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Are you happy with the state of combat in murkmire?

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Zenimax online studios released murkmire on OCT. 22nd for PC, and with that release they have basically destroyed their combat system. Today I had a chance to play on a friend's PC account to test for myself some of the egregious failures that have accompanied this release, and I have to say it's even worse than I thought it could be.

Cast time targeted abilities are completely broken. If your cursor moves from a target before the cast time is complete, the ability cancels completely. This means that skills like Dizzying swing, dark flare, snipe (god bless), mend wounds, etc are completely destroyed. Essentially, any stam class without a class spammable that uses dizzying (stam sorc, 9/10 stam DK's, many stam wardens) are more or less unplayable. Although I literally do not care about the snipe stackers as snipe itself is a broken, exploitable ability; they make up a large number of the DPS in PvP, and I'm sure we will soon see the rage when they can no longer hit their targets with snipe due to an inability to track them. Dark flare is the only hard burst ability magplars have, and it is more or less useless.

Templar jabs are suffering from a massive delay in between casts. Some users here on the forums have claimed that weaving a light attack can prevent this bug from occurring, but any experienced pvper will know that this is not viable during prime time PvP as 50% of the time, light attacks do not fire or connect. The lag makes this bug 100 times worse, and I haven't even been able to test them during prime time but my observation is that Stamina templar is nearly unplayable in PvP.

Shadow Image, the only ability that makes a light armor magicka nightblade viable in pvp without SPAMMING cloak, is completely broken. I might remind you that there was a 6 month period in the last year where the shade did not work at all. While it was previously bugged, shading to it out of range would cause your character to bug out completely, locking you out of doing anything at all. In addition to this, you also could shade to OTHER PEOPLE'S SHADES that were in range. Now in murkmire, you cannot move vertically with the shade 9/10 times. You simply receive a "Invalid Location" message, in addition to occasionally having your character stutter and lock up for a tick or two. Oh by the way, did I mention that your shade can and will teleport you inside of objects such as towers, rocks, trees, and staircases? Or that this bug has been around since the beginning of the game?

All in all, zenimax has more or less destroyed combat for a wide variety of classes and playstyles, primarily in PvP. They have yet to acknowledge any of these issues despite showing an active forum presence since the patch, and the observation I've drawn from this is that because the players they make the most money from are those that primarily participate in housing/crown store purchases, and that since these same players tend not to care about the combat much if at all, zenimax is prioritizing issues such as ESO+ failing to work, furnishings not functioning properly, and crown store purchases not functioning properly. They are completely neglecting a large portion of their playerbase in favor of their more profitable population, despite the fact that the combat is the primary advertising point for the game.

I'll be quitting after spending over 5,000+ hours on this game if this patch goes live on console and we've yet to receive any acknowledgement of the aforementioned issues, or if they simply state "we're working on a fix for a future patch". Bugs like this in a game where fast paced, functional combat is core to both the PvE and PvP aspects of the game are unacceptable, and with the state of combat zenimax should have reverted the patch until it was bug free and ready for a real launch.

So tell me, are you happy with the state of combat?
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Are you happy with the state of combat in murkmire? 156 votes

Yes, Explain why.
14%
GilvothInklingsFaulgorlpwTanadrielRavenSwornSureshawtUPrimetemjiuswirveNolic1ElwendryllLiquidPonyNelothDirkRavenclawColecovisionWildRaptorXKingslayer513joseayalacAznox 23 votes
No, self explanatory.
85%
SolarikenMoloch1514Mojmircrashen17b14_ESOSigtricAlendrinStriken7deLioncourtMintyBadgerScardyFoxbigdavid11b16_ESOValen_ByteAgallochreActor1kari-pekka.hamalaineneb17_ESOkojouAldia_of_Drangleicjuha.smedsneb18_ESOfalcasternub18_ESOFeannag 133 votes
  • React
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    No, self explanatory.
    Cheeky little edit: They've also introduced a bug where anyone with a lapsed eso+ subscription who had over the amount their halved bankspace could hold banked at the time of the update, lost a massive amount of items. Since most of these players were unaware a bug like this could occur, they have no idea what items they've lost and have no way of making a list for support to restore.

