Can't do damage

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

I've been agonizing, trying desperately to do something to get my damage level to something reasonable, but nothing I've done seems to help. So, here I am.

The character in question uses sword and board. Now, I know that's a set meant to be more defensive, but the disparity in offense is ridiculously extreme.

For example, I went to a Dolmen and happened to be there when the cultists appeared to begin the anchor bit. I attacked one and was busily stabbing away at him when someone HALF my level came in and obliterated them all in about 3 seconds. I'd been fighting them for about 30 seconds, and hadn't even managed to bring down the one I had been attacking.

As I say, I get it, it's a tanking set, but even low level characters are VASTLY exceeding the damage I'm doing... and I can't seem to do anything to remedy the situation.

At the moment I'm using 5 pieces Hunding's, and 4 Storm Knight (the helmet stubbornly refuses to drop for me). I haven't spent my CP, as the character concept makes that rather a complicated task, but it shouldn't be necessary to be able to do something with sword and board.

Part of the issue might be a lack of AOE damage. Every other weapon has some kind of AOE attack, but not so with sword and shield.

So... this thread has two purposes.

First, I was hoping for some suggestions as to how I might remedy this. The character is a Templar, but has a particular concept (I won't get into). Think Paladin, and you'll be on the track. At present he's L36.

Second, I'm going to suggest a revamp of this skill set. There's just no way to do any decent damage. Perhaps adjusting the morphs so one provides more dps while the other provides more defense (and taunting).

Anyway, any thoughts are welcome.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

The other morph of heroic slash is an AOE. But really though, you want to do damage with a s/b? Level 35 is nothing. You don't even have 15% of the passives you need unlocked. Get to level 50, cp 160, before you try to have the game changed to your liking.

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Well... there's a lot of game that happens before I get to max (gear) level...

I've never taken Low Slash, as I extremely dislike the animation... but if that's the only AOE I can get, I may have to get it.

As it is, I've only got room on my bar for 2 weapon skills. Right now I have:
1. Honour the Dead (self heal)
2. Shielded Charge (Quick move plus decent damage shield)
3. Ransack (reasonable damage plus resistance debuff)
4. Structured Entropy (ranged attack)
5. Volcanic Rune (the only AOE I currently have access to)

Sharee · October 2018

As a templar, use jabs. They are AOE.

Spend your CP. There's no reason not to, you can always respec later.

Use damage enchants on jewelry.

NyxWrench · October 2018

First, while the other guy may have been lower level, that doesn't mean he doesn't have CP. CP is shared on all characters as soon as you get any on any character. If he was CP 780 on another character, his brand new level 1 character also gets to make use of 780 CP.

So, don't take a character's level as indicative of their overall power just because they're below 50. (Above 50, you'll obviously see their full CP level.)

Second, AOE damage is obviously a massive multiplier when dealing with crowds. Whether or not he could burn all the mobs down in 3 seconds without any CP, if all the mobs were concentrated around you, then that likely made it easier for him as well. I know that when I do anchors, the pathing of the mobs in that initial burst is what makes them most annoying to deal with. There's inevitably 1 or 2 that get outside the AOE range. If they've already attacking someone, that makes it far easier to burn them down quickly.

Third, when I was messing around with sword and shield on dragonknight (which was occasionally more effective than 2H for damage), I found that proc sets (eg: Red Mountain's volcano, Syvarra's Scales' poison, Thunderbug's electricity, etc) to help boost my baseline damage a lot. That was mostly pre-level 50, so I'd expect it to work reasonably well for you as well. I'd probably at least recommend Thunderbug over Storm Knight, as Storm Knight is fairly narrowly scoped, and has a low proc rate.

If you use sets that focus on weapon damage (like Hunding's), be sure to consider how much effect that weapon damage will have on your actual damage output. A lot of abilities don't scale up very quickly, or scale up differently with weapon damage vs max stamina, so you can end up pushing a boulder uphill trying to use the wrong stat to boost your damage output.

And of course, look into alternate options for weapons to put on your back bar. Even if your S&B doesn't have AOE, you can still use a bow or staff to lay down some AOE DOTs in between hitting things with a sword.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

. Well... there's a lot of game that happens before I get to max (gear) level...

