Can we get a definitive answer to the following

SugaComa · July 2018

The 3 bars population indicator in the campaign for each faction ...

How are they calculated

Seeing 3 bars of one faction. v 3 bars of another faction but still feeling outnumbered 3 to 1 makes you question the math around the damn things

I've asked I've searched and found no answer

I feel.its time unravelled this mystery and give us an answer once and for all

Nestor · July 2018

Cyrodiil is a huge map, your just not where the rest of your peeps are.

SugaComa · July 2018

Bloodmayne ... Only single keep left ... 3 bars red, 3 bars yellow , 1 blue

Map indicated no skirmishes no other keeps under attack in fact it shows a very serene image

At least 2 groups in the keep ...40 players max

But reds are out numbering us at the home keep, and from chatting to other group members we have spread over the map to monitor what's going on they're reporting lots of reds and blues but zero other AD

Now I'm not shouting conspiracy, faction stacking , cheating

I just want to know what is used to calculate the population

I have reports of IC is included others say it isn't

Some say delves are included others say it isn't

Some say if you port from one campaign into another it still counts you in the first

... I feel it's time all these theories were closed and were are given the facts on how it's calculated

zyk · July 2018

Cyrodiil and IC do have a shared population.

Nestor · July 2018

There is an NPC at the entrance of the zone with one of those clicky counters....

It does not matter what someone is doing, if they are in the zone, they are counted. There is your answer.

Because anyone that is in that zone can fight in PVP, so they are counted. Now, why IC is included in that count is a mystery to me. Although you do have to ride through Cyro to get there, so you could be sidetracked by a shiney battle. But, IC is pretty much a non factor most times. That place is dead everytime I have gone there.

As for not seeing someone where there is a battle, I spend more time getting to the fight than I ever do fighting, but then again I dont last long either. But even when I am in a good group where I dont die all the time, it is 80% horse, 20% combat.

I have also seen pitched battles that are no where near a resource or keep, though those are rare.

Also, this event has drawn all the PVE folks into that zone so they can get Caltrops. So, drawing any PVP conclusions during the first week of this event is going to give you all kinds of false positives.

SugaComa · July 2018

I've pvped for years ... And while I get what your saying ... You're still theorising how the country t works ...

I would like to see actual numbers ...

I want to see documented results

I get the whole pve brigade in here for vigour and caltrops and probably skyshards and fishing

Let me rephrase

Is one bar 50, one bar 100

Is ratio based to keep balance

Example server can hold unlimited numbers however if one faction. Has double numbers the bars indicate that irrelevant of if it's 200 people.or 2000 people

Alomar · July 2018

Other than stating during/before the first pvp beta test that the cap was 1800 with 600 per faction, ZOS has purposefully ignored stating what the total population cap or any of the low, med, or high figures are per campaign. They've significantly lowered them at least 3-4 times that I'm aware of, so I imagine they don't want you to know how bad (low) it has become compared to what was originally intended and capable of.

redspecter23 · July 2018

I wonder why we can't be allowed to see actual numbers? It might be enlightening. Let's say the population cap is 100 for the sake of argument. You could see pop capped blue and red at exactly 100 and a 2 bar yellow at 70 for instance. If you ever under any circumstances see a pop capped faction above the cap, then it could be an exploit at work. There have been exploits in the past (and possibly currently) that allow players to bypass the caps. A bit of transparency would help alleviate the concerns about breaking pop cap. We would know the players are there somewhere, even if we can't see them.

Side note. It's far past the time that we remove IC from the standard campaigns. Queue us separately for it and DO NOT count the IC population toward Cyrodiil.

VaranisArano · July 2018

SugaComa wrote: »

I've pvped for years ... And while I get what your saying ... You're still theorising how the country t works ...

I would like to see actual numbers ...

I want to see documented results

I get the whole pve brigade in here for vigour and caltrops and probably skyshards and fishing

Let me rephrase

Is one bar 50, one bar 100

Is ratio based to keep balance

Example server can hold unlimited numbers however if one faction. Has double numbers the bars indicate that irrelevant of if it's 200 people.or 2000 people

You aren't going to get the numbers you want. ZOS doesn't release the numbers.

