The API (and thus add-ons) shouldn't allow the kind of detection you say (showing player locations).

In theory third party software would allow it, but I wouldn't jump to this directly.

What class were you on, were you using any skills or sets, it could be one of those broke your stealth, or someone on your faction revealed you some how. It seems like they got a glimpse of you but couldn't track you, otherwise they wouldn't waste time throwing AoE somewhere you no longer are.

Thunderknuckles wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

The API (and thus add-ons) shouldn't allow the kind of detection you say (showing player locations).

In theory third party software would allow it, but I wouldn't jump to this directly.

What class were you on, were you using any skills or sets, it could be one of those broke your stealth, or someone on your faction revealed you some how. It seems like they got a glimpse of you but couldn't track you, otherwise they wouldn't waste time throwing AoE somewhere you no longer are.

I mentioned that I was on my stamblade already in stealth when they showed up. I did not mention that I was alone, though. No skills being used. Just me crouching in stealth and observing. I can frequently get right behind someone without being seen, too. Point being that my stealth is as good as you can get it without armor sets. This did actually happen. They were wayyyy too far away to detect me just sitting there in stealth, but somehow they seemed to know my general area.

Not sure then I'm afraid. If you suspect foul play and know any of the names you could report them to ZOS for investigation.

raasdal wrote: »

Did you whisper them and ask? Might clear it up.

But to answer; No current way to do what you describe, to my knowledge.

If he was using skills there are certain features of certain soundcards that can determine the relative position of an audiosource and display them relative to the user on a 2nd monitor or mobile phone or such things.

I keep explaining that I was already in stealth and not moving before they even got there. lol I wasn't making any sounds to be detected. Unless characters can be heard breathing somehow.

lordrichter wrote: »

Were you hiding somewhere that was sort of an obvious hiding place?

They might have just been checking it to see if anyone was hiding there.

Maybe, but not likely, if EVERYONE in the group turned from where they were going to start spamming a.o.e like they knew someone was there.

I have had this happen before (recently), along with my stealthed heavy attacks being dodged (multiple times, by the same players)

I wouldnt instantly jump to "HAXOR!" but i think something needs to be looked at.

Thunderknuckles wrote: »

I keep explaining that I was already in stealth and not moving before they even got there. lol I wasn't making any sounds to be detected. Unless characters can be heard breathing somehow.

So you weren't holding your breath?

I'm kidding. It's interesting though that they moved to where you were but didn't follow you (did they use detect pots then?). Surely any outside help that could pinpoint you would keep pinpointing you, or at least tell them you'd moved.

Weird.

I've had it happen.

I've had it happen when even if I was "desynced" they couldn't see me (I was behind a rock face).

Then I looked at the names and wasn't surprised.

ZOS had chosen to ignore obvious exploitation in game and pretend it doesn't occur and will take no action. The cheats are allowed to churn out posts claiming cheating doesn't work on these forums, fact is they do and they are in use and it's pretty pathetic.

I'm also betting that every player in the detection train moves super fast all the time too.

JAwtunes wrote: »

Possibly off topic but a couple of people were discussing certain players avoiding heavy attacks from stealth in cyro zone chat a few days ago. The way they described it made it sound like the most addon prior to the fixes zos introduced. One I know to be a very knowledgeable and skillful player so it caught my eye.

I’ve had people dodge my snipe from sneak while they were out of combat with no one around them

SirAndy wrote: »

3rd party software can do that since your location information (along with your @name and character name and some basic stats) is sent to their client once you are in what would be visible range if you weren't in stealth.

That data is loosely encrypted during transport, so a simple packet sniffer would have to be able to decrypt the messages but anyone (or better anyapp) that knows how to look at the ESO client memory can see all that data unencrypted.

So, long story longer, a 3rd party app that knows where to look in the ESO client memory can get data of all players within a certain radius, regardless of whether they are currently in stealth or not.

This is actually not true. When you are cloaked / stealthed, no information is sent to your would-be attacker’s client. As far as that client is concerned, you do not exist... only the server knows you exist.

This disparity is why there are so many desyncs, bugs, and glitches with cloak and stealth.

But if they didn’t have that disparity, then yeah... 3rd party programs would work. So ZOS got to choose between bugs and cheaters and chose bugs, and I’m glad they did.

(Fun fact - the to-hit check for almost all AOEs is server side, whereas for single target skills it’s done client side by the ATTACKERS client. This is why AOE is what pulls stamblades out of stealth and why single target stuff like dots and projectiles that were already applied / shot will still get negated... the attackers client determines if the single target stuff landed and as far as the attackers client is concerned, the target doesn’t exist anymore. Only the server knows that the NB is still there, and because the server handles AOE dmg (try landing AOE stuff when it’s laggy lol) only AOE dmg can pull the NB out of cloak.

