Pandorii wrote: »

Casual games and solo players: Do you ever find yourself face-to-face with committed players who are a little rigid with their ways? Example: hardcore PvErs who criticize you if you don't have the right best-in-slot gear. PvPers who criticize you for not being loyal to the faction or having all the right siege. Trader guild leaders who kick you because you didn't know all the prices or some other erroneous rule they set. Social guilds that expect you to participate and attend events daily.

I just want to come home after a stressful day of work and have fun, but everywhere I turn I'm face-to-face with a committed player who is like 'how dare you not know X'. They expect me to be as committed as them.

Really bums me out. I want to contribute and cooperate, but at my slow pace it seems like it's never enough. Any suggestions? Should I just go back to single player games?

Pandorii wrote: »

Sylvermynx wrote: »

I don't know. Are you in a guild? Is it guildies who are coming off this way? I just solo 99.9% of the time (my friends in the game have WAY better connections than I do - so grouping with me is like waiting for molasses running uphill in January and I try not to get in their way).

It sounds as if you want to do group content. But perhaps that's not something that's realistic until you have a long vacation, or you retire?

I find playing solo in this game works - but it's not something that is going to get you a lot of xp or great gear. I get decent blue and purple gear by having done the Psijic quest line (at least through the first part) on most of my girls - because Psijic portals give you gear far better than you'll get unless you can run delves and dungeons (which with my lag, I just can't). I don't even go there with grouping, because I know a group will be at a disadvantage with me at 999+ lag.

There are things we all expect with games. My expectation is just to explore and have fun. This game does that for me - but I'm not trying to do group content. So I don't have to deal with the expectations of others. If what you really want is the group content, well.... you're going to have to decide to not having a relaxing "play the game my way" I think.

I hope you find some way to enjoy the beauty that is ESO.

I've been in a few different kinds of guilds, and I will keep jumping around until I find one that's a good fit.

It's more a battle with the individuals. I want to be respectful and recognize that they have strong opinions because they are strongly committed. But I am not, and I don't want to have a 1 hour heater convo about why this build is better than that one. Or why it's important that I follow this arbitrary guild rule. It makes gaming feel like a job.

Pandorii wrote: »

Casual games and solo players: Do you ever find yourself face-to-face with committed players who are a little rigid with their ways? Example: hardcore PvErs who criticize you if you don't have the right best-in-slot gear. PvPers who criticize you for not being loyal to the faction or having all the right siege. Trader guild leaders who kick you because you didn't know all the prices or some other erroneous rule they set. Social guilds that expect you to participate and attend events daily.

I just want to come home after a stressful day of work and have fun, but everywhere I turn I'm face-to-face with a committed player who is like 'how dare you not know X'. They expect me to be as committed as them.

Really bums me out. I want to contribute and cooperate, but at my slow pace it seems like it's never enough. Any suggestions? Should I just go back to single player games?

Pandorii wrote: »

Casual games and solo players: Do you ever find yourself face-to-face with committed players who are a little rigid with their ways? Example: hardcore PvErs who criticize you if you don't have the right best-in-slot gear. PvPers who criticize you for not being loyal to the faction or having all the right siege. Trader guild leaders who kick you because you didn't know all the prices or some other erroneous rule they set. Social guilds that expect you to participate and attend events daily.

I just want to come home after a stressful day of work and have fun, but everywhere I turn I'm face-to-face with a committed player who is like 'how dare you not know X'. They expect me to be as committed as them.

Really bums me out. I want to contribute and cooperate, but at my slow pace it seems like it's never enough. Any suggestions? Should I just go back to single player games?

Pandorii wrote: »

PvPers who criticize you for not being loyal to the faction or having all the right siege.

ESO_GOD wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

ESO_GOD wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

ESO_GOD wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

ESO_GOD wrote: »

Well, coming to the dungeon with bad gear is a big big problem.

If you dont agree with the guild's rules, well, maybe you should leave that guild.

This is a very competitive game. The best guilds often have rules and/or policies, and low performance in game is grounds for kicking and other punishment.

There are many less compeitive games out there such as disney or pokemon. Maybe one should seek those out if they find they cannot keep with performance expectations.

It's honestly disturbing to see someone so new so indoctrinated.

That attitude is everything wrong with this game and why I've been warning people -away- from it actively.

I am a veteran player, CP 969. I just never ventured to the forums until today. I forgot about them.

That's fair. My comments on the mentality still hold, though. It's divisive, it's counterproductive, and it's the biggest hurdle new players have. Stop with that.

Division and general animosity is prevalent all throughout this community, here.

Prioritizing general progression and achievement within the game is the one thing that could unite the community.

As in, I hop into a dungeon run and I see a player who does not know how to play the game. Maybe they are playing it like how they'd imagine 'Skyrim Online' to be. This infuriates me, because they should never have been in a dungeon run to begin with.

