Warden: returning player leveling perspective

EQBallzz · October 2018

So after a 2.5 year hiatus I have rolled a Warden to relearn the game and experience the new class that I never played. I have a 50 NB, 50 Templar and 50 Sorc but didn't want to jump back into one of those. I'm trying to gauge the Warden but I'm only up to level 15 so not sure if I have a great feel for the class yet.

My perspective so far feels like the bear pet is sort of weak (weaker than I expected) and my overall DPS also feels kind of weak. I feel like I don't have adequate AE dmg to deal with groups. That being said I feel like my survivability is pretty good so I rarely feel in danger unless I'm doing something dumb like trying to solo the crab WB at level 11..it just feels like killing mobs is rather slow (especially groups of mobs). I also feel like I can heal others reasonably well even though I haven't done much of it so I don't think I'm utilizing my healing abilities all that well.

By comparison (at least from my memory of almost 3 years ago) my NB always struggled with groups as well due to bad survivability and somewhat limited AE but compensated with good single target DPS and stealth opening attacks (at least how I played with a bow). My Templar always felt like easy mode doing anything (solid DPS and amazing survivability) and I could just do whatever I wanted including soloing many WB). I honestly don't remember how my Sorc played for some reason but I seem to recall it being somewhere in between. Maybe these classes have changed so i don't know how my experience then would compare to now.

Is my initial impression of the Warden accurate or is this just lower level or am I missing something? I guess I will have more AE options once I max out destructive staff to get impulse but that isn't really a Warden thing anyway. Are there particular Warden abilities or synergies/combos/playstyles that I'm missing that improve the Warden DPS that I'm not getting?

EQBallzz · October 2018

I guess I should point out that I have been going the route of a magicka based Warden with light armor and trying to focus on the pet skill line if that matters. I'm putting points into magicka and health with a ratio of about 2/3 magicka and 1/3 health.

MooseKnuckles88 · October 2018

I have both a magden and a stamden, stamden is where you wanna be for dps warden in Murkmire.

You might have already noticed, but wardens don't have a ton of damage abilities in their class. Most damage comes from the Animal Companions skill line, a small amount of damage can come from the Winters Embrace skill line and Green Balance is exclusively healing. The more animal companion skills you have slotted the more those skills are buffed due to the advanced species passive.

EQBallzz · October 2018

MooseKnuckles88 wrote: »

I have both a magden and a stamden, stamden is where you wanna be for dps warden in Murkmire.

You might have already noticed, but wardens don't have a ton of damage abilities in their class. Most damage comes from the Animal Companions skill line, a small amount of damage can come from the Winters Embrace skill line and Green Balance is exclusively healing. The more animal companion skills you have slotted the more those skills are buffed due to the advanced species passive.

I did notice that and i am focusing on the animal companion skill line. Is the bonus from more slotted abilities in that line really going to make the difference or is the Warden just not a very good DPS class?

FlyingSwan · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

MooseKnuckles88 wrote: »

I have both a magden and a stamden, stamden is where you wanna be for dps warden in Murkmire.

You might have already noticed, but wardens don't have a ton of damage abilities in their class. Most damage comes from the Animal Companions skill line, a small amount of damage can come from the Winters Embrace skill line and Green Balance is exclusively healing. The more animal companion skills you have slotted the more those skills are buffed due to the advanced species passive.

I did notice that and i am focusing on the animal companion skill line. Is the bonus from more slotted abilities in that line really going to make the difference or is the Warden just not a very good DPS class?

I levelled a Warden when I came back to the game and I can't really get along with it. It could of course be just me, but I couldn't get great DPS from it, when reskilling and gearing as a tank it's a bit dull to play compared to my NB tank but nowhere near as useful as my DK tank.

Warden seems to work as a support char, a bit of healing, a bit of damage, a bit tough, but ESO is not the sort of game that needs support chars, as it's very much focused on min-max style play. Which is quite amusing because when Warden was first touted, people were saying it was a P2W class, but to me it's an also-ran class that can't match the vanilla classes that we know and love.

RedRook · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

MooseKnuckles88 wrote: »

I have both a magden and a stamden, stamden is where you wanna be for dps warden in Murkmire.

You might have already noticed, but wardens don't have a ton of damage abilities in their class. Most damage comes from the Animal Companions skill line, a small amount of damage can come from the Winters Embrace skill line and Green Balance is exclusively healing. The more animal companion skills you have slotted the more those skills are buffed due to the advanced species passive.

I did notice that and i am focusing on the animal companion skill line. Is the bonus from more slotted abilities in that line really going to make the difference or is the Warden just not a very good DPS class?

