(Stam) PvP is hard!

srnm · July 2018

Why do I have to wait for my dawnbreaker to be up before spamming steel tornado to be able to take out 80+% of players on Vivec?

But seriously, almost every PvP streamer is running steel tornado now.
And people complain about Sload's and a lack of build diversity?

Drakkdjinn · July 2018

+1 spin spam is stupid easy to cheese.

Nyladreas · July 2018

I mean.. you're always freee to run one of the many counter builds to spin to win cheese

Tornados usually just tickle me

Asmael · July 2018

Why do I have to wait for my dawnbreaker to be up before spamming steel tornado to be able to take out 80+% of players on Vivec?

80% of people sitting at less than 20k HP, light armor no impen and no damage shields nor healing, sure.

Altho I am certain you have a few links to provide showcasing how overpowered steelnado is against players who aren't AFK.

Gprime31 · July 2018

Drakkdjinn wrote: »

+1 spin spam is stupid easy to cheese.

Orc sorc, hurricane,3swift, speed pots, DB,spin-to-win= gg

Biro123 · July 2018

I don't know what changed to make it meta

raasdal · July 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

I don't know what changed to make it meta

Nothing changed. And i honestly don't know what fuzz is about. The counter to "spin-2-win cheese", whatever that is meant to be, is to not be AFK. Outside of pure zergplay, Steel Tornado is only usefull for finishing off low-health targets that would otherwise dodgeroll / cloak etc or for the same, in smallscale. I have NEVER died to anyone 1v1 who used Steel Tornado. I have killed plenty of them though.

Feanor · July 2018

It's lethal in BGs though, especially coupled with stamWarden burst. Still, I remember when it had a range of 12m and whole trains were running it exclusively.

Feanor · July 2018

Biro123 wrote: »

I don't know what changed to make it meta

It became undodgeable.

del9 · July 2018

Respectfully disagree OP. Its not just stam, ESO PVP is hard for everyone. Hate that we have to depend on RNG for my sloads to proc my
Skoria

Durham · July 2018

I hate spin to win also.... I run duel wield but its not a fun ability to use there is no targeting or anything ... Ult drop then spin its that simple in most cases....

Currently the combat in PVP has gotten worse... AOE death spam require little to no skill combine that with proc sets its just stupid.. No strategy or no active combat play .. I have always liked the way combat worked in this game but its currently moved into a bad position...

Vapirko · July 2018

Agreed it’s stupid. I’m fairly certain we’ve got people running around with a bunch of blood thirsty trait jewelry spamming steel tornado.

Asgari · July 2018

problem is stam doesnt have many options for execute

Ender1310 · July 2018

Ehh its just a phase guys. Every game goes through it. Post constructively and next patch will fix it. I don't like it either I miss being a heavy armor tank. Now with all the stuns unmitigated damage and apparently ( I didn't know it) un-dodgeable steel tornado it's impossible to be in an open battle on the front lines. You just melt under the pressure now. Meh I have every alt so its nothing for me to gear up the sorc and melt faces from 40 ft away.

Yubarius · July 2018

Asgari wrote: »

problem is stam doesnt have many options for execute

Ha, that's sarcasm right?

Waffennacht · July 2018

It's undodgeable, it's AoE, it's an execute

Really it's the undodgeable part

Drakkdjinn · July 2018

raasdal wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

I don't know what changed to make it meta

Nothing changed. And i honestly don't know what fuzz is about. The counter to "spin-2-win cheese", whatever that is meant to be, is to not be AFK. Outside of pure zergplay, Steel Tornado is only usefull for finishing off low-health targets that would otherwise dodgeroll / cloak etc or for the same, in smallscale. I have NEVER died to anyone 1v1 who used Steel Tornado. I have killed plenty of them though.

There's a few sets that interact with Spin in ways they either shouldn't or haven't previously that's been present in recent patches, that is my understanding.

srnm · July 2018

Trying to resurrect this discussion because of what I'm seeing on twitch right now.

There is a certain prominent streamer whose only offensive ability is steel tornado.
We are talking about spin-to-win ripping through dozens of the opposition - with a leap now and then when possible.
On sotha-sil it appears that skill alone is enough to guarantee the win against most opponents.

