Something needs to be done about lethal arrow

Wreuntzylla · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

... each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

There is your problem right there.

I played bow gank on and off but completely stopped with the nerf to might of the guild. Some people I hit non-block for 1.5k...

Palidon · August 2018

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

This is boarder line an exploit with how effective it is.....

Where is this border line exploit. That is what a good Nightblade Bow Ganker will do with a appropriate Bow Gank build.

Lethal Arrow reduces healing by 30%. By putting Champion points into Befoul that will further reduce the healing done.
Lethal Arrow can be used up to a distance of 48 meters with Poison Injection up to 41 meters. If that player was a Wood Elf one of that race class passives, Stealthy increases the damage while in stealth by 9%. Most likely the player who wasted you 30 times was also using a five piece Marksman set which increases the damage of Bow abilities against players by 8%. In addition that player could of also been using the Hawkseye set with Marksman for an additional 5% Bow damage or Spriggans for additional penetration or even Morag Tong for increased poison damage. There are also other areas in the Champion Point tree that will increase overall damage.

I am so sick of these nerf this or nerf that threads. That Nightblade ganker was good and new how to effectively play his build against you and your pals.

RedTalon · August 2018

Granted the nerf threads for pvp pop up in large amounts during midyear event.

Think some people kepe their gankers around just for this event sometimes.

But are more then enough way to avoid gankers less your questing in the pvp areas, and even then ways to counter stuff and more then enough info out there.

TheInfernalRage · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

This is boarder line an exploit with how effective it is..... Im a 750 player in pvp gear, have been pvp'ing for over a year and a half and I didnt get more than one attack off on this player before I died 30+ tries in a row. The fact that a decent pvper can be 2 shot before being able to do anything is absurd.

It's what it should be. If you're not prepared for it, even a supposed garbage weapon like a bow can hit you like a truck. I'd agree on nerfing this function of the bow, but they might as well overhaul its design.

OneKhajiitCrimeWave · August 2018

Everyone has known for a long while that there's a few issues with snipe with regards to its animations and sound/health desync that comes with it. The animation issue is the same with any cast time projectile such as Dark Flare where the animation is cut shorter on second cast and this causes a desync with animation and sound. The attack will hit before you hear the second one and damage will apply when the sound plays.

If this desync part was fixed then that would just be fine.

Most players dodge roll from pure instinct now the second that first arrow hits or is heard. There's usually more in the air already so is the safest bet.

ItsMeToo · August 2018

Try playing this game deaf. Sound warnings don't help and before I got a faster internet I didn't even have the visual warnings.

Nerf sound and visuals.

Welcome to my world.

AdicusDio · August 2018

I run the other morph of snipe and it'll get 14-16k on shield-less players.

TBH, there are a ton of sorc abilities that are just as bad or worse. Or tanks somehow able to output 10k per hit, or all the snares, etc..

REALLY should be like this:

DPS = paper thin defense untouched offense
Tank = Extremely high health, low/no damage
Healer = Shields and heals

IF they forced this in pvp, it'd go so much smoother. As it stands now, you have annoying builds that can negate a couple 100k in damage and then whine anytime a set even bugs them. Or a sorc that can stand there and shrug off repeated 14k hits x 8 other players doing their own damage then snare and weak damage you to death when you are out of resources.

So many broken things in a broken game.

Thrain · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

This is boarder line an exploit with how effective it is..... Im a 750 player in pvp gear, have been pvp'ing for over a year and a half and I didnt get more than one attack off on this player before I died 30+ tries in a row. The fact that a decent pvper can be 2 shot before being able to do anything is absurd.

There is one thing you could do against bowspammers inside a keep. (i do that always and its funny^^)
You come with a sorc, you use elegance set, and mages guild passive, then you sneak to this keep until you are there where he kills ppl.
Then you can overload gank him^^
Is overload ganking crap? maybe yes but for thoose ppl who are inside a keep and only spamming 1 attack.....for thoose ppl its perfect^^

Or you could come with an dk and reflect his lethal arrows so he would kill himself by attacking you

agegarton · August 2018

OGLezard wrote: »

Roflmfao "borderline an exploit"

This wins..... because something is effective it is now close to being called out as an exploit.

I have heard it all now ^_^

Was going to say the same - no need now. We have reached that "fine line" between players who can play, and cheaters. Apparently it's a much finer line than I thought!!!

FloppyTouch · August 2018

Snipe is very strong but I just flap my wings and let's them kill themselves. Best part about snipe spammers is how squishy they are.

martinhpb16_ESO · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

As a rampant bow ganker I can tell you 12k is exceptional. Even if I spam snipe > light > poison arrow so that they all land at once 12k is pushing it. Most die from the poison or gap close to finish. If they do die fast they are either on a horse or have some sort of other debuff / damage on them.

