Vote kick and dungeon queue

qbit · September 2018

If I get vote-kicked from a dungeon, will i get put back in the queue? Front of the queue? Or do I start over again?

Never been kicked and last night had first encounter where I wanted to be kicked given the group I got. It would have been better for all involved to kick me. So that’s what prompted this question for those curious.

Partomax · September 2018

Getting kicked has the same effect as leaving, the cooldown does not reset and you are not put back into any queue (you will have to manually queue again(assuming you are able))

Hope this helps.

Donny_Vito · September 2018

qbit wrote: »

Very good advice. And admittedly this is the first time I’ve encountered it, so I wasn’t sure of the best way to handle it. Probably wont see it again for a long time. Wasn’t sure if the proper response is to just ask they kick me.

I mean I don’t want to leave because of non-CP players or because of fake tanks etc. and I didn’t realize we had a fake tank/healer problem AND a jerk problem until the end. But I was wondering to myself the entire time if they kicked me if I could avoid the queue. Referencing back to that one guy that encountered a high CP player actually request the group kick him.

I still don’t know why he requested that.

That said, I guess since I’m at CP 255, I should probably start PUGing vet dungeons. Which I would love to do. But I also realize I have no experience with the mechanics and have respect enough not to waste peoples’ time if I’m too low level or too unknowledgibe to do vet dungeons. I was purturbed levels 15-25 were queuing for normal dungeon finder. Never seen that before. Maybe I should not have such a personal hang up and shamelessly queue for vet dungeons not knowing at all what I’m doing. Especially the DLC dungeons.

Dungeon finder allows low levels to play normals and not everyone can be assumed to be able to work as a team. Maybe I queue for vet tonight and just inform all its my first time and see how it goes. Want to but also don’t want to be the giy holding everyone back.

There is a significant difference between regular Vet dungeons and Vet DLC ones. For the most part, regular Vet ones can be done at your level with a little communication with your group. There is always a chance you'll get some d-bag who thinks he's an elitist and only wants max CP with him, but for the most part people are nice. When it comes to Vet DLC dungeons though, you really need to do some homework on the mechanics or specifically queue with people you know. High DPS is very helpful, but knowing the mechanics is always important. And unfortunately, the DLC ones are much more unforgiving than the regular dungeons.

Merlin13KAGL · September 2018

qbit wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

qbit wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

I read a comment some time back about fake tanks etc where a commenter said he encountered someone asking to be kicked. Which implied to me that maybe there was a reason the guy asked to be kicked. Relating to my question.

And to elaborate, I was grouped with a fake tank and healer. Who were having quite a laugh with each other. Everyone was level 15-25. Spindlecluch 2. I was doing 80% of DPS consistently. And that was with me having to constantly spam shields and run from boss. That will be fun after PTS goes live, but I digress.

This was obvious after first mini boss. At first I thought I’d just carry things along and help them out. As our fake tank and healer got increasingly more verbally abusive.

Finally the fake tank wanted to sneak past second to last and optional boss. I said “no”. I proceeded to solo the boss while he proceeded to tell me how stupid I am and that I’m a “sweaty palmed try hard.”

Sorry, but the decon mats from the boss loot is worth the 60 seconds to kill him.

But I soloed him anyway and then on the last boss let them wipe a few times as I responded to his rants.

Jumped in and finished the boss while he continued to insult me.

So yeah, it would have been better for all involved to kick me. But not if I have to requeue. But see my first paragraph. That’s why I asked.

Fair enough, why I asked. Some would want this to get out of certain dungeons or for less valid reasons than yours.

Sadly, since you're not going to get a kick Tank / Heals to pass, since they were in it together, your best bet would be to leave or let them continue without you.

If you linger long enough (simply refuse to help), a kick is likely.

If they refuse to kick, I'm willing to bet your time and lack of frustration is worth far more than both the decon mats and the cooldown time lost.

Some groups cannot be saved. Some groups should not be saved. They were not worth your time, nor your effort.

Report, exit, and be content knowing you're capable and they're off somewhere brick walling, awaiting their ban.

In either case, I believe the cooldown for queue is still in place. The good news is, group combos like this tend to be few and far between.

Very good advice. And admittedly this is the first time I’ve encountered it, so I wasn’t sure of the best way to handle it. Probably wont see it again for a long time. Wasn’t sure if the proper response is to just ask they kick me.

I mean I don’t want to leave because of non-CP players or because of fake tanks etc. and I didn’t realize we had a fake tank/healer problem AND a jerk problem until the end. But I was wondering to myself the entire time if they kicked me if I could avoid the queue. Referencing back to that one guy that encountered a high CP player actually request the group kick him.