Exactly, you can light attack everything to death, if you understand the game.

I've never taken Low Slash, as I extremely dislike the animation... but if that's the only AOE I can get, I may have to get it.

It is not. As @sharee has stated, use puncturing strikes, morphed to sweeps, it heals while damaging and is AOE. Really the only skill you need at your play level .

. As it is, I've only got room on my bar for 2 weapon skills.

You can equip a secondary weapon and swap on the fly. It gives you 5 more skills and another Ultimate to use.

Like I said, you need to get to level 50 and cp 160 before you ask for the game to change for you. You have no idea how to play. Try different things. Learn. Don't come to the forums right away, I was like vr 8 (which is like cp 200 right now) before I started to care about builds or anything.

mague · October 2018

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

I've been agonizing, trying desperately to do something to get my damage level to something reasonable, but nothing I've done seems to help. So, here I am.

The character in question uses sword and board. Now, I know that's a set meant to be more defensive, but the disparity in offense is ridiculously extreme.

For example, I went to a Dolmen and happened to be there when the cultists appeared to begin the anchor bit. I attacked one and was busily stabbing away at him when someone HALF my level came in and obliterated them all in about 3 seconds. I'd been fighting them for about 30 seconds, and hadn't even managed to bring down the one I had been attacking.

As I say, I get it, it's a tanking set, but even low level characters are VASTLY exceeding the damage I'm doing... and I can't seem to do anything to remedy the situation.

At the moment I'm using 5 pieces Hunding's, and 4 Storm Knight (the helmet stubbornly refuses to drop for me). I haven't spent my CP, as the character concept makes that rather a complicated task, but it shouldn't be necessary to be able to do something with sword and board.

Part of the issue might be a lack of AOE damage. Every other weapon has some kind of AOE attack, but not so with sword and shield.

So... this thread has two purposes.

First, I was hoping for some suggestions as to how I might remedy this. The character is a Templar, but has a particular concept (I won't get into). Think Paladin, and you'll be on the track. At present he's L36.

Second, I'm going to suggest a revamp of this skill set. There's just no way to do any decent damage. Perhaps adjusting the morphs so one provides more dps while the other provides more defense (and taunting).

Anyway, any thoughts are welcome.

There are no low levels in ESO. The game buffs people till they are 50.

If you cant get the helmet, why dont you buy one ? It doesnt have to be the desired trait as long as you get the shock damage proc.

Are you hybrid or stamina ? And if you are Stamina , why the use of Structured Entropy ? You have a stamina morph of the javelin. If you want to stack stamina for blocking ? Then your damage is Jabs and Power of Light.

If you dont want to be a group tank then go magicka an

Structured Entropy
Ritual of Retribution
Solar Barrage
Pierce Armor
Purifying Light

Pierce Armor is cheap, taunts and debuffs always. You dont have to stack stamina for it. But then Hundings is useless and i would go for 5 heavy Julianos and 5 Whiterakes or Song of Lamae. That would be a classic Templer, heavy knight of light. On certain fights you might change food and get 5000 more stamina for an hour.

In other words. if you want to raise your damage, you ll have to adjust. Medium Hundings, critical chance and Jabs with Power of the Light are high stamina damage. You may top it with a two handed sword ot dual wielding swords or daggers. But that not exactly a Darien Gautier.. a wait a Knight of Light.

Vapirko · October 2018

Jabs, jabs, jabs. Also make sure you’re spec’d for either stamina or magicka (not both) and that you’re using the appropriate morphs.

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

. Well... there's a lot of game that happens before I get to max (gear) level...

Exactly, you can light attack everything to death, if you understand the game.

I've never taken Low Slash, as I extremely dislike the animation... but if that's the only AOE I can get, I may have to get it.

It is not. As @sharee has stated, use puncturing strikes, morphed to sweeps, it heals while damaging and is AOE. Really the only skill you need at your play level .

. As it is, I've only got room on my bar for 2 weapon skills.

You can equip a secondary weapon and swap on the fly. It gives you 5 more skills and another Ultimate to use.

