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DW vs 2H now slightly unbalanced, differently.

bg22
bg22
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Since the changes to 2H weapons now qualifying as 2 set slots, the balance has been thrown off.

Not in the traditional sense, but now that in order to get the same 5 piece bonus, 2H users are only required to grind and upgrade one weapon, while reaping the same benefits as those who are required to grind and upgrade 2 weapons.

I feel like there should be an additional benefit to DW for the additional time, effort, and gold required. Such as the ability to run 2 poisons, one on the main hand, and one on the offhand.

Even if the 2nd poisons value is cut in half, I think that would be a fair trade.
Tirik Ironheart - V4 Templar
Tirik - V12 NB Retired

There are no pacts between lions and men.
  • bg22
    bg22
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    Aesthier wrote: »
    If you have 2 weapons equipped on the same bar (without poisons) then you already get the added benefit of the second trait and enchant of the second weapon.

    That is more than those with a 2H get.

    But if you run 1 poison, it suppresses both enchantments. That’s not cool. And needs fixed.

    If anything, it should only suppress 1 enchantment if we can’t have 2 poisons.
    Tirik Ironheart - V4 Templar
    Tirik - V12 NB Retired

    There are no pacts between lions and men.
  • Aesthier
    Aesthier
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    bg22 wrote: »
    Aesthier wrote: »
    If you have 2 weapons equipped on the same bar (without poisons) then you already get the added benefit of the second trait and enchant of the second weapon.

    That is more than those with a 2H get.

    But if you run 1 poison, it suppresses both enchantments. That’s not cool. And needs fixed.

    If anything, it should only suppress 1 enchantment if we can’t have 2 poisons.

    Which is exactly the same as those who use a 2H.

    I don't see any reason to change that.
    Vapirko wrote: »
    I agree it should be less mats. It doesn’t make sense that a weapon half the size takes the same amount of material. And maybe they should be 5 tempers instead of 8. One isn’t really better than the other at this point, they both have benefits.

    ^ This, however, makes sense. Simply make it to where the costs of making/upgrading two 1H weapons are the same as one 2H weapon and remove the ability of the offhand trait and enchant to apply itself (or allow 2H weapons two traits and enchants)

    (This is under the understanding the damage difference between two 1Hs and one 2H would be normalized for the above to work.)
    Edited by Aesthier on July 12, 2018 1:01PM
  • Xuhora
    Xuhora
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    be carefull what you wish for guys... with the math of @Vapirko 1 handed weapons should only have 943 Basedmg instead of 1335...
  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    @Xuhora wtf are you talking about. How would you ever infer that.
  • Xuhora
    Xuhora
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    @Vapirko 60% matcost, 60% dmg? because as you stated, there is nooo way a weapon with half the sice costs the same mats. well a weapon half the sice doesnt do the same dmg?
  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    Xuhora wrote: »
    @Vapirko 60% matcost, 60% dmg? because as you stated, there is nooo way a weapon with half the sice costs the same mats. well a weapon half the sice doesnt do the same dmg?

    @Xuhora well then you go ahead and run around with only one DW weapon equipped and let me know how that goes for you :D last time I checked you need both therefore the total amount of mats would still be more than a 2H. And I never said anything about equating mats to damage. By your logic dw should have double the base wpn damage of 2h.
    Edited by Vapirko on July 12, 2018 12:59PM
  • Jamdarius
    Jamdarius
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    Lol all i see is ppl [removed profanity] cause pricy this pricy that... mats are cheaper than ever, 2-3 years ago you would pay nice sum of gold for all the mats ... Going by your logic let's make it as u say but hey let us dimnish the dmg 1 handed weapons deal, they are smaller after all, also going by your logic mats in crafting bows should also increase after all it is 2 handed weapon of sorts and takes 2 slots...
    ~3600 gold / 1 tempering alloy is nothing, u can earn few times that by stealing and fencing, at max legerdemain trafficker skill u can fence 140 items/day, assuming u are lazy like i am and u sell green or better loot that gives u 140 x 100 gold = 14.000 gold/day, and let us be honest if u got passives from thieves guild u earn even more and its not always green u sell sometimes u sell blue and purple loot to fence or manage to get nice recipe or motif. So if u are not lazy u can buy 3-4 temp alloys / day without much effort (depends on market price) or just demand lowering mat costs here and wasting time 'cause you don't feel like grinding a bit.
    Edited by ZOS_JesC on July 12, 2018 6:51PM
  • Xuhora
    Xuhora
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    let me explain
    -2H weapon 1571 Basedmg (Upgraded to legendary)
    -2H Staff and Bow 1335 Basedmg (Upgraded to Legendary)
    -1H Weapons 1335 Basedmg (Upgraded to legendary)

    that has nothing to do with running arround with one dual wield equipped....

