November 2018

Liofa wrote: »

Depends on content. In trials, it's a lot easier to manage a NB tank because you don't really need a pull and/or AOE root ability. If you are doing dungeons, use Silver Leash and Ice Blockade for AOE snare. Leash is expensive but there are simple ways around it. Simply use Stamina Cost Reduction enchants on your jewelry to decrease cost of your Pierce Armour, Heroic Slash, Silver Leash. This will also make your Leeching Strikes almost free, making it restore the amount of the original cost as an extra. Use 5/1/1 or 5/2 for even more stamina sustain through Medium Armour passives.

The main problem with this is, you shouldn't be blocking as much, only things you HAVE TO block. You have a ton of self heals as well as a NB tank so throw on Sentinel of Rkugamz as an extra sustain tool. It's basically a stronger Orb synergy every 15 seconds and provides the bonus to allies as well. You can also enchant your Frost Saff with Absorb Stamina, which will proc on blockade ticks. With Torug's and Infused, it restores 600 Stamina every 2 blockade ticks. It's basically a way to convert Magicka into Stamina.

Don't look at NB tank as bad because lack of chain/root abilities. They are bad because they lack support, just like sorcerer. Sustain is just a small problem you can easily work around with a bit of theorycrafting. As you see above, sustain is absolutely not an issue with all those easy to pull off strats. Also being an Argonian will help too.

If you want to tank as a NB and afraid of having no pull/root abilities, don't be. I listed a ton of ways that will allow you to run Leash without having any Stamina issues while having an access to a very potent 60% AOE snare which I prefer to Talons on my DK tank. Have fun.

Hi Liofa , will you try NB tank after DK and Warden ?
VMOL / VAS +2 / VHOF

I believe you can make it

Joxer61 · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

This whole thread was a mistake.

Nah mate, its all good. You just got caught up in some crazy ass drama and a direction I didn't intend this thread to go...sorry. Was only asking for some input into NB tanks, didn't mean to start WW4......my bad.

Silver_Strider · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

Since you keep misrepresenting my views based on your angst over past threads, i’ll Give the sum of them here so as to accurately represent myself. Keep in mind I have no illusion that explaining this will in any way reconcile the two of us. A person doesn’t stay salty for months then suddenly listen to reason. This is for the benefit of other readers.

My view can be summarized in two thoughts.

1. From its foundation the classes were designed to be able to do anything but excell at something. This is just reality. DK was meant to excell at tanking. Templar healing. Nightblade and Sorc various DPS styles. You may hate this. It may have been a mistake, but it’s reality. Mag DKs as case in point. One slight shift and they are out of trial meta for months. We just weren’t as robustly designed for dps as a Nightblade even though we can do Dps. Wardens as late comers are the exception that proves the rule.

2. If you simply step in and equalise tanking, but you do nothing to revamp the entire class system, then you haven’t created balance, you have murdered the DK class by robbing us of our niche while leaving every other class their niche. Tanking might then be more balanced, but DKs will be the casualty.

So yes. I while I am a big advocate of giving needed tanking tools, I cheered for leash, for time stop, for mending, for the recent stamina changed to templars etc. Just last week in tank discords I advocated equalising leash and chains because it’s so important to tanking. I am FOR lifting the other classes up as tanks. But if you COMPLETELY equalise them without revisiting the core concepts of eso classes in their entirety, then you are killing the DK class.

I don’t personally think that opinion is all that radical.

So if somebody wants to spin that like I’m some DK supremacist, whatev.

But, heck. All I wanted to actually say is that silver leash is pretty good.

How in Akatosh's name did you make a foundation for what a class was made to excel in when the Devs themselves can't decide what the hell they're doing with classes. ESO has been an absolute train wreck in regards to balance throughout its lifespan that finding anything that could even remotely be called a foundation is a mere player constructed delusion. Launch was absolutely awful because Vampire MagDK was king in everything except healing, which Templar excelled at, Stamina was completely nonexistent and NB/Sorcs were god awful at pretty much everything that any sort of "foundation" at that point would have had a hell of a time trying not to fall over itself, let alone support this mentality that classes were designed to do everything but excel at something. There were patches that DK was best DPS, there were patches Sorcs were best DPS but while today, that title goes to NBs, it hasn't always been that way, not by a long shot and to say that a foundation was laid out that each class was designed to excel in something while looking at the current state of the game, is horses***. Why is a Sorc, which is supposedly made to excel as a ranged DPS, currently the 2nd worst DPS spec in the game? Where is its foundation to support that it's suppose to be a DPS spec class that excels at ranged DPS? Nowhere and do you want to know why? It's because IT DOES NOT EXIST!!!

