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What do we need servers for? Let's have an off line mode.
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Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
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People underestimate just how beefy a private server can be made. LAN games are far from a recent occurrence.
I don't really buy the argument that it's "too big" to run on the client side. Okay, I admit that I don't have a lot of direct experience with coding MMOs, but I do have a lot of experience programming client-server stuff and it's typically not the case that the server is a vast resource-intensive beast except inasmuch as it needs to maintain a large number of clients and information pertaining to them all. Most of the assets that are seen from the client side of ESO are already on the PC anyway: it would simply be way too inefficient to attempt to transfer anything but the most minor amount of information in real-time, which indicates to me that it is not outside the realm of possibility that a single-user server could be hosted on one's PC.Azuramoonstar wrote: »do more research into it then. MMO are hosted on servers, none of the games data is on our pc or console, just textures and net connections. All the game data is server side not client side. Single player games are hosted client side. [snip]
Of course actually converting a large multi-user system into a single-user one if its design isn't already conducive to doing so may be a prohibitive amount of effort, but based on my own experience, my inclination is that development effort (well, and politics) would be the stumbling block rather than the resources required to host it.
Rarely, in such instances, modified versions of small instance servers are made available for the fanbase to maintain or mod. Since certain aspects could (and would) be reverse engineered, I would say this is unlikely, unless the tech is so far outdated they simply wouldn't be concerned anymore. (See free downloads of TES I and TES II, for instance)
I don't support the idea, nor the necessity of a standalone for the development costs, the (necessary) lack of support, nor the idea that it's difficult to get semi-decent internet almost anywhere on the planet.
However, the coder in me does become curious as to the overall size of the server code, just for perspectives' sake.
I doubt they'll ever reveal that, but it would be interesting to know, especially to the programmers out there.
Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS0 -
Azuramoonstar✭✭✭✭
I don't really buy the argument that it's "too big" to run on the client side. Okay, I admit that I don't have a lot of direct experience with coding MMOs, but I do have a lot of experience programming client-server stuff and it's typically not the case that the server is a vast resource-intensive beast except inasmuch as it needs to maintain a large number of clients and information pertaining to them all. Most of the assets that are seen from the client side of ESO are already on the PC anyway: it would simply be way too inefficient to attempt to transfer anything but the most minor amount of information in real-time, which indicates to me that it is not outside the realm of possibility that a single-user server could be hosted on one's PC.Azuramoonstar wrote: »do more research into it then. MMO are hosted on servers, none of the games data is on our pc or console, just textures and net connections. All the game data is server side not client side. Single player games are hosted client side. [snip]
Of course actually converting a large multi-user system into a single-user one if its design isn't already conducive to doing so may be a prohibitive amount of effort, but based on my own experience, my inclination is that development effort (well, and politics) would be the stumbling block rather than the resources required to host it.
Again research, noclip had a documentary on the rise and fall, and rebirth of final fantasy 14. They do talk indepth on how mmo are made. There is a lot of stuff stored server side in mmo. Character creator, inventory, character data, the game.
Mmo are large games, larger then the witcher 3, it takes server clusters to run the zones.
Any amount of research would help, because you got a poor attitude, and don't seem interested in doing a lil bit of research to not sound ignorant.Long time mmo player: 2004-[current year]
Long time Elder scrolls player: Xbox launch morrowind.
Follower of the dawn and dusk, keeper of the moon and star.0 -
Ydrisselle✭✭✭✭✭What I'd like even better would be to host our own private servers, like the original NWN had, so you could invite your friends and play with just the people you want to play with. Maybe just a MORPG, get rid of the massively part. Letting us play without the griefers and bad sports and jerks and cheaters and bots and trolls would make it a lot better experience. I'd pay an extra sub fee for that.
That would be problematic because it would give the server code in the hands of the cheaters. They could do much better hacks and cheats based on that server code. You wouldn't get less cheaters - you would get much, much more.0 -
neverwalk✭✭✭✭Turn ESO off, plays as single-player game like Skyrim but way better. Change very little about game. do something for someone and they can become follower, who you can train to be better fighter. When you have a group of 4 highly-trained followers, you head for Vet WGT and take that *** down.1 -
vometia✭✭✭
I'm not entirely sure where the "poor attitude" comes from or why such an accusation is justified. I'm simply pontificating out loud, though I am bringing at least some of my experience as a programmer to bear, my usual approach being to see how a problem can be solved rather than examining why it shouldn't be tackled.Azuramoonstar wrote: »Mmo are large games, larger then the witcher 3, it takes server clusters to run the zones.