I’m curious to see what they changed about the Templar jabs. It feels different but I’m not exactly sure what the new underlying mechanics are when it comes to client side vs server side to-hit checks. I’m curious to see if we’ll see HP desyncs now with nightblades using cloak while getting jabbed.

Thogard wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

3rd party software can do that since your location information (along with your @name and character name and some basic stats) is sent to their client once you are in what would be visible range if you weren't in stealth.

That data is loosely encrypted during transport, so a simple packet sniffer would have to be able to decrypt the messages but anyone (or better anyapp) that knows how to look at the ESO client memory can see all that data unencrypted.

So, long story longer, a 3rd party app that knows where to look in the ESO client memory can get data of all players within a certain radius, regardless of whether they are currently in stealth or not.

This is actually not true. When you are cloaked / stealthed, no information is sent to your would-be attacker’s client. As far as that client is concerned, you do not exist... only the server knows you exist.

This disparity is why there are so many desyncs, bugs, and glitches with cloak and stealth.

But if they didn’t have that disparity, then yeah... 3rd party programs would work. So ZOS got to choose between bugs and cheaters and chose bugs, and I’m glad they did.

(Fun fact - the to-hit check for almost all AOEs is server side, whereas for single target skills it’s done client side by the ATTACKERS client. This is why AOE is what pulls stamblades out of stealth and why single target stuff like dots and projectiles that were already applied / shot will still get negated... the attackers client determines if the single target stuff landed and as far as the attackers client is concerned, the target doesn’t exist anymore. Only the server knows that the NB is still there, and because the server handles AOE dmg (try landing AOE stuff when it’s laggy lol) only AOE dmg can pull the NB out of cloak.

I’m curious to see what they changed about the Templar jabs. It feels different but I’m not exactly sure what the new underlying mechanics are when it comes to client side vs server side to-hit checks. I’m curious to see if we’ll see HP desyncs now with nightblades using cloak while getting jabbed.

Thogard, you're not only a highly intelligent young man (I'm old enough to call you "young man" ha ha) but you're also a friendly guy, and that's a quality I appreciate in anyone. Even with your apparent knowledge of software and gaming servers and how they interact with the player client, etc. I still think you're not quite accurate on some of this. These things DO happen, and lately with much more regularity. I know it may not seem possible to you, but something very odd is going on and it isn't mere coincidence, lag, or other glitches.

Last night at around 6P central at a battle at Ash someone was tripping out about an EP player who was "flying and casting non stop ice comets". I took that with a grain of salt, as it sounded waaaay too much like what happened 2 years ago. Still, I know people (and I always hate saying that) who know quite a lot about that infamous program and the fricking thing has not gone away, and it isn't only possible to affect your character's speed.

So, I have to wonder if enough time has passed that people are getting careless with it again. I honestly don't know the answer, but I'm not stupid, have a well above average IQ, and I've been playing this long enough to know when something is downright rotten (much of the time) and the result of lag or desync, etc. Again, most of the time. lol I'm also intelligent enough to admit it when I'm wrong....usually. LOL

There is mischief afoot here I am sure.

The_Brosteen wrote: »

I've had people tell me im cheating before because i saw them pull themselves out of stealth.

Some skills pull you out of stealth, just fyi. If you didn't cast any skills then that might be something curious, but more likely a bug that brought you out of stealth briefly. Or someome had that addon that tells you how many of each faction are nearby.

Oh believe me I know. Playing stam and magblade is becoming more frustrating for me as it seems quite a multitude of things pop you out of stealth. Staying in stealth is a constant job. Nevermind that Break free is "broke all ta crap" right now, so if you do get pinned by someone it's just plain ol' back to spawn for you.

There have been a few other times that I haven't mentioned where similar things have happened. I was WAY away from a group of player already in stealth just sitting there when, like in my first example, they suddenly changed directions and came searching my general area. Those players did not seem to know exactly where I was, but they for certain knew someone was there. There is no feature in the game, again, that allows for a player to detect a stealthed play who's 40 or more meters away.

RedRook wrote: »

Thunderknuckles wrote: »

I keep explaining that I was already in stealth and not moving before they even got there. lol I wasn't making any sounds to be detected. Unless characters can be heard breathing somehow.

So you weren't holding your breath?

I'm kidding. It's interesting though that they moved to where you were but didn't follow you (did they use detect pots then?). Surely any outside help that could pinpoint you would keep pinpointing you, or at least tell them you'd moved.

Weird.

You'd think so. I kept on moving away, so maybe they gave up and continued on to whatever resource where they were going to farm AP. lol I don't actually know that that's what they were going to do originally, but those types of players would be VERY likely to do that.