Moonhunter Keep Feedback
Sange13
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I'd really like this to be a place where ZOS can get some useful information from us about how the experience is in there. I realize many of us will likely have differing opinions about it, but that's the main point here. Let's keep the opinion bashing to a minimum to focus on just relating our own experiences and maybe offer some suggestions.
With that out of the way, here's what I want to say about it.
Thematically it's quite nice, plenty of lootables, no major excess of trash mobs. The design even lets you encounter one of the dangerous giant werewolves before you see them in boss encounters, which is really good for the learning curve for those that pay attention. A couple of the boss fights are quite fun too. However, I have a few gripes about the difficulty and sets.
For starters, the giant white werewolf in the courtyard needs to be tuned back just a tad. On NORMAL my 30k+ resistances and 55k hp DK tank takes 50% hp damage while blocking his power attack and about 90% when not. That is just excessive for a Normal run of any dungeon. His pounce attack where he channels a one-shot skill could use another second or so on the channel time. This is partly because of position and telegraphing issues, and partly due to the lag most of us have to deal with anyway. I'm not saying it the mechanic shouldn't be there, only that it needs a slightly longer window to deal with.
The last boss with the two pet wolves and the random spawn werewolves has a bit too much CC going out all the time. This wouldn't be so bad, except that you don't seem to get the same CC immunity window that you do in PvP when you use Break-Free. Getting CC'd is something most players don't appreciate much to begin with, but I understand it has its place in the game. This just seems a bit excessive. I would suggest either reducing the number of CC effects in the encounter, lowering their duration, or dramatically increasing the cooldowns on them. The CC perma-lock is an absolutely horrible experience.
The medium set in this dungeon is amazing, but the other two are somewhere between "meh" and "why bother?" Given the high difficulty and low quality of the non-medium gear here, I don't foresee spending the time to farm that set since other options are easier to attain for similar results. In fact, the mechanics and damage output in this run require enough focus and skill from the group that I have no faith in randoms to be able to complete it in a timely manner. I'll be leaving this place immediately upon entering if it's the one that pops in random queue. I suspect I'm not alone in this since I've heard many players in game express a general disinterest in, or refusal to run, this dungeon. Even on Normal, it's harder than most of the Vet dungeons, so the balance seems extremely off kilter. I don't think anyone expects it to be like Fungal I or anything, but this doesn't seem okay to me.
With that out of the way, here's what I want to say about it.
Thematically it's quite nice, plenty of lootables, no major excess of trash mobs. The design even lets you encounter one of the dangerous giant werewolves before you see them in boss encounters, which is really good for the learning curve for those that pay attention. A couple of the boss fights are quite fun too. However, I have a few gripes about the difficulty and sets.
For starters, the giant white werewolf in the courtyard needs to be tuned back just a tad. On NORMAL my 30k+ resistances and 55k hp DK tank takes 50% hp damage while blocking his power attack and about 90% when not. That is just excessive for a Normal run of any dungeon. His pounce attack where he channels a one-shot skill could use another second or so on the channel time. This is partly because of position and telegraphing issues, and partly due to the lag most of us have to deal with anyway. I'm not saying it the mechanic shouldn't be there, only that it needs a slightly longer window to deal with.
The last boss with the two pet wolves and the random spawn werewolves has a bit too much CC going out all the time. This wouldn't be so bad, except that you don't seem to get the same CC immunity window that you do in PvP when you use Break-Free. Getting CC'd is something most players don't appreciate much to begin with, but I understand it has its place in the game. This just seems a bit excessive. I would suggest either reducing the number of CC effects in the encounter, lowering their duration, or dramatically increasing the cooldowns on them. The CC perma-lock is an absolutely horrible experience.
The medium set in this dungeon is amazing, but the other two are somewhere between "meh" and "why bother?" Given the high difficulty and low quality of the non-medium gear here, I don't foresee spending the time to farm that set since other options are easier to attain for similar results. In fact, the mechanics and damage output in this run require enough focus and skill from the group that I have no faith in randoms to be able to complete it in a timely manner. I'll be leaving this place immediately upon entering if it's the one that pops in random queue. I suspect I'm not alone in this since I've heard many players in game express a general disinterest in, or refusal to run, this dungeon. Even on Normal, it's harder than most of the Vet dungeons, so the balance seems extremely off kilter. I don't think anyone expects it to be like Fungal I or anything, but this doesn't seem okay to me.