Any amount of research would help, because you got a poor attitude, and don't seem interested in doing a lil bit of research to not sound ignorant.
But if you want to continue making snarky comments about me personally... shrug.2 -
Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
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Which is why you'd only go to trusted servers, private servers (invite only), or host your own. The good ones for any game also have pretty active moderators that don't have to adhere to the warm and fuzzy requirements for restricting certain players as a global game tends to.Ydrisselle wrote: »What I'd like even better would be to host our own private servers, like the original NWN had, so you could invite your friends and play with just the people you want to play with. Maybe just a MORPG, get rid of the massively part. Letting us play without the griefers and bad sports and jerks and cheaters and bots and trolls would make it a lot better experience. I'd pay an extra sub fee for that.
That would be problematic because it would give the server code in the hands of the cheaters. They could do much better hacks and cheats based on that server code. You wouldn't get less cheaters - you would get much, much more.
Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS1 -
Aebaradath✭✭✭✭✭
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Really? You cannot see the likelihood of people cheating and roflstomping Molag Bal and other stuff in Offline Mode? Or add every single item to their character? Really?CelticStones wrote: »Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Offline mode would cause rampant cheating.
This is a silly argument. Who would you be cheating against? LOL Single player would mean zero lag, zero bandwidth. As someone with pre millenium copper wires and only one person at a time being able to use the net, offline mode would be great for doing the grindy long winded multi-alt stuff (shards, lore, skill points, crafting writs fishing etc). Pretty sure you cant cheat in any of that.
On a side note, I'd totally model-swap my character with a mudcrab.0 -
"I don't know much about MMO"
"why can't we play off line?
"having trouble fighting mud crabs"
you should lay off that glue its not good for ya2 -
Malacthulhu✭✭✭✭Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Offline mode would cause rampant cheating.
This, and once you make all that client side they definitally wouldnt be able to do anything about the cheating unless it was extremely restrictive and then that defeats the purpose.
I would never play this game as a single player game. I will never play skyrim again lol I feel games like the witcher have raised the bar very high in story telling. As far as dragons go in skyrim I feel dragons dogma has better dragons and mechanics even though the story feels like my 5 year old tried to toss something together at the last minute. There are probably better examples of better games.Edited by Malacthulhu on August 7, 2018 1:07PMXbox One Na1 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭What I'd like even better would be to host our own private servers, like the original NWN had, so you could invite your friends and play with just the people you want to play with. Maybe just a MORPG, get rid of the massively part. Letting us play without the griefers and bad sports and jerks and cheaters and bots and trolls would make it a lot better experience. I'd pay an extra sub fee for that.What I'd like even better would be to host our own private servers, like the original NWN had, so you could invite your friends and play with just the people you want to play with. Maybe just a MORPG, get rid of the massively part. Letting us play without the griefers and bad sports and jerks and cheaters and bots and trolls would make it a lot better experience. I'd pay an extra sub fee for that.
This right here. My favorite game these days is a game with private servers, Conan Exiles. Even without the finish and polish of ESO, the experience of playing that game is vastly superior to this one. Why? Because I can play with the sort of people I really like... and deny entry to those I don't. With MMOs in general being populated with far too many rude people I just don't have the patience for, I would gladly pay a sub for a private server option.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!2 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »
Really? You cannot see the likelihood of people cheating and roflstomping Molag Bal and other stuff in Offline Mode? Or add every single item to their character? Really?CelticStones wrote: »Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Offline mode would cause rampant cheating.
This is a silly argument. Who would you be cheating against? LOL Single player would mean zero lag, zero bandwidth. As someone with pre millenium copper wires and only one person at a time being able to use the net, offline mode would be great for doing the grindy long winded multi-alt stuff (shards, lore, skill points, crafting writs fishing etc). Pretty sure you cant cheat in any of that.
On a side note, I'd totally model-swap my character with a mudcrab.