It does make a difference when you get two points into it.

I just switched my magden to a stamden not long ago, and it's better in every way, unless you plan to be a healer.

Ramber · October 2018

You shoulda gone stam, their single target and group dps is really sick right now. My stamplar can dps about 42k on a 6million hm dummy if i get crits in my favor lol, my warden can do 46k dps since the patch when it was about 36 before it.

Tandor · October 2018

If you're after DPS, why have you put a third of your points into health?

EQBallzz · October 2018

Tandor wrote: »

If you're after DPS, why have you put a third of your points into health?

Well I'm just leveling so I figured while starting out the extra survivability from health might be useful. I'm not trying to min/max a DPS class per se but DPS is usually the focus when leveling. I can always respec later to something more min/max when I have more levels/gear/skills. Maybe that was a mistake and I should have just gone full magicka. I dunno.

Sounds like I might have gotten better DPS results going stam. I really wanted to focus on DPS with some healing which is why I went magicka but sounds like that may not be as viable as I had hoped.

ESO_Nightingale · October 2018

yeah dont go magden. not the greatest ATM.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

Deep fissure + lightning heavys, all the AOE you need in overland pve, even at level 15.

Ermiq · October 2018

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

ESO_Nightingale · October 2018

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

it doesn't stun enemies anymore. this change happened a long time ago.

Skander · October 2018

You made the mistake coming back

Azurya · October 2018

I guess, but that are my 50 cents, that you are missing a lot of CP, and running around with a lvl 15 Warden don´t get you any CP neither.
my suggestion, take one of your lvl 50 chars and start getting CP in amounts,
then run with your warden dungeons over the Groupfinder, in the times waiting, do some overland content, like dolmen, delves aso
But first get CP, without CP you are weak as wet noodle.

Ermiq · October 2018

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

it doesn't stun enemies anymore. this change happened a long time ago.

Oh. I'm so inattentive.

EQBallzz · October 2018

Azurya wrote: »

I guess, but that are my 50 cents, that you are missing a lot of CP, and running around with a lvl 15 Warden don´t get you any CP neither.
my suggestion, take one of your lvl 50 chars and start getting CP in amounts,
then run with your warden dungeons over the Groupfinder, in the times waiting, do some overland content, like dolmen, delves aso
But first get CP, without CP you are weak as wet noodle.

I currently have about 270 CP. What do you feel is an adequate amount of CP to not be a "wet noodle"?

EQBallzz · October 2018

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

I have been using Deep Fissure and the dmg seems decent but my big problem with it is that there is this weird gap of time between casting it and it going off. It's so awkward and slow and it doesn't have a ground indicator so it's hard for me to tell what the proper distance is. It's not just slow to fire but sometimes it doesn't seem to fire at all so I'm always in this state of waiting for it and wondering if it's actually working or not. Doesn't make for the most satisfying gameplay.

I have been trying to use it as a combat opener on groups due to the delay in casting but without a ground indicator and the fact that sometimes groups of enemies are not that close together initially makes that awkward to do as well.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

I have been using Deep Fissure and the dmg seems decent but my big problem with it is that there is this weird gap of time between casting it and it going off. It's so awkward and slow and it doesn't have a ground indicator so it's hard for me to tell what the proper distance is. It's not just slow to fire but sometimes it doesn't seem to fire at all so I'm always in this state of waiting for it and wondering if it's actually working or not. Doesn't make for the most satisfying gameplay.

I have been trying to use it as a combat opener on groups due to the delay in casting but without a ground indicator and the fact that sometimes groups of enemies are not that close together initially makes that awkward to do as well.

cast Deep Fissure and look at your feet, there is a circle, it goes out then back in, when that circle comes back in, that is when it goes off, 3 seconds later in the direction that your toon is looking, which is almost the exact time that a lighting heavy attack takes to complete and the lightning heavy attack does 3 ticks of damage and a final pulse, these damage ticks from the staff are also aoe, as long as you have one point into the first passive in the destro skill tree, which you ought to, since you are level 15 and that passive is able to be unlocked at destro skill rank 5. these 2 things together, deep fissure and lightning heavy will do more then 30k damage together, aoe, that is enough to kill 90% of overland mobs, not to mention, that you will get healed every time you have Deep Fissure go off.

EQBallzz · October 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

EQBallzz wrote: »

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

I have been using Deep Fissure and the dmg seems decent but my big problem with it is that there is this weird gap of time between casting it and it going off. It's so awkward and slow and it doesn't have a ground indicator so it's hard for me to tell what the proper distance is. It's not just slow to fire but sometimes it doesn't seem to fire at all so I'm always in this state of waiting for it and wondering if it's actually working or not. Doesn't make for the most satisfying gameplay.