All toons must be properly geared and should have the correct skills slotted before queuing, under all circumstances and despite any/all other factors including level and time spent playing the game.

People who do not respect this, will create further division because they will p** people off. It's the in-game equivalent of poor etiquette.

If skill level and general ability as well as general achievements achieved within the game were further prioritized, people like this may think twice before queuing unprepared due to the potential consequence endured.

In other words, prioritizing skill level and things such as "percentage completion" is the number one way to unite the community further. MMOs are inherently unaccommodating to the casual player and casual mindset. Attempting to circumvent this aspect will not yield a successful result because things like valuing individual skill level instead of accommodating casuals is built into the game.

There's one problem with that mentality and your insistance of it.

ESO does one of the most horrible jobs of actually teaching people how to play and relies overly on the community who refuses to pick up the slack.

This isn't like WoW which teaches you how to play your class as you level up, slowly. Every bit of experience is valuable.

And no, MMO's are not inherently unaccomidating to the casual player and mindset. That's horsecrap. The casual, overland content that people seem to want to enrich with an -option- for difficulty rather than buffing it and leaving casual players out in the cold. In fact every experience this game has had, has had the opposite result. Craglorn got nerfed because nobody wanted to wade through difficult content for so little reward and forced grouping. The overland got nerfed because it was not only difficult in the extreme and exclusive, but a shallow experience that only served to 'train' for the PVP mode, and poorly.

We see time and again MMO's that go the tryhard route fail. Guildwars 2 with heart of thorns. Wizardry online. It happens over and over and you just never learn.

You want to actually see players stop coming into those dungeons under-prepared? Have the game make a better effort of teaching them. The sample-build feature was built to do exclusively this, and there a re still yet more steps to take in that direction. Difficulty overhaul, with a story-focused difficulty for casuals for dungeons and raids, a training difficulty, and a harder vet mode for those who want that difficulty. Providing options for people who dont and better ability to train for the people who do.

These things can be done. They can, because I've seen it happen. The chapter model and the easy overland and the reletively low hardcore content production speaks to me that the casual audience is bigger, and more prone to profit then the hardcore. So enough with this 'MMO's cannot abide casuals'. It's blatently false with even the least bit of research.

Your way is the way of death. It must be opposed at all cost. You are the unwitting murderer of MMO's attempting to drive out it's lifeblood: casual players. You must. Be. Defeated.

I have never seen a better distillation of the hardcore mentality or the damage it can cause. Bravo. I will now use you as an example for all days to come.

Feel free to use me as an example, I'm pretty much asking for it at this point

And just to respond, it's not like wat you're saying doesn't make sense. Indeed it does.

However, there are a few points here that need responding to

First of all, the Craglorn point. See, ZOS's problem (one of many) is that they don't properly incentivize content and then seem to later wonder why nobody runs said content anymore and can't figure out why.

You bring up Craglorn. Well nobody runs it because there isn't any point. The rewards and incentive isn't there. Make the content harder with adequate incentives and myself and I'm sure many other people will be there to run the dailies and so forth for the chance of significantly valuable rewards.

In terms of difficulty, I'd argue for a balance between old and new Craglorn skewed slightly towards the old in terms of difficulty. Higher difficulty increases replay value which I feel is a point you fail to acknowledge.

I believe it is best to try to introduce casual and unskilled players to the concept of skilled play as early on as possible or else they degrade the overall quality of the gameplay experience simply by not knowing how to play properly while being amongst players that do.

While it is true that ESO does not offer much in the ways of tutorials on gameplay, the problem moreso lies with players. Players should be actively researching the game to learn more about it for a good amount of their time, that is what is correct for a gamer to do. If you are just starting a game you have to research it extensively to learn as much as possible by reading about it online.

I would doubt most casuals would even notice an increase in overland difficulty if the fact that the increase had happened was not revealed to them. We're talking about people who can barely tie their shoes.

Easy overland content is a result of the One Tamriel update (which I have mixed feelings about at best), and ZOS's laziness. They could be too lazy to do it, otherwise, why is it not done yet? Overland content is embarrassingly easy, we should all be collectively ashamed! I sure am about it!

Casuals should be appealed to, and a collective effort should be made to bring each one of them into the hardcore mentality to the greatest extent possible. Doing so will also retain them as players and spenders.

I am arguing less that casuals shouldn't be allowed to play (they should), but instead I believe a general shift towards the game becoming as competitive as possible as quickly as possible is something that is essential. This would also mean a slight bump in difficulty in many instances. Revert the DLC dungeon nerf, what a disgraceful embarrassment. Buff overland difficulty and quest content to an acceptable level. All of those will improve the quality of the game which will increase the chances of retaining players, as long as the game still remains accessible. The accessibility can be maintained while buffing some content, yes, this is possible. Too much stuff is embarrassingly easy, a change is needed.

In this game I am always striving to learn as much possible, complete all content and improve my skills. That is what everyone should be doing.