IGN: Sange-13
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mocap✭✭✭✭✭
✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/424205/pts-update-19-feedback-thread-for-moon-hunter-keep
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/425002/moon-hunter-keep-walkthrough-and-guide-spoilers
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/430948/rate-the-new-ww-dungeons-lets-start-with-moon-hunters-keep1 -
Sange13✭✭✭We're not in PTS anymore.
It has nothing to do with knowing the fights, as should be obvious if you actually read it.
Rating the dungeon isn't the same as conveying your experience/opinions.IGN: Sange-132 -
Elsterchen✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yeah, that werewolf is a killer... but that darn mage is even worse...
I actually like the overall difficulty of the new dungeons (both of them). Even on normal both dungeons are not only a DPS race - and I like that very much, too!
While I first concentrated mainly on march of sacrifies, I did run moon hunter 3-4 times on normal and had a few uncompleted runs. I may add: I usually PUG. Yesterday I acepted a invite from a friend and ended in the vetVersion of moon hunter ... my excuse: it was late, I was just fishing and enjoying a beer and I didn't ask beforehand. I wasn't up to the task of completing moon hunter on vet... and I realized this very clearly, but I did get some insight on how the normal version is preparing one for the difficulties of the vet version. In this aspect I think the difficulty of the normal version is very nicely choosen. The main mechanics play out, even on normal. That werewolf needs to be interrupted ... and that darn mage(s) need to be burned quickly... or your team gets rect.
Maybe its because I choose to run normals only (give or take that few times i end up lured into vets anyways), I rather like the increased difficulty in play as for me its a rather fitting level of difficulty. Helping me to improve while playing the game, rather then performing rota-training alone at my house. Till now I ran dungeons for loot, but if eso keeps up introducing dungeons like the new ones (that provide a challenge even on normal) - I might get more involved in the future. Well, and as far as i understood the goals for the upcoming udates/DLCs/patches, eso wants to provide content that requires each role to be filled. I think the new dungeons reflect this goal nicely. And on normal difficulty there is still room for mistakes or non-standard group composition.
Specifically on the werewolf boss, one thing I noticed to really help alot while fighting the boss in the vet version, was our healer setting psjik-bubbles whenever adds summed up. It doesn't stop the boss, but the adds are stunned and kept in place for a little while. Thats the time to burn them down, before getting back to interupting and targeting the boss.
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Sange13✭✭✭Yeah, I didn't mention the mages because I felt they were okay in their role of the fight.IGN: Sange-130
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mocap✭✭✭✭✭
✭and yet two big paragraphs of your post addressed to combat, while guide thread has ton of it. Rating thread state pretty much all specific aspects about this dungeon, not only your "abstract experience".0 -
Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭The posion set is actually pretty good for pvp. I ran this 6-7 times on Saturday with a guy who wanted the medium and light set. Helped him get a lot of pieces for both.
When we fight the Hulking adds we would just kite it around when it started to do its heavy slam attack.
Overall Moon Hunter Keep is pretty fun on normal.1 -
xRIVALENx✭✭✭Just wanted to add some input in regards to the crowd control on the last boss from a tanking perspective. With the exception of the totem randomly dropping on you during the fight, all other crowd control can be mitigated.
AoE Fear (Step out of the circle)
Roar (Block)
Boss Pounces (Roll Dodge or Block, preferably roll dodge to mitigate damage)
Roar (Block)
Stamina resources will only become an issue if you are not using the window before the pounce to get a couple heavy attacks in.
The boss I would be more concerned with is the Lurcher, this boss actually animation cancels his one shot heavy attack every so often which makes it necessary to keep block up far more often than necessary.3 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭dear @Sange13,
I took the time to carefully read your entire post and realize that you are not yet sufficiently familiar with the mechanics of this dungeon. This leads you to wrong conclusions such as e.g that this damage you're taking is intended. It is not. Once you complete normal while doing all tactics correctly you will not see that kind of damage. By the time you finished HM you will read your own post again with a smile on your face
I don't know if you noticed but with Dragonbone/Wolfhunter the devs have clearly started promoting dodgeroll to become something useful again instead of something "useless for heavy armor tanks and only interesting for medium armor dps". Some hits are not only huge but also leave huge dots that only good healers can counter. Consider a dodgeroll once in a while...
Consider the possibility that maybe some attacks hit harder the more health you have, like health % based. This ensures that a 35k health tank can handle them fine but a 55K health tank still feels them as significant and intended damage that must be avoided, not just stand there being bored saying "I have 55K health, it just tickles..." Maybe swap out 10K of your health for more stamina or sustain...fyi I ususally tank veteran with 40-45K health and I could easily do it with 38K if I really had to.
