Zos... Dont you think this grind is a little ridiculous?

eso_lags · September 2018

OrphanHelgen wrote: »

I played battlegrounds for a few days and got all the motifs. I didn't even have meta build, just some crappy build I put together.
All I did was having fun and got motifs eventually.
But if you wanna rage about rng, lets talk about the fishing recipes in summerset.

I mean im not really raging. I think a lot of people misunderstand criticism for salt on the forums and in threads like this. And i dont understand why. People get very defensive, not you specifically, when people criticize zos. Like "if you got them too fast you would be complaining about something to do" Or "you should play another game".. Stupid useless statements that have no value.

But ya i would say the fishing recipes are rage worthy. Oh and you deff didnt get all the pages in 3 days. At least not the horned dragon and fanged lair ones that im talking about. The other ones, ya for sure.

eso_lags · September 2018

JitchDaddy wrote: »

xb1LL_mr_sir_LL wrote: »

if you got the pages as fast as you wanted you'd be on here whining about how there's nothing to do.

Highly unlikely. There is always something to grind. The best part about ESO is that you can grind for years and still have something to do.

Exactly. And on top of that i am primarily a pvp player. I play one class usually but have played them all. And i play every stamina class frequently. Most of my time is spent in cyrodil (or was until it became too laggy, now its spent in bgs)..

However my crafter is 9 trait everything. Nearly every motif in the game. Probably pushing 900 furnishing recipes known.

I have multiple pve chars. Flawless conq etc.. I have a cp 160 char on pc na with the stormproof title.

I know how about the game that i am playing. I know about the different grinds in this game and how to get what im looking for. And I also know about RNG in this game. Running malestrom for a year looking for a 2hand was a nightmare. I get it, zos likes rng. But I just think sometimes its a bit over the top and sometimes its needed. And you are right, there is always something to do in this game. So the other guy really has no idea what hes talking about, sadly.

Dymence · September 2018

Pages being limited to once a day makes it per definition not a grind. A grind is something you can continuously work towards, albeit taking a significant amount of time to do so. Like jewelrycrafting, to name something.

Urvoth · September 2018

Valrien wrote: »

Urvoth wrote: »

What I hate is that playing BGs actually loses you money. With the amount of potions you use and how bad the rewards of the worthy and victory rewards are, you pretty much come out at a massive loss by playing BGs regularly.

Then don't use expensive potions.

I should be using Health + Magicka + Unstoppable on my Mag Sorc but I do okay with standard Magicka potions...not great, but okay.

And if I can manage on a Mag Sorc (worst sustain) then anyone should be able to manage on anything

I only play on a magsorc, but I use tri pots since stam recovery is pretty much mandatory with all the DKs spamming fossalize atm. Tri pots are affordable for me to make, but it's just annoying that grinding something fun actually puts you at a massive gold loss if you want to be competitive.

Btw I used to use those immovable pots but tested out the tri stat ones and they are just so much better. I'd definitely recommend testing them out for a few games.

max_only · September 2018

I’m making a comment in this thread to keep count of how many people come in, don’t read which style pages he’s talking about, and say something like “I got it in 3 days”.

Androconium · September 2018

I can't even be bothered with this one.

MaxJrFTW · September 2018

I'm missing the Stormlord helmet, and it has been 100+ bgs since my last piece which was the Stormlord shoulders. Those also took a very long time, but not like this.

jypcy · September 2018

Probably beating a dead horse by now but I try to jump in every time these get brought up

Let’s lay out some of the differences in drawbacks between how you earn some of these “end game” cosmetics. For example, all of them are easier to get when playing with a permafrost group of players, so I won’t overinflate the lists by mentioning it. As I see it, they are:

PvE skins:
-Skill based
-Duplicates are worthless (achievement-based)

PvP proofs:
-Skill based
-Time-restricted
-Cost currency to combine

PvP costume (Emp regalia):
-Skill based
-Duplicates are worthless (achievement-based)

