Dear ZOS, hire players of every class and let them talk to devs often in person

DorianDragonRaze · September 2018

Instead of just enabling weapon skills that are slotted on 3rd bar you choose to remove it.
Do you realize/care how many magsorc builds you ruin and how much it hurts the class?

Hire several medium-to-max-CP players of every class (PvE and PvP) and let them talk to devs often.
They should be not testers but end-users.
You'll get more satisfied clients and more money in return.

Ohtimbar · September 2018

Everything they need to know is right here on their own forums. Ditto Youtube, Twitch, etc. If they wanted that information they would already have it; anything else is just theatrics.

Koolio · September 2018

They literally just did that lol.

Sylvermynx · September 2018

Well, the Class Rep setup would be sort of what you were talking about I think, @DorianDragonRaze. It doesn't seem as if that worked too well.

I doubt that ZOS would be willing to pay players to be part of the team either.

Goratesque · September 2018

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Well, the Class Rep setup would be sort of what you were talking about I think, @DorianDragonRaze. It doesn't seem as if that worked too well.

I doubt that ZOS would be willing to pay players to be part of the team either.

Or... it worked just as intended!

Artim_X · September 2018

Of all the changes they are making I really hope the overload change is reverted or adjusted so that the 3rd bar isn't removed. Having that 3rd bar is a godsend for many sorcs.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · September 2018

Then you have to ignore them and add cast times to everything.

BretonMage · September 2018

Ohtimbar wrote: »

Everything they need to know is right here on their own forums. Ditto Youtube, Twitch, etc. If they wanted that information they would already have it; anything else is just theatrics.

There's too much trolling and hysteria on the forums. And people generally come to the forums to rant and complain, so they don't tend to get very balanced feedback on issues.

AlienatedGoat · September 2018

The Class Rep system was supposed to work like this.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter what kind of system is made if ZOS doesn't want to listen and take the insights to heart.

DorianDragonRaze · September 2018

Artim_X wrote: »

Of all the changes they are making I really hope the overload change is reverted or adjusted so that the 3rd bar isn't removed. Having that 3rd bar is a godsend for many sorcs.

Thank you for your builds descriptions in signature.

Turelus · September 2018

Did the reps actually know about this change before Monday though, I thought this was a blind side even to them?
Admittedly I don't really follow their Discords to know if they had prior warning. If they didn't though doesn't the next meeting become the point where they give the feedback?

NyassaV · September 2018

Or just make your devs play the game more. MANDATORY PLAYTIME

Darkestnght · September 2018

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong... ...not everyone has the same play style and I would rather not have some random player giving ZOS developers advise.

LonePirate · September 2018

Phage wrote: »

The Class Rep system was supposed to work like this.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter what kind of system is made if ZOS doesn't want to listen and take the insights to heart.

Exactly! It’s the old adage about leading a horse to water, except the horse will occasionally take a drink whereas ZOS will never listen.

I think ZOS should stream developer game play on a live game server for an hour or two each week, rotating between classes, magicka/stamina, PVE/PVP, platforms and servers to ensure that all combinations are covered at least once per quarter. The dev should be someone who actually makes decisions about the game, not some entry level employee with zero influence. They should interact with stream chat by answering questions, explaining builds, combos, tactics and mechanics while keeping it light and casual.

ZOS could certainly benefit from the feedback and the player base would benefit by seeing someone with authority interact with and experience the game the same way players do.

DorianDragonRaze · September 2018

Darkestnght wrote: »

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong... ...not everyone has the same play style and I would rather not have some random player giving ZOS developers advise.

At least 2 of each class per PvE and PvP or something like that would do.

DorianDragonRaze · September 2018

LonePirate wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

The Class Rep system was supposed to work like this.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter what kind of system is made if ZOS doesn't want to listen and take the insights to heart.

Exactly! It’s the old adage about leading a horse to water, except the horse will occasionally take a drink whereas ZOS will never listen.

I think ZOS should stream developer game play on a live game server for an hour or two each week, rotating between classes, magicka/stamina, PVE/PVP, platforms and servers to ensure that all combinations are covered at least once per quarter. The dev should be someone who actually makes decisions about the game, not some entry level employee with zero influence. They should interact with stream chat by answering questions, explaining builds, combos, tactics and mechanics while keeping it light and casual.