Mylene's pounce attack is only about 3seconds before she kills her primary target and sure intended. While I agree that for the majority of (especially for low skilled) players adding another second wouldn't exactly hurt the point is to promote the use of ranged interrupts just like in the Menagerie fight in Fang lair where the senche jumps a player. Your dps/healers refuse to use ranged interrupt skills like Crushing shock/ Venom arrow ? You as tank refuse to use shield charge ? fine, be prepared to die and wipe alot then. But rest assured, finally a dungeon with proper mechanics where not everything can be outdpssed/outhealed/outtanked so you better start learning mechanics. This will teach all those players that keep coming on these forums saying dungeons are too boring and tanks don't have an active job to do but stand there doing nothing...
Vykosa's mechanics and adds are triggered based on boss health %. Dps just doing a bit too much dps on the boss is enough to unleash a cc hell on yourself where fear totems, aoe, adds and pet dogs suddenly all happen at the same time. In addition position is key. If you're going to try and tank everything at the boss location in vet which for sure triggers too much dps on the boss you better be beyond amazing or your group will wipe to no end.
So you see, the mechanics are not overtuned at all in here. They are simply present and enforced for the first time (finally!) and 90% of the players going into this dungeon based on their usual lack of knowledge on mechanics fail to realize that. It's part of the growing pains of the player community. And for once the normal version (which is *** easy by the way) at least prepares players properly for the mechanics of the dungeon in vet for once instead of allowing outdps/outheal/outtank.
Finally and in case you wonder, let me state very clearly that I typed all this only with the goal of helping and enlightening you and the entire community. More even, for that exact reason I've already done 25runs in there since pts and guided over 10 random group finder pugs through the veteran version already while tanking or healing. Feel free to contact me in-game if you are on PC eu for a free ride (@profundido). I'll gladly take you on a guided tour through veteran where I can show you all mechanics first hand. Until then I highly recommend you read all the existing guides and info that someone linked so nicely
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idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭For starters, the giant white werewolf in the courtyard needs to be tuned back just a tad. On NORMAL my 30k+ resistances and 55k hp DK tank takes 50% hp damage while blocking his power attack and about 90% when not.
I cannot say I recall how much health I have lost but I have seen the fight on normal and vet and have not had an issue tanking it. If you are losing that much health dodge roll it. I expect you already have points into CP cost reduction for that and if not put some.The last boss with the two pet wolves and the random spawn werewolves has a bit too much CC going out all the time. .
Again, have not noticed this issue on normal nor has anyone said anything. The fight on normal is pretty easy. Tank should taunt one of the chained wolves at the start and when they come back into play. On normal I just taunt the other wolves also. On vet the other wolves that spawn can be kited and snared.
As for the gear, meh. With how many sets Zos adds every DLC I do not think many really care much about the sets that are not that great. So much to choose from as it is.
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Sange13✭✭✭I realize that you are trying to be helpful and appreciate that, but you have also made several unfounded and false assumptions about how I play or what my complaints actually stem from. You've made a few correct ones too, before anyone thinks I'm just being defensive.
As for trying to prevent people from "out-roling" the fights, that's certainly an unappreciated approach, because it undermines two major drivers for player motivation: (1) to make the most exceptional builds they can, which this punishes for doing by setting these kinds of soft "caps" on their effectiveness, (2) and--through trying to force certain player behaviors (like roll-dodging)--narrowing build variety/viability. The creative freedom afforded to builds and playstyle in this game is one of the reasons people love it so much.
Every year or so ZOS wants to go "a new direction" with their design, and sometimes it's okay, but other times it causes massive schisms in the community. The huge resources nerf right before Morrowind was such an event, and I saw many guilds lose large portions of their players as a result. I don't think that'll happen with this if it's just a few dungeons for awhile, but I do think that will happen eventually as they release more this way--especially if they try to retroactively apply it to existing ones.
The tl;dr of what I want to say about it is simply that Normals being harder than most Vets is not a good thing, and neither is arbitrarily trying to make players play/build a certain way. Therefore, I doubt you'll convert too many people into an appreciation of this dungeon over simple avoidance when it's so much more hassle than what you get out of it.
I would take you up on your offer, though, but I can't since I'm PC/NA.IGN: Sange-131 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I didn’t find either of the new dungeons on normal harder than any of the original vet dungeons on vet. Ofc the vet versions of the old normal dungeon are a snooze and don’t really count.