BGs team styles (Firedrake etc.):
-RNG based
-Duplicates are worthless (21 unique pieces)

BGs daily styles (Fanged Worm etc.):
-Skill based
-RNG based
-Duplicates are worthless (64 unique pieces)
-Time-restricted

This doesn’t fully capture the experience for acquiring each, and I’m happy to add more reasonable items to any list if others bring them up. But as I see it, the bgs daily styles both combine the most frustration points to earn a piece and have the most pieces to earn. I’ve suggested it before, but I’d certainly appreciate a different system to earning these, such as a BGs achievement based one similar to the BGs furnishings: you earn x achievement and that character can then purchase a, b, and c outfit styles, probably for AP. Some of the grander achievements such as Pit Hero and Grand Champion still require an awful lot of game time, so ZOS can still expect tons of replayability out of BGs for people trying to complete these without having to make the method for earning them so frustratingly restrictive for even skilled players who play BGs regularly. Even if they made it so you couldn’t buy multiples of the same style and they’re BoP, it’d still reduce the drawbacks to:
-Skill based
-Duplicates are worthless
-Cost currency to acquire
...which, even with three drawbacks, I think would be a breath of fresh air over the current system.
Medal earnings could be another system (e.g., after a character has earned 100 Steady Centurion BGs medals, the Horned Dragon shields style is unlocked).

@ZOS_RobGarrett (hoping you’re the right person to tag!)

Tandor · September 2018

xb1LL_mr_sir_LL wrote: »

if you got the pages as fast as you wanted you'd be on here whining about how there's nothing to do.
in case you forgot you're playing a mmo everything Is a grind its kinda the whole point of the game.

Spot on.

Arkangeloski · September 2018

CyberSkooma wrote: »

I got like 6 style pages today so i don't know what you're talking about.

The op is not talking about the pit deamons, stormlords styles etc, he is talking about the one we get from the purple container that you get once a day... Wich is the same concept one single piece heavy medium or light for the designated body piece motif u get on the mail. Pretty lame if u ask me.

Hateanthem · September 2018

What happened to the good ol' days where people simply understood that they might not ever get what they want?

"Oh you want that [insert some kind of epic reward here]? That's nice because after trying for six months it is no longer attainable... and you like it that way. Now give me your $15 and kick rocks."

Dashmatt · September 2018

The real problem is that if you get a duplicate, you get nothing. This is a bad system. If you want to split styles into weight and make it take a long time to get them all, that’s one thing, but you can’t keep duplicates in the drop pool when there is such a crazy number of them. Then on top of that, you only get one chance per day per character. The new team-based styles are a bit better since they can at least drop from any match.

With normal crafting motifs, at least you can farm them and sell the duplicates. Maybe the idea is to try to encourage people to do battlegrounds to earn something that can’t be bought? Not the worst idea, but when you can go 10 daily randoms without getting an outfit style, people will just give up.

eso_lags · September 2018

Dashmatt wrote: »

The real problem is that if you get a duplicate, you get nothing. This is a bad system. If you want to split styles into weight and make it take a long time to get them all, that’s one thing, but you can’t keep duplicates in the drop pool when there is such a crazy number of them. Then on top of that, you only get one chance per day per character. The new team-based styles are a bit better since they can at least drop from any match.

With normal crafting motifs, at least you can farm them and sell the duplicates. Maybe the idea is to try to encourage people to do battlegrounds to earn something that can’t be bought? Not the worst idea, but when you can go 10 daily randoms without getting an outfit style, people will just give up.

Exactly. The whole thing is a bit to much. I just think they should remove the RNG from it. Maybe something like guaranteed page for the 1st place and a chance for the 2nd place (since only those 1st and 2nd get the box anyway)..

I havent gotten a double yet, though. Hopefully i dont.

oxygen_thief · September 2018

as for me the best solution is to make bgs reward boxes salable again like they were at the beginning. it would allow players who loathe pvp to get items they want, pvpers would earn some additional gold. everyone would be happy

keevil111 · September 2018

BGs are supposed to be fun. Collecting motifs and stuff is supposed to be fun. If acquiring the stupid pages is annoying, then frickin stop already!