ZOS could certainly benefit from the feedback and the player base would benefit by seeing someone with authority interact with and experience the game the same way players do.

That would work!

idk · September 2018

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

DorianDragonRaze · September 2018

LonePirate wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

The Class Rep system was supposed to work like this.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter what kind of system is made if ZOS doesn't want to listen and take the insights to heart.

Exactly! It’s the old adage about leading a horse to water, except the horse will occasionally take a drink whereas ZOS will never listen.

I think ZOS should stream developer game play on a live game server for an hour or two each week, rotating between classes, magicka/stamina, PVE/PVP, platforms and servers to ensure that all combinations are covered at least once per quarter. The dev should be someone who actually makes decisions about the game, not some entry level employee with zero influence. They should interact with stream chat by answering questions, explaining builds, combos, tactics and mechanics while keeping it light and casual.

ZOS could certainly benefit from the feedback and the player base would benefit by seeing someone with authority interact with and experience the game the same way players do.

Yeah, the spoiler sections with dev comments in patch notes are definitely not enough.
ZOS should display in real game that their changes are reasonable and viable.

Bam_Bam · September 2018

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Well, the Class Rep setup would be sort of what you were talking about I think, @DorianDragonRaze. It doesn't seem as if that worked too well.

I doubt that ZOS would be willing to pay players to be part of the team either.

that was such a lame attempt at interacting with the community - a first class demonstration on how not to do it.

If a great demonstration of how much they value community feedback, the Class Rep thing was it. Pathetic. And sad.

Bam_Bam · September 2018

DorianDragonRaze wrote: »

LonePirate wrote: »

Phage wrote: »

The Class Rep system was supposed to work like this.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter what kind of system is made if ZOS doesn't want to listen and take the insights to heart.

Exactly! It’s the old adage about leading a horse to water, except the horse will occasionally take a drink whereas ZOS will never listen.

I think ZOS should stream developer game play on a live game server for an hour or two each week, rotating between classes, magicka/stamina, PVE/PVP, platforms and servers to ensure that all combinations are covered at least once per quarter. The dev should be someone who actually makes decisions about the game, not some entry level employee with zero influence. They should interact with stream chat by answering questions, explaining builds, combos, tactics and mechanics while keeping it light and casual.

ZOS could certainly benefit from the feedback and the player base would benefit by seeing someone with authority interact with and experience the game the same way players do.

Yeah, the spoiler section with dev comments in patch notes are definitely not enough.
ZOS should display in real game that their changes are reasonable and viable.

Will never EVER happen.

Bam_Bam · September 2018

idk wrote: »

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

They hired Gilliam but nobody knows his role. All I know is he is a huge loss to the community and ZOSs' gain, although I can't see them letting him do much if at all.

OGLezard · September 2018

idk wrote: »

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

So now we blame him instead of wrobel?

OGLezard · September 2018

OGLezard wrote: »

idk wrote: »

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

So now we blame him instead of wrobel?

Quick, someone fire up the gif cannon!

ezio45 · September 2018

LITERALLY I WOULD FOR FREE GIVE THEM FEEDBACK ON ANY PROPOSED CHANGE THEY WANTED TO MAKE TO MAG SORC

I only know magsorc well enough but literally I would give them detailed explanations of why I think a proposed change would be good or bad.

Hell I already do this they just actually need to take the time to read it and have it not be in the update set to appear in a month

NyassaV · September 2018

Bam_Bam wrote: »

idk wrote: »

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

They hired Gilliam but nobody knows his role. All I know is he is a huge loss to the community and ZOSs' gain, although I can't see them letting him do much if at all.

I know for a fact Gilliam is doing good work there. But he isn't the only person working there who has ideas.

His words were;
"The other issue is that we can't say the reason for every change
If all of the patch notes I submitted made it to live
They would have been an extra 2 pages
And that's just mine"

Turelus · September 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

LITERALLY I WOULD FOR FREE GIVE THEM FEEDBACK ON ANY PROPOSED CHANGE THEY WANTED TO MAKE TO MAG SORC

I only know magsorc well enough but literally I would give them detailed explanations of why I think a proposed change would be good or bad.