You need to improve your build and use of defensive passives & skills if this is happening to you. Were you wearing PVE gear?

Ever heard of block or LOS for a start.

There are a whole bunch of passives that build my snipe, racial, class etc.

I get exploded all the time with frags etc. I get cc'd by jabs until i'm jelly. Do I cry exploit - no.

Bow ganking is situational, there are a huge number of counters and some players - those arrows just bounce off. The life of the bow ganker is a lonely one. You hardly ever play with others, instead you are always looking for that target away from zergs etc.

Its a fine balance between upfront dd and resource management - you need to be able to move fast in stealth and keep up the stam and magi regen to be able to move around fast. When that dead persons chums come looking, you gotta scram like Scooby Doo.

Its a playstyle that induces rage from some but its all part of the pvp experience. Snipe has already been nerfed in the past and the old bow armors like marksman and hawkeye sets are pretty useless now, although they do crop up in builds from time to time.

Please no bow nerf, its bad enough with all the trolling and tbagging as it is. Not all of us want to play Sorc or DK.

AdicusDio · August 2018

If you are getting hit by 1-5 snipe/morphs and then dead, that's a latency issue. It means the person firing it sees your "avatar" on "his" screen as just standing in one place and repeatedly fires it. By the time the info bottleneck clears and "your" screen is registering the hits, it's too late as the info being sent was that all hits connected.

There are sorc attacks that do the same thing or are able to be fired off and by the time the bottleneck gets cleared, you are dead.

Best advice is move constantly and try not stay in the same spot on keep walls if it can be helped, or do NOT stand near the edge of platforms for more than a sec or 2. If someone has eagle eye on, you'll hate them more.

martinhpb16_ESO · August 2018

TempPlayer wrote: »

I agree with something need to be done with lethal arrow. Since it is call lethal arrow, it should one-shot kill anything, otherwise it should call nonlethal arrow.

If you are being one shotted there is something seriously wrong with your build.

biminirwb17_ESO · August 2018

My sniper can hit for 12-13k but its rare, most times it does 7-8k damage. Was OP in divines? I do know who when and where to snipe and when to forget it.

The worse situation is releasing a snipe and the dk reacts with the flappys, I have to block oh noes .

ArchMikem · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

You said there were three of you. I assume none of you were Nightblades? Because this is exactly why I go into Cyrodiil as a Nightblade. Piercing Mark saves lives.

Biro123 · August 2018

martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »

TempPlayer wrote: »

I agree with something need to be done with lethal arrow. Since it is call lethal arrow, it should one-shot kill anything, otherwise it should call nonlethal arrow.

If you are being one shotted there is something seriously wrong with your build.

I get one-shotted fairly often by gankers.. whether by snipe or incap burst.. doesn't really matter. My build has low health to maximise magica and rely on shields.
I get killed in combat with shields down - my own stupid fault.
I get killed while travelling, It's just a consequence of my build-choice. I live with it - it was my choice and a build weakness I accept so I can benefit from its strengths.

But as soon as someone dies from a sorc burst --ohhh, the forums explode...! Your perfectly-timed 4-ability, telegraphed burst shouldn't be able to kill my med-armoured, low-health ganker!!!!!! Nerf Sorc!!!! Its never their build choice that's at fault, never their inability to see it coming.. Nooo..

Nerf Sorc!
Nerf Sorc!
Nerf Sorc!

Ahem, sorry.. These forums do this to you eventually..

olsborg · August 2018

The worst part about snipers is the desync, it happens almost everytime someone snipes me, I get hit with 2 or 3 arrows before I even notice im being sniped. No sound or animation is showing..

bloodthirstyvampire · August 2018

Just remove all weapons, armour, skills, cp and attributes.
Because it'll be nerfed eventually

martinhpb16_ESO · August 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

If you are being one shotted there is something seriously wrong with your build.

I get one-shotted fairly often by gankers.. whether by snipe or incap burst.. doesn't really matter. My build has low health to maximise magica and rely on shields.
I get killed in combat with shields down - my own stupid fault.
I get killed while travelling, It's just a consequence of my build-choice. I live with it - it was my choice and a build weakness I accept so I can benefit from its strengths.

But as soon as someone dies from a sorc burst --ohhh, the forums explode...! Your perfectly-timed 4-ability, telegraphed burst shouldn't be able to kill my med-armoured, low-health ganker!!!!!! Nerf Sorc!!!! Its never their build choice that's at fault, never their inability to see it coming.. Nooo..

Nerf Sorc!
Nerf Sorc!
Nerf Sorc!

