Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
This is my opinion & you're all welcomed to break it down however you want to.
My issue with ESOs combat is that as of late it seems they're trying to make it so every class is able to perform the same role as good as the traditional role e.g DK as a Tank, Templar as a Healer,etc.
Now I think sure all classes should be able to perform all roles but some classes should be able to perform that role better because that is the whole reason to have a class.
ESO is changing skills, nerfing others, & buffing others so all classes can do all roles near the same capacity; If this is the case then why don't we simply get rid of classes all together?
I honestly feel that we need to go back to where classes had their identity i.e 1.5/1.6. This is not to say that all the clear OP aspects return but a return of what made classes the best for the role to return.
We cannot keep trying to make everything equal & then call for more class identity.
-Discuss & inb4 "Okay" responses
This is my opinion & you're all welcomed to break it down however you want to.
My issue with ESOs combat is that as of late it seems they're trying to make it so every class is able to perform the same role as good as the traditional role e.g DK as a Tank, Templar as a Healer,etc.
Now I think sure all classes should be able to perform all roles but some classes should be able to perform that role better because that is the whole reason to have a class.
ESO is changing skills, nerfing others, & buffing others so all classes can do all roles near the same capacity; If this is the case then why don't we simply get rid of classes all together?
I honestly feel that we need to go back to where classes had their identity i.e 1.5/1.6. This is not to say that all the clear OP aspects return but a return of what made classes the best for the role to return.
We cannot keep trying to make everything equal & then call for more class identity.
-Discuss & inb4 "Okay" responses
Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
LiquidPony wrote: »Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
This is my opinion & you're all welcomed to break it down however you want to.
My issue with ESOs combat is that as of late it seems they're trying to make it so every class is able to perform the same role as good as the traditional role e.g DK as a Tank, Templar as a Healer,etc.
Now I think sure all classes should be able to perform all roles but some classes should be able to perform that role better because that is the whole reason to have a class.
ESO is changing skills, nerfing others, & buffing others so all classes can do all roles near the same capacity; If this is the case then why don't we simply get rid of classes all together?
I honestly feel that we need to go back to where classes had their identity i.e 1.5/1.6. This is not to say that all the clear OP aspects return but a return of what made classes the best for the role to return.
We cannot keep trying to make everything equal & then call for more class identity.
-Discuss & inb4 "Okay" responses
LiquidPony wrote: »Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
LiquidPony wrote: »It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
LiquidPony wrote: »League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
LiquidPony wrote: »I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
LiquidPony wrote: »Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
You completely missed my point if you think that was an “ermahgerd animation canceling” response. You need to read the whole sentance someone writes before responding.
The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow.
Last time I checked, if I reload my guns in Overwatch I’m not still shooting bullets out of them somehow. Same in every other FPS I’ve played. I don’t play any of that other stuff you mentioned.
LiquidPony wrote: »Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
They have animation canceling, yes. The difference is, in those other games AC is infinitely more challenging to pull off and still have the ability damage/effect go through; especially since in ESO it's not challenging at all.LiquidPony wrote: »It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
It's indeed funny how people wish to face no negative consequences of their own poor tactical decisions instead of learning to make better decisions. If you have a skill with a long wind-up animation, you shouldn't be using this skill unless you have a safe opening and/or a support ally ready to heal or shield you - or unless you think it's worth it to take the risk, knowing and accepting that you can get hit or killed in the attempt.
LiquidPony wrote: »LiquidPony wrote: »Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
You completely missed my point if you think that was an “ermahgerd animation canceling” response. You need to read the whole sentance someone writes before responding.
The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow.
Last time I checked, if I reload my guns in Overwatch I’m not still shooting bullets out of them somehow. Same in every other FPS I’ve played. I don’t play any of that other stuff you mentioned.
Animation canceling in Overwatch isn't limited to reload animations. Look up Genji right click/melee or slash/dash/melee combos or Hanzo ulti animation cancel.
The idea that canceling an animation would cancel the damage doesn't make sense. The damage already happened. That's why you can cancel it. Animation canceling in ESO is effectively combo chaining. You don't need to do the follow-through of a light attack because you've chained it into another attack.LiquidPony wrote: »Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
They have animation canceling, yes. The difference is, in those other games AC is infinitely more challenging to pull off and still have the ability damage/effect go through; especially since in ESO it's not challenging at all.LiquidPony wrote: »It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
It's indeed funny how people wish to face no negative consequences of their own poor tactical decisions instead of learning to make better decisions. If you have a skill with a long wind-up animation, you shouldn't be using this skill unless you have a safe opening and/or a support ally ready to heal or shield you - or unless you think it's worth it to take the risk, knowing and accepting that you can get hit or killed in the attempt.