I have been trying to use it as a combat opener on groups due to the delay in casting but without a ground indicator and the fact that sometimes groups of enemies are not that close together initially makes that awkward to do as well.

cast Deep Fissure and look at your feet, there is a circle, it goes out then back in, when that circle comes back in, that is when it goes off, 3 seconds later, with is almost the exact time that a lighting heavy attack takes to complete and the lightning heavy does 3 ticks of damage and a final pulse, these damage tick from the staff are also aoe, as long as you have one point into the first passive in the destro skill tree, which you ought to, since you are level 15 and that is able to be unlocked at destro skill rank 5. these 2 things together, deep fissure and lightning heavy will do more then 30k damage together, aoe, that is enough to kill 90% of overland mobs, not to mention, tha tyou will get healed every time you have Deep Fissure go off.

I actually have a fire staff atm but will give the lightning staff a try. Thanks for the info!

jypcy · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

Eremith wrote: »

I love the Deep Fissure. It's very strong direct damage and at the same time it's an AoE. And also it stuns enemy. And moreover it applies Major Breach debuff to all enemies.
But overall magden's DPS is quite low compared to any other class, that's a fact.
Warden is very cool for solo play though, it's my favorite class.

I have been using Deep Fissure and the dmg seems decent but my big problem with it is that there is this weird gap of time between casting it and it going off. It's so awkward and slow and it doesn't have a ground indicator so it's hard for me to tell what the proper distance is. It's not just slow to fire but sometimes it doesn't seem to fire at all so I'm always in this state of waiting for it and wondering if it's actually working or not. Doesn't make for the most satisfying gameplay.

I have been trying to use it as a combat opener on groups due to the delay in casting but without a ground indicator and the fact that sometimes groups of enemies are not that close together initially makes that awkward to do as well.

You’re right, there’s not a ground indicator for the area it’ll affect, but you should get a feel for it as you use it more. There is the blue ring at your feet that contracts then expands to indicate when it’ll fire, though. Perhaps knowing that will help you use it more effectively!

As noted above, even at level 15, deep fissure with lightning staff heavies should give you good aoe. You can also use shock clench for another bursty aoe that stuns your target and wall of elements for additional damage. Try this for groups of mobs:
Deep fissure > wall of elements > shock clench > deep fissure > lightning heavy attack
If you do that, you should be casting the second deep fissure right after the first goes off, but play around with the timing if necessary. If you cast another deep fissure before the previous one fires, you’ll cancel the previous cast of it.

Your damage will increase when you can learn the ancient knowledge passive from the destro staff line and the Betty Netch skill from animal companions.
To make sure you maintain power while leveling, try to keep your gear (and especially your weapon) pretty close to your current level.
[Edit to add: also, you can probably use a damage-oriented mundus stone, such as the lover (available in the three alliance starting zones).]

I play end game pve magden so, speaking from personal experience, I find it both effective and enjoyable. As long as you’re not running with a group that’s trying to squeeze out every bit of dps that they can to get the most competitive scores, which it doesn’t sound like something you’re interested in, magden is great!

majulook · October 2018

I have a Magden and a Stamden, both are fun to play.

Magden is a High Elf using fire and lightening destruction staffs (also has full skilled restoration staff if needed as healer).
Stamden is a Wood Elf Werewolf using poison bows (also looking at at Dual wield with poison and disease or dual bleed).

Magden has great sustain and a but bit lower dps than other classes.
Stamden has great dps and typical stamina sustain as damage and movement all come for the same resource pool.

max_only · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

I guess, but that are my 50 cents, that you are missing a lot of CP, and running around with a lvl 15 Warden don´t get you any CP neither.
my suggestion, take one of your lvl 50 chars and start getting CP in amounts,
then run with your warden dungeons over the Groupfinder, in the times waiting, do some overland content, like dolmen, delves aso
But first get CP, without CP you are weak as wet noodle.

I currently have about 270 CP. What do you feel is an adequate amount of CP to not be a "wet noodle"?

Have you assigned your cp to your new character? The lvl 15 can use the 270cp, he just can’t gain any more for the account wide total.

Also, put all attribute points in either magic, stamina, or health. Don’t mix.

Magic and elemental damage skills are better when you have high Magicka.

stamina and physical damage skills are better when you have high stamina.

If you are going to be a Magicka healer warden the use staff only. You won’t benefit from a bow or melee weapons.