    Imagine losing multiple gold sets of dungeon/trial/monster gear, or thousands of potions/food, or any of the valuable items in your bank and not having it fixed day one. No amount of gold or crowns could make that right, you've lost HOURS that you put into the game that you cannot get back. That'd make me quit for sure.
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  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    I don't know that I'm happy with the state of combat. Minus the bugs, which clearly need to be fixed, of course.

    However, I'm not unhappy enough to quit.
  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    I don't know that I'm happy with the state of combat. Minus the bugs, which clearly need to be fixed, of course.

    However, I'm not unhappy enough to quit.

    See, the quitting stems from overall unhappiness built up over the course of over a year. I pvp 95% of the time I'm logged into the game, and PvP is the portion that has received the most overall neglect. There are gamebreaking bugs that have been in the game for nearly a year (i.e the sprint bug and knockback bugs), which have not even been acknowledged. The server lag makes PvP during prime time straight up unplayable at a high level. It's to the point where players who have put the time into becoming top tier pvper's are being punished because the lag and combat bugs directly cause over 50% of their deaths, while the lower tier pvp players/zergs don't even notice it. I can deal with the lag, and I can deal with the combat bugs TO AN EXTENT, because I've spent over a year adjusting my playstyle to cope with them. But now for zenimax to release a patch that fully breaks multiple classes to the extent that they are unplayable in pvp, then for them to not comment on these bugs while simultaneously HOTFIXING things like ESO+ issues and corpses despawning, is just unacceptable. It is likely that we are looking at 3 months of dealing with these bugs, which I simply cannot do at this stage of the game.

    It seems to me that zenimax staff have been instructed not to acknowledge combat bugs or server performance, simply because that means they have to give us an update on the state of fixing them, which they are clearly incapable of doing. They would rather *** off a small portion of the community that understands the bugs that are occurring and really feels the negative impacts of these bugs, because the vast majority of players do not notice or care about the combat issues, and most of their profit comes from housing & cosmetic enthusiasts.

    I've never seen neglect to this extent on behalf of a developer in any title I've played, ever.
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  • Qwazzy
    Qwazzy
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    No, self explanatory.
    Agree, dark times ahead if changes aren't made.
    Smallscale/Solo player on multiple servers

    PC North America - Characters
    AD Sorcerer - PvP 16
    AD Templar - PvP 33
    AD Nightblade - PvP 17
    AD Dragonknight - PvP 19
    AD Necromancer - PvP 22
    EP Sorcerer - PvP 20
    EP Templar - PvP 21
    EP Nightblade - PvP 20
    DC Sorcerer - PvP 16
    DC Templar - PvP 24
    DC Nightblade - PvP 18
    Xbox North America - Characters
    AD Sorcerer - PvP 32
    AD Sorcerer - PvP 20
    AD Sorcerer - PvP 14
    AD Templar - PvP 41
    AD Templar - PvP 16
    AD Templar - PvP 14
    AD Warden - PvP 29
    AD Nightblade - PvP 27
    AD Dragonknight - PvP 18
    AD Necromancer - PvP 14
    Xbox Europe - Characters
    AD Sorcerer - PvP 42
    AD Templar - PvP 36
    EP Sorcerer - PvP 16
  • crashen17b14_ESO
    crashen17b14_ESO
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    No, self explanatory.
    The gutting of Nightblade healers has prompted me to start looking at other things to spend my money on, since i can't even figure out what the devs were thinking, even giving them them the benefit of the doubt.
  • katorga
    katorga
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    No, self explanatory.
    I've never seen neglect to this extent on behalf of a developer in any title I've played, ever.

    I agree. I didn't know about the ESO+ bug, when mine lapses in the next couple of months if my stuff vanishes that will probably be it for me. Too much hassle, I won't bother coming back.

  • Turelus
    Turelus
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    I'm not really happy or unhappy with it, just neutral. There are plenty of things I don't like and would love to see changed, but it doesn't detract from my fun or ability to play the game for the most part.
    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
  • ImmortalCX
    ImmortalCX
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    Ragequitting is a two step process.

    1) You rage

    2) You quit


    You've already done #1.

  • Spartabunny08
    Spartabunny08
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    Shorter list, what isn't broke in this game... Lmao answer nothing. We're out as well. The handling of this game has been an appalling nightmare.
  • Elwendryll
    Elwendryll
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    Yes, Explain why.
    Pve side. Stamsorc.