Like I said, you need to get to level 50 and cp 160 before you ask for the game to change for you. You have no idea how to play. Try different things. Learn. Don't come to the forums right away, I was like vr 8 (which is like cp 200 right now) before I started to care about builds or anything.

With reference to this... I don't believe this IS an AOE... are you referring to the first skill in the line? Puncture... it morphs into Pierce Armour (which debuffs spell resistance as well as physical), and Ransack (which increases my physical resistance). I see no reference to a self heal or aoe in either description...

I swapped out Ransack for Low Slash, and I can't say I'm much impressed. It uses twice the stamina, does less damage and attacks more slowly (and looks kind of silly). However, I haven't got it morphed yet, I'll let you know more when I do.

There are some conceptual limitations on the character. He's not using any of his class skills (yet), except the one healing spell. The only magic he's learned to use since coming to Tamriel is what he's learned at the Mage's Guild (meaning staff skills and Mage Guild skills...). At present, I don't even have an ultimate to use.

I know I can equip a secondary weapon. It's a restoration staff.

I've actually been around since beta. I do know more or less what I'm doing, but this character has some limitations that are giving me some grief, and this is the first time I've really delved into the sword and board skill line. My main character is a Sorceror who uses a staff and greatsword, and my alt is also a Sorceror who only uses staves.

I wasn't aware I wouldn't see a lower level character's CP points, if he has them.

Anyway, I appreciate the thoughts. Still a work in progress...

Siohwenoeht · October 2018

@Morgha_Kul

Honest question: are the limitations self driven (i.e. roleplay) or are you trying to just test out SnB and weapon skills first?

If he's already slightly Magicka inclined due to mages guild, it may suit him to go to the psijics as well (if roleplay). That line has imbue weapon that has both a Magicka and stamina morph that could ratchet up your light attacks.

If not for rp, you'll be gimped in the damage department by not using some of the class skills for damage, especially once you reach top level. It will take a while to even unlock once you hit 50. I'd recommend at least 1 skill from each class tree so the tree itself can level with you.

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

@Morgha_Kul

Honest question: are the limitations self driven (i.e. roleplay) or are you trying to just test out SnB and weapon skills first?

If he's already slightly Magicka inclined due to mages guild, it may suit him to go to the psijics as well (if roleplay). That line has imbue weapon that has both a Magicka and stamina morph that could ratchet up your light attacks.

If not for rp, you'll be gimped in the damage department by not using some of the class skills for damage, especially once you reach top level. It will take a while to even unlock once you hit 50. I'd recommend at least 1 skill from each class tree so the tree itself can level with you.

It's more a RP thing.

I'll get into it then...

The premise of the character is that he's a person from OUR world (me, in this case) that's been transported into Tamriel. The point is to try to interact with the world of the game as I think I actually would do. That means I'm generally not going to get into fights. I'm generally not going to go adventuring. I'm going to spend my time exploring, crafting and learning about the world while trying to figure out how to return home.

That meant that the initial skills I would learn would be skills I actually have (like swordsmanship and archery, both of which I actually know how to do). I made the character a Templar on the notion that at some point I would learn how to use magic (being something of a scholar), but probably to heal, as I don't want to kill anyone (I generally use a mace, as I can rationalize that I'm incapacitating without killing). However, the only magic I could learn under "normal" circumstances would be Mage Guild spells.

Over the course of the game, I went to Coldharbour, where I was taught a healing spell by the Prophet. My expectation is that when I get to doing the Vivec quests, I'll probably go into the Templar skills more fully.

That has meant that my focus has been primarily on stamina, but with some allowance for magicka. It means sword and shield and bow have been my main skill lines for most of my adventuring, but many points have been spent on crafting skills (which I spend more time doing than actually adventuring).

As you can imagine, this presents a bit of a quandry where CP are concerned. I have around 300 or so, but haven't spent them (in part because of all the glowie effects and stuff that results from them, which are not appropriate) because I'm uncertain what direction I need to go to stay in concept and yet be effective.