If you are trying to be a hunter, and you want to use a bow and send in your bear, then you are actually a stamwarden.

You can’t be both. I mean, you will need to keep a heal (Lotus or Vines) on your bar but just because you have 2-4 skills that cost Magicka doesn’t mean you should put attributes in Magicka. Rather, if you are using bows and melee you put the points in stamina and put Magicka glyphs on a few armor pieces.

The most important thing to decide is what weapon you are going to use.

As far as “all points in health” this is for a warden tank and that’s a bit more complex.

EQBallzz · October 2018

max_only wrote: »

EQBallzz wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

I guess, but that are my 50 cents, that you are missing a lot of CP, and running around with a lvl 15 Warden don´t get you any CP neither.
my suggestion, take one of your lvl 50 chars and start getting CP in amounts,
then run with your warden dungeons over the Groupfinder, in the times waiting, do some overland content, like dolmen, delves aso
But first get CP, without CP you are weak as wet noodle.

I currently have about 270 CP. What do you feel is an adequate amount of CP to not be a "wet noodle"?

Have you assigned your cp to your new character? The lvl 15 can use the 270cp, he just can’t gain any more for the account wide total.

Also, put all attribute points in either magic, stamina, or health. Don’t mix.

Magic and elemental damage skills are better when you have high Magicka.

stamina and physical damage skills are better when you have high stamina.

If you are going to be a Magicka healer warden the use staff only. You won’t benefit from a bow or melee weapons.

If you are trying to be a hunter, and you want to use a bow and send in your bear, then you are actually a stamwarden.

You can’t be both. I mean, you will need to keep a heal (Lotus or Vines) on your bar but just because you have 2-4 skills that cost Magicka doesn’t mean you should put attributes in Magicka. Rather, if you are using bows and melee you put the points in stamina and put Magicka glyphs on a few armor pieces.

The most important thing to decide is what weapon you are going to use.

As far as “all points in health” this is for a warden tank and that’s a bit more complex.

Yes I have assigned the CP to my character. I was only asking that question because the poster was implying that my level of CP was not sufficient. I was just wondering how many more than 270 is required to get beyond this "wet noodle" stage.

Thanks for the other info. I'll stick with the magicka path for now I guess because I like the healing but maybe I will respec attributes to reclaim the 8 points I sunk into health and put them into magicka.

kylewwefan · October 2018

At low level it’s hard to gauge your damage really. It’s gonna constantly feel like a wet noodle until you reach CP. even once you hit CP, practically every build you see won’t really reach potential without being max cp.

The warden shalks are integral to good damage, but they’re weird . 3 second delay and the directions they fire off can be cumbersome at times.

max_only · October 2018

EQBallzz wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

EQBallzz wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

I guess, but that are my 50 cents, that you are missing a lot of CP, and running around with a lvl 15 Warden don´t get you any CP neither.
my suggestion, take one of your lvl 50 chars and start getting CP in amounts,
then run with your warden dungeons over the Groupfinder, in the times waiting, do some overland content, like dolmen, delves aso
But first get CP, without CP you are weak as wet noodle.

I currently have about 270 CP. What do you feel is an adequate amount of CP to not be a "wet noodle"?

Have you assigned your cp to your new character? The lvl 15 can use the 270cp, he just can’t gain any more for the account wide total.

Also, put all attribute points in either magic, stamina, or health. Don’t mix.

Magic and elemental damage skills are better when you have high Magicka.

stamina and physical damage skills are better when you have high stamina.

If you are going to be a Magicka healer warden the use staff only. You won’t benefit from a bow or melee weapons.

If you are trying to be a hunter, and you want to use a bow and send in your bear, then you are actually a stamwarden.

You can’t be both. I mean, you will need to keep a heal (Lotus or Vines) on your bar but just because you have 2-4 skills that cost Magicka doesn’t mean you should put attributes in Magicka. Rather, if you are using bows and melee you put the points in stamina and put Magicka glyphs on a few armor pieces.

The most important thing to decide is what weapon you are going to use.

As far as “all points in health” this is for a warden tank and that’s a bit more complex.

Yes I have assigned the CP to my character. I was only asking that question because the poster was implying that my level of CP was not sufficient. I was just wondering how many more than 270 is required to get beyond this "wet noodle" stage.

Thanks for the other info. I'll stick with the magicka path for now I guess because I like the healing but maybe I will respec attributes to reclaim the 8 points I sunk into health and put them into magicka.

Well as long as your weapons and armor are the same as your level you should be fine. Try to get them to purple (epic) level if you can.

Eating a buff food also really helps a lot more than you might think.