I still don’t know why he requested that.

That said, I guess since I’m at CP 255, I should probably start PUGing vet dungeons. Which I would love to do. But I also realize I have no experience with the mechanics and have respect enough not to waste peoples’ time if I’m too low level or too unknowledgibe to do vet dungeons. I was purturbed levels 15-25 were queuing for normal dungeon finder. Never seen that before. Maybe I should not have such a personal hang up and shamelessly queue for vet dungeons not knowing at all what I’m doing. Especially the DLC dungeons.

Dungeon finder allows low levels to play normals and not everyone can be assumed to be able to work as a team. Maybe I queue for vet tonight and just inform all its my first time and see how it goes. Want to but also don’t want to be the giy holding everyone back.

Some of the DLC's are pretty rough, no doubt.

If you find yourself in a situation where you don't think your character is ready, nothing wrong with a quick "Sorry, I'm not quite ready for this one" and exiting or requesting a kick.

If you're honest about it and not trying to dance around it, most will respect that and oblige.

Don't automatically count yourself out just because it's Vet or because you're unfamiliar. Make it known upfront and most good experienced groups will be happy to give you the brief mechanics of relevant fights. Higher level groups are usually more willing to make up the difference and be more forgiving if you're upfront about it.

The best way to get better is to jump straight into the fire. Be willing to listen to advice and suggestions, as a group and an individual player, and you'll find you're a 'pro' dungeon delver in no time.

There's some content you're probably going to have to work yourself up to being able to complete, and that's fine. So long as you're honest about your knowledge, experience, and capability, you're never going to be "holding everyone back."

It's how you learn. It's how you get better.

Good luck!

Merlin13KAGL · September 2018

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

qbit · September 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

I read a comment some time back about fake tanks etc where a commenter said he encountered someone asking to be kicked. Which implied to me that maybe there was a reason the guy asked to be kicked. Relating to my question.

And to elaborate, I was grouped with a fake tank and healer. Who were having quite a laugh with each other. Everyone was level 15-25. Spindlecluch 2. I was doing 80% of DPS consistently. And that was with me having to constantly spam shields and run from boss. That will be fun after PTS goes live, but I digress.

This was obvious after first mini boss. At first I thought I’d just carry things along and help them out. As our fake tank and healer got increasingly more verbally abusive.

Finally the fake tank wanted to sneak past second to last and optional boss. I said “no”. I proceeded to solo the boss while he proceeded to tell me how stupid I am and that I’m a “sweaty palmed try hard.”

Sorry, but the decon mats from the boss loot is worth the 60 seconds to kill him.

But I soloed him anyway and then on the last boss let them wipe a few times as I responded to his rants.

Jumped in and finished the boss while he continued to insult me.

So yeah, it would have been better for all involved to kick me. But not if I have to requeue. But see my first paragraph. That’s why I asked.

Partomax · September 2018

qbit wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

I read a comment some time back about fake tanks etc where a commenter said he encountered someone asking to be kicked. Which implied to me that maybe there was a reason the guy asked to be kicked. Relating to my question.

And to elaborate, I was grouped with a fake tank and healer. Who were having quite a laugh with each other. Everyone was level 15-25. Spindlecluch 2. I was doing 80% of DPS consistently. And that was with me having to constantly spam shields and run from boss. That will be fun after PTS goes live, but I digress.

This was obvious after first mini boss. At first I thought I’d just carry things along and help them out. As our fake tank and healer got increasingly more verbally abusive.

Finally the fake tank wanted to sneak past second to last and optional boss. I said “no”. I proceeded to solo the boss while he proceeded to tell me how stupid I am and that I’m a “sweaty palmed try hard.”

Sorry, but the decon mats from the boss loot is worth the 60 seconds to kill him.

But I soloed him anyway and then on the last boss let them wipe a few times as I responded to his rants.

Jumped in and finished the boss while he continued to insult me.

So yeah, it would have been better for all involved to kick me. But not if I have to requeue. But see my first paragraph. That’s why I asked.

The kick option exists to prevent abuses such as "fake tanks" and "fake healers", were it to reset the queue and requeue the player it would not stop them from abusing. In the situation you were in, if the kick worked like you asked in your question, then yes it would be beneficial for you to be kicked, however, when someone is kicked that means they did something wrong and rewarding them for it would be counter productive. In your situation what you should have done is vote kicked the tank and healer which would quickly be replaced by fitting players. If you were unable to kick them as the others wouldn't vote then you are always free to carry on with them, just remember the 10 minute cooldown starts when you're queue ends and you join the instance (not when you leave the group mid-dungeon like WoW and other MMOs) so after you've been with them for 10 minutes you are free to leave them and instantly requeue which is sometimes faster than sticking with them and taking 30 minutes to finish the dungeon.

qbit · September 2018

Yes it was because the fake healer and tank were obviously friends and the second DPS had no idea what was going on. A vote-kick of either of them would have failed. No majority.