I think the point is that the cheating wouldn't matter if their character can never be used again in online mode. Offline characters would never be allowed online.
It won't happen, but I am just explaining the mindset. Doesn't matter if they have every single item in an offline character.3 -
vometia✭✭✭
That was my thought about the matter: either that the online/offline characters would be kept totally separate or that there would be a one-way journey from online to offline world (well, that needn't mean the deletion of an online character, just that whatever happens offline stays offline). It would be very easy to do by simply not allowing the uploading of character data from the offline version of the game.DaveMoeDee wrote: »I think the point is that the cheating wouldn't matter if their character can never be used again in online mode. Offline characters would never be allowed online.
It won't happen, but I am just explaining the mindset. Doesn't matter if they have every single item in an offline character.
But I am aware that some people object on principle to what others do in entirely single-player environments with some getting very uptight indeed about modes that are "too easy", things like savescumming, even the concept of non-checkpoint saves. Though I'm also aware that some of them protest rather too hard, one of the more hilarious examples being a guy on the Oblivion forums who repeatedly claimed the hard mode was way too easy, but at some point posted his config setting for debugging purposes, revealing he actually played at close to the easiest setting. Well I found it amusing anyway, though some people might say with some justification that I'm easily entertained.
Another potential benefit to an offline version is that it could open it up to people who like modding, though I admit that's another can of worms.Edited by vometia on August 7, 2018 4:18PM1 -
DMuehlhausen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Offline mode would cause rampant cheating.
How so? Genuine question. I don't know so that is why I made this topic. Never thought of it so like to see your answer.
Since you would be offline with no way for ZOS to track you, you could use hacks (Cheat Engine, etc.) to blast through vMA and other trials to get gear and skins. You would also have the zones entirely to yourself and could use hacks for farming mats, etc. It's best if ZOS keeps an eye on everyone the best they can.
But if it's all offline then who cares? I get this was a problem in a game like Diablo 1 back in the day where your offline character was also your online character. So you could just give your character the best stuff or even make fake items like the Demon Coat Spike Ring (was only an armor). In this instance though he would kinda be playing a Dev version of the game giving him free regin.
I get it's not going to happen and should and Skyrim is just a better option, but him hacking an offline character wouldn't affect us on the servers at all.1 -
Ydrisselle✭✭✭✭✭DaveMoeDee wrote: »PelinalWhitestrake wrote: »
Really? You cannot see the likelihood of people cheating and roflstomping Molag Bal and other stuff in Offline Mode? Or add every single item to their character? Really?CelticStones wrote: »Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »Offline mode would cause rampant cheating.
This is a silly argument. Who would you be cheating against? LOL Single player would mean zero lag, zero bandwidth. As someone with pre millenium copper wires and only one person at a time being able to use the net, offline mode would be great for doing the grindy long winded multi-alt stuff (shards, lore, skill points, crafting writs fishing etc). Pretty sure you cant cheat in any of that.
On a side note, I'd totally model-swap my character with a mudcrab.
I think the point is that the cheating wouldn't matter if their character can never be used again in online mode. Offline characters would never be allowed online.
It won't happen, but I am just explaining the mindset. Doesn't matter if they have every single item in an offline character.
Do you know the reaction? "Waa, why can't I import back my offline character to the live servers? Yes, I cheated and made that toon a walking god, but if I could do it, I have the right to do it! I want to play with my little god on the live servers too!"
And 20 more threads like this every day...0 -
Korah_Eaglecry✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Go play Skyrim on Alexa OP.Penniless Sellsword CompanyCaptain Paramount - Jorrhaq VhentKorith Eaglecry * Enrerion Aedihle * Laerinel Rhaev * Caius Berilius * Seylina Ithvala * H'Vak the GrimjawlTenarei Rhaev * Dazsh Ro Khar * Yynril Rothvani * Bathes-In-Coin * Anaelle Faerniil * Azjani Ma'LesAban Shahid Bakr * Kheshna gra-Gharbuk * Gallisten Bondurant * Etain Maquier * Atsu Kalame * Faulpia SeverinusWhat is better, to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort? - Paarthurnax0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭An offline mode would denote single player which is the antithesis of an mmorpg.