Hell I already do this they just actually need to take the time to read it and have it not be in the update set to appear in a month

You've been able to do this since beta. /feedback and the forum threads.
The thing is they don't have to listen to said feedback, which is where people get frustrated.

idk · September 2018

Bam_Bam wrote: »

idk wrote: »

in previous updates we such poorly conceived changes we could easily state no one at Zos was experienced in the most challenging content in the game. However, with Gilliam becoming an employee of Zos that has changed ans he was/is experienced in PvP and competitive raiding.

So now these changes are receiving input from a very experienced player.

They hired Gilliam but nobody knows his role. All I know is he is a huge loss to the community and ZOSs' gain, although I can't see them letting him do much if at all.

Haven’t looked at his twitter recently but it did say he was in combat design. He’s certainly not drawing new mounts did crown crates.

Doctordarkspawn · September 2018

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Well, the Class Rep setup would be sort of what you were talking about I think, @DorianDragonRaze. It doesn't seem as if that worked too well.

I doubt that ZOS would be willing to pay players to be part of the team either.

@Sylvermynx

The thing is, the class reps didn't get a -overview- of the patch before the patch went live, Alcast, who is a class rep, just published a video which essentially ammounted to 'wtf'.

They took the feedback, which was 'sorc shields need looked at' and went "LETS NUKE THEM IN THE WORST POSSIBLE WAY" likely not understanding how a cast time would have done this.

The class reps, didn't know. And most of them hate this change. And last we heard, they officially had a 'lets come to jesus' meeting date (Figure of speech, but you get the idea) with ZOS that has allready happened or will happen very soon. The class rep meeting was made in advance, they were not told the changes pre-patch launch.

So dont give them too much ***. Their just as pissed as we are. Whether their lisened to, will define whether this game is made, or broken.

Luckylancer · September 2018

Having all weapon skills enabled would be op. Enabling last weapon equiped would be better. Bar removal anoyed me too even if i dont play sorc a lot.

Zardayne · September 2018

BretonMage wrote: »

Ohtimbar wrote: »

Everything they need to know is right here on their own forums. Ditto Youtube, Twitch, etc. If they wanted that information they would already have it; anything else is just theatrics.

There's too much trolling and hysteria on the forums. And people generally come to the forums to rant and complain, so they don't tend to get very balanced feedback on issues.

Believe it or not, those folks that come to this forum to rant and complain generally are the players who give a damn about the longevity of said game. These are forums to discuss various topics. Those can be happy unicorns and rainbows or the dark underbelly of MMOs. Alot of what is posted I'm sure most of us would love a developer to take notice of. I do care about the longevity of any MMO I'm playing and the developers make *** decisions I feel it's my right as a paying customer to call then out on it. If I don't and they serve me a another heaping spoonful of shite I have no one but myself to blame for not voicing my opinion. With that I said I feel ZOS could get a huge deal ofpositive feedback from forums if they would just open their eyes and ears. When players tell you magdens are pulling crap DPS and you nerf bear damage and increase another dps abilities spell costs..that tells me they're not listening..their heads up their delvehole.

Most of on these forum users give a damn about the game or we wouldnt be wasting our breath.

DMuehlhausen · September 2018

DorianDragonRaze wrote: »

Instead of just enabling weapon skills on 3rd bar you choose to remove it.
Do you realize/care how many magsorc builds you ruin and how much it hurts the class?

Hire high-end players of every class (PvE and PvP) and let them talk to devs often.
They should be not testers but end-users.
You'll get more satisfied clients and more money in return.

It's a decent thought, until you say high end players.

Most people never realize that end game raiders/high end players normally make up less thatn 1% of the player population. These changes are designed to balance stuff in PvE for the other 99% of the player base. If it breaks PvP it's not an issue since PvP is really just and add on game play style for games like this.

Dear ZOS, hire players of every class and let them talk to devs often *in person*

Dear ZOS, hire players of every class and let them talk to devs often in person