    Well. The only thing that changed for me is my dps. It got buffed by ~2k ~6%. But maybe this is because I always manage to use sets and abilities that are less likely to be nerfed. Actually, each update, I feel like Zos is pushing my playstyle, and everything is working exactly how it is supposed to work. Keep in mind that I play stamina and quasi-exclusively pve (no dizzying swing), this is just the impact on my own gameplay.
    PC - EU - France - AD
    Main character: Qojikrin - Khajiit Sorcerer Tank/Stamina DD - since March 25, 2015.
    Guildmaster of Oriflamme: Focus on 4 player endgame content.
    Member of Brave Cat Trade, Panda Division and Toadhuggers.

    All 4-man trifectas - TTT, IR, GH
  • Cously
    Cously
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    I stopped caring about combat when they destroyed DK's over the years. Thankfully there are plenty of other things to do in game. As for combat, I roll with the cards they give me. And I'm way more happy and enjoy the game more. No sympathy for Sorc and NB tears, where were you when DKs needed, ahh, whining about DKs.
  • FearlessOne_2014
    FearlessOne_2014
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    No, self explanatory.
    Cously wrote: »
    I stopped caring about combat when they destroyed DK's over the years. Thankfully there are plenty of other things to do in game. As for combat, I roll with the cards they give me. And I'm way more happy and enjoy the game more. No sympathy for Sorc and NB tears, where were you when DKs needed, ahh, whining about DKs.

    I do not require your sympathy! I've found a another MMO to play and spend money on. So K thanks bye!
  • DaveMoeDee
    DaveMoeDee
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    Liam12548 wrote: »
    Cheeky little edit: They've also introduced a bug where anyone with a lapsed eso+ subscription who had over the amount their halved bankspace could hold banked at the time of the update, lost a massive amount of items. Since most of these players were unaware a bug like this could occur, they have no idea what items they've lost and have no way of making a list for support to restore.

    Imagine losing multiple gold sets of dungeon/trial/monster gear, or thousands of potions/food, or any of the valuable items in your bank and not having it fixed day one. No amount of gold or crowns could make that right, you've lost HOURS that you put into the game that you cannot get back. That'd make me quit for sure.

    Wow. I don't know if I am happy or sad that I bought a 6 month sub a month ago. Wouldn't mind making up a list of lost items.

    Do you know how many master writs I had to do to get those 100 attunable stations?
  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    @ReactSlower - PC/NA - 2000+ CP
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  • shinikaze
    shinikaze
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    No, self explanatory.
    Cously wrote: »
    I stopped caring about combat when they destroyed DK's over the years. Thankfully there are plenty of other things to do in game. As for combat, I roll with the cards they give me. And I'm way more happy and enjoy the game more. No sympathy for Sorc and NB tears, where were you when DKs needed, ahh, whining about DKs.

    I do not require your sympathy! I've found a another MMO to play and spend money on. So K thanks bye!

    please share!
  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    Combat in of itself is not all that different from what it was, the most major change are to those who really went for the speed meta. Yes enchants are OP with torugs but that’s not so different from the Sloads debaucle, and we do need the targeting bug fixed but I’d say all in all it’s really pretty similar feel to what it’s been for a long time.
  • GrigorijMalahevich
    GrigorijMalahevich
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    No, self explanatory.
    Everything is running at intended, maybe a small magsorc nerfs are required
    PC/EU 800 CP.
    PvP MagSorc.
    Pedro Gonzales - Mag Sorc EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/CB6j6
    Valera Progib - Stam Sorc DC vMA Flawless Conqueror clear https://i.imgur.com/eYgpXG2.png
    Valera Pozhar - Mag DK EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/jrsuK
    Valera Podlechi - Mag Templar AD vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/N0BYq
  • Bergzorn
    Bergzorn
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    No, self explanatory.
    Even if only a minority of Players still care about the combat system, there is no reason to *** them off and drive more of them away. ZOS has a strange buisness model.
    no CP PvP PC/EU

    EP Zergborn
    DC Zerg Beacon

    guild master, raid leader, janitor, and only member of Zergbored
  • Turelus
    Turelus
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    Liam12548 wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno ZOS_Wrobel ZOS_RichLambert ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    59 votes (at time of this post) vs the millions of accounts they boast. Whilst it's not good that 59 people are angry about the update, I'd imagine an very bigger number than that are just logging in and playing the game any way.