Not only does playing and mmorpg, even if playing solo, mean your playing in a world with other players but there are other aspects where playing in offline mode would make it easier to hide exploits.0 -
vometia✭✭✭
That would be a risk. My inclination would be for Zenimax to just this once extricate itself from its love of verbose legalese and stick with a very simple "I acknowledge that I cannot re-upload my offline character" or words to that effect. In allcaps etc. Though it's debatable how much difference it would realistically make.Ydrisselle wrote: »Do you know the reaction? "Waa, why can't I import back my offline character to the live servers? Yes, I cheated and made that toon a walking god, but if I could do it, I have the right to do it! I want to play with my little god on the live servers too!"
And 20 more threads like this every day...0 -
Azuramoonstar✭✭✭✭My question is, why can't people just accept the fact this is a MMO and stop asking for your hand to be held in the matters of social interaction?
I got into MMO after watching and playing the .hack games. I loved the concept of logging into a game, and meeting new people good and bad. I grew up with ADD, and was a self aware kid who knew i was different, and that "bad" by my peers, that I was slower then they are. I grew up with limited friends and didn't know why as I'm a fairly kind person, and don't try to pick fight. I am blunt, because i had problems speaking and it wasn't till adulthood i realized i had a high functioning form of autism.
Anyway, i started to play MMO in 2004 with final fantasy 11. I restarted my character some 75 times, to figure out what I wanted to do. I never did complete the story parts, but I did have fun. I met a ton of nice people, and a ton of not so nice people. I dated a guy via the game/voice and video chat, for 7 years. Dude was kind enough to get me a few presents like my ps3, and a Vermont teddy bear. I never expected much, and though the relationship didn't last I have fond memories.
I remember getting bullied over how I played a job (rdm) as it wasn't the "meta" way of playing it. I remember getting cyber stalked for 2-3 months by someone I never met who would send me private messages asking if I would kick a dude in the stones, and would demand my irl gender. As I grew older i tried other MMO like Aion, WoW, dozens of free to play MMO like Mabinogi and such. I played ff14, where I tried tanking for the first time. I recall times I did well tanking, and times I didn't do well tanking.
I recall a few cases I was bullied over my tanking, like being told I shoulda been a stain on the bed sheets. Or that I'm too slow. I recall a few cases i was told I did very well, and was one of the better tanks a person had met.
As i grew and play, I learned how to deal with each interaction, and learned what I could do to better myself. I also met my wonderful boyfriend, from playing MMO And moved from my state of Massachusetts, to his state of Louisiana. Which i got to see "oak ally" plantation, a place I grew up wanting to see irl due to watching interview of the vampire. If it wasn't for MMO, and having the good and bad experiences none of that would have happen.
If we only surround ourselves with people who share our opinion, we don't mature in our social interaction. We become stagnate, and see what we see lately with people. In that if we meet someone who don't agree with our opinion, we consider them toxic people. I find this to be a flawed concept, and just hurts us a community.
I think when people play MMO, there should be an expectation of social interaction, and that being around other players isn't a bad thing. the "toxic community" in any MMO is between 1-10%. Not everyone is a troll, a griefer, a bully, a cheater. In fact in my 14+ years of mmo i met a grand total of 16 bullies of the 2000 people i met and grouped up with. And sure those 16 people stick out most, but I met more good then bad. MMO are more solo friendly then they have been. And eso is so far the most solo friendly MMO. Which can be a flaw to people who enjoy the grouping aspect of mmo.
With suggestions like this, it ruins the genre. At this point why would people group up if there is no point or reason? MMO are unique, in that they are more then just games as you can meet people from all over. I personally wish it to stay this way.
It for wasn't for those experiences I wouldn't have learn better communication skills in dealing with good and bad people. I wouldn't have met my boyfriend, I'd still be living in a hostile environment in Massachusetts.
MMo's already have tools to better your experiences, we have block/ignore/black lists to add people who grief, bully etc. We have guilds people can form and invite people we enjoy playing with. we have friend lists we can add people who we enjoy talking to. We also have the ability to report people who break the rules (and yes, from personal experience gm do punish people). Just use them. If you don;t want to socialize with others, or not want to deal with a supposed "toxic players" then MMO isn't a genre for you, It isn't a bad thing, but there are plenty of games out there that are single player, or have light multiplayer aspects. You don't need the MMO genre to cater to you, and ruin it for those who enjoy the Massive multiplayer aspects.Long time mmo player: 2004-[current year]
Long time Elder scrolls player: Xbox launch morrowind.