It also kind of limits me where skills are concerned... which is why I wanted to know if there was a way to optimize the skills I have to do better damage. I went with the Hunding set (someone made for me, I still don't have enough traits learned) in medium armour to directly increase damage. The Storm Knight set I'm using only because I happen to have all the bits necessary. It just won't give me the helmet for that 5th part (I've had 77 belts so far). If there's something else I should be using, I'll happily change to that.

In any case, it's very late and time for bed. Thanks to all for any advice, I'm still hoping to improve things.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

With reference to this... I don't believe this IS an AOE... are you referring to the first skill in the line? Puncture... it morphs into Pierce Armour (which debuffs spell resistance as well as physical), and Ransack (which increases my physical resistance). I see no reference to a self heal or aoe in either description...

Puncturing strikes is a skill from the templar skill line "Aedric Spear", this skill https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncturing_Strikes.

I swapped out Ransack for Low Slash, and I can't say I'm much impressed. It uses twice the stamina, does less damage and attacks more slowly (and looks kind of silly). However, I haven't got it morphed yet, I'll let you know more when I do

.

ransack is the weaker morph of "Puncture", https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncture, the other morph is better because it will raise your damage with magic and physical sources. the resist you get from ransack is only ~2% damage mitigation. hardly anything, meanwhile, your spell will hit for ~11% more damage if you use the other morph.

Low Slash, https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Low_Slash, is not used for damage, i was simply pointing out that you where wrong when you said "Part of the issue might be a lack of AOE damage. Every other weapon has some kind of AOE attack, but not so with sword and shield." the skill is used for the minor main, which lower the damage from the mob you are hitting with the skill by 15%, morphed to heroic slash, gives ulti gen as well, both thing tanks need to do.

There are some conceptual limitations on the character. He's not using any of his class skills (yet), except the one healing spell. The only magic he's learned to use since coming to Tamriel is what he's learned at the Mage's Guild (meaning staff skills and Mage Guild skills...). At present, I don't even have an ultimate to use.

if you are RPing then stop asking for changes to fundamental game mechanics, that you don't understand. you are not playing the game like you ought to be if you want the results you desire. this really erked me-

Second, I'm going to suggest a revamp of this skill set. There's just no way to do any decent damage. Perhaps adjusting the morphs so one provides more dps while the other provides more defense (and taunting).

you have no idea how to play the game, moreover you seem to not want to learn, because of RP reasons. so either learn to play the game, or RP a reason why your toon sucks. asking for fundamental game mechanics to be changed, while you are level 33, while RPing is just bad.

Siohwenoeht · October 2018

@Morgha_Kul
I love the concept! And I can definitely see the limitations. I'll take a look at the skill lines you're wanting to start with once I get home and see where we might squeeze some damage from.

Sharee · October 2018

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

With reference to this... I don't believe this IS an AOE... are you referring to the first skill in the line? Puncture... it morphs into Pierce Armour (which debuffs spell resistance as well as physical), and Ransack (which increases my physical resistance). I see no reference to a self heal or aoe in either description...

Puncturing strikes, not Puncture. The former is from the templar Aedric Spear skill line, not the sword-and-shield skill line.

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

That has meant that my focus has been primarily on stamina...

The biting jabs morph of Puncturing strikes is actually a stamina skill, if it helps. When you morph the base ability to jabs, it changes from a magicka skill to a stamina skill. You would have to play with the magicka un-morphed version for a while first tho, until you level it up so it can be morphed. That should go very fast however, since it is the first skill in the line and thus requires relatively little experience to level up.

If you insist on not using any magicka skills whatsoever, you could get by with using Dawnbreaker, the ultimate skill from fighter's guild skill line. It can of course only be used when your ultimate is charged, but is relatively cheap for an ultimate, and provides excellent (physical damage)AOE attack ability.

In case your RP rules require you to only use "real" weapons, i'd suggest taking 2H as an option - the skill brawler is excellent for dealing with large mob packs.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · October 2018

@mague There are no low levels in ESO. The game buffs people till they are 50.

this is just wrong. they get buffed stats, max stats and regen but the game is more then those stats, you get passives, like sorcs implosion or temps spear wall, and actives skills the higher level you are. there are most definitely low levels in this game.

