exeeter702 wrote: »

Please read, i know its a bit lengthy....

Classes exist in modern MMOs, ESO included, to offer a variety of different thematic and mechanical play styles to approach the various different challenges among the 3 core roles that encompass group play.

You are misusing the term identity in this regard. Every class has their own distinct identity, only its thematic and in how it plays, not in what exclusive tools it has access to that others do not.

Classes are being made to function uniquely from one another (with varying levels of success mind you) so that your gameplay approach to tanking a trial with a NB with be vastly different from doing so with a DK or Templar. etc. It is entirely HOW you approach the role that creates the variety. Again.. a NB, Warden and DK tank will all play different from one another.

The second you provide a unique tool to a single class, of which said tool is MANDATORY for the viability of that role, historically in ESO we can point to the most obvious example of this and how it has changed.... Templars for most of the games lifespan have been the definitive healer, not because of a "dedicated healing skill line" (which has always only ever been a half truth if im being honest here) but because they had exclusive access to the ability to provide resources to allies, this is as integral to the role of healer as a taunt is to a tank. This simple fact almost completely invalidated ANY of the other classes from attempting the role in an end game environment.

Now, you might be asking yourself "what is the problem with templars being the best healer by design?". well, the simple answer is everything when you consider ESOs class structure as a whole. There are only 5 core classes in ESO and of those 5, the systems in place allow for their to essentially be 2 versions a stamina and magicka version which basically results in there being 10 unique outlets for a player to choose in regards to class. Lets break that down for a second and look at how limited the options are....

Stamina Templar - DPS
Magicka Templar - Healer
Stamina NB - DPS
Magicka NB - DPS
Stamina Sorc -DPS
Magicka Sorc - DPS
Stamina DK - Tank
Magicka DK - DPS
Stamina Warden - DPS
Magicka Warden - DPS

This is the mmo that you are advocating for. One with essentially 10 class options of which only 1 is a viable tank and 1 is a viable healer. That is terrible. As opposed to an mmo with 5 healers, 5 tanks and 10 dps. I would much rather take the later.

The various skills in ESO are specifically designed around being analogous to one another. Simply put, this means skills, whether they belong to a class skill line, weapon skill line, guild skill line etc etc are made to mirror each other in functionality but differ in application Its ts also VERY important to understand that those aforementioned categories are ALL weighted the same (a class skill is not inherently superior to its analogous weapon, guild, world skill counterpart). An example i often use is the Shards vs Orbs debate. Both are made to restore allies resources yet have very different secondary perks and criteria for which they excel over one another. Shards is very fast and accurate, meaning the templar can precisely provide the synergy to a specific ally without delay or much repositioning. The trade off is that only one application of shards can be on the floor at a given time, therefore for each ally that needs the resource you have to time it and commit a new cast for each target in need. Orbs on the contrary is very slow, and risks not reaching its target in time yet the orbs themselves have a much wider application range in that the caster can field them for multiple allies without having to drop the same amount of time outside of a potential healing window. In this example, THAT is one of the defining characteristics of a templar. Do you value the accuracy of the shards, is the tank really the only recipient in need of resource for a particular trial or group makeup? This is what your decision is based around.

This is how all skills in the game are balanced against one another, regardless of whether or not they belong to a class or if its simply a fighters guild skill vs a weapon skill. They encompass a similar goal with a different form of application / use.

If this were an mmo that did not adhere to the holy trinity, where group content was wildly varied in what makes a full group effective, im talking FF11 levels of broad strokes here, where you have countless different makeups and pseudo roles like puller and buffer and where scenarios in which some classes (jobs) simply had no place being, was accepted because of just how many options were available and the freedom to not bind a player to said class on a single character. ESO is not that game, and trying to shoehorn classes into specific performance niches only serves to make the game less interesting when your available class pool is limited and your group content is operating on the holy trinity of Tank Healer Damage dealer.

You often hear the complaints about class homogenization, due to unique tools being spread out / made available to all. And while in some small cases, that might be true, the use of homogenization is used VERY generously on these forums. In truth its not nearly as egregious as most make it out to be.

Do you pick the magicka templar because you want to be the most optimal numerically superior healer? Or do you pick the templar because you are attracted to the idea of being more resilient / protective and less mobile while using holy magic and harnessing the power of the sun? this being their identity mind you. ZOS would likely prefer your choice come from the later i assure you.

MaxwellC wrote: »

@Yakidafi Yeah break down my opinion in how it doesn't make sense or how it does make sense but nonetheless have a debate not insert words into my mouth.

You stated I had said that one class should do a particular role whereas I stated one class should perform that role better than other classes but nonetheless all classes should obviously be able to perform that role. I am not sure how you fail to see what I am stating but alright.

So to reiterate what I clearly stated; One class should excel in a particular role where other classes could still perform that role but not up to the same capacity.
*Just because you put a picture in your statement does not make it more valid.