Follower of the dawn and dusk, keeper of the moon and star.1 -
Azuramoonstar✭✭✭✭
I'm not entirely sure where the "poor attitude" comes from or why such an accusation is justified. I'm simply pontificating out loud, though I am bringing at least some of my experience as a programmer to bear, my usual approach being to see how a problem can be solved rather than examining why it shouldn't be tackled.Azuramoonstar wrote: »Mmo are large games, larger then the witcher 3, it takes server clusters to run the zones.
Any amount of research would help, because you got a poor attitude, and don't seem interested in doing a lil bit of research to not sound ignorant.
But if you want to continue making snarky comments about me personally... shrug.
You assume i'm being snarky, I did research with how MMO are made after the final fantasy 14 failure as it was a BIG DEAL. MMO are coded much differently then most games, and programs. You have character data, world data, server data, inventory data, npc shop data, item data. You showed no sign of going out and looking things up, and want to protest to me that you don't believe me. The final fantasy 14 noclip doc has the info you need on why mmo can't have a single player aspect. Which includes stuff like everything is stored server side, and data size of the game. How do you fit 12+ large zones full of different mobs, over 2000 npc, 1000 types of armor on to a client? Even the witcher 3 isn't that big. And i didn't even include the dialog, voice dialog, combat, combat effects.
This question was asked in ff14, and was answered, I gave you the answer that they gave. The bad attitude i was talking about was you just claim "i don't believe you" with doing 0 research and basing it off your experience coding which wasn't even video game, or mmo coding.
Simply put, it just isn't possible. MMO have too much data to be stored on a client, like a pc or ps4.Edited by Azuramoonstar on August 7, 2018 7:40PMLong time mmo player: 2004-[current year]
Long time Elder scrolls player: Xbox launch morrowind.
Follower of the dawn and dusk, keeper of the moon and star.0 -
Davor✭✭✭✭✭
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Depression and real life events kept me from playing. I am still fighting my depression right now, but fighting through it and playing ESO now, a lot compared to when I started. So I still feel like a total newb. I play ESO as a single player game experience. So I haven't really experience how a MMO is suppose to work. I see no difference yet from say any TES game or Witcher game or any single player game. So I would I know what a MMO is suppose to offer? Lots of times reading the threads on this forum makes no sense to me. I don't understand and just move on. I finally want to understand.
Hence wise I ask. I always tell my children, if you don't know ask.
Not my quote but I love this saying
"I would pay It for support. But since they choosed we are just numbers and not customers, i dont mind if game and zos goes to oblivion"0 -
Davor✭✭✭✭✭
✭Azuramoonstar wrote: »My question is, why can't people just accept the fact this is a MMO and stop asking for your hand to be held in the matters of social interaction?
Awesome post. I like to thank you very much for this.
Thing is, how is having an off line mode prevent you from any of what you have said? For comments like "accept" or "move to a game that has it" is just the same result in having an off line mode. People will not be there. So if people will not be there it would make your on line experience better since you will have more server resources dedicated for your gaming experience unlike people like me who play the game solo. I am not telling anyone how to play. Why would other people tell me how to play? All I did was ask a question. All I did was offer a suggestion. Is that so bad? After all we are on a forum to discuss things.
I accept that this game is an MMO. Thing is, even after reading 4 pages here, I understand a bit better of what a MMO is. I still don't know 100% because I am still thinking it's something different. So let me see if I get this correct.
I am old. Almost 50 years old. Technology has passed me by. I am basically a hermit. I don't go out. I only have 2 friends. I don't even socialize online. So I basically live under a rock. So I am trying to get out of my rock and learn now. Never to old to learn.
So that said, in terms I can understand is a MMO is basically a single player game. I always though a MMO was something totally different that you can only do with other people. Since I thought MMO was always dealing with other people and there was no NPCs I never tired any of them out. I did try Guild Wars 1 a bit. It was mostly single player but a bit of human interaction. Since I was never good at keyboard and mouse I quit it.