    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
  • React
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    No, self explanatory.
    Vapirko wrote: »
    Combat in of itself is not all that different from what it was, the most major change are to those who really went for the speed meta. Yes enchants are OP with torugs but that’s not so different from the Sloads debaucle, and we do need the targeting bug fixed but I’d say all in all it’s really pretty similar feel to what it’s been for a long time.

    I'm not talking about balance here. Balance is a whole other issue. I'm talking about the literal broken system due to the plethora of bugs.

    Jabs, dark flare, snipe, dizzy, etc barely work.

    Shade doesn't work.

    On console, any time you get hit with a ranged cc while moving, you receive the CC before the animation registers. Thus you have no way to tell if you're cc'd other than noticing your skill bar gray out. If you break the cc before the animation registers, you slide back several steps and get locked out of abilities. This happens 25+ times per pvp session when i play.

    The sprint bug happens literally all the time. I'd say 10+ times in a 5 hour session, more if its lagging badly.

    The lag during primetime makes gameplay practically unplayable, completley unplayable st a high level.

    The game is broken, and zenimax won't even acknowledge it.
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  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    Turelus wrote: »
    Liam12548 wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno ZOS_Wrobel ZOS_RichLambert ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    59 votes (at time of this post) vs the millions of accounts they boast. Whilst it's not good that 59 people are angry about the update, I'd imagine an very bigger number than that are just logging in and playing the game any way.

    Agreed. A much large percentage of the population doesn't care about combat at all or isnt experienced enough with it to notice that it is literally broken. And because of that, zenimax is putting fixing these massive combat bugs on the back burner in favor of working on crown store, furnishing, and eso+ issues.

    Because who cares about the players who have put thousands of hours into becoming good an PvP or other aspects of the combatsystem, it's not like they buy $100's worth of furnishings.
    @ReactSlower - PC/NA - 2000+ CP
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  • Kikke
    Kikke
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    No, self explanatory.
    Turelus wrote: »
    Liam12548 wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno ZOS_Wrobel ZOS_RichLambert ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    59 votes (at time of this post) vs the millions of accounts they boast. Whilst it's not good that 59 people are angry about the update, I'd imagine an very bigger number than that are just logging in and playing the game any way.

    So, how do you feel about the patch then?
    Cleared Trials:
    - vAA HM - vHRC HM - vSO HM - vMoL HM - vHoF HM - vAS HM - vCR HM -

    "The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step, and a lot of bitching."
    -Someone said it, I guess.
  • Turelus
    Turelus
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    kikkehs wrote: »
    Turelus wrote: »
    Liam12548 wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno ZOS_Wrobel ZOS_RichLambert ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    59 votes (at time of this post) vs the millions of accounts they boast. Whilst it's not good that 59 people are angry about the update, I'd imagine an very bigger number than that are just logging in and playing the game any way.

    So, how do you feel about the patch then?
    As said here.
    Turelus wrote: »
    I'm not really happy or unhappy with it, just neutral. There are plenty of things I don't like and would love to see changed, but it doesn't detract from my fun or ability to play the game for the most part.
    Otherwise I am mostly happier than I am unhappy. I stopped getting angry over ESO a couple of years ago, I could give you pages of things I dislike about the game, but I've come to accept ESO isn't the game I want it to be and never will be. I just focus on the bits I find fun and enjoy my time playing.

    Life's too short to be stressing and ruining your mental health over a video game. That's what politics is for.
    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    Turelus wrote: »
    kikkehs wrote: »
    Turelus wrote: »
    Liam12548 wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno ZOS_Wrobel ZOS_RichLambert ZOS_Gilliam

    Interesting poll results here.
    59 votes (at time of this post) vs the millions of accounts they boast. Whilst it's not good that 59 people are angry about the update, I'd imagine an very bigger number than that are just logging in and playing the game any way.

    So, how do you feel about the patch then?
    As said here.
    Turelus wrote: »
    I'm not really happy or unhappy with it, just neutral. There are plenty of things I don't like and would love to see changed, but it doesn't detract from my fun or ability to play the game for the most part.
    Otherwise I am mostly happier than I am unhappy. I stopped getting angry over ESO a couple of years ago, I could give you pages of things I dislike about the game, but I've come to accept ESO isn't the game I want it to be and never will be. I just focus on the bits I find fun and enjoy my time playing.

