Maybe add Transmutation Crystals to more PvE content?

Bevik · September 2018

Thinking about randomly to Chests, World Bosses with a guarantee of 1-3, Daily writs 1 per each means you can get 7 per char / day. Which is not much but for a casual player they are plenty. vMA 5 is decent but not everyone can do vMA in 30 mins, nTrials are quick but can be long if you have to do PUG and wait for people to join. Best way is to do PvP which is also time consuming and not everyone likes/have gear for PvP. Also need different setup for PvE and PvP.

Beardimus · September 2018

I'm ok with adding a few more here or there but honestly getting in PvP isn't that hard. Just need 25kAP in a 30 day campaign and you get 50. That's repair one keep or mutagen heal a zerg you don't need a full PvP spec.

Issue with giving via writs is some people would do on 12 toons a day and be drowning in them. I think the goal is to encourage folks to do other content

iiYuki · September 2018

Group bosses should have a 10-20% chance to drop them and the final boss should be guaranteed to drop one based upon difficulty, normal dropping the green or blue ones and veteran dropping the blue and purple ones.
I guess they do it so that you dont just transmute every item that drops it means people play more, therefore are in-game more and they have more chances to target us with ads etc.
I think for someone who doesn't PvP or do trials you really have 3 chances a day (pledges) to get crystals which is pretty bad, and with the abysmal return rates on all geodes that say 1-10 or 1-25 and getting 1 maybe 2 at best every time. I honestly have never used the transmute system before, its quicker and easier to grind gear out and save them for a piece of gear you really need to have that trait on.

jcm2606 · September 2018

Yep. Adding more sources of crystals in PVE, as well as raising the cap or removing the cap completely are two things that need to happen.

The whole "you're not meant to get a full set of gear in the right traits in 5 minutes" argument against raising or removing the cap is now invalid, in my opinion. Summerset introduced new jewelry traits which require transmutation to use, so it is no longer a skip-the-grind mechanic, more a gate to access new content, and so the constraints aimed at a skip-the-grind mechanic that we have now should be removed.

Narvuntien · September 2018

What do you need the crystals for?
If you do a lot of PVE you can just do more PVE to get the gear you want...

If you aren't playing the game a whole lot just wear crafted gear you don't need BiS, you can complete the content you want in juli or hundings or torags.

How is it a gate to accessing new content? You don't need to transmute things just don't wear the set if you don't have the crystals.

The problem here is that people are chasing the bis when the bis isn't even that much better than the next best thing you could be using that you don't need transmute crystals for.

susmitds · September 2018

You don't need BiS gear. Transmute crystals should definitely not be increased. Your idea will crash the good traited item market. The grind should not be allowed to skipped. You don't need perfect traits for jewellery either. The traditional three traits work just as fine.

Tl:dr - Get good and earn your BiS gear in perfect traits. It's not that hard. Till then, use inferior traits.

XDark_One13 · September 2018

Maybe as a daily log in reward? A green one on any day, or a gold one that always drops 25 or 50 on a 7 day special reward.

ruikkarikun · September 2018

They want you to go cyrodil for month geodas reward in pve setup, so elitist pvp player can have fun with fresh meat in cyro.

Don't get me wrong, but you get 50 crystals for Tier 1 reward (which is 25k AP only) and you get like 2-5 for HM vet dungeons and trials which is JOKE compared to to time you spent etc.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

susmitds wrote: »

You don't need BiS gear. Transmute crystals should definitely not be increased. Your idea will crash the good traited item market. The grind should not be allowed to skipped. You don't need perfect traits for jewellery either. The traditional three traits work just as fine.

Tl:dr - Get good and earn your BiS gear in perfect traits. It's not that hard. Till then, use inferior traits.

All right. Then nerf crystal rewards in PvP, does that sound more appealing to you? ^^ I'm to-o-o-otally sure a lot of people here will get behind this idea. ^^

susmitds · September 2018

ruikkarikun wrote: »

They want you to go cyrodil for month geodas reward in pve setup, so elitist pvp player can have fun with fresh meat in cyro.

Don't get me wrong, but you get 50 crystals for Tier 1 reward (which is 25k AP only) and you get like 2-5 for HM vet dungeons and trials which is JOKE compared to to time you spent etc.

You only get 50 per month. Compare that to 8-20 each day by pledges.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

susmitds wrote: »

You only get 50 per month. Compare that to 8-20 each day by pledges.

What about rewards for the worthy? That's daily 4-25 coffer.

Royaji · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

You only get 50 per month. Compare that to 8-20 each day by pledges.

What about rewards for the worthy? That's daily 4-25 coffer.

Which is equal to doing 2 non-DLC pledges. Seems fair to me.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

@Royaji , pledge gives purple tier (1-10), not gold like reward for the worthy, so average gain from two pledges is less than one coffer. Also, can you compare time spent farming 20k AP with running two vet dungeons? I wouldn't.