I didn’t mind carrying them all. Even despite fake tank insulting everyone over and over. I just ignored. But when fake tank demanded we sneak past a sub-boss and I refused and everyone just watched while flinging insults at me in group chat, I was already at the end and rather enjoyed watching them wipe a few times on last boss. But I had to take a break from battle in order to respond to the fake tank’s concerns he wrote while I was soloing the boss he wanted to skip.

Just wanted to know if request to kick me would have allowed them to have their fun while I avoided wasting my time on the pledge. Apparently it doesn’t. So question answered.

Partomax · September 2018

Alright well, enjoy.
Good luck in your future endeavors

Donny_Vito · September 2018

Nothing worse than entering the Random Daily (or any specific dungeon for that matter) and getting grouped with people who've already started a dungeon. But then, you get that ever-frustrating message of "Jump failed. Instance is already full." How can it already be full when I'm the 4th person in the group? Lousy programming is the answer. So I continue to try and portal to the players in the group. Ten, fifteen times. Still...."Jump failed. Instance is already full." This is where I really start to vent my frustration at the lack of development skills that went into the group dungeon finder. By this time, I've been kicked from the group for not being able to join the instance. Time to wait 10 more minutes and do it again.

Amazing experiences like this, and the "fake tanks/healers" are what discourage people from enjoying the dungeon finder. It's almost more enjoyable to spam in zone/guild chat trying to find people than it is to use the dungeon finder functionality.

qbit · September 2018

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Nothing worse than entering the Random Daily (or any specific dungeon for that matter) and getting grouped with people who've already started a dungeon. But then, you get that ever-frustrating message of "Jump failed. Instance is already full." How can it already be full when I'm the 4th person in the group? Lousy programming is the answer. So I continue to try and portal to the players in the group. Ten, fifteen times. Still...."Jump failed. Instance is already full." This is where I really start to vent my frustration at the lack of development skills that went into the group dungeon finder. By this time, I've been kicked from the group for not being able to join the instance. Time to wait 10 more minutes and do it again.

Amazing experiences like this, and the "fake tanks/healers" are what discourage people from enjoying the dungeon finder. It's almost more enjoyable to spam in zone/guild chat trying to find people than it is to use the dungeon finder functionality.

Yes. I can say after some 50 or so normal PUGs for pledges, this is the first one I’ve encountered this level of shenanigans on. I was with them from the beginning but couldn’t deal with the 12-year old trash talk once it was directed at me. It was directed in general at the group and his friend previously.

But skipping a boss that can be soloed? Just because that’s what the kid wanted to do? No. And him breaking TOS over it to tell me how he’s right and I’m wrong when he just had to wait 2 minutes for me to solo the boss he watched me kill.

I don’t report kids like this because ESO may be the only thing they have in their life when their parents aren’t abusing them or they’re not being bullied at school. Get their account banned and a school shooting might take place. Or a suicide.

Merlin13KAGL · September 2018

qbit wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

I read a comment some time back about fake tanks etc where a commenter said he encountered someone asking to be kicked. Which implied to me that maybe there was a reason the guy asked to be kicked. Relating to my question.

And to elaborate, I was grouped with a fake tank and healer. Who were having quite a laugh with each other. Everyone was level 15-25. Spindlecluch 2. I was doing 80% of DPS consistently. And that was with me having to constantly spam shields and run from boss. That will be fun after PTS goes live, but I digress.

This was obvious after first mini boss. At first I thought I’d just carry things along and help them out. As our fake tank and healer got increasingly more verbally abusive.

Finally the fake tank wanted to sneak past second to last and optional boss. I said “no”. I proceeded to solo the boss while he proceeded to tell me how stupid I am and that I’m a “sweaty palmed try hard.”

Sorry, but the decon mats from the boss loot is worth the 60 seconds to kill him.

But I soloed him anyway and then on the last boss let them wipe a few times as I responded to his rants.

Jumped in and finished the boss while he continued to insult me.

So yeah, it would have been better for all involved to kick me. But not if I have to requeue. But see my first paragraph. That’s why I asked.

Fair enough, why I asked. Some would want this to get out of certain dungeons or for less valid reasons than yours.