If what has been said in reply to your OP isn’t fitting with what you expected it’s due to the approach in the OP.
Regardless, it’s good to have a little resistance in the normal versions.0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd0 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.0 -
reprosal✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
Actually Buddy and I both slotted timestop as DPS and just killed them without the tank being involved in the adds. Tank only taunted the boss and Zel while we killed Ary.
Worked very well3 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
Actually Buddy and I both slotted timestop as DPS and just killed them without the tank being involved in the adds. Tank only taunted the boss and Zel while we killed Ary.
Worked very well
That sir is the mark of truly awesome dps. By doing so you just proactively took some extra load off the shoulders of the tank who's busy trying to survive while getting the enraged boss to the shockwardens to de-enrage him. You have my 'awesome' vote 0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
One of us is confused and I'll confess that it could be me. To me, the werewolves are the adds that spawn on top of the walls and hop down during the fight. Zel and Ary I just call dogs or wolves. This fight only gets real hairy (Haha see what I did there) at 20 or 30 percent, don't remember which percent exactly but somewhere around there. You get a ton of crap thrown at you at once but just stick to the kill order and while chaotic it's not horribly bad.
The first night we attempted MOS (off topic I know) we tried for an hour before we had to call it a night. I thought the fight was going to be impossible tbh and I didn't even feel lime trying again but we got hm the next night after about another hour maybe I wanna say.
Both are still way more fun than the last 2 dlc ones that were released. MOS is probably the best visually stunning dungeon imo In any game I've ever played. Mad props to the team on this one. So bad ass with Hircine towering over everything.They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd0 -
reprosal✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
One of us is confused and I'll confess that it could be me. To me, the werewolves are the adds that spawn on top of the walls and hop down during the fight. Zel and Ary I just call dogs or wolves. This fight only gets real hairy (Haha see what I did there) at 20 or 30 percent, don't remember which percent exactly but somewhere around there. You get a ton of crap thrown at you at once but just stick to the kill order and while chaotic it's not horribly bad.
The first night we attempted MOS (off topic I know) we tried for an hour before we had to call it a night. I thought the fight was going to be impossible tbh and I didn't even feel lime trying again but we got hm the next night after about another hour maybe I wanna say.
Both are still way more fun than the last 2 dlc ones that were released. MOS is probably the best visually stunning dungeon imo In any game I've ever played. Mad props to the team on this one. So bad ass with Hircine towering over everything.
No. @BuddyAces . They added Hircine in a hotfix....0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
One of us is confused and I'll confess that it could be me. To me, the werewolves are the adds that spawn on top of the walls and hop down during the fight. Zel and Ary I just call dogs or wolves. This fight only gets real hairy (Haha see what I did there) at 20 or 30 percent, don't remember which percent exactly but somewhere around there. You get a ton of crap thrown at you at once but just stick to the kill order and while chaotic it's not horribly bad.
The first night we attempted MOS (off topic I know) we tried for an hour before we had to call it a night. I thought the fight was going to be impossible tbh and I didn't even feel lime trying again but we got hm the next night after about another hour maybe I wanna say.
Both are still way more fun than the last 2 dlc ones that were released. MOS is probably the best visually stunning dungeon imo In any game I've ever played. Mad props to the team on this one. So bad ass with Hircine towering over everything.
No. @BuddyAces . They added Hircine in a hotfix....
^^^ he totally didn't see Hircine the entire time we were in there until it was pointed out =pThey nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd0 -
Sange13✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
Actually Buddy and I both slotted timestop as DPS and just killed them without the tank being involved in the adds. Tank only taunted the boss and Zel while we killed Ary.
Worked very well
And this is why my comments were geared more toward random queue (PUG) than pre-arranged groups. This kind of stuff is simply too much to expect from randoms. I just think MHK is a little too far above the average difficulty curve of Normal dungeons that maybe it would be enough to not see it in random queue. Barring that, I'd really like to just have the option to veto 2-3 of the dungeons for the queue, leaving the other... what, 20 or so? There are some places that are just not worthing trying to PUG. This is one of them.IGN: Sange-130 -
Silver_Strider✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I actually find WH to be the absolute best Dungeon DLC since it actually makes you learn mechanics, while still being fairly forgiving. I honestly want ZOS to go back and update all dungeons to be similar since I personally believe that dungeons shouldn't be as hand holding as they are on normal, it just stiffens the player base by not actually teaching them anything about mechanics and that's something I feel WH dungeons gets right, for the most part (Spriggan boss in MoS could be better explained because, while not hard to understand it does get frustrating that people do not understand that the synergy is made to save them and they just ignore it and take the hit instead)
Having said that, the courtyard WW boss could have an extra second or 2 added to their OHKO attack since, unless you have a ranged interrupt or a Gap closer on, you can potentially be in a terrible position to interrupt the boss and while I'm not particularly against the idea of range interrupts seeing some more common play in PvE content, I don't think that it should be made mandatory either.Argonian forever1 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
One of us is confused and I'll confess that it could be me. To me, the werewolves are the adds that spawn on top of the walls and hop down during the fight. Zel and Ary I just call dogs or wolves. This fight only gets real hairy (Haha see what I did there) at 20 or 30 percent, don't remember which percent exactly but somewhere around there. You get a ton of crap thrown at you at once but just stick to the kill order and while chaotic it's not horribly bad.
