Two issues with Werewolf

nordic_two · August 2018

1) When using Pounce from a longer distance the enemy agro's right when you activate the ability, and if they are a melee enemy, they move toward you. This means you can land behind them, and have to turn around or back up to continue fighting. I believe this happens on other gap closers but it seems to be worse on WW due to the length of time you are in the air with Pounce.

2) Using abilities appears to cause a lower DPS than just using light attacks. On a single enemy I can get 20k dps with light attacks (level 29 character) but only around 14k dps if I use Piercing Howl even once (weaving it in with light attack). I get a similar effect when using Pounce even from minimum range.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom · August 2018

Thanks, @nordic_two. Passed these along for investigation. Both of these are pretty broad, so any additional details or examples you or anyone else can provide would help.

idk · August 2018

Even the target moves I believe pounce puts the player where the target was. Not where it is. This has been completed he case since before the update today.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom · August 2018

idk wrote: »

Even the target moves I believe pounce puts the player where the target was. Not where it is. This has been completed he case since before the update today.

Thanks @idk, that's what I thought (that the first one sounded like something that was present before today's update.)

nordic_two · August 2018

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Thanks, @nordic_two. Passed these along for investigation. Both of these are pretty broad, so any additional details or examples you or anyone else can provide would help.

The first one (gap closer/pounce) you land where the enemy was when you activate the ability, but the enemy often will move toward where you where. This is why you land behind them. (I believe this did exist before today's patch)

For the 2nd, if I just use light attacks only I do more DPS than if I try to weave in some WW abilities. Out of WW form doing that results in much higher DPS, but in WW form doing that results in lower DPS.

DBZVelena · August 2018

my best guess on why the use of abilities lowers dps is: the game isn't using the stats of your equipped weapon stats as a base for the dps numbers. or not in the same way/same ww modifier as the game uses for the light and heavy attacks.
End result: WW has higher light/ heavy attack dps than is caused if using its ww skills.

ADarklore · August 2018

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Even the target moves I believe pounce puts the player where the target was. Not where it is. This has been completed he case since before the update today.

Thanks @idk, that's what I thought (that the first one sounded like something that was present before today's update.)

So if it's a known issue, are the devs trying to fix it? Because it's really irritating using a gap closer and landing BEHIND the enemy. Also, how is it that enemies can detect your 'activation' of a gap closer BEFORE you even reach them?!? This occurs even when gap closing an enemy from behind. I could understand a line of sight detection, but they shouldn't detect you when you're gap closing from their blind spot.

idk · August 2018

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

ADarklore · August 2018

idk wrote: »

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

I think the SOLUTION should be that targets (outside of bosses and such) should not be able to 'detect' your gap closer before you strike; this way they would not MOVE before you got there causing the location displacement.

idk · August 2018

ADarklore wrote: »

idk wrote: »

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

I think the SOLUTION should be that targets (outside of bosses and such) should not be able to 'detect' your gap closer before you strike; this way they would not MOVE before you got there causing the location displacement.

Read my first reply. If target is moving the issue occurred before today and many NPCs path and all players move.

DocFrost72 · August 2018

ADarklore wrote: »

idk wrote: »

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

I think the SOLUTION should be that targets (outside of bosses and such) should not be able to 'detect' your gap closer before you strike; this way they would not MOVE before you got there causing the location displacement.

^

By the way, this is why take flight's range increase is silly, it does the same thing and at max range you can sometimes even miss.

ADarklore · August 2018

idk wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

idk wrote: »

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

I think the SOLUTION should be that targets (outside of bosses and such) should not be able to 'detect' your gap closer before you strike; this way they would not MOVE before you got there causing the location displacement.

Read my first reply. If target is moving the issue occurred before today and many NPCs path and all players move.

Ah... for me I only encounter this with stationary targets... but if your example is the case, I can understand how a gap closer would land BEHIND a target. You cannot 'shift' your path while moving, I agree with this, because it would be unrealistic to be jumping in the air and then suddenly extend or adjust your course mid-jump.

nordic_two · August 2018

ADarklore wrote: »

idk wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

idk wrote: »

The devs have had issues with gap closers in the game since the dawn of time. Some have been worked out but the WW was probably flying under the radar since it had lighter use than others. It’ll become more apparent if the WW redesign is successful. That’ll lead to more pressure to fix it.

My guess is the game is moving the player to a location vs a target.

However, this does point out the need to test and provide feedback on the PTS.

I think the SOLUTION should be that targets (outside of bosses and such) should not be able to 'detect' your gap closer before you strike; this way they would not MOVE before you got there causing the location displacement.

Read my first reply. If target is moving the issue occurred before today and many NPCs path and all players move.

Ah... for me I only encounter this with stationary targets... but if your example is the case, I can understand how a gap closer would land BEHIND a target. You cannot 'shift' your path while moving, I agree with this, because it would be unrealistic to be jumping in the air and then suddenly extend or adjust your course mid-jump.

For NPC's(or players) if they are already moving you would still land were when you activated the ability. The real issue is when using the leap at the start of a fight, when NPCs are standing still. You land where they are when you first activate the ability. The problem is, they agro as soon as you activate it, so melee based NPCs will run toward you.