RNG is RNG. Sometimes it seems that the devs have a secret way of knowing what you want and can keep you from getting it. Maybe they can LOL. Maybe not.

Point is, if it is not fun, don't do it. If you feel like you have to, then it seems like work. Work sucks. Anyone who feels this way just needs to pop MarioKart SNES in and have some fun!

Sandman929 · September 2018

itzTJ wrote: »

Maybe just a little??

I havent been a bit fan of bgs up until the last month or so. And i dont really like bgs, tbh.. I only play it because cyrodil is unplayable on xbox... I have cp and i want to use it. Its actually pretty gross that they wouldn't even give us 1 bg mode with CP, but thats another rant.

Sorry for just focusing on the one point that you were avoiding, but for me this is the problem with no CP BGs and a problem with ZOS in general. What kind of game has an endgame progression system that has to be excluded? One that perhaps needs to be looked at and redone?
Sure, there's probably not enough players to have both CP and no CP options, but there's clearly something about CP that even the developers don't want in BGs or they'd be in there. So, for ZOS, is there some reason that BGs are no CP? I'd love to hear some developer feedback on what's wrong with their progression system that warrants it's exclusion, and are there any plans to resolve that issue?

eso_lags · September 2018

Sandman929 wrote: »

itzTJ wrote: »

Maybe just a little??

I havent been a bit fan of bgs up until the last month or so. And i dont really like bgs, tbh.. I only play it because cyrodil is unplayable on xbox... I have cp and i want to use it. Its actually pretty gross that they wouldn't even give us 1 bg mode with CP, but thats another rant.

Sorry for just focusing on the one point that you were avoiding, but for me this is the problem with no CP BGs and a problem with ZOS in general. What kind of game has an endgame progression system that has to be excluded? One that perhaps needs to be looked at and redone?
Sure, there's probably not enough players to have both CP and no CP options, but there's clearly something about CP that even the developers don't want in BGs or they'd be in there. So, for ZOS, is there some reason that BGs are no CP? I'd love to hear some developer feedback on what's wrong with their progression system that warrants it's exclusion, and are there any plans to resolve that issue?

Probably because CP leads to poor performance. Thats my guess. Combined with other things that cause cyrodil to be a disaster so they just avoid it in BGs.

Bigevilpeter · September 2018

RNG is similar to gambling, but instead of gambling with your money you gamble with your time. It has and addictive psychological effect that MMOs rely on for keeping people playing

eso_lags · September 2018

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

RNG is similar to gambling, but instead of gambling with your money you gamble with your time. It has and addictive psychological effect that MMOs rely on for keeping people playing

For sure. Honestly i like rng in mmos. But i like it in the right places and not overkill.

[Deleted User] · September 2018

Hello everyone,

Recently we've had to remove a few posts for some unneeded flaming and baiting, both being against the Forum Rules. For further posts please be sure to keep these rules in mind to prevent action on one's own account.

Thank you for understanding.

Katahdin · September 2018

My theory

Lots of people wanted BG
So they spent time developing them
They kinda failed and werent popular.
This looks bad to the suits and stock holders

These style pages motivate collector to go in there and play BG

The longer it takes for you to collect the pages, the more you'll play.

Suddenly BG are popular and a success which make the suits and investors happy

eso_lags · September 2018

Katahdin wrote: »

My theory

Lots of people wanted BG
So they spent time developing them
They kinda failed and werent popular.
This looks bad to the suits and stock holders

These style pages motivate collector to go in there and play BG

The longer it takes for you to collect the pages, the more you'll play.

Suddenly BG are popular and a success which make the suits and investors happy

true but i think the "one day at a time" boxes came before the end of match reward styles (pit daemon stormlord firedrake).. So idk why they would make it easier to get styles.. But those are only body pieces so idk. Either way thats not a bad guess because i find bgs slightly less repulsing now that im getting styles for it.