1. Players would whine horribly about being outnumbered.

2. Everyone would see just how small the PVP population is now compared to launch, thanks to over a year of persistent performance issues with the PVP campaigns.

So I'd be right there with you wanting numbers, but I'd be shocked if ZOS ever tells us the numbers.

That being said, ZOS fixed the cross faction queue bug, so the most likely explanation is that you aren't seeing your whole faction's population at one time. Its pretty easy for me to fall into a mindset of "where the heck is EP?!" When the answer is "Somewhere other than where I think they should be".

DeadlyRecluse · July 2018

I would be very surprised if we were ever to get accurate numbers from an official source, for 2 reasons:

1. Part of the veneer of ESO PvP is the uncertainty--every alliance can confidently assert they are the underdog, so nobody feels too bad about losing. This doesn't foster a longterm competetive environment, but it does take some of the sting out for casuals.

2. The max population is a LOT lower than it used to be. It's at least 90, (we know that thanks to the leaderboards back when bleakers farming was taking place in EU, 90 people were on the scoreboard after the first score calculation) but is probably a lot more than that (since some of the people farming surely guested that server or were queued in). IIRC, there have been at least 4 documented reductions in population--I forget the originally published amount that could be in cyrodiil, but it was 4 figures worth of players, and multiple servers were full (AND there were more low-medium pop servers up!). The population of the game has grown leaps and bounds, campaign population has shrank, number of campaigns has shrank, and (outside of this event) usually only one campaign is full...

Acknowledging the drain in PvP population is probably bad PR. Can't imagine we get that officially acknowledged.

Kikke · July 2018

agreed, would like to know this aswell

Thlepse · August 2018

the population cap is realistically around 100 or 150, the pop bars are a very unreliable indicator because its not updated correctly most of the time when its between 3 bars and the lock symbol

EDIT: typo

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · August 2018

Populations represent a range e.g. 20-40 so one faction could theoretically have less players if they were on the low end of their bracket and the other faction was on the higher end.

Personally I feel the cap is around 90 per faction. We fought 83 at faregyl prior to this event so allowing for some afks at base I feel that's fairly accurate.

Additionally im fairly sure different servers have different caps.

Thogard · August 2018

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Populations represent a range e.g. 20-40 so one faction could theoretically have less players if they were on the low end of their bracket and the other faction was on the higher end.

Personally I feel the cap is around 90 per faction. We fought 83 at faregyl prior to this event so allowing for some afks at base I feel that's fairly accurate.

Additionally im fairly sure different servers have different caps.

That is very interesting about the servers having different caps. What observations have lead you to conclusion?

SugaComa · August 2018

Thogard wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Populations represent a range e.g. 20-40 so one faction could theoretically have less players if they were on the low end of their bracket and the other faction was on the higher end.

Personally I feel the cap is around 90 per faction. We fought 83 at faregyl prior to this event so allowing for some afks at base I feel that's fairly accurate.

Additionally im fairly sure different servers have different caps.

That is very interesting about the servers having different caps. What observations have lead you to conclusion?

Yes, please share ... This is what I'm getting at a lot of theories with no hard facts ...

But this is something I've not heard before

WildWilbur · August 2018

zyk wrote: »

Cyrodiil and IC do have a shared population.

^This. I really want to know who at ZOS had this 'brilliant' idea...

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · August 2018

Thogard wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Populations represent a range e.g. 20-40 so one faction could theoretically have less players if they were on the low end of their bracket and the other faction was on the higher end.

Personally I feel the cap is around 90 per faction. We fought 83 at faregyl prior to this event so allowing for some afks at base I feel that's fairly accurate.

Additionally im fairly sure different servers have different caps.

That is very interesting about the servers having different caps. What observations have lead you to conclusion?

We did some small amounts of testing back in the day group queuing to different servers and checking pop changes. Also just general observation of playing. E.g. can port to a "locked" shor and find very few enemies (comparably) vs a "locked" vivec

SugaComa · August 2018

While answering another post it hit me ...