So now playing ESO. To me it seems it's a single player game but just like GW1 it has some human interaction. So is this how all MMO games work? Have I been missing all these MMOs games for over 20 years because I didn't know what a MMO really was? So a MMO is a single player game that can be played with others if you so choose. It's not mandatory but you still need to play online. I think I finally get it. I understand and I can accept it.
Not my quote but I love this saying
"I would pay It for support. But since they choosed we are just numbers and not customers, i dont mind if game and zos goes to oblivion"0 -
Azuramoonstar✭✭✭✭Azuramoonstar wrote: »My question is, why can't people just accept the fact this is a MMO and stop asking for your hand to be held in the matters of social interaction?
Awesome post. I like to thank you very much for this.
Thing is, how is having an off line mode prevent you from any of what you have said? For comments like "accept" or "move to a game that has it" is just the same result in having an off line mode. People will not be there. So if people will not be there it would make your on line experience better since you will have more server resources dedicated for your gaming experience unlike people like me who play the game solo. I am not telling anyone how to play. Why would other people tell me how to play? All I did was ask a question. All I did was offer a suggestion. Is that so bad? After all we are on a forum to discuss things.
I accept that this game is an MMO. Thing is, even after reading 4 pages here, I understand a bit better of what a MMO is. I still don't know 100% because I am still thinking it's something different. So let me see if I get this correct.
I am old. Almost 50 years old. Technology has passed me by. I am basically a hermit. I don't go out. I only have 2 friends. I don't even socialize online. So I basically live under a rock. So I am trying to get out of my rock and learn now. Never to old to learn.
So that said, in terms I can understand is a MMO is basically a single player game. I always though a MMO was something totally different that you can only do with other people. Since I thought MMO was always dealing with other people and there was no NPCs I never tired any of them out. I did try Guild Wars 1 a bit. It was mostly single player but a bit of human interaction. Since I was never good at keyboard and mouse I quit it.
So now playing ESO. To me it seems it's a single player game but just like GW1 it has some human interaction. So is this how all MMO games work? Have I been missing all these MMOs games for over 20 years because I didn't know what a MMO really was? So a MMO is a single player game that can be played with others if you so choose. It's not mandatory but you still need to play online. I think I finally get it. I understand and I can accept it.
guild wars 1 isn't an MMO it is a morpg, or was was called an ORPG. you have a hub location everyone boots up/log into. Them you have instanced quest content. You form groups in the hub local, before going to do the quest. Or you can do it it solo.
In the near 20+ years of MMO, they changed. World of warcraft was one of the first MMO to be mostly solo content, Which changed the genre. In previous MMO, grouping up was expected, and in some cases required. I started playing MMO with final fantasy 11. It was my first MMO, and in the early days, you only could solo up to level 10, anything after level 10 required a group. If you died/ko'ed you would lose experience and/or levels. Leveling could take months, and some content in the game took years to complete (old relic) though the game has been rendered mostly solo (mainly due to the community being tiny) so it changed.
Now a days MMO are more solo friendly, also with your suggestion. Most MMO are filled now a days with "mostly solo" communities. If all MMO had a solo mode, who would play the MMO mode? This happen in ff11 when they made the game solo friendly. People just stopped doing parties, and was either afk or solo. If you asked for help, you was told to level up and solo it. If you tell people you don't want to do that you get insulted, claiming how bad you are.
You even see it in this game with the mind of "why do we need a tank, if we out gear and can solo content" So people who do enjoy playing the tank role are left out due to lack of dps compared to a pure dps.
Also age is nothing, there was a beloved 80 year old WoW gamer when i was in my early 20s. And I sometimes watch an 80+ year old women play skyrim (she better then me and i've been gaming since i was 3).
Best way to experience mmo, just say hi to people. It is how I met my boyfriend. Join a guild, or make your own. Using depression or your age as an "reason" isn't all that good. My mom had depression yet she raised 3 kids, and baby sat/did foster care for most of my family. She didn't let it stop her from going out. (and her depression is way bad, she been on 12 different pills to get help and most didn't work) And age is just a number, if an 80+ year old women can start gaming and host a youtube channel. A 50 year old mmo gamer can say Hi! to another player.
