Is 2H Stamina DPS realistic?

SmellyUnlimited · July 2018

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

yttoks · July 2018

DW is still better, so if you're looking for 40k you're probably going to have trouble with a 2H. I'm sure the very, very, very good can do it on a 2H, but they can also hit 50 with DW, so...

Faffox · July 2018

Majority of your damage comes from endless hail and execute. I notice that I can do more if execute phase is long enough. But since a lot of people running bloodthirsty, sadly it's not.

newtinmpls · July 2018

You have two bars.

Runefang · July 2018

Well double bow can hit over 40k, I'd find it hard to believe a 2H/Bow build couldn't as well.

Naturally DW is still better DPS.

Drakkdjinn · July 2018

Totally viable, but not totally min-maxed.

Bowser · July 2018

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

Liofa · July 2018

Try this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42qCGlp1Ma8

Ramber · July 2018

had a little help did we lol

Integral1900 · July 2018

Night mothers, storm fist and any set that boosts healing

Dual wield back bar for buffs and healing skills like bloodthirst

Two handed front bar for most of the damage output

Works a treat, tanks normal dungeons and will hit 25k (enough for any pve content if you learn the mechanics) while being a nice and rugged dps in vet, love it, plays as smooth as silk. Also, this this is an awesome debuff supplier

No complaints received yet, had a few compliments.... also half the sorc class passives are useless to you so more points for skills

Edit: one warning I should now add

The sorc is effective but because it’s nature is more towards lots of high crit quick attacks you will find yourself mostly doing light attacks and maintaining your buffs and aoe effects which gets dull very fast indeed

Using a two handed weapon on a dk works a treat and sinergises well with their skills and visuals, dk is more about a few big hits than several little ones, they stack more to weapon damage than crit which plays well with two handed, also they seem more varied

Raraaku · July 2018

31k is pretty good in of itself, you should be able to run most if not all veteran trials, so I'm not sure why hitting 40k+ is really needed unless you're into leaderboard speed runs on veteran trials. DW is still stronger in single-target DPS compared to 2H, but 2H has received a boost with the introduction of Crushing Weapon. You could use the Executioner Morph instead of Reverse Slice, but you sacrifice 2H's biggest advantage (AoE splash damage) for more single-target damage. Executioner will help improve the parse, but I think Reverse Slice is the better choice for use outside of the dummy. Sorcerer is my least favorite class so I can't offer any insight into the class.

But as I said before, 31k in of itself is respectable and shouldn't be an issue outside of speed runs.

Sparr0w · July 2018

Yep 2H can hit 40k if you get your rotation down properly. You also get the added benefit of built in splash damage.

Alcast used to run a 2H StamSorc for vet trials, swapped to DW on the last boss tho. Have a look on his YT.

SmellyUnlimited · July 2018

Integral1900 wrote: »

Night mothers, storm fist and any set that boosts healing

Dual wield back bar for buffs and healing skills like bloodthirst

Two handed front bar for most of the damage output

Works a treat, tanks normal dungeons and will hit 25k (enough for any pve content if you learn the mechanics) while being a nice and rugged dps in vet, love it, plays as smooth as silk. Also, this this is an awesome debuff supplier

No complaints received yet, had a few compliments.... also half the sorc class passives are useless to you so more points for skills

Not having bow is a deal breaker for me. Maelstrom endless Hail is the strongest stamina attack in the game - single target AND AoE. And 25k is very very low, especially if you’re applying major fracture yourself with Nightmother. It’s no enough for any PvE content -vHoF and vMoL have considerable dps race portions. 8 dps pulling 25k will NOT drop a steamer in time before another one pops, then it’s practically RIP

SmellyUnlimited · July 2018

How much more dps would you tack on if I’m at 33k without puncture? Just tryin to get a ballpark of how much additional damage that debuff would provide.

I like the 2h play style, and you’re right, Crushing weapon is nice for it. Having an execute, in addition to Implosion, is pretty strong.