Sadly, since you're not going to get a kick Tank / Heals to pass, since they were in it together, your best bet would be to leave or let them continue without you.

If you linger long enough (simply refuse to help), a kick is likely.

If they refuse to kick, I'm willing to bet your time and lack of frustration is worth far more than both the decon mats and the cooldown time lost.

Some groups cannot be saved. Some groups should not be saved. They were not worth your time, nor your effort.

Report, exit, and be content knowing you're capable and they're off somewhere brick walling, awaiting their ban.

In either case, I believe the cooldown for queue is still in place. The good news is, group combos like this tend to be few and far between.

qbit · September 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

qbit wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Cooldown remains in effect, as it should.

And why did you want to be kicked? You can leave on your own at any time.

Why should you get to circumvent the cooldown because you don't like your present circumstance?

I read a comment some time back about fake tanks etc where a commenter said he encountered someone asking to be kicked. Which implied to me that maybe there was a reason the guy asked to be kicked. Relating to my question.

And to elaborate, I was grouped with a fake tank and healer. Who were having quite a laugh with each other. Everyone was level 15-25. Spindlecluch 2. I was doing 80% of DPS consistently. And that was with me having to constantly spam shields and run from boss. That will be fun after PTS goes live, but I digress.

This was obvious after first mini boss. At first I thought I’d just carry things along and help them out. As our fake tank and healer got increasingly more verbally abusive.

Finally the fake tank wanted to sneak past second to last and optional boss. I said “no”. I proceeded to solo the boss while he proceeded to tell me how stupid I am and that I’m a “sweaty palmed try hard.”

Sorry, but the decon mats from the boss loot is worth the 60 seconds to kill him.

But I soloed him anyway and then on the last boss let them wipe a few times as I responded to his rants.

Jumped in and finished the boss while he continued to insult me.

So yeah, it would have been better for all involved to kick me. But not if I have to requeue. But see my first paragraph. That’s why I asked.

Fair enough, why I asked. Some would want this to get out of certain dungeons or for less valid reasons than yours.

Sadly, since you're not going to get a kick Tank / Heals to pass, since they were in it together, your best bet would be to leave or let them continue without you.

If you linger long enough (simply refuse to help), a kick is likely.

If they refuse to kick, I'm willing to bet your time and lack of frustration is worth far more than both the decon mats and the cooldown time lost.

Some groups cannot be saved. Some groups should not be saved. They were not worth your time, nor your effort.

Report, exit, and be content knowing you're capable and they're off somewhere brick walling, awaiting their ban.

In either case, I believe the cooldown for queue is still in place. The good news is, group combos like this tend to be few and far between.

Very good advice. And admittedly this is the first time I’ve encountered it, so I wasn’t sure of the best way to handle it. Probably wont see it again for a long time. Wasn’t sure if the proper response is to just ask they kick me.

I mean I don’t want to leave because of non-CP players or because of fake tanks etc. and I didn’t realize we had a fake tank/healer problem AND a jerk problem until the end. But I was wondering to myself the entire time if they kicked me if I could avoid the queue. Referencing back to that one guy that encountered a high CP player actually request the group kick him.

I still don’t know why he requested that.

That said, I guess since I’m at CP 255, I should probably start PUGing vet dungeons. Which I would love to do. But I also realize I have no experience with the mechanics and have respect enough not to waste peoples’ time if I’m too low level or too unknowledgibe to do vet dungeons. I was purturbed levels 15-25 were queuing for normal dungeon finder. Never seen that before. Maybe I should not have such a personal hang up and shamelessly queue for vet dungeons not knowing at all what I’m doing. Especially the DLC dungeons.

Dungeon finder allows low levels to play normals and not everyone can be assumed to be able to work as a team. Maybe I queue for vet tonight and just inform all its my first time and see how it goes. Want to but also don’t want to be the giy holding everyone back.

El_Borracho · September 2018

qbit wrote: »

Yes it was because the fake healer and tank were obviously friends and the second DPS had no idea what was going on. A vote-kick of either of them would have failed. No majority.
.

So funny, read this yesterday and ran into nearly the exact same situation last night while running vet FG1. Should have known when I saw the tank was a level 85. Luckily, the healer was a 400+. Everything ran smoothly until Kra'gh. Tank was all over the place trying to DPS. Healer and I tried to kick him, fail, because the other DPS was his buddy. Ended up taking forever and about a dozen resurrections on the "tank" to beat the boss.