  • bg22
    bg22
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    Aesthier wrote: »
    bg22 wrote: »
    Aesthier wrote: »
    If you have 2 weapons equipped on the same bar (without poisons) then you already get the added benefit of the second trait and enchant of the second weapon.

    That is more than those with a 2H get.

    But if you run 1 poison, it suppresses both enchantments. That’s not cool. And needs fixed.

    If anything, it should only suppress 1 enchantment if we can’t have 2 poisons.

    Which is exactly the same as those who use a 2H.

    I don't see any reason to change that.
    Vapirko wrote: »
    I agree it should be less mats. It doesn’t make sense that a weapon half the size takes the same amount of material. And maybe they should be 5 tempers instead of 8. One isn’t really better than the other at this point, they both have benefits.

    ^ This, however, makes sense. Simply make it to where the costs of making/upgrading two 1H weapons are the same as one 2H weapon and remove the ability of the offhand trait and enchant to apply itself (or allow 2H weapons two traits and enchants)

    (This is under the understanding the damage difference between two 1Hs and one 2H would be normalized for the above to work.)

    That would be ok too. But as is, isn’t exactly balanced. Especially when it comes to grinding some sets, and then double the tempers.

    I’m open for options, but I think something should be done to balance it back out.

    Either one of the following options:
    1. Less Mats (definitely less tempers)
    2. 2 poisons (the offhand at roughly half value of main hand)
    3. Have poison only disable 1 enchantment, rather than losing 2 enchantments over 1 poison.

    Any other ideas?
    Tirik Ironheart - V4 Templar
    Tirik - V12 NB Retired

    There are no pacts between lions and men.
  • ADarklore
    ADarklore
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    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.
    Started ESO: May 2015-Quit: Sept 2018
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    Morrowind/Summerset
    ** Strictly a solo PvE quester **
  • bg22
    bg22
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    ADarklore wrote: »
    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.

    Why’s that funny?

    I mean, it’s only logical to be able to use 2 poisons. It makes sense... and uh, yea. It just makes sense. Why would gain the benefit of 2 enchantments, but be restricted to only 1 poison?

    What’s funny is when ppl like yourself come into threads and post without even so much as a point to get across. I mean seriously, what is the point of your post?

    Who’s blaming who? I don’t even know what you’re talking about to be honest. Nobody is blaming anyone, kid. This original post was to bring up what I deemed to be slightly unbalanced, and to offer a simple and in my opinion, fair solution. If you’re here without an argument, in either direction as to why or why not my suggestions should be considered, then please refrain from pointless post. Thank you in advance.

    Oh, and poisons don’t suppress traits, by the way. Unless, of course it’s infused, in which case is rendered useless. I think. Who knows.
    Edited by bg22 on July 12, 2018 5:29PM
    Tirik Ironheart - V4 Templar
    Tirik - V12 NB Retired

    There are no pacts between lions and men.
  • griffkhalifa
    griffkhalifa
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    bg22 wrote: »
    ADarklore wrote: »
    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.

    Why’s that funny?

    I mean, it’s only logical to be able to use 2 poisons. It makes sense... and uh, yea. It just makes sense. Why would gain the benefit of 2 enchantments, but be restricted to only 1 poison?

    What’s funny is when ppl like yourself come into threads and post without even so much as a point to get across. I mean seriously, what is the point of your post?

    Who’s blaming who? I don’t even know what you’re talking about to be honest. Nobody is blaming anyone, kid. This original post was to bring up what I deemed to be slightly unbalanced, and to offer a simple and in my opinion, fair solution. If you’re here without an argument, in either direction as to why or why not my suggestions should be considered, then please refrain from pointless post. Thank you in advance.

    Oh, and poisons don’t suppress traits, by the way. Unless, of course it’s infused, in which case is rendered useless. I think. Who knows.