Most ppl I met started mmo when they were 12 with ever quest. I started @ 19 with final fantasy 11.
Let me put it this way. MMO, are online table top rpg like dungeons and dragons. Would you expect or suggest people make a solo table top rpg? What would be the point when table top rpg require more then 1 person. Or put it in a simple way, would you expect companies to make single player board games like clue, mouse trap or monopoly. Even chess is better with 2 people.Long time mmo player: 2004-[current year]
Long time Elder scrolls player: Xbox launch morrowind.
Follower of the dawn and dusk, keeper of the moon and star.1 -
Ydrisselle✭✭✭✭✭Azuramoonstar wrote: »My question is, why can't people just accept the fact this is a MMO and stop asking for your hand to be held in the matters of social interaction?
Awesome post. I like to thank you very much for this.
Thing is, how is having an off line mode prevent you from any of what you have said? For comments like "accept" or "move to a game that has it" is just the same result in having an off line mode. People will not be there. So if people will not be there it would make your on line experience better since you will have more server resources dedicated for your gaming experience unlike people like me who play the game solo. I am not telling anyone how to play. Why would other people tell me how to play? All I did was ask a question. All I did was offer a suggestion. Is that so bad? After all we are on a forum to discuss things.
I accept that this game is an MMO. Thing is, even after reading 4 pages here, I understand a bit better of what a MMO is. I still don't know 100% because I am still thinking it's something different. So let me see if I get this correct.
I am old. Almost 50 years old. Technology has passed me by. I am basically a hermit. I don't go out. I only have 2 friends. I don't even socialize online. So I basically live under a rock. So I am trying to get out of my rock and learn now. Never to old to learn.
So that said, in terms I can understand is a MMO is basically a single player game. I always though a MMO was something totally different that you can only do with other people. Since I thought MMO was always dealing with other people and there was no NPCs I never tired any of them out. I did try Guild Wars 1 a bit. It was mostly single player but a bit of human interaction. Since I was never good at keyboard and mouse I quit it.
So now playing ESO. To me it seems it's a single player game but just like GW1 it has some human interaction. So is this how all MMO games work? Have I been missing all these MMOs games for over 20 years because I didn't know what a MMO really was? So a MMO is a single player game that can be played with others if you so choose. It's not mandatory but you still need to play online. I think I finally get it. I understand and I can accept it.
Today's MMOs are more of a hybrid game: a story content which can be done alone, as a solo player; and group content, which requires a full group of tank(s), healer(s) and damage dealers. In ESO parts of the group content can also be done alone (dolmens, public dungeons, normal dungeons, some easier veteran dungeons and world bosses). However a trial - ESO's raid - still requires a group.
Not so long ago - before WoW's Wrath of the Lich King expansion - the story content also had quests for groups with hard hitting elite mobs and minibosses. They were dropped slowly, because people moved through levelling zones, and after a point there wasn't enough new players, so there wasn't enough people for making groups and finishing these groups quests. If the level cap is let's say 75, there won't be enough lvl20 players for a lvl20 elite zone. That means people will skip these elite quests and subzones, and come back after they are much higher level, overpowering and oneshotting everything. It's a problem in ESO too, since high CP lvl players can solo the parts of the content which needed a group, like world bosses. (note: I'm not taking about those very skilled players, who can do these things at a lower level with weak gear, since most of the people can't do what they are doing routinely)
So, an MMO is a single player game, if you are interested in the lore and quests. As soon as you want to do some endgame content - trials, achievement hunting in dungeons, PvP - you will need a group, preferably a skilled one with great knowledge about the mechanics of the fights and gearing. But there are less and less endgame players, not only in ESO, but in any MMO as well. This genre was a niche one before WoW (and maybe Second Life), and it seems that it becomes a niche again after ~15 glorious years.1 -
Watchdog✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Depression and real life events kept me from playing. I am still fighting my depression right now, but fighting through it and playing ESO now, a lot compared to when I started. So I still feel like a total newb. I play ESO as a single player game experience. So I haven't really experience how a MMO is suppose to work. I see no difference yet from say any TES game or Witcher game or any single player game. So I would I know what a MMO is suppose to offer? Lots of times reading the threads on this forum makes no sense to me. I don't understand and just move on. I finally want to understand.