I'm all for giving players the benefit of the doubt. I'm sure a CP 85 can competently tank FG1, but at least try to tank. Or, at the very least, tell the two strangers in the group that you have no idea what you are doing and are a fake tank so I can bail at the outset.

qbit · September 2018

El_Borracho wrote: »

qbit wrote: »

Yes it was because the fake healer and tank were obviously friends and the second DPS had no idea what was going on. A vote-kick of either of them would have failed. No majority.
.

So funny, read this yesterday and ran into nearly the exact same situation last night while running vet FG1. Should have known when I saw the tank was a level 85. Luckily, the healer was a 400+. Everything ran smoothly until Kra'gh. Tank was all over the place trying to DPS. Healer and I tried to kick him, fail, because the other DPS was his buddy. Ended up taking forever and about a dozen resurrections on the "tank" to beat the boss.

I'm all for giving players the benefit of the doubt. I'm sure a CP 85 can competently tank FG1, but at least try to tank. Or, at the very least, tell the two strangers in the group that you have no idea what you are doing and are a fake tank so I can bail at the outset.

Yeah after cooling down a day or two about this, I’ve had some other experiences. Maybe we just all need to communicate better. Doing DLC pledge last night. No idea of mechanics of any boss. CP 780 tank keeps telling us short little riddles of what we should be doing instead. Finally I pipe up rather irritated that maybe he should explain mechanics before the boss fight since he has such leet skills. He said maybe I should say at the beginning I need them explained. He explained each boss after and we all melted the bosses.

Point being: he was the only one that knew what to do. The other three of us did not, and I was the only one that finally spoke up after I started considering his comments elitist (in a normal pledge).

Turns out he was making some assumptions based on our CP level and the fact he saw our healer wearing the meta (with very high CP). He saw me wearing ilambris set (I was carried through vCoH is the only reason I have it; it’s not an indication I know what I’m actually doing). He assumed we all knew what was up and we just sucked. And we assumed he was being elitist.

After some bad noise, we all kicked ass and I learned some mechanics. And in the end, we all just assumed a bunch of stuff we could have avoided by simply communicating at the beginning.

Lesson learned. A great experience.

El_Borracho · September 2018

@qbit, I totally agree with you. While its a safe assumption in normal dungeons that its likely the first time for some in a PUG, I think its a mistake to assume everyone in a vet dungeon knows the mechanics. Especially since some of the vet dungeons are really easy. Aside from ones like Scalecaller, Fang Lair, MOS, MHK, most of the dungeons can be done on vet for the first time if you have a solid group if you just don't run around like a madman and/or know or are told the mechanics.

I'm like you and try to give people some warning if I haven't done one before. Have yet to catch heat for piping up. And I definitely wasn't ripping players who don't speak up upon joining. Its the guys who don't respond to the others in the group who ask things like, "Everyone got this?" or "Everyone know the mechanics?" We gave that tank every opportunity to come clean and he just wouldn't, to the point of ignoring advice from others after wiping us several times. Maddening.

ghastley · October 2018

El_Borracho wrote: »

Tank was all over the place trying to DPS.

I've been the tank "all over the place" when the DPS's keep pulling the boss, running around trying to escape, and I can't catch up to it to taunt and hold.

Donny_Vito · October 2018

ghastley wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

Tank was all over the place trying to DPS.

I've been the tank "all over the place" when the DPS's keep pulling the boss, running around trying to escape, and I can't catch up to it to taunt and hold.

The only time DPS will be pulling the boss is if you have an inexperienced mag DPS who's using an Ice Staff and keeps heavy attacking. Otherwise, if you're losing taunt then it's because you're not tanking properly. And you don't need to "catch up to the boss" to taunt, just use Inner Fire/Rage and range taunt him back.

ghastley · October 2018

Donny_Vito wrote: »

ghastley wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

Tank was all over the place trying to DPS.

I've been the tank "all over the place" when the DPS's keep pulling the boss, running around trying to escape, and I can't catch up to it to taunt and hold.

The only time DPS will be pulling the boss is if you have an inexperienced mag DPS who's using an Ice Staff and keeps heavy attacking. Otherwise, if you're losing taunt then it's because you're not tanking properly. And you don't need to "catch up to the boss" to taunt, just use Inner Fire/Rage and range taunt him back.

This was with low-level chars (30'ish) on normal. The DPS's ran ahead, and I did not yet have a ranged taunt. Once I caught up and could get in the first taunt, he stuck with me. The whole scenario repeated at the next one. It all ended well enough as normal tends to, so no big deal.

I doubt that anyone else had taunted, just aggro'ed too soon, and ran the boss away from me.

The Elder Scrolls Online

Vote kick and dungeon queue

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