    Damn, bro, update your signature. V4 and V12? lol
    PS4 NA
  • bg22
    bg22
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    bg22 wrote: »
    ADarklore wrote: »
    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.

    Why’s that funny?

    I mean, it’s only logical to be able to use 2 poisons. It makes sense... and uh, yea. It just makes sense. Why would gain the benefit of 2 enchantments, but be restricted to only 1 poison?

    What’s funny is when ppl like yourself come into threads and post without even so much as a point to get across. I mean seriously, what is the point of your post?

    Who’s blaming who? I don’t even know what you’re talking about to be honest. Nobody is blaming anyone, kid. This original post was to bring up what I deemed to be slightly unbalanced, and to offer a simple and in my opinion, fair solution. If you’re here without an argument, in either direction as to why or why not my suggestions should be considered, then please refrain from pointless post. Thank you in advance.

    Oh, and poisons don’t suppress traits, by the way. Unless, of course it’s infused, in which case is rendered useless. I think. Who knows.

    Damn, bro, update your signature. V4 and V12? lol

    I’m an OG.

    Oh, and haven’t visited the forums via computer since I... well, since I was VR4, and VR12 on PC.

    Hmm... makes me want to check in on my PC account tho.
    Tirik Ironheart - V4 Templar
    Tirik - V12 NB Retired

    There are no pacts between lions and men.
  • Ri_Khan
    Ri_Khan
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    Did you think there was any kind of balance between DW and 2H before the change? It seems to me that DW has always had the upper hand and now 2H is much closer. Buffing DW would just widen the gap again.

    Cheese for everyone!
  • pauli133
    pauli133
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    Once again, I find myself wishing that Dual Wield and Sword+Shield didn't consist of two separate items (each). Had it been "this is a pair of swords, as a unit" and "this is a sword and shield, as a unit" instead of "these are two separate items, mixed and matched", all of these one piece vs two pieces complaints would never have been an issue.
  • Aesthier
    Aesthier
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    bg22 wrote: »
    ADarklore wrote: »
    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.


    What’s funny is when ppl like yourself come into threads and post without even so much as a point to get across. I mean seriously, what is the point of your post?

    While I may not agree with his presentation I see his point quite clearly.

    He doesn't agree with your perspective that DW is underbalanced because one cannot apply separate poisons to their DW weapons when DW gets an extra Trait and Enchant as it is.

    I think it could be more balanced however as others have mentioned it would take a complete normalization of the base damage of weapons, crafting materials, and even possibly creating or receiving weapons as a set.


    Unfortunately, all of that leaves out the "special circumstances" that would have to be implemented for 1H and Shield.


    So with all that being said It appears to me that the cost of creating/upgrading DW weapons is currently being used by ZoS to balance out the fact that DW weapons receive an extra Trait and Enchant.


  • firedrgn
    firedrgn
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    So dw has gotten a buff for like ever and now thats a problem. Nevermind. Blah
  • runagate
    runagate
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    bg22 wrote: »
    bg22 wrote: »
    ADarklore wrote: »
    Funny... DW gains TWO traits plus TWO enchants... so you use poisons which suppressed enchants, that's YOUR choice to use poisons... stop blaming ZOS for your choices.

    Why’s that funny?

    I mean, it’s only logical to be able to use 2 poisons. It makes sense... and uh, yea. It just makes sense. Why would gain the benefit of 2 enchantments, but be restricted to only 1 poison?

    What’s funny is when ppl like yourself come into threads and post without even so much as a point to get across. I mean seriously, what is the point of your post?

    Who’s blaming who? I don’t even know what you’re talking about to be honest. Nobody is blaming anyone, kid. This original post was to bring up what I deemed to be slightly unbalanced, and to offer a simple and in my opinion, fair solution. If you’re here without an argument, in either direction as to why or why not my suggestions should be considered, then please refrain from pointless post. Thank you in advance.

    Oh, and poisons don’t suppress traits, by the way. Unless, of course it’s infused, in which case is rendered useless. I think. Who knows.

    Damn, bro, update your signature. V4 and V12? lol

    I’m an OG.

    Oh, and haven’t visited the forums via computer since I... well, since I was VR4, and VR12 on PC.

    Hmm... makes me want to check in on my PC account tho.

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  • DanteYoda
    DanteYoda
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    Don't use poisons.. And DW is way better than 2H
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