Turelus wrote: »

Players who want to give feedback have multiple ways of doing so. /feedback in game, the open and public forums, attending events and talking directly to devs.

What a delightful little bubble you must live in.

Nah, the class reps are doing fine. They do talk to the players, and more to the point they play the damn game - on multiple classes - and know how it works.

The class reps are not the problem. The devs don't really care to listen to us - no doubt they feel they're always being shouted at, but that's what happens when you sit like a stone when people are talking to you. They get louder. The devs and the company have their own directives and priorities that may or may not have anything to do with whether or not we're having any fun, and their own ideas about what's important in gameplay that may or may not have anything to do with what it's like to play the game. You can throw yourself at that wall all you like, but there it stays.

You'd rather poll the general population for changes than have the developers make decisions while deliberately listening to feedback from the most experience players?

Congratulations. We now have flying mounts and PvP has been removed from the game.

thedude33 wrote: »

Player A thinks Sorc shields are over powered
Player B thinks Sorc shields are fine as is
Player C thinks Sorc shields need a slight boost.

ZoS nerf shields. 67% of their player base says ZoS doesn't listen to their input
ZoS leaves shields as is. 67% of their player base says ZoS doesn't listen to their input
ZoS bumps up shields. 67% of their player base says ZoS doesn't listen to their input

This is the reality of feedback and changes. Getting all butthurt and emotional over changes only reinforces the fact that you are not the person that should be deciding how to change the game.

yodased wrote: »

You know why none of this matters?

How many threads do you see the same names in, over and over (myself included).

Take all those active invested people out of the game completely, not even a drop in the ocean.

For that matter, remove every single person who has posted on this very forum in the last month from the game, you know what happens? Nothing.

You, me, everyone here do not mean a thing. They have openly stated this game is designed to be played for 3weeks or a month after a new patch drops. Thats how the biggest return is gotten, thatd what the massive majority do.

Wasting energy trying to get a developer to create "your" version of their game is like telling the artist what paint and brush to use on a commissioned piece.

If you have such amazing ideas, millions of dollars in investment capital, and millions more to support operational and advertising, make your own game exactly as you want it.

Squeaky wheel in this case simply gets replaced.

The sooner you come to terms with the reality of the situation, the easier it will be to either have fun in the gamr again or leave for greener pastures, but to expect, after all this time, any relevant changes will be made to cater to any specific crowd other than the profit generating populus is just silly.

Its not adapt and survive. Its accept and assimilate.

@yodased

Youve made a good point here except this game isn't ZOS' game, its Bethesda's world that they created. ZOS have a duty to deliver an MMO to Elder Scrolls fans/players and must stick to the insturctions and boundaries given to them by their superiors, Bethesda lol.

If ZOS, didnt make this game, then another company would have but no one would have made The Elder Scrolls if it wasnt Bethesda so Im not asking them do it my way or the community's way or the highway. Im saying SPEAK to us and ask us the USERS for our opinion before they make such stupid decisions which they always always go back on anyway but its just a wasted 3/4 months of awful combat before they do so.

yodased wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

yodased wrote: »

You know why none of this matters?

How many threads do you see the same names in, over and over (myself included).

Take all those active invested people out of the game completely, not even a drop in the ocean.

For that matter, remove every single person who has posted on this very forum in the last month from the game, you know what happens? Nothing.

You, me, everyone here do not mean a thing. They have openly stated this game is designed to be played for 3weeks or a month after a new patch drops. Thats how the biggest return is gotten, thatd what the massive majority do.

Wasting energy trying to get a developer to create "your" version of their game is like telling the artist what paint and brush to use on a commissioned piece.

If you have such amazing ideas, millions of dollars in investment capital, and millions more to support operational and advertising, make your own game exactly as you want it.

Squeaky wheel in this case simply gets replaced.

The sooner you come to terms with the reality of the situation, the easier it will be to either have fun in the gamr again or leave for greener pastures, but to expect, after all this time, any relevant changes will be made to cater to any specific crowd other than the profit generating populus is just silly.

Its not adapt and survive. Its accept and assimilate.

@yodased

Youve made a good point here except this game isn't ZOS' game, its Bethesda's world that they created. ZOS have a duty to deliver an MMO to Elder Scrolls fans/players and must stick to the insturctions and boundaries given to them by their superiors, Bethesda lol.