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

With reference to this... I don't believe this IS an AOE... are you referring to the first skill in the line? Puncture... it morphs into Pierce Armour (which debuffs spell resistance as well as physical), and Ransack (which increases my physical resistance). I see no reference to a self heal or aoe in either description...

Puncturing strikes is a skill from the templar skill line "Aedric Spear", this skill https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncturing_Strikes.

I swapped out Ransack for Low Slash, and I can't say I'm much impressed. It uses twice the stamina, does less damage and attacks more slowly (and looks kind of silly). However, I haven't got it morphed yet, I'll let you know more when I do

.

ransack is the weaker morph of "Puncture", https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncture, the other morph is better because it will raise your damage with magic and physical sources. the resist you get from ransack is only ~2% damage mitigation. hardly anything, meanwhile, your spell will hit for ~11% more damage if you use the other morph.

Low Slash, https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Low_Slash, is not used for damage, i was simply pointing out that you where wrong when you said "Part of the issue might be a lack of AOE damage. Every other weapon has some kind of AOE attack, but not so with sword and shield." the skill is used for the minor main, which lower the damage from the mob you are hitting with the skill by 15%, morphed to heroic slash, gives ulti gen as well, both thing tanks need to do.

There are some conceptual limitations on the character. He's not using any of his class skills (yet), except the one healing spell. The only magic he's learned to use since coming to Tamriel is what he's learned at the Mage's Guild (meaning staff skills and Mage Guild skills...). At present, I don't even have an ultimate to use.

if you are RPing then stop asking for changes to fundamental game mechanics, that you don't understand. you are not playing the game like you ought to be if you want the results you desire. this really erked me-

Second, I'm going to suggest a revamp of this skill set. There's just no way to do any decent damage. Perhaps adjusting the morphs so one provides more dps while the other provides more defense (and taunting).

you have no idea how to play the game, moreover you seem to not want to learn, because of RP reasons. so either learn to play the game, or RP a reason why your toon sucks. asking for fundamental game mechanics to be changed, while you are level 33, while RPing is just bad.

I see, I was confused by Puncturing Strikes being the AOE you suggested, since my concern was the Sword and Shield skill line not having one.

I used Ransack because most of my damage is coming from my weapon, not magick, so the reduction in spell resistance seemed pointless. Granted the physical resistance buff from ransack is minor, but was at least something I was using.

The problem isn't that Low Slash isn't used for damage, it's that it seems that NOTHING in the skill set is used for damage. It's a problem I actually have with the restoration staff too, but in that case I can understand it more because that's a "weapon" that doesn't exist in the real world. In reality, a sword will do damage to people pretty reliably.

Whatever my RP situation, the sword and shield set is still lacking some fundamental elements, as I see it. It has abysmal damage output. It lacks an AOE (though the morph of Low Slash alleviates this somewhat). These problems have nothing to do with my RP choices.

Again, I do know how to play the game. THIS character has some challenges I'm struggling with, but I do have other characters that I do just fine with. I don't get why you're becoming so antagonistic, it's really not necessary. I mean, do you really think they're going to change anything based on this thread?

Sharee · October 2018

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

The problem isn't that Low Slash isn't used for damage, it's that it seems that NOTHING in the skill set is used for damage.

Its only really a question of your weapon damage stat, and max stamina stat (plus things like CP into damaging stars).

Get those high enough, and even puncture does great damage. Certainly in the context of your gameplay (i.e. overland questing).

Consider things like proc sets that boost weapon damage (molag kena, senche's bite, armor of truth, clever alchemist, ...), use a nirnhoned weapon with a damage proc enchant etc.

NordSwordnBoard · October 2018

Put three damage enchants on the jewelry you have. Purple or blue quality until you get jewelry you won't out level, then purple until you decide what jewelry to use in your build.

Starlock · October 2018

@Morgha_Kul - I quite empathize with what you're trying to do here as one who sometimes makes similar sacrifices for story/character/RP purposes. It presents new sets of challenges to keep true to a character concept while still building a relatively effective character for what you want to do. For me, it often becomes a bit of a give-and-take. I keep the character concept at core, but recognize I have to fudge things a little bit here and there to do what I want to do within the limitations of the tools I've been provided.