The first night we attempted MOS (off topic I know) we tried for an hour before we had to call it a night. I thought the fight was going to be impossible tbh and I didn't even feel lime trying again but we got hm the next night after about another hour maybe I wanna say.
Both are still way more fun than the last 2 dlc ones that were released. MOS is probably the best visually stunning dungeon imo In any game I've ever played. Mad props to the team on this one. So bad ass with Hircine towering over everything.
ah I see the confusion clearly now. After the talk about dps killing shockwardens and and adds not being tauntable I had the Mylene fight in mind (big white enraged werewolf in the courtyard) since this is the only place in the dungeon where adds are not tauntable. Now I realize your reply was about last boss Vykosa HM where the same mechanic reappears but adds are tauntable werewolves. Sorry I totally missed that. Besides the adds being different mobs there is 1 important difference in mechanics:
Mylene: The adds that spawn are wolves and they can be cc'd but not taunted. As tank you're powerless to handle the wolf adds unless people bring them to the shockwarden 'meeting point' (where the tank will be bringing the boss as well)
Vykosa HM: the adds that spawn are werewolves and they can be taunted as well as cc'd. As tank I'm used to handling all the adds here myself with a combination of cc (talons) and taunts as well as dodging the fear totem and aoe. After I did HM again only last night I now realize that this is in fact really hard to pull off for a tank and dps offloading that part with timestop is a brilliant solution and would make it alot more controlled and easier. Most likely the best solution to handle this part of the fight !0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »profundidob16_ESO wrote: »MHK is probably the easiest dlc hm there is imo. The only thing where high dps really shines is when the warden shock guys spawn. Burn them asap. The werewolves that spawn can be cc'd by every skill that can cc. Time stop, negate, caltrops, rearming trap, and anything else I forgot about. Place is just a giant mechanic check.
you meant the wolves, not werewolves but yes you're absolutely right: all cc works, just not taunt so smart dps and healers will take the adds to the tank so he can talon/timestop them.
One of us is confused and I'll confess that it could be me. To me, the werewolves are the adds that spawn on top of the walls and hop down during the fight. Zel and Ary I just call dogs or wolves. This fight only gets real hairy (Haha see what I did there) at 20 or 30 percent, don't remember which percent exactly but somewhere around there. You get a ton of crap thrown at you at once but just stick to the kill order and while chaotic it's not horribly bad.
The first night we attempted MOS (off topic I know) we tried for an hour before we had to call it a night. I thought the fight was going to be impossible tbh and I didn't even feel lime trying again but we got hm the next night after about another hour maybe I wanna say.
Both are still way more fun than the last 2 dlc ones that were released. MOS is probably the best visually stunning dungeon imo In any game I've ever played. Mad props to the team on this one. So bad ass with Hircine towering over everything.
ah I see the confusion clearly now. After the talk about dps killing shockwardens and and adds not being tauntable I had the Mylene fight in mind (big white enraged werewolf in the courtyard) since this is the only place in the dungeon where adds are not tauntable. Now I realize your reply was about last boss Vykosa HM where the same mechanic reappears but adds are tauntable werewolves. Sorry I totally missed that. Besides the adds being different mobs there is 1 important difference in mechanics:
Mylene: The adds that spawn are wolves and they can be cc'd but not taunted. As tank you're powerless to handle the wolf adds unless people bring them to the shockwarden 'meeting point' (where the tank will be bringing the boss as well)
Vykosa HM: the adds that spawn are werewolves and they can be taunted as well as cc'd. As tank I'm used to handling all the adds here myself with a combination of cc (talons) and taunts as well as dodging the fear totem and aoe. After I did HM again only last night I now realize that this is in fact really hard to pull off for a tank and dps offloading that part with timestop is a brilliant solution and would make it alot more controlled and easier. Most likely the best solution to handle this part of the fight !