LadyNalcarya · September 2018

Agreed. I think it would be nice if they would add purple geodes to world bosses' loot tables... Maybe they could even add undaunted experience to them (at least for the first time you kill them).

Latios · September 2018

susmitds wrote: »

ruikkarikun wrote: »

They want you to go cyrodil for month geodas reward in pve setup, so elitist pvp player can have fun with fresh meat in cyro.

Don't get me wrong, but you get 50 crystals for Tier 1 reward (which is 25k AP only) and you get like 2-5 for HM vet dungeons and trials which is JOKE compared to to time you spent etc.

You only get 50 per month. Compare that to 8-20 each day by pledges.

You can't just ignore RotW guaranteed 4 every day, and you can even get more if you PvP a lot. Today I dropped 20 on a single PvP geode.
However, I don't think they should change how crystals are obtained, at least not drastically. Give a guaranteed green on veteran trials and guaranteed blue/purple on HM trials, perhaps? I don't think it would be good to add them to dungeons, though. A good group can breeze really fast through any dungeon, and that would make the farming too easy. It's true a good trial group can do the same, but it's harder to get a 12-man solid group going.

Narvuntien · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

You don't need BiS gear. Transmute crystals should definitely not be increased. Your idea will crash the good traited item market. The grind should not be allowed to skipped. You don't need perfect traits for jewellery either. The traditional three traits work just as fine.

Tl:dr - Get good and earn your BiS gear in perfect traits. It's not that hard. Till then, use inferior traits.

All right. Then nerf crystal rewards in PvP, does that sound more appealing to you? ^^ I'm to-o-o-otally sure a lot of people here will get behind this idea. ^^

But If you are a PVP player that needs PVE gear to complete in PVP and you only have a character that is set up for PVP you will find completing veteran PVE combat extremely difficult.
But if you have a PVE character set up for PVE but with crafted gear you can easily complete that content over and over to farm for gear. Not to mention you are a PVE player you presumably like to play PVE.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

@Narvuntien , I wasn't expressive enough, I guess. ^^ It was sarcasm, I wasn't really suggesting to nerf PvP rewards.

That said, you get APs (and rewards for the worthy) simply for all activities you're doing in PvP. In PvE, there are fewer sources of crystals, and they all take longer time to complete; where you can get 20k AP during practically any activity you do in Cyro (maybe save for questing?), in PvE, you have to run daily pledges (which aren't necessarily dungeons you enjoy), trials (which will be almost automatically longer than earning 20k AP, due to hassle with assembling teams) and solo arenas (which are quite longer too). All that, for smaller rewards (and you can actually stash your rewards for the worthy and open them on next day - while in PvE, if you don't run pledge today, it's a lost opportunity for geode).

Bevik · September 2018

You see that is what is ruining PvP in a lot of aspects. PvE players forced to go PvP zones just to get PvE traits right. That is why sometimes Cyro is a joke when you can clearly see a PvP group killing PvE people there who are trying to get their RotW or farming the PvP skills. I've been there with my 9 toons to farm those skills and geodes. It is just funny.

Also, if I don't have to farm that long doesn't mean I can do what I enjoy the most? What about getting points to kill raid bosses, any kind and then change raid points to geodes?

And as I meantioned I was talking about casuals most, means 1 hour a day or so playtime. You can expect much from that time. Can't even do daily writs on all chars that fast.

GreenhaloX · September 2018

Bevik wrote: »

Thinking about randomly to Chests, World Bosses with a guarantee of 1-3, Daily writs 1 per each means you can get 7 per char / day. Which is not much but for a casual player they are plenty. vMA 5 is decent but not everyone can do vMA in 30 mins, nTrials are quick but can be long if you have to do PUG and wait for people to join. Best way is to do PvP which is also time consuming and not everyone likes/have gear for PvP. Also need different setup for PvE and PvP.

Would be nice.. yes. I would surely hit those WBs more then.

Anrose · September 2018

Please remove the cap. I’m at 200/200 and have 60 geodes all worth 50 each from PvP. Rip my inventory.

Starlock · September 2018

Yes, please!!!

Those of us who focus in questing and RP have no good source for transmute crystals to help our gear match our character concept! It’s all locked behind group content or PvP!

Starlock · September 2018

jcm2606 wrote: »

Yep. Adding more sources of crystals in PVE, as well as raising the cap or removing the cap completely are two things that need to happen.

The whole "you're not meant to get a full set of gear in the right traits in 5 minutes" argument against raising or removing the cap is now invalid, in my opinion. Summerset introduced new jewelry traits which require transmutation to use, so it is no longer a skip-the-grind mechanic, more a gate to access new content, and so the constraints aimed at a skip-the-grind mechanic that we have now should be removed.