The 1h and shield skill line doesn't actually need a revamp to do decent damage, in my experience. You're absolutely right that the skill line lacks a powerful AoE, but what others suggested with Low Slash -> Deep Slash is spot on. It's surprisingly strong when put on a character with decent stamina and weapon damage. When you can take it, I would also suggest Power Bash -> Power Slam. While single target, it can hit pretty hard when used strategically. You'd first hit your enemy with whatever morph of Puncture you have, block whatever they attack you with, and slam them in the face with your shield. I've found stuff dies pretty fast with that combo, especially weaving in some light attacks. Admittedly, my experiences with this involved using my CP, so there will be differences, but 1h and shield can hit pretty darned hard if tuned right.

You might consider breaking cannon a little bit to grab vigor and caltrops from the PvP skill lines. It sucks these are locked behind things that might not make sense for our characters to do, but sometimes you've got to bend a little bit. In my head, I just say that the events never really happened and that the character earned those skills some other way. The AoE from caltrops will be super useful, though. Vigor isn't as important since you have the templar heal, but will unlock anyway, so might as well use it as it'll be a bit stronger.

The last bit folks have mentioned is gear. Hunding's is a good crafted set for a damage dealer of the stamina/weapon variety. Storm knight is also a super fun set, though it isn't going to add much to your damage. Sometimes the survivability is worth the tradeoff. Up to you. Other sets you might think about?

Armor of the Veiled Heritence (overland, heavy). Alongside Hundings, this is the other set I run on my character who is a sword and board damage dealer. When you deal damage (meaning it will work for your bow as well) you get a big weapon damage boost. The proc rate is very reliable if you have AoE's going, but you might want to go another direction if you don't have that.
Way of Fire (overland, heavy). You say you are using weapon abilities a lot, and this set plays to that giving you a decent chance of hitting an enemy with a burst of fire damage.
Senche's Bite (overland, medium). Warning - this set will work much better if using your CP to reduce roll dodge cost and if you have a good (at least ~1300) stamina regen. It basically lets you proc a big boost to weapon damage whenever you roll dodge, plus a bit of crit.
Twin Sisters (overland, medium). I suggest this one because it'll give you an AoE bleed effect when you block on attack, though it is a proc chance. I've never played with this set, so it might not work well in practice.
Kvatch Gladiator (crafted). The build you are doing doesn't really have an execute. This set would basically give you one.

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Ok, got the morph on Low Slash now, and it's doing a little bit of "aoe" inasmuch as it hits two additional targets. I'm finding it really weak, actually. The damage is really poor, the stamina cost is very high (comparatively) and I really don't much care for the animation... so I'll probably go back to Puncture/Ransack. I'll get my aoe from other places... Right now, that's the Volcanic Rune (which is a soft control, too), but I'll have other options once I get into the Templar skills.

I'm still disappointed though. I get that the one handed skill line is "meant" as a tanking set, but the disparity in damage is so extreme! I still think it could use a bit of a buff on its blade attacks.

I did have another thought... tell me what you think. Personally, I find the Shield Bash skill kind of redundant, as it is very similar to the Charge skill (I use Shielded Charge). What if they changed the charge so there was no minimum range, meaning you could use it in melee? This would allow them to replace the Shield Bash skills with something more useful, like a reasonable damage skill or that elusive aoe?
Just an idea I'm toying with. I really don't expect them to be changing anything at this point.

SugaComa · October 2018

Don't assume every low level character is new

I had a level 10 drunk DK who would obliterate mobs and new lever 30+s would look on line WTF ... But that character has max CP under the hood ....

Yes CP makes hell of difference

malicia · October 2018

@OP - maybe reconsider your line of thought in this thread.

You seem to be an old hand at the game, but that doesn't mean that you are knowledgeable about theorycrafting. Said without malice, you do seem to be a bit uninformed as to the more technical aspects of theorycrafting.

Rather than complain about the skill line, why not rather post your current build, post your RP limitations and ask advice? That might get you friendlier replies than asking for the base game to be changed just to suit you.