If ZOS, didnt make this game, then another company would have but no one would have made The Elder Scrolls if it wasnt Bethesda so Im not asking them do it my way or the community's way or the highway. Im saying SPEAK to us and ask us the USERS for our opinion before they make such stupid decisions which they always always go back on anyway but its just a wasted 3/4 months of awful combat before they do so.

You do realize that Zeinmax media owns bethesda right? It's this level of misunderstanding that puts people in the position they are in right now.

Well, Bethesda created the world and they made Skyrim so why can't I have this.

Zenimax is a massive, MASSIVE company that owns SEVERAL of your favorite studios.

Bethesda is the original IP developer sure, and Zenimax Online Studios was created for the sole purpose of ESO and any other MMORPG that the parent company decides to build.

Pete Hines himself couldn't go to his bosses and say herp derp, you are messing with my world, stop it.

Zenimax is a corporation on the same level of EA or Wal-Mart in so much that they give exactly this much about anyone's personal opinion: -394

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethesda_Softworks

@yodased

Mate, I couldnt give a damn who owns who, Bethesda MADE The Elder Scrolls, its their world and their story. Ive seen ZOS developers in videos saying they have to check up with the lore at Bethesda regularly to make sure they're sticking to everything theyre allowed to. The Elder Scrolls belongs to Bethesda no matter who you look at it.

Take those ZOS tinted glasses off asap, it will only do you good

Turelus wrote: »

Players who want to give feedback have multiple ways of doing so. /feedback in game, the open and public forums, attending events and talking directly to devs.

For real !! and when was the last time Zos listend to the feedback ? The only thing we get from zos in the threads is : We removed some comments that dont follow the rules.... and the /feedback in the game is even worse, they dont even answer

Regarding the class reps, they are a wet PR dream for Zo$ they a working for free and if the natchpotes backfire they can blame the reps

I have no tinted glasses, I am seeing facts plain as day.

Lore means *** when it comes to money.

So a woodelf has certain things they say or do, and that means they should not nerf shields?

Do you understand how ridiculous of a concept that is?

Lore =/= control of systems, combat, itemization, loot tables, marketing, operations. NONE of that is what makes the money for the company.

Sure, they want to make sure they represent the world in it accurately, but that is precisely where that input stops.

Really, you actually think that because a subsidiary company init ally made the IP that the parent company doesn't completely control it?

You should care about who owns who because it is the only pertinent piece of information that matters in this discussion.

Oh and to the point of listening and speaking to the "playerbase", where would that poll be? The forums? Do me a favor, you probably won't, but try this out.

Take 10 random samplings through the next week and just go to the most populated areas of the game you can, and ask in zone how many people even know this game has forums, and those that do, how many are active.

That may give you some perspective about how little this minority is here. They are going to ask the most passionate and invested people what to do with the game they are trying to entice casual players to spend money on? HELL NO, they are going to follow the almighty dollar and reskin mounts and make crates and push out content to keep the money printing process.

Idealism is great, optimism is great, but be realistic here

Don't have any issues with the DK rep to be honest. Even though I don't really follow what he does nowadays, better him than someone less competent.

Sir_Xalvador wrote: »

oh and before I forget stop with all the new motifs and new sets every 4 months its not needed we have plenty

This I agree with, at least with sets.

We really don't need over twenty new sets a year, when most of them are not used or the new ones just have to be stronger versions of old ones.

Turelus wrote: »

1 second cast times.

We don't need that. All this happened after people complained about shield stacking. Instead of fixing that single problem they just destroyed shields in general.
I've posted the proposal with technical description in the other thread how to fix this mess. I will repeat it here:

If all the time the main problem was shield stacking then why not just to remove the possibility of having those 2 effects being active at the same time?

I've always used only hardened ward and now with this changes on order to approach my previous lvl of defense I have to sacrifice another slot for the second shield. With this patch ZOS is basically pushing people to shield stacking!

How to do it: just like you did with major sorcery effect for example. You can't jump over 20% with that effect. Same with shields.
1. Bring those skills back to their initial state.
2. Name both effects "Major shield" or something to prevent them from stacking..
3. Create separate mini effects for pet protection for Hardened Ward, magicka restoration for that other light armor shield skill, etc... Thus those mini effects could be the only thing that can be stacked (which I don't think is worth it).