As for your second point, that's a crock as well since ZOS has made several adjustments over the years that have done exactly that. Giving Orbs the ability to restore Stamina while also gutting Templar's monopoly as the only stamina battery in the game was proof enough that ZOS didn't want just Templar Healers to be the only healer but for all classes to have a chance; they even went as far as giving NB and Sorcs a burst heal ability. Same thing with Tanks, they gave every tank (apart from Templar) a Health based heal ability. Silver Leash, Time Stop, etc. all just go to show that ZOS is slowly giving each class the tools it needs to function better in any role but why would they do this if they only wanted one class to excel in an area. I mean, if each class was capable of performing their role but not as effectively as the class that was designed to excel at that role then it wouldn't make sense for ZOS to keep going further with equalizing the classes, unless they actually WANT other classes to be equally viable in any given role, which seems far more likely than them trying to make a class excel at a role (granted Murkmire pretty much threw all that work out a window of the Empire State Building but still).

It's not so much that the idea is radical but rather that the idea is constantly being railroaded by ZOS themselves that it becomes harder and harder to take the idea as anything more than people clinging to their opinion on how the game should be and trying to impose that opinion on others as something that is factual, when it really isn't.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

Bow backbar- check.
Caltrops - check.
CP into shattering blows - check.
100 cp into mighty - check.
Execute - check.

This.. this is the new tanking meta Ive been looking for.
Screw Woeler, Liofa and Alcast. They had it wrong all along.

Ive seen the light. I cant close my eyes anymore. This is it!
Thank you guys so much!! I cant believe how wrong I was a along...
Praise the new meta!

I almost had a stroke reading all these things, I honestly wish I would have died. Because then I wouldnt have to live with the knowledge that people run this trash and say stuff like

You have to build to the NB strengths. The main issue is no one really knows how to build a NB tank, a lot try too hard to make it just like the DK.

Big yikes.

I clearly pointed that bow back bar in dlc vets is weaker then meta and recommended to use different builds for dlc vet (meta) and others (any build person find interesting), why exaggerate the facts?
Anybody can read alcast, there is no 200 iq requirement to level
up argonian dk in a week, craft him torug + take ebon from bank and you are good to go with your cp500+. But this argonian won’t save your run from bad PUG group or zone lfg trial.. and if we talk about coordinated group with discord and everybody up to snuff.. such group will complete 99% content with any non-meta but reasonable builds.
So why state that argonian dk is only option if he is required for only 1% of content?

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

Bow backbar- check.
Caltrops - check.
CP into shattering blows - check.
100 cp into mighty - check.
Execute - check.

This.. this is the new tanking meta Ive been looking for.
Screw Woeler, Liofa and Alcast. They had it wrong all along.

Ive seen the light. I cant close my eyes anymore. This is it!
Thank you guys so much!! I cant believe how wrong I was a along...
Praise the new meta!

I almost had a stroke reading all these things, I honestly wish I would have died. Because then I wouldnt have to live with the knowledge that people run this trash and say stuff like

You have to build to the NB strengths. The main issue is no one really knows how to build a NB tank, a lot try too hard to make it just like the DK.

Big yikes.

I clearly pointed that bow back bar in dlc vets is weaker then meta and recommended to use different builds for dlc vet (meta) and others (any build person find interesting), why exaggerate the facts?
Anybody can read alcast, there is no 200 iq requirement to level
up argonian dk in a week, craft him torug + take ebon from bank and you are good to go with your cp500+. But this argonian won’t save your run from bad PUG group or zone lfg trial.. and if we talk about coordinated group with discord and everybody up to snuff.. such group will complete 99% content with any non-meta but reasonable builds.
So why state that argonian dk is only option if he is required for only 1% of content?

Right. I tanked pugs on my NB tank and its worse than tanking it on my DK tank.
If I get teammates who run infront and attack everything my DK tank can just spam chains and then talons to group up the ads and igenous shield to shield myself and the group.
On my NB I have to run from one ad to another taunt then chain the the ads that are further away and its hell. So even in your PUG scenerio the DK is better.
Having a bad healer in a PUG trial? Magma shell! No need for heals anymore.

Silver_Strider wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

Since you keep misrepresenting my views based on your angst over past threads, i’ll Give the sum of them here so as to accurately represent myself. Keep in mind I have no illusion that explaining this will in any way reconcile the two of us. A person doesn’t stay salty for months then suddenly listen to reason. This is for the benefit of other readers.

My view can be summarized in two thoughts.

1. From its foundation the classes were designed to be able to do anything but excell at something. This is just reality. DK was meant to excell at tanking. Templar healing. Nightblade and Sorc various DPS styles. You may hate this. It may have been a mistake, but it’s reality. Mag DKs as case in point. One slight shift and they are out of trial meta for months. We just weren’t as robustly designed for dps as a Nightblade even though we can do Dps. Wardens as late comers are the exception that proves the rule.

2. If you simply step in and equalise tanking, but you do nothing to revamp the entire class system, then you haven’t created balance, you have murdered the DK class by robbing us of our niche while leaving every other class their niche. Tanking might then be more balanced, but DKs will be the casualty.

So yes. I while I am a big advocate of giving needed tanking tools, I cheered for leash, for time stop, for mending, for the recent stamina changed to templars etc. Just last week in tank discords I advocated equalising leash and chains because it’s so important to tanking. I am FOR lifting the other classes up as tanks. But if you COMPLETELY equalise them without revisiting the core concepts of eso classes in their entirety, then you are killing the DK class.

I don’t personally think that opinion is all that radical.