Hahaha that courtyard fight...
Never died to those wandering dogs that you're talking about until we did our no death. Lil suckers have a 1 shot apparently =/They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd0 -
munster1404✭✭✭✭I don't see any problems slotting meta skills to accomplish certain content. But Tanks having to perform dodge roll of any kind sounds just wrong, imo. Defeats the image of slow, hulking heavily armored giants that represents Tanks in general.Edited by munster1404 on September 5, 2018 12:49PM3
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Sange13✭✭✭That's not the issue I see with it, Munster. It's that magicka-based tanks aren't likely to have the stam to keep up dodge-rolling all the time, especially if they have to use their stam for anything else.IGN: Sange-130
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Krayl✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »Your dps/healers refuse to use ranged interrupt skills like Crushing shock/ Venom arrow ? You as tank refuse to use shield charge ? fine, be prepared to die and wipe alot then.
I agree with most of your post, but I have a problem with this. Unless and until there is a "dual spec" type system or the ability to change morphs on the fly added to the game, basing a mechanic on needing an interrupt that someone may not have spec'd is unsatisfactory as a solution, specifically for a 'normal' dungeon.
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BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »Your dps/healers refuse to use ranged interrupt skills like Crushing shock/ Venom arrow ? You as tank refuse to use shield charge ? fine, be prepared to die and wipe alot then.
I agree with most of your post, but I have a problem with this. Unless and until there is a "dual spec" type system or the ability to change morphs on the fly added to the game, basing a mechanic on needing an interrupt that someone may not have spec'd is unsatisfactory as a solution, specifically for a 'normal' dungeon.
Lil secret I'ma let you in on, every character in the game can bash interrupt.They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd1 -
Starlock✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Even on Normal, it's harder than most of the Vet dungeons, so the balance seems extremely off kilter. I don't think anyone expects it to be like Fungal I or anything, but this doesn't seem okay to me.
I’ve only run this once, but this was my impression as well. I came in as a replacement tank. Fortunately it was my *dedicated* tank so he could handle it, but the stuff I had to do was on par with a vet dungeon. Granted, none of us really knew the mechanics and that contributed to wiping several times, but by the end of it I was just like ‘wut?’ Gods, if the devs keep doing this they absolutely need an opt out of DLC dungeons for random normals. If I did dungeons more regularly, I would probably unsub to get them out of my roster entirely. Not because they are bad or I hate them, but because I queue with randoms and it sucks more often than not doing that.3 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭@Starlock that's 1 thing I agree with and I've been advocating exactly that since a long time: that these dungeons which are clearly of a whole different difficulty Tier should be split off in their own section called "Veteran DLC group finder" (with a matching reward attached for those willing to learn and suffer through) so that people like me who are bored with non-dlc vet can queue for random vet DLC dungeons exclusively and other players have the option to queue worry free for non-DLC vet dungeons. This way all of the player base can be pleased whereas the option to opt out of DLC would please only the latter part of the community
There's more than enough DLC dungeons already for ZOS to give them their own section where they belong.1 -
profundidob16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭profundidob16_ESO wrote: »Your dps/healers refuse to use ranged interrupt skills like Crushing shock/ Venom arrow ? You as tank refuse to use shield charge ? fine, be prepared to die and wipe alot then.
I agree with most of your post, but I have a problem with this. Unless and until there is a "dual spec" type system or the ability to change morphs on the fly added to the game, basing a mechanic on needing an interrupt that someone may not have spec'd is unsatisfactory as a solution, specifically for a 'normal' dungeon.
Lil secret I'ma let you in on, every character in the game can bash interrupt.
it's true it's possible actually without ranged interrupt but I'll admit it's really hard due to some rng. The trick is form a square with 4m distance between every player and try to maintain it the whole fight. After dodging aoe or doing mechanics keep coming back to this formation. It ensures you're far enough from eachother so that never 2 people get put down on the floor at once and yet close enough to sprint and bash when needed. But again it's challenging due to rng and not exactly an option for RGF pugs.0 -
SquareSausage✭✭✭✭✭Completed the 2 new on Vet with premade.
Then decided to PUG both for a laugh on normal.
No. Just all manners of no. You be heard it all before so won't go into it. But, no.
Will deffo be leaving dungeon queue if ever happen that's the random I get lol.Breakfast KingPS4 EU2