Narvuntien · October 2018

You could back bar endless hail for AoE damage and obviously razor caltrops from the PVP skill line.

If you are a sword and board dps then you'll be good at PVP and get it quickly.

I mean I take forever to kill anything on my tank but I am also unkillable, I just chain a million mobs together and try to take them all on with a tickle of AoE.

Also, I have heard of people just playing full proc sets and getting 20K dps (enough to do everything on normal)

Starlock · October 2018

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

I did have another thought... tell me what you think. Personally, I find the Shield Bash skill kind of redundant, as it is very similar to the Charge skill (I use Shielded Charge).

Presuming you mean the "Power Bash" skill rather than just the bash you get from blocking then attacking while blocking (which yes, is super weak unless you run something like Jolting Arms), the "Power Slam" morph of that has advantages over charge in that once you block it deals increased damage. Combined with a crit it hits surprisingly hard. It's definitely felt more powerful to me than the charge skill. Perhaps as players we feel like the charge skill does more because the animation is more dramatic?

Morgha_Kul · October 2018

Starlock wrote: »

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

I did have another thought... tell me what you think. Personally, I find the Shield Bash skill kind of redundant, as it is very similar to the Charge skill (I use Shielded Charge).

Presuming you mean the "Power Bash" skill rather than just the bash you get from blocking then attacking while blocking (which yes, is super weak unless you run something like Jolting Arms), the "Power Slam" morph of that has advantages over charge in that once you block it deals increased damage. Combined with a crit it hits surprisingly hard. It's definitely felt more powerful to me than the charge skill. Perhaps as players we feel like the charge skill does more because the animation is more dramatic?

Perhaps... though I use it more for the damage shield. Either way, it just seemed a bit redundant having two skills that are so similar.

db0ssman · October 2018

Unfortunately Sword and Shield is for tanks, trying to make a strict dps build with only that is probably gonna run into problems in the same way you'd run into problems trying to make a straight DPS with a resto on both bars. I'd suggest you run dual wield on your off hand. it will scale off of stamina like your sword and board, but you will also have spin to win for mob control and the throwing knife thing for major brutality. That could be like your RP for hand to hand combat if your shield and sword drop, or something.

Starlock · October 2018

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

Starlock wrote: »

Morgha_Kul wrote: »

I did have another thought... tell me what you think. Personally, I find the Shield Bash skill kind of redundant, as it is very similar to the Charge skill (I use Shielded Charge).

Presuming you mean the "Power Bash" skill rather than just the bash you get from blocking then attacking while blocking (which yes, is super weak unless you run something like Jolting Arms), the "Power Slam" morph of that has advantages over charge in that once you block it deals increased damage. Combined with a crit it hits surprisingly hard. It's definitely felt more powerful to me than the charge skill. Perhaps as players we feel like the charge skill does more because the animation is more dramatic?

Perhaps... though I use it more for the damage shield. Either way, it just seemed a bit redundant having two skills that are so similar.

I suppose it depends on what one regards as similar. To me they are quite different - one is a gap closer and the other is a damage skill. Granted, they both involve bashing someone in the face with your shield, but if I'm going to go to that level, ransack isn't different from heroic slash since they both involve hitting someone with your one handed weapon... haha. At any rate, I think I might be tapped out for suggestions and ideas. Best of luck!

md3788 · October 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

With reference to this... I don't believe this IS an AOE... are you referring to the first skill in the line? Puncture... it morphs into Pierce Armour (which debuffs spell resistance as well as physical), and Ransack (which increases my physical resistance). I see no reference to a self heal or aoe in either description...

Puncturing strikes is a skill from the templar skill line "Aedric Spear", this skill https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncturing_Strikes.

I swapped out Ransack for Low Slash, and I can't say I'm much impressed. It uses twice the stamina, does less damage and attacks more slowly (and looks kind of silly). However, I haven't got it morphed yet, I'll let you know more when I do

.

ransack is the weaker morph of "Puncture", https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Puncture, the other morph is better because it will raise your damage with magic and physical sources. the resist you get from ransack is only ~2% damage mitigation. hardly anything, meanwhile, your spell will hit for ~11% more damage if you use the other morph.