RavenSworn · July 2018

Not to mention the execute phase starts at 50%...

Bobby_V_Rockit · July 2018

I dont know, I been trying real hard but the light and heavy attacks just feel so dang slow

Bobby_V_Rockit · July 2018

Bowser wrote: »

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

But without Arms of Relequen and Advancing Yokuda?

Strider__Roshin · July 2018

Anything is doable, but not everything is competitive.

Danksta · July 2018

RavenSworn wrote: »

Not to mention the execute phase starts at 50%...

I don't think you'd want to start executing at 50%, pretty sure that'd be a DPS loss.

kylewwefan · July 2018

I was told the execute damage scales. So you don’t get that %330 until enemy has around %1 health left.

I get more damage and flexibility with daggers.

I use 2H sometimes because I like the way it looks. It is viable, but there’s better options. Play how you want.

SodanTok · July 2018

I parse like 3k dps lower than on DW so its very much realistic (45.5 vs 42). I would imagine the same difference (around 10% DPS loss) would apply for any DPS you get on normal DW build (at least on stamsorc)

Danksta wrote: »

RavenSworn wrote: »

Not to mention the execute phase starts at 50%...

I don't think you'd want to start executing at 50%, pretty sure that'd be a DPS loss.

Personally Reverse Slice starts outperforming in damage Crushing Weapon around 35%

MerlinPendragon · July 2018

Other than Nightblade, is any particular class better at stam 2H than others?

LiquidPony · July 2018

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

SmellyUnlimited · July 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

I’ve actually never heard anyone mention Kvatch before, that’s interesting. So is Bloodthirsty better than Infused?

Also, what’s the bow bug? I’m not familiar with this one.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · July 2018

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

I’ve actually never heard anyone mention Kvatch before, that’s interesting. So is Bloodthirsty better than Infused?

Also, what’s the bow bug? I’m not familiar with this one.

Endless hail is only proccing back bar enchants, not main hand echants like live.

MerlinPendragon wrote: »

Other than Nightblade, is any particular class better at stam 2H than others?

Sorcs, temps, dks and wardens, they all do just fine with two-handers.

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Bowser wrote: »

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

But without Arms of Relequen and Advancing Yokuda?

I get 30k DPS using no weapon damage pots or the sets you are talking about, you do need the vma bow though.

Bobby_V_Rockit · July 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

I’ve actually never heard anyone mention Kvatch before, that’s interesting. So is Bloodthirsty better than Infused?

Also, what’s the bow bug? I’m not familiar with this one.

Endless hail is only proccing back bar enchants, not main hand echants like live.

MerlinPendragon wrote: »

Other than Nightblade, is any particular class better at stam 2H than others?

Sorcs, temps, dks and wardens, they all do just fine with two-handers.

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Bowser wrote: »

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

But without Arms of Relequen and Advancing Yokuda?

I get 30k DPS using no weapon damage pots or the sets you are talking about, you do need the vma bow though.

I just gotta get dat rotation down then, cheers

Alcast · July 2018

I do currently have two 2H builds, one for Stamina Dragonknight and one for Stamina Sorcerer. You can also find gameplay at the bottom of the page:

https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-sorcerer-2h-build-pve/
https://alcasthq.com/eso-stamina-dragonknight-2h-build-pve/

2H builds are very viable and in some situations even ahead of Dual Wield. Stamina Sorcerer is definitely the favored Class in terms of 2H dps. Tho I also want to try an War Machine Asylum NB Setup with Incap spam.

I would defo try to use Advancing Yokeda to make up for the low Weapon Crit of 2H. Or Serpent in case you have sustain issues.

mr_wazzabi · July 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

I’ve actually never heard anyone mention Kvatch before, that’s interesting. So is Bloodthirsty better than Infused?

Also, what’s the bow bug? I’m not familiar with this one.

Endless hail is only proccing back bar enchants, not main hand echants like live.

MerlinPendragon wrote: »

Other than Nightblade, is any particular class better at stam 2H than others?