I don't know what the solution is... just that the way steel tornado is being used, in no-CP and CP campaigns, makes for really bad game play.

Will try it out for myself on my stam toons

kyle.wilson · July 2018

Feanor wrote: »

It's lethal in BGs though, especially coupled with stamWarden burst. Still, I remember when it had a range of 12m and whole trains were running it exclusively.

That was of course after the pulsar spamming trains.

Thogard · July 2018

srnm wrote: »

Trying to resurrect this discussion because of what I'm seeing on twitch right now.

There is a certain prominent streamer whose only offensive ability is steel tornado.
We are talking about spin-to-win ripping through dozens of the opposition - with a leap now and then when possible.
On sotha-sil it appears that skill alone is enough to guarantee the win against most opponents.

I don't know what the solution is... just that the way steel tornado is being used, in no-CP and CP campaigns, makes for really bad game play.

Will try it out for myself on my stam toons

It’s the only spammable in the DW skill line.

I was running it for a lot of last night. Still use offensive class skills though.

I’m sure that’s true for whichever prominent streamer you’re referring to as well.

Trinotops · July 2018

Thogard wrote: »

It’s the only spammable in the DW skill line.

brandonv516 · July 2018

Steel Tornado is very lethal in BGs. One of a handful of AoEs to really worry about when trying to evade.

I always find myself satisfied killing anyone running this setup.

CatchMeTrolling · July 2018

Thogard wrote: »

srnm wrote: »

Trying to resurrect this discussion because of what I'm seeing on twitch right now.

There is a certain prominent streamer whose only offensive ability is steel tornado.
We are talking about spin-to-win ripping through dozens of the opposition - with a leap now and then when possible.
On sotha-sil it appears that skill alone is enough to guarantee the win against most opponents.

I don't know what the solution is... just that the way steel tornado is being used, in no-CP and CP campaigns, makes for really bad game play.

Will try it out for myself on my stam toons

It’s the only spammable in the DW skill line.

I was running it for a lot of last night. Still use offensive class skills though.

I’m sure that’s true for whichever prominent streamer you’re referring to as well.

Shrouded daggers too.

But we know he’s talking about Fengrush

Amdar_Godkiller · July 2018

Great for 1vX (AOE execute) and Xv1 (unblockable). Weak for 1v1, compared to any and every other execute.

mursie · July 2018

srnm wrote: »

Trying to resurrect this discussion because of what I'm seeing on twitch right now.

There is a certain prominent streamer whose only offensive ability is steel tornado.
We are talking about spin-to-win ripping through dozens of the opposition - with a leap now and then when possible.
On sotha-sil it appears that skill alone is enough to guarantee the win against most opponents.

I don't know what the solution is... just that the way steel tornado is being used, in no-CP and CP campaigns, makes for really bad game play.

Will try it out for myself on my stam toons

that certain streamer was emp - wearing VD and heem ja - spinning and leaping for a quick proc. i think it's working as intended.

DivineFirstYOLO · July 2018

I've watched some streams.. it's not his fault and not the fault of steel tornado that people die like potatoes.. after all it's still only an execute ability (dealing more dmg when in execute range - OK?)

The_Protagonist · July 2018

Dawnbreaker brings the health down to below 50% on most people, in range for DW execute passive and Tornado just happens to be undodgeable, that's why.

exeeter702 · July 2018

Feng was taking the smartest approach. Double ap brings out the potatoes. Steel tornando cuts down the potatoes.

Its that simple. What was happening on his stream is not in any way a benchmark to gauge the potency of steel tornando and whether or not its overtuned. (Its not)

srnm · July 2018

I was watching while said streamer was emp - and it was brutal.
However, I was watching post-emp too and saw much the same results.

Also, no way calling out the prominent streamer for using what's effective.
Lots of other streamers and non-streamers spam spin-to-win.

The issue is more that an aoe undodgeable spammable execute, that does decent non-execute damage, and has a wide area, makes for one-button gameplay.

Twohothardware · July 2018

Warden is the only class Spin2Win is somewhat unbalanced on because of the up front burst from Dawnbreaker + Shalks. Dawnbreaker and Steel Tornado by itself isn't enough to kill most players unless they're just super squish.