    Life's too short to be stressing and ruining your mental health over a video game. That's what politics is for.

    So basically what you're saying is that it is totally fine for Zenimax to break things and not even acknowledge that they're broken?

    I have two questions for you. First, do you PvP outside of a zerg? Second, what exactly does "Community Ambassador" entail?
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  • Heimdarm
    Heimdarm
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    No, self explanatory.
    Hey guys, anyone can confirm if the changes in abilities with cast time cancelling if target is out crosshair, is a planned feature, or is it just a bug what will disappear?
  • DirkRavenclaw
    DirkRavenclaw
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    Yes, Explain why.
    Im Happy because, over Months people complain how easy this Game is, now, you actually have to use Tactics to win a Fight, all scream, its to hard, what gives me Hope is that ZOS isnt adressing any of the Calls for reverb, it looks like we stay with this, yeah some stuff needs a readjustment, my Sorc needs to run some Heavy Armour now, but even before, he soloed Normal Group Dungeons with a Volatile Pet and no Shields or any Heals eqipped, so not much change for me,
    Council Member of AtWritsEnd, Member of LoneWolfeHelp, Donor of GhostSeaTradingCO., Factor of EastEmpireTradingCO.,HonourGuard of ´DominionImperialGuard(DIG/PVP)

    Master Crafter including Jewelry, i craft for Mats and Donation, always happy to help, if Im not in the Middle of PVP, i play since around 14 Months
  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    Im Happy because, over Months people complain how easy this Game is, now, you actually have to use Tactics to win a Fight, all scream, its to hard, what gives me Hope is that ZOS isnt adressing any of the Calls for reverb, it looks like we stay with this, yeah some stuff needs a readjustment, my Sorc needs to run some Heavy Armour now, but even before, he soloed Normal Group Dungeons with a Volatile Pet and no Shields or any Heals eqipped, so not much change for me,

    Thanks for your opinion. Very well said.
    @ReactSlower - PC/NA - 2000+ CP
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  • mr_wazzabi
    mr_wazzabi
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    No, self explanatory.
    It looks like the silence from ZOS is because they're are seeking help from a PR firm in order to properly deal with the problems they created.

    Communication freeze is a way to protect yourself for the time being while scrambling for solutions to problems.

    Anything they say can and will be used against them, hence the silence.
    Bosmer Stamina NB
    Altmer Magicka TEMP
    Dunmer DK both stam/mag (depends what I feel like)
    Altmer Magicka NB
    Breton Magicka Sorc
    Redguard Stam Sorc
    Max CP
  • LiquidPony
    LiquidPony
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    Yes, Explain why.
    I honestly don't mind most of the combat changes, from a PvE perspective. Don't think the shields are a big deal. Not really happy that magblades got hit so hard and from so many directions, but other specs are mostly in a better place in PvE. The enchant proc changes are good for PvE, new Absorb Stamina glyph is good, the classes are much more balanced as far as DPS/sustain potential. Generally I think the positives marginally outweigh the negatives, which is a win from my perspective.

    PvP is another matter entirely and unfortunately this nasty new DW/DW 4 x Infused/Torug's proc meta is going to lead to the enchant changes being reverted.

    My dissatisfaction with Murkmire is actually all of the bugs rather than the combat changes.
  • React
    React
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    No, self explanatory.
    LiquidPony wrote: »
    I honestly don't mind most of the combat changes, from a PvE perspective. Don't think the shields are a big deal. Not really happy that magblades got hit so hard and from so many directions, but other specs are mostly in a better place in PvE. The enchant proc changes are good for PvE, new Absorb Stamina glyph is good, the classes are much more balanced as far as DPS/sustain potential. Generally I think the positives marginally outweigh the negatives, which is a win from my perspective.

    PvP is another matter entirely and unfortunately this nasty new DW/DW 4 x Infused/Torug's proc meta is going to lead to the enchant changes being reverted.

    My dissatisfaction with Murkmire is actually all of the bugs rather than the combat changes.

    This isnt a post about balance. It is a post about the functionality of combat.
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    Twitch.tv/reactfaster
    Youtube.com/@ReactFaster
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