The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Shield Breaker in ESO 4.2 and beyond
-
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerAmdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
That doesn't add up.Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.3 -
Kingslayer513✭✭✭✭✭
✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerI propose introducing damage scaling to the set based on the total shield points active on the enemy player. For example, it could do 100% of the current live damage if the enemy player's total shield value is 20k or above (ie. they are shield stacking). The damage is scaled down in proportion to the total shield value, down to 0% at 0 shield points. It should be stronger against people who have massive shields (or are stacking), but it should not do a flat max damage value against people with a tiny 700pt shield because they activated block. Obviously, the numbers I threw out could be adjusted as needed.
PS. I main a Magsorc in pvp, and yes my hardened ward is stronger now than before murkmire.0 -
Jules✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerKingslayer513 wrote: »I propose introducing damage scaling to the set based on the total shield points active on the enemy player. For example, it could do 100% of the current live damage if the enemy player's total shield value is 20k or above (ie. they are shield stacking). The damage is scaled down in proportion to the total shield value, down to 0% at 0 shield points. It should be stronger against people who have massive shields (or are stacking), but it should not do a flat max damage value against people with a tiny 700pt shield because they activated block. Obviously, the numbers I threw out could be adjusted as needed.
PS. I main a Magsorc in pvp, and yes my hardened ward is stronger now than before murkmire.
solid idea. also, to add to this - it should do damage to the actual shield, not the health underneath.0 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerThe concept of oblivion damage is more of an issue rather than this set itself.1 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭Remove/Change Shieldbreakerdwemer_paleologist wrote: »the set is even weaker now in PvP because now the sorc shields are even Stronger.
and NO thats not a joke.
being serious.
this is the only patch i have ever seen in all of eso history that took what was meant to be a shield nerf and turned it into making shields Stronger in PvP.
in pve they are made weaker but in PvP they are stronger now then they have ever been.
if anything the shield breaker set needs to be doing more damage against shields.
Wow. The amount of dmg done has not changed from this set, nor does the fact shields seem "tankier" have anything to do with the amount of damage being done. Shields have been adjusted multiple times over the years, and after multiple times the same players complain. I think at this point it's fair to say it's a L2P issue.1 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerI'm glad there's a majority of players that know what's up
0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerAmdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.Edited by Minalan on November 5, 2018 11:43PM0 -
Flame_of_Hades✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerAmdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.
so. what im reading is that you have to be like the rest of us? with an exchange for damage and defense? wow. i feel so bad for you
2 -
Bergzorn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Flame_of_Hades wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.
so. what im reading is that you have to be like the rest of us? with an exchange for damage and defense? wow. i feel so bad for you
So, to stay on topic, why do ward users still have to eat Oblivion damage from a stupid set then?no CP PvP PC/EU
EP Zergborn
DC Zerg Beacon
guild master, raid leader, janitor, and only member of Zergbored4 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerFlame_of_Hades wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.
so. what im reading is that you have to be like the rest of us? with an exchange for damage and defense? wow. i feel so bad for you
Running 7k+ Weapon Damage while still being able to survive a good amount of damage definitely fits the concept of exchanging damage for defense. But what's fine for Stam is an issue when it comes to Sorcs it seems.
Shieldbreaker was and always will be a bad set, an attempt of "fixing" shield stacking without nerfing the shields, while having the benefit it also might drive Imperial Ciry DLC sales back then. So for ZOS, it was a win-win. Then of course they drastically cut shield duration, and nows also reduced strength. The set has no place in the game.
Also, there is noCP. Resistances mean a huge trade-off there outsidse the overperforming heavy stam sets.Edited by Feanor on November 6, 2018 8:54AMMain characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerFlame_of_Hades wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.
so. what im reading is that you have to be like the rest of us? with an exchange for damage and defense? wow. i feel so bad for you
Except, that unlike the rest of you we have to invest heavily in sustain too.
And we have zero debuff abilities.0 -
danno8✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Change it so it does more damage against shielded opponents, as opposed to the contentious Oblivion damage that no one likes.
Like defile against heals, channels/undogeables against dodges, unblockable/GbAoE against blocks etc... it makes life harder for shielded opponents rather than a complete counter.
This game plays better with soft-counters, not hard counters.
edit: You should have split "Remove" and "Change" in your poll options. Very different things.Edited by danno8 on November 6, 2018 6:22PM0 -
Sacredx✭✭✭Regardless of how this set performs, this discussion is a spec of dust compared to all the other more important issues that need to fixed. Hardly anyone uses this set and those that do get huge penalties against most players who don't run shields. If this was something broken every man and his dog would use it and the devs would do something about it, just like they did with the latest proc build that got nerfed. The fact that this is not the case speaks for itself. Priorities.PC NA PvP Oceanic
The Kelly Gang [TKG]
Highest kill streak: https://i.imgur.com/V6jJhoy.png
KB sample: https://i.imgur.com/n7TFyZr.png
TKG raid sample: https://youtube.com/watch?v=RkrsHg3T7pc2 -
Kingslayer513✭✭✭✭✭
✭Remove/Change ShieldbreakerAmdar_Godkiller wrote: »Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Where is the buff option?
Damage shield changes were not a nerf in PVP. With full impen and prismatic enchantments, it's a net buff, so shields need to either be further nerfed or shield breaker needs to be buffed tremendously.
That shields can have crit/phys/spell resistance is offset because they can be crit and there is a maximum shield cap based on HP. So in order to have a tanky damage shield, shield builds must compromise their damage potential in a way they did not need to before. And even then, it doesn't compare to the stack that was possible with 50k+ max magicka bulds.
It costs next to nothing to get your build to a point where this is a buff to shields. All you have to do is wear impen and invest 50 CP in Resistant. Then you are benefiting from your resistances and the crit damage you take will be very small.
It requires absolutely no defensive sets.
They must not be teaching reading or math in schools anymore.
READING the patch notes would tell you that shields are capped at 40 and 50% of health respectively for harness and hardened ward.
MATH would tell you that a sorc with 20K health and 30K stacked shields pre-nerf is going to be considerably weaker now. Armor rating isn't going to make up for that kind of loss.
Now the sorc has to invest in impen, health, and armor, except it's a lot harder to do in light armor than it is for heavy. And every mod invested in defense and sustain takes away from DAMAGE.
How has nobody called this post out yet? Completely misses the mark on several points, and the overall conclusion is dead wrong.
Pre murkmire in a cp campaign I'd run about 23.5k health with a 14k Hardened Ward. You must recall that shields were already reduced by 50% in pvp by battle spirit. Now, shields are still reduced by 50%, but there's also a cap of 40-50% hp PER SHIELD. The cap is applied after battle spirit, so after the 50% reduction and 5k extra health. In murkmire, I run 25k health with a 12.5k Hardened Ward that also gets 30% extra damage mitigation from my 20k resistances. That's over 16k in effective shield strength, which is obviously a net gain in strength compared to pre murkmire.
All I had to do was bump my health up a little and invest some more into crit resist. My sorc has felt better than ever in pvp since the shield changes.1