Sorcs, temps, dks and wardens, they all do just fine with two-handers.

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Bowser wrote: »

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

But without Arms of Relequen and Advancing Yokuda?

I get 30k DPS using no weapon damage pots or the sets you are talking about, you do need the vma bow though.

Can you post your rotation for stam nb? I run spriggans and vo or briarheart and vo. I like not having to use pots

mr_wazzabi · July 2018

If zos didn't nerf 2h light attacks maybe dps could be equal to dw

LiquidPony · July 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

I have a stam Sorc that I’ve farmed till I’m blue in the face for automaton daggers. I’ve got an automaton infused great axe that I’m considering using, but before I gold I was curious how my stam have tested 2H and whether or not it pulls comparable dps. I’m on console so don’t have access to PTS, and I’ve seen a couple videos, but in practice I seem to fall short. Trying Advancing 2Hander gold I have (jewels are not transmuted yet), I’m getting about 31k solo. I really need to hit 40k+, but I’m not sure if jewel transmutation will add that much.

Note: I’m also using 5 divines Relequen on body golded

For you stam out there, is 2H viable or is DW still supreme?

DW is still supreme.

As for your Automaton daggers ... IMO it's not worth the grind.

Ravager, Veiled Heritance or Kvatch Gladiator will get you the same or better numbers. You can buy the first two and craft the third, much easier than getting those elusive Automaton DW weapons.

I usually hit 42-44k with any of those sets including Automaton, with my best parses coming from Kvatch Gladiator with 3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry.

That's totally solo ... 5 x Relequen (Divines), 5 x Kvatch Gladiator (3 x Bloodthirsty jewelry, Nirn dagger, Infused axe), 2 x Selene. Just a hair under 44k.

Same setup with someone throwing fracture comes in around 51k on the first try on PTS ... unfortunately haven't done further testing on PTS, would really like to do some 6mil parses with Fracture because Kvatch + Bloodthirsty will be stronger on a parse with a longer execute, because the bow light attack bug in 4.1.1 makes testing kind of difficult:

* And actually on review, looks like I was probably using Stormfist in the second parse. Would probably be 1k higher with Selene.

I’ve actually never heard anyone mention Kvatch before, that’s interesting. So is Bloodthirsty better than Infused?

Also, what’s the bow bug? I’m not familiar with this one.

Endless hail is only proccing back bar enchants, not main hand echants like live.

MerlinPendragon wrote: »

Other than Nightblade, is any particular class better at stam 2H than others?

Sorcs, temps, dks and wardens, they all do just fine with two-handers.

Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »

Bowser wrote: »

2h is totally doable. You just need to work on your rotation.

But without Arms of Relequen and Advancing Yokuda?

I get 30k DPS using no weapon damage pots or the sets you are talking about, you do need the vma bow though.

In this case I wasn't talking about enchantment bugs.

Currently on PTS, light attacking with a bow screws up the animation queue. You *can* still do a rotation on your back bar, you just can't see any of it happen. You're just relying on the skills all casting because the animations don't play for bow skills if you LA weave.

As for Kvatch ... it's definitely a solid set and much like Bloodthirsty, shows more promise the longer the execute phase.

Personally I've had better results with Bloodthirsty than Infused, pretty much across the board. On a stamblade, on a 3mil parse, Infused is better because execute only lasts about 10 seconds. But on a 6mil Bloodthirsty pulls ahead. Infused is probably better for trash, but single-target seems to favor Bloodthirsty. Especially on a stamsorc, with Bound Armaments boosting LA damage and Kvatch boosting LA weapon damage in execute, all of that stacking with Bloodthirsty is very strong. On that 3mil parse with Fracture I posted, I had light attacks hit for up to 17k, without optimizing CP at all.

Bobby_V_Rockit · July 2018

Now for a dumb question, with the changes to night mothers gaze and sunderflame limiting group penetration, is there a place for 2h mauls now to boost it?

I ask this because I have only come across one 2h automoton weapon and it happens to be a maul...