Result: No more shield stacking. You can choose one shield which fits your gameplay better and enjoy a reasonable amount of protection.

StormChaser3000 wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

1 second cast times.

We don't need that. All this happened after people complained about shield stacking. Instead of fixing that single problem they just destroyed shields in general.
I've posted the proposal with technical description in the other thread how to fix this mess. I will repeat it here:

If all the time the main problem was shield stacking then why not just to remove the possibility of having those 2 effects being active at the same time?

I've always used only hardened ward and now with this changes on order to approach my previous lvl of defense I have to sacrifice another slot for the second shield. With this patch ZOS is basically pushing people to shield stacking!

How to do it: just like you did with major sorcery effect for example. You can't jump over 20% with that effect. Same with shields.
1. Bring those skills back to their initial state.
2. Name both effects "Major shield" or something to prevent them from stacking..
3. Create separate mini effects for pet protection for Hardened Ward, magicka restoration for that other light armor shield skill, etc... Thus those mini effects could be the only thing that can be stacked (which I don't think is worth it).

Result: No more shield stacking. You can choose one shield which fits your gameplay better and enjoy a reasonable amount of protection.

I can guarantee you that you'll have people who don't agree with this. ZOS were screwed from the start with shield changes because no matter what they did people were going to be mad.

A fix which is acceptable for some groups might not be acceptable for others. There are plenty of people happy and fine with the current changes for example, we just don't see them as much because generally forums posts tend to be made in protest of a change rather than support of it.

Sir_Xalvador wrote: »

I agree,
Every 4 months we get a buff that we don't need or want or a nerf we don't need or want, then 4 months later its back to the way it was the first time quit nerfing and buffing stuff, You end up breaking the game when you do and them ots oh we will fix that in the next incremental patch... Let us play the game, it seems like the people nerfing and buffing things DO NOT PLAY THE GAME ANYHOW... kinda like that one mgr at your job never did your job before and does not know how too do it but they are going to tell you how to do it as they hold a clipboard.....


oh and before I forget stop with all the new motifs and new sets every 4 months its not needed we have plenty

While I whole-heartadly agree with your sentiment, there is a reason that these motifs are split into chapters and why new sets are introduced en-masse.

For some reason, I'm not sure why, they are focused on time-in-server as a metric of success. Most games use player base growth month/month to measure their success, but it appears, in my opinion, ZOS is really concerned with how long the players are logged in once they log in.

Follow the logic, motifs split into pages, motifs locked behind dailies, motifs locked behind insane treasure chest grind, motif locked behind pickpocketing, motifs locked behind RNG last boss to match the weapons they are selling.

What does all of this do? It entices those that have completionist tendencies to log in more often, for more time per session as well as makes those shiny gold books inside crown crates look that much better.

With the addition of the outfit system, motifs are much more paramount to a casual gamer now, so they make it very inconvenient for the average player who plays 4-5 hours a week and conversely very convenient, if expensive to simply purchase the book with gems, or get lucky in the crates.

Also to the analogy of that manager who never did your job, thats a bad manager, but still one that can fire you, same as this game, whatever your personal feelings are about the creator, you either accept it and play or accept it an leave, you are not going to go to the VP of this fictional company and tell them that their manager has no idea what they are doing, and the "bosses" sure as hell are not going to hold a poll in the lunchroom to see if their employees like their manager or choices, there is a suggestion box that leads directly to a shredder maybe, but they made the active choice to put that manager in that position with his or her clipboard for a reason. That reason may not make sense to you or you may not know the reason, but that is irrelevant to your paycheck at the end of the week.

Another thing that keeps popping up so much is this "we" want, and "playerbase", when in reality the person is simply stating their opinion.

Even the "class representatives", while commendable, do not represent nearly anything close to a % majority of players.

The representatives, while I'm sure are great people, are in an echo chamber, they are not some grand leader who takes straw polls in zone every day, they are a group of dedicated, well intentioned skilled players who were chosen because they are popular and good at the game.

This means nothing to the average player who logs in, dyes their costume, queues for spindleclutch1 normal and wipes.