So if somebody wants to spin that like I’m some DK supremacist, whatev.

But, heck. All I wanted to actually say is that silver leash is pretty good.

How in Akatosh's name did you make a foundation for what a class was made to excel in when the Devs themselves can't decide what the hell they're doing with classes. ESO has been an absolute train wreck in regards to balance throughout its lifespan that finding anything that could even remotely be called a foundation is a mere player constructed delusion. Launch was absolutely awful because Vampire MagDK was king in everything except healing, which Templar excelled at, Stamina was completely nonexistent and NB/Sorcs were god awful at pretty much everything that any sort of "foundation" at that point would have had a hell of a time trying not to fall over itself, let alone support this mentality that classes were designed to do everything but excel at something. There were patches that DK was best DPS, there were patches Sorcs were best DPS but while today, that title goes to NBs, it hasn't always been that way, not by a long shot and to say that a foundation was laid out that each class was designed to excel in something while looking at the current state of the game, is horses***. Why is a Sorc, which is supposedly made to excel as a ranged DPS, currently the 2nd worst DPS spec in the game? Where is its foundation to support that it's suppose to be a DPS spec class that excels at ranged DPS? Nowhere and do you want to know why? It's because IT DOES NOT EXIST!!!

As for your second point, that a crock as well since ZOS has made several adjustments over the years that have done exactly that. Giving Orbs the ability to restore Stamina while also gutting Templar's monopoly as the only stamina battery in the game was proof enough that ZOS didn't want just Templar Healers to be the only healer but for all classes to have a chance; they even went as far as giving NB and Sorcs a burst heal ability. Same with with Tanks, they gave every tank (apart from Templar) a Health based heal ability. Silver Leash, Time Stop, etc. all just go to show that ZOS is slowly giving each class the tools it needs to function better in any role but why would they do this if they only wanted one class to excel in an area. I mean, if each class was capable of performing their role but not as effectively as the class that was designed to excel at that role then it wouldn't make sense for ZOS to keep going further with equalizing the classes, unless they actually WANT other classes to be equally viable in any given role, which seems far more likely than them trying to make a class excel at a role (granted Murkmire pretty much threw all that work out a window of the Empire State Building but still).

It's not so much that the idea is radical but rather that the idea is constantly being railroaded by ZOS themselves that it becomes harder and harder to take the idea as anything more than people clinging to their opinion on how the game should be and trying to impose that opinion on others as something that is factual, when it really isn't.

Honestly dont even bother with him, I had the same argument with him in several different threads. You will see him saying the same stuff in another thread in a few days/weeks

Nevasca · November 2018

@actosh can help you with insights in terms of build and etc.

For me, DK and Warden are straight out better than NB tanking in PvE. And that doesn't change by any stretch of the imagination. But that doesn't mean you can't tank with NB, and do I mean every content, even HM. Playing DK will be more easy and better utility for sure, but doesn't mean you have to.

Takes-No-Prisoner · November 2018

Liofa wrote: »

The main problem with this is, you shouldn't be blocking as much, only things you HAVE TO block.

As I am learning NB Tank, the more this becomes apparent to me. Not being able to CC enemies never really bothered me, as long as I have the elites/heavy hitter mobs taunted.

Joxer61 · November 2018

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

Liofa wrote: »

The main problem with this is, you shouldn't be blocking as much, only things you HAVE TO block.

As I am learning NB Tank, the more this becomes apparent to me. Not being able to CC enemies never really bothered me, as long as I have the elites/heavy hitter mobs taunted.

How are you finding it? Hating yourself for even going down this road or are you having fun and is it working? Yea, its no DK by a long stretch but that's part of the challenge eh? Not everyone wants a cookie cutter class/build that you step into with no personal input at all, that's just robotic and silly.

vyrzeden · November 2018

Joxer61 wrote: »

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

Liofa wrote: »

The main problem with this is, you shouldn't be blocking as much, only things you HAVE TO block.

As I am learning NB Tank, the more this becomes apparent to me. Not being able to CC enemies never really bothered me, as long as I have the elites/heavy hitter mobs taunted.

How are you finding it? Hating yourself for even going down this road or are you having fun and is it working? Yea, its no DK by a long stretch but that's part of the challenge eh? Not everyone wants a cookie cutter class/build that you step into with no personal input at all, that's just robotic and silly.

I know you didn't ask me, but my new (1 month old) stamblade tank is having a blast focusing on shields and making use of the new tools like leash and time freeze. Thus far, this has been limited to pugging vet dungeons (non-DLC) and normal trials, but trying to get myself going on organized vet DLC content.

Mind you, I didn't make this character cause I like it "harder than a DK" or anything, I just prefer the character concept of a stamblade in the game as a whole. But I did make the base geared towards tanking and then working around that. Let's face it, insta-queue is OP and as long as I can do the job, then I win no matter what anyone things of it.

Psyonico · November 2018

I think only NBs can do this (no Ayleid, no Toughness)

Not sure why I have so much more magic than stamina, running Maw, Skoria, Green Pact, and Plague Doctor

TiZzA93 · November 2018

@Psyonico having a siphoning ability slotted gives 8% magika