It’s funny that when I’ve pointed this out, it gets ignored by the naysayers. Then again, folks also mistakenly assume it’s about ‘bis’ for competitive content when it isn’t necessarily about that at all. There is really no good reason to avoid adding crystals to PvE content, especially with the stupidity of ‘no dropped set will ever drop jewelry in X trait.’

Emma_Overload · September 2018

Sell them for Tel Var like they do Hakeijos.

Starlock · September 2018

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Sell them for Tel Var like they do Hakeijos.

That doesn’t help players who hardly PvP, though (who are also unlikely to own IC at all). It’s already stupid easy to earn crystals from PvP, isn’t it?

Royaji · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Royaji , pledge gives purple tier (1-10), not gold like reward for the worthy, so average gain from two pledges is less than one coffer. Also, can you compare time spent farming 20k AP with running two vet dungeons? I wouldn't.

I believe purple geode is 2-10 so getting 2 purple geodes (+ you can get an extra from last boss) is equal to getting 1 gold. And yes, getting 2 non-DLC pledges done is pretty comparable to 20k AP.

AlnilamE · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Royaji , pledge gives purple tier (1-10), not gold like reward for the worthy, so average gain from two pledges is less than one coffer. Also, can you compare time spent farming 20k AP with running two vet dungeons? I wouldn't.

Depending on the dungeon, I can most certainly run two of them in less time than I can earn 20k AP. It's all a matter of where your experience lies.

I don't feel the need to PvP to get geodes. I'll PvP if I feel like it, but I get enough geodes through PvE activity. But I guess I'm just a patient person.

Zathras · September 2018

Starlock wrote: »

Yes, please!!!

Those of us who focus in questing and RP have no good source for transmute crystals to help our gear match our character concept! It’s all locked behind group content or PvP!

^ This.

..and I agree with the OP. I shouldn't have to change my playstyle just so I can have the "privilege" of changing a trait. Less hoops to jump through, more access.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

@Royaji , the geode from last boss is not a guaranteed drop with rather low chance. Averages from two purples would be 11 vs. 14.5 with slightly different distribution if original distribution is normal, although it's not; point in case, RFTW gives more than two pledges.

I'd argue that earning 20k AP is faster than running two dungeons the size of CoA, with long trash pulls, especially if (like most) you have to wait in finder queue and depend on your team, but it's subjective of course; I was earning AP faster than I was doing dungeons.

Oh, and I didn't even mention that coffer from arenas and trials is a weekly affair, not daily... that's worth mentioning too.

Royaji · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Royaji , the geode from last boss is not a guaranteed drop with rather low chance. Averages from two purples would be 11 vs. 14.5 with slightly different distribution if original distribution is normal, although it's not; point in case, RFTW gives more than two pledges.

I'd argue that earning 20k AP is faster than running two dungeons the size of CoA, with long trash pulls, especially if (like most) you have to wait in finder queue and depend on your team, but it's subjective of course; I was earning AP faster than I was doing dungeons.

Oh, and I didn't even mention that coffer from arenas and trials is a weekly affair, not daily... that's worth mentioning too.

You can't say average when the drop chances are not equal. You will get 4 crystals from a gold 90% of the time and 2 from a purple 90% of the time. So for most cases 1 gold is equal to 2 purple. And from my experience extra geode from last boss is not that rare. I usually get one evrey other day when I'm runnig pledges. Even though this is anecdotal evidence.

And you are not getting 2 CoA runs since Maj's pledge is always an easy under 10 min dungeon. And even the worst offenders like CoA and tempest can be done in 20-25 minutes. This is indeed faster than 20k AP, especially for someone who is not great at PvP and will most likely zerg surf.

John_Falstaff · September 2018

@Royaji , see, 90% is guesswork? In that case, your estimate is just as imprecise, and you can't say that they're equal; we're both making various assumptions. And yes, I fear anecdotal evidence can't replace actual estimate. Also, keep in mind that a DD can easily wait half an hour in queue alone during prime time when pledges are being ran. Take into consideration that you're grouped with pug team that can be doing a quest so you'd do good to wait for them, has low damage output, on occasion a fake tank (even on vet, yes) or struggles with HM in the end. Add up that playing in Cyro is mostly a process free of idling periods, and not capped by three pledges a day.

Royaji · September 2018

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Royaji , see, 90% is guesswork? In that case, your estimate is just as imprecise, and you can't say that they're equal; we're both making various assumptions. And yes, I fear anecdotal evidence can't replace actual estimate. Also, keep in mind that a DD can easily wait half an hour in queue alone during prime time when pledges are being ran. Take into consideration that you're grouped with pug team that can be doing a quest so you'd do good to wait for them, has low damage output, on occasion a fake tank (even on vet, yes) or struggles with HM in the end. Add up that playing in Cyro is mostly a process free of idling periods, and not capped by three pledges a day.

90% is pretty damn accurate. No matter how you spin it, majority of times people get 4 crystals of gold geode and not 25.

And if you are pugging pledges... welll, there is your problem.