This isn't relevant in ESO. Skills with truly long animations are almost all channeled, and canceling those animations does in fact partially or completely cancel the effect. Skills that are instant cast (notice the key word "instant") can be canceled to block or dodge or bash or bar swap if necessary. And regardless, this is a silly and altogether moot point. Players don't "wish to face no negative blah blah blah," that's just the way it is. That's the way ESO combat is designed. If you just fired Endless Hail as The Warrior turns to Chuck his shield at you, you're just dead if you can't cancel it with a block. If you just hit Blockade and S'kinrai and his adds Jesus Beam your tank and DPS during conversions, they're dead if you can't bash cancel. If you just hit Rearming Trap as The Mage drops a meteor on you, you're dead if you can't block cancel.
Four years later and people are still beating this dead horse. It's preposterous.
LiquidPony wrote: »Huh. The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow. No other game I’ve played works like that. It makes no sense.
I don’t feel that allowing different classes to play similar roles destroys identity. Then again, I’m also a gamer who explicitly focuses on creating unique identities for my characters. I face challenges doing this, but it definitely isn’t because the class system supports all classes being able to do all roles. That actually enhances my ability to create unique identities. My nightblade healer, for example, works very differently from my warden healer.
Didn't take long for the "ermahgerd animation canceling" response.
No other game works like that?
League of Legends has animation canceling. DotA has animation canceling. Smite has animation canceling. Overwatch has animation canceling. Fortnite has animation canceling. Breath of the Wild has animation canceling. Mario 64 had animation canceling. Street Fighter IV (and many other entries in the series) has animation canceling (as do many other fighting games ... Guilty Gear, Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat, etc ... look up "Roman Cancel" in Guilty Gear which is a form of animation canceling that is a core gameplay mechanic). Super Smash Brothers has animation canceling. Plenty of FPS games have animation canceling in the form of reload/swap canceling.
It's funny ... go read Monster Hunter forums or Warframe forums or Final Fantasy XIV forums and you'll find plenty of people saying things like "I really wish I could cancel my animations, I press a button and some long animation winds up and then the boss hits me with some random attack and I can't dodge or block it. Please add animation canceling."
You completely missed my point if you think that was an “ermahgerd animation canceling” response. You need to read the whole sentance someone writes before responding.
The thing that jumps out at me personally is that it’s dumb to cancel an ability and have it still do damage somehow.
Last time I checked, if I reload my guns in Overwatch I’m not still shooting bullets out of them somehow. Same in every other FPS I’ve played. I don’t play any of that other stuff you mentioned.
JumpmanLane wrote: »Animation canceling works. It’s in the game for a reason (should you suddenly need to block). ZOS isn’t going to change it. Learn it or get reckt.
It's indeed funny how people wish to face no negative consequences of their own poor tactical decisions instead of learning to make better decisions. If you have a skill with a long wind-up animation, you shouldn't be using this skill unless you have a safe opening and/or a support ally ready to heal or shield you - or unless you think it's worth it to take the risk, knowing and accepting that you can get hit or killed in the attempt.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
@Yakidafi
Never said classes are for certain roles so I'd like it if you didn't assume that. I clearly stated that some classes should be able to perform certain roles better instead of going down this hill where we try to equalize each class so they can perform the role at the same capacity.
Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell
@Yakidafi Yeah break down my opinion in how it doesn't make sense or how it does make sense but nonetheless have a debate not insert words into my mouth.
You stated I had said that one class should do a particular role whereas I stated one class should perform that role better than other classes but nonetheless all classes should obviously be able to perform that role. I am not sure how you fail to see what I am stating but alright.
So to reiterate what I clearly stated; One class should excel in a particular role where other classes could still perform that role but not up to the same capacity.
*Just because you put a picture in your statement does not make it more valid.
@Yakidafi Yeah break down my opinion in how it doesn't make sense or how it does make sense but nonetheless have a debate not insert words into my mouth.
You stated I had said that one class should do a particular role whereas I stated one class should perform that role better than other classes but nonetheless all classes should obviously be able to perform that role. I am not sure how you fail to see what I am stating but alright.
So to reiterate what I clearly stated; One class should excel in a particular role where other classes could still perform that role but not up to the same capacity.
*Just because you put a picture in your statement does not make it more valid.
No, I get what you are saying.
I fail do understand the difference between one class is for a certain role and one class is better at a role. To me it leads to the same outcome.
I use memes to enforce what I am feeling.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***