Ahem, sorry.. These forums do this to you eventually.. [/quote]

Agree nerf Sorc! When shields are up I cant gank em and 9/10 they aoe, cc me to death, while I'm dodge rolling like a little flee

(had a whisper from a sorc that decimated me yesterday "balanced class

" )

I'm with ya, nerf lethal arrow, would be the last straw for me. Too much nerf crying.

ezio45 · August 2018

Stovahkiin wrote: »

I might agree if it weren’t for the fact that the bow is already pretty useless. It really can’t stand more nerfs right now imo.

Could even nerf the sets that got with this build but there are ultis that dont hit for 12k.... this combo is basically incap in ability form

ezio45 · August 2018

TheShadowScout wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons...

Call your dragonknight friend, let him flap wings, laugh at result?
Use anti-stealth stuff, magelight, detection potions, etc, then smack him out of his sniper leathers?
Go sneaky yourself, and counter-gank?
Stack shields, be ready to unload when he reveals his position with the next arrow?
Ready heals, play target, heal up while friend rushes the sniper once he shoots you?

At least that's what people did to my poor lil nightblade archer girl when I tried that trick in Cyrodil...

tried this, had 2 shields going at one point, didnt help because of the stun, didnt get past curse after he popped up
mage light he said outta range
called in a zerg, killed his buddies, thought he was dead walked out to ride to roe and nope, dead on door

Zpook · August 2018

technohic wrote: »

Reduce damage 40% and remove cast. Give bow a spammable. I use it as an opener but on a non-gank build, pretty much better off most the time without it. On a ganker, it’s not really needed

Bow allready has a spammable, light attacks is the name of the skill.

ezio45 · August 2018

ArchMikem wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

You said there were three of you. I assume none of you were Nightblades? Because this is exactly why I go into Cyrodiil as a Nightblade. Piercing Mark saves lives.

nah one sorc (myself) and 2 nbs

Recon4thCav · August 2018

Sounds like the op is a *** and should not be in pvp.

technohic · August 2018

ezio45 wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Ok so was in pvp and 2 other players and I noticed some player killing people outside nik, we tried like 30+ times to kill this guy and failed every single time, why?

Because he was spamming lethal arrow from stealth with trap poisons and each lethal arrow hit was hitting me for 12k....

You said there were three of you. I assume none of you were Nightblades? Because this is exactly why I go into Cyrodiil as a Nightblade. Piercing Mark saves lives.

nah one sorc (myself) and 2 nbs

So 2 friendly NBs were there. I've ran into a few that practically weave cloak with abilities to where you play hell to hit them back. If I am on my NB, I will check out a second to just slot mark as these guys are often full glass to hit hard and be able to sustain that. Take away cloak and they're dead.

SilverWF · August 2018

Stovahkiin wrote: »

TempPlayer wrote: »

I agree with something need to be done with lethal arrow. Since it is call lethal arrow, it should one-shot kill anything, otherwise it should call nonlethal arrow.

Maybe just change the name to semi-lethal arrow

Knee Arrow

Sandman929 · August 2018

I like these threads not only for the OP, but for the replies. Yes, snipe is annoying, especially when it's spammed by someone at range when you're fighting someone else. Absolutely agreed.
Now for the replies "just be a DK when it happens", "be wearing Sentry", "be wearing Swarm Mother or be with someone who is"...people suggesting counter-play for very specific pain points that involves doing something that, for the rest of the gaming experience, makes little to no sense or is completely impractical (in the case of suggesting that the victim should have been a different class to help out with this situation) is a good indication that the problematic skill should be looked at. Or at least the conditions that make the skill problematic; lag, desync.

Kuramas9tails · August 2018

Palidon wrote: »

A good Bow Ganker is hard to detect or kill. They have the advantage of distance attacks which is the whole point of Sniping.

Naw, a Mageblade and DK with wings can easily counter their pathetic build. I kill so many snipers and bag them in Cyrodiil.

SilverWF · August 2018

Sandman929 wrote: »

...people suggesting counter-play for very specific pain points that involves doing something that, for the rest of the gaming experience, makes little to no sense or is completely impractical

Excuse me, but why we must seriously care about 'very specific situations, that has no sense for the general gameplay' then?

Sandman929 · August 2018

SilverWF wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

...people suggesting counter-play for very specific pain points that involves doing something that, for the rest of the gaming experience, makes little to no sense or is completely impractical

Excuse me, but why we must seriously care about 'very specific situations, that has no sense for the general gameplay' then?

I don't know what you're saying. To clarify what I'm saying, counter-play suggestions that involve something impractical isn't really counter-play. Someone can't simply be a DK the moment they're getting snipe spammed, and practically no one has a reason to run around all the time in 5 Sentry or 2 Swarm Mother just in case there's a stealthed sniper around.
For me, Lethal Arrow isn't much of an issue when the game works. There is an audible warning and it's dodgeable, so that's fine, until the state of the game makes it so there aren't those things and you die instantly with no warning.