Hence wise I ask. I always tell my children, if you don't know ask.
For me, ESO has so far been mainly a solo experience with some ad hoc help both given and received in delves, dungeons and in the overworld.
I joined a relaxed, social guild, with over 400 members. We have both veteran raiders and new players like me in one pot. I like it and I have started getting into some group content with the help of experienced guildmates. No drama, just having fun. Sometimes alone, sometimes together.
I would suggest finding such a guild too.Member of Alith Legion: https://www.alithlegion.com0 -
Davor✭✭✭✭✭
✭Thank you @Azuramoonstar and @Ydrisselle . I believe I understand what a MMO is now in todays age. So it has changed and I didn't know about it.
Thank you @Watchdog I will see if I can. I joined one group, just need to figure out how to communicate with them now.
Not my quote but I love this saying
"I would pay It for support. But since they choosed we are just numbers and not customers, i dont mind if game and zos goes to oblivion"0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thank you Azuramoonstar and Ydrisselle . I believe I understand what a MMO is now in todays age. So it has changed and I didn't know about it.
Thank you Watchdog I will see if I can. I joined one group, just need to figure out how to communicate with them now.
To talk in guild chat, its usually /g# where the # is the number of the guild you joined. So my first guild is /g1 to talk in guild chat. If they have a discord or a teamspeak where you can voice chat with guild members, that info is usually on the Message of the Day.
For groups like for dungeons, its just /g0 -
TheValar85✭✭✭✭✭well let me inform you guys
those who say it is not posible to allow offline mode for this thats a huge lie.
second about cheating sience your charatcers are going to be localy resting on your HDD and those toons cant join the ZOS sever so no harm will be coused on the ZOs server side sorted characters, they are 2 spearted thing, so cheating in singly player does not and never will effect the ZOS online mod. if you want to play online you have to login to the server and have accsess to your account on ZOS server you can't cheating on that server or using your godlike stuffs what you created on single player, cos single player toons ar localy sorted to your HHD and not on the ZOs servers. its not a rocket sience to udnerstand.
About expanding the game core to allow this mmo to be a single player offline version too, it will take alot of resources form ZOS. they can do it, basicly every mmo developer can do it they just dont want to adimit it simply becasue of the number of the demands for it and actualy they dont want to loose their cash flow from the coustumers.
Not just because of payments for the coustumer supports, or the server parks rentings and the maintances. every mmo can be ported to offline mod. They just simply dont want to do it, even if it dies out, cos they will administrate the game as it was sucsessful prductum they had their income wich was scripted long before the development and they dont care about the rest of it anymore. this is how mmo busnines works.
But to be honest if ZOS ever decied they are going to release an offline mod for the game, surly that would be the greates thing in mmo hystories. And it will make them more popular then now and also their reputation will increase even that high that they cant even handle, considering how big the the Elder Scrolls fan base.
Piracy? nah thats not a reason to not to do it. the game already have private servers all over the world including working emulatros for the game (not going to tell it here where to finde them and how to use them so if @ZOS wants to know pm me and i galdly give this information for free)
if you doubt my words i dont realy care i've been in this busniness for 15+ year now and i know and they also know how things works and yes they can do it. they just simply wont do it. and thats all. and the game can survive if the devs wants to make sure to survive even the single player and online aspect of the game. Edited by TheValar85 on August 8, 2018 3:14AMGM Of The Lusty Argonian ERPGM Of THe Alessia Dynasty PVP GuildGM Of The Guardians Of MiddleEarthMy Smiling Emperor Profile Picture: https://ibb.co/bsOM6n0 -
Azuramoonstar✭✭✭✭TheValar85 wrote: »well let me inform you guys those who say it is not posible to allow offline mode for this thats a huge lie.
.
care to point out an example of this? as I never seen a full blown MMO with a single player/offline mode.
i' ve seen single player games with optional multiplayer. And i've seen orpg which are not full blown mmo.Long time mmo player: 2004-[current year]
Long time Elder scrolls player: Xbox launch morrowind.
Follower of the dawn and dusk, keeper of the moon and star.0
This discussion has been closed.