Low Slash, https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Low_Slash, is not used for damage, i was simply pointing out that you where wrong when you said "Part of the issue might be a lack of AOE damage. Every other weapon has some kind of AOE attack, but not so with sword and shield." the skill is used for the minor main, which lower the damage from the mob you are hitting with the skill by 15%, morphed to heroic slash, gives ulti gen as well, both thing tanks need to do.

There are some conceptual limitations on the character. He's not using any of his class skills (yet), except the one healing spell. The only magic he's learned to use since coming to Tamriel is what he's learned at the Mage's Guild (meaning staff skills and Mage Guild skills...). At present, I don't even have an ultimate to use.

if you are RPing then stop asking for changes to fundamental game mechanics, that you don't understand. you are not playing the game like you ought to be if you want the results you desire. this really erked me-

Second, I'm going to suggest a revamp of this skill set. There's just no way to do any decent damage. Perhaps adjusting the morphs so one provides more dps while the other provides more defense (and taunting).

you have no idea how to play the game, moreover you seem to not want to learn, because of RP reasons. so either learn to play the game, or RP a reason why your toon sucks. asking for fundamental game mechanics to be changed, while you are level 33, while RPing is just bad.

@Lightspeedflashb14_ESO Ease up on the guy. People make suggestions every day on these forums, 99.9% of them won't be changed but that doesn't stop people from doing it. He obviously knows how to play the game being CP300.

OP keep playing how you want to play and just ignore the negativity from people like this. I think you understand that you aren't going to be endgame raiding with a sword and board but you make a valid point that sword and board is 100% pigeonholed into tanking and does next to nothing in terms of damage.

kringled_1 · October 2018

Except that that isn't the OP's issue. When I look at the raw tooltips, heroic slash does about as much immediate damage as any other stamina weapon skill, with the two main exceptions being Uppercut and snipe (both with cast times), and puncture isn't far behind. It's not a useful skill line for PvE DPS because it has no DOTs at all, and very limited AOE, not because the skills don't do damage. And it has more than it's share of utility (buffs/debuffs/CC) than other stamina weapon lines.
Using just those 2 skills (Puncture/Low slash, both morphed) and light attacks, I took down a 29k health overland mob in about 5-6s on a full tank build (Ebon/Bahraha's Curse). The cultists at the dolmens are about that same level of health. For them to have not died similarly quickly to the OP means that his stats have to be lacking - very low stamina, weapon damage, or both (gear very under level?) For the OP not to have identified that, but insist that the skill line needs to be changed, really suggests that his ability to understand where his problem is coming from is poor.
If you want to play solo content with multiple severe self-imposed limitations, fine. But if you don't get good results, then it's somewhat presumptuous to lead by suggesting that the game needs to be changed.

malicia · October 2018

md3788 wrote: »

He obviously knows how to play the game being CP300.

OP keep playing how you want to play and just ignore the negativity from people like this.

That's quite a presumption you're making. I've met plenty of players who have zero interest in the usual vet dungeon/trial content. They are happy with low DPS and not chasing the meta. That's no problem, but if such a player runs into a problem with their DPS being too low for their purposes, it is usually possible to help them if they ask advice.

I know a player who did a 2h brawler type of char. The RP side was that the char hated magic, so no 'magic' allowed. He took a long time to even kill a mud crab. He was willing to ask advice, though, and all it took were a few gear and skill changes, and he ended up pretty happy. I never got round to helping him to complete the build, but even the initial bit of help already made a massive change to his char's quality of life.

The issue in this thread is not that people are unwilling to help, but that the OP is asking for the game to be changed rather than asking how he can make the most of his char within the RP limitations.

Sheezabeast · October 2018

A couple questions. Do you have all 64 attributes in your stamina? And are you using food or a drink? And do you have stamina enchants on your armor? Your physical damage scales off your stamina pool. I suspect you could be hitting harder if your skills had more heft behind them. You mention how much stamina some skills cost, with a larger stamina pool, it will be easier to spam attacks.