Could I and others be contributing to the population bar by not being logged in but still in cyrodil

I only ask as I'm hearing people complain of long queues into cyrodil ... I've not experienced any I log in I'm in cyrodil when I log out I'm in cyrodil

Only thing changes is I'm moved to western / esstern gates

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · August 2018

SugaComa wrote: »

While answering another post it hit me ...

Could I and others be contributing to the population bar by not being logged in but still in cyrodil

I only ask as I'm hearing people complain of long queues into cyrodil ... I've not experienced any I log in I'm in cyrodil when I log out I'm in cyrodil

Only thing changes is I'm moved to western / esstern gates

Not past a certain timer. You log back into your last location (Cyro) when there is no queue. If there is a queue you would be back in PvE. Queues only start when the server is full locked (lock symbol shows before this)

SugaComa · August 2018

Maybe I tend to play towards the back end of peak

10:00pm to midnight here

Hammy01 · August 2018

I have been asking for real numbers for a long time... The main reason for doing so is because I am tired of explaining to my SO that just because we have 3 bars and the other factions have 3 bars does not mean we are even. We could have 201 people in cyro but the other factions could have 300 or more.

Hammy01 · August 2018

Nestor wrote: »

There is an NPC at the entrance of the zone with one of those clicky counters....

It does not matter what someone is doing, if they are in the zone, they are counted. There is your answer.

Because anyone that is in that zone can fight in PVP, so they are counted. Now, why IC is included in that count is a mystery to me. Although you do have to ride through Cyro to get there, so you could be sidetracked by a shiney battle. But, IC is pretty much a non factor most times. That place is dead everytime I have gone there.

As for not seeing someone where there is a battle, I spend more time getting to the fight than I ever do fighting, but then again I dont last long either. But even when I am in a good group where I dont die all the time, it is 80% horse, 20% combat.

I have also seen pitched battles that are no where near a resource or keep, though those are rare.

Also, this event has drawn all the PVE folks into that zone so they can get Caltrops. So, drawing any PVP conclusions during the first week of this event is going to give you all kinds of false positives.

What NPC? Give some better details... I need to check this out!

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · August 2018

Hammy01 wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

There is an NPC at the entrance of the zone with one of those clicky counters....

It does not matter what someone is doing, if they are in the zone, they are counted. There is your answer.

Because anyone that is in that zone can fight in PVP, so they are counted. Now, why IC is included in that count is a mystery to me. Although you do have to ride through Cyro to get there, so you could be sidetracked by a shiney battle. But, IC is pretty much a non factor most times. That place is dead everytime I have gone there.

As for not seeing someone where there is a battle, I spend more time getting to the fight than I ever do fighting, but then again I dont last long either. But even when I am in a good group where I dont die all the time, it is 80% horse, 20% combat.

I have also seen pitched battles that are no where near a resource or keep, though those are rare.

Also, this event has drawn all the PVE folks into that zone so they can get Caltrops. So, drawing any PVP conclusions during the first week of this event is going to give you all kinds of false positives.

What NPC? Give some better details... I need to check this out!

Which faction do you play? it's in a different location for each.

Hammy01 · August 2018

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Hammy01 wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

There is an NPC at the entrance of the zone with one of those clicky counters....

It does not matter what someone is doing, if they are in the zone, they are counted. There is your answer.

Because anyone that is in that zone can fight in PVP, so they are counted. Now, why IC is included in that count is a mystery to me. Although you do have to ride through Cyro to get there, so you could be sidetracked by a shiney battle. But, IC is pretty much a non factor most times. That place is dead everytime I have gone there.

As for not seeing someone where there is a battle, I spend more time getting to the fight than I ever do fighting, but then again I dont last long either. But even when I am in a good group where I dont die all the time, it is 80% horse, 20% combat.

I have also seen pitched battles that are no where near a resource or keep, though those are rare.

Also, this event has drawn all the PVE folks into that zone so they can get Caltrops. So, drawing any PVP conclusions during the first week of this event is going to give you all kinds of false positives.

What NPC? Give some better details... I need to check this out!

Which faction do you play? it's in a different location for each.

DC

Potenza · August 2018

They don't want you to know exactly how many players are on.