Shuffle vs Forward momentum
In a world where the developers and most of the understanding player base wants there to be less tank builds in cyro ie. less heavy armour. Since you cant run shuffle in heavy anymore, why is it viable to run heavy w/forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave but now they are even more tankier with unlimited snare immunity. You'd think that the developers would try promote the use of light/medium over heavy in order to bring out more skillful play. Really feel the flat benefit should be more than .5 seconds. Wearing a generic 5-1-1 gives you 2.5 seconds of snare immunity. 80% of the time you are snared is when you are running away from a sweaty group and they are spamming snares on you because they know how tiny the window is for immunity. I really do feel it should be increased upwards of 100%. 1 second per piece of medium seems reasonable. IMO regardless, between the 2 skills, you'd think that if you're wearing medium and susceptible to taking a lot of damage you could at least get snare immunity for the duration of forward momentum over shuffle. The immunity time for both skills should be swapped if i'm being totally honest, does anyone else feel the same way?
Not even to mention that for whatever reason may it be lag or whatever but you can cast shuffle and immediately have a snare applied. Not sure if it's a bug, broken, lag or a combination of all 3.
Cheers,
Not even to mention that for whatever reason may it be lag or whatever but you can cast shuffle and immediately have a snare applied. Not sure if it's a bug, broken, lag or a combination of all 3.
Cheers,
DC - Every class - 900cp
5
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IZZEFlameLash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Titaniiumite wrote: »In a world where the developers and most of the understanding player base wants there to be less tank builds in cyro ie. less heavy armour. Since you cant run shuffle in heavy anymore, why is it viable to run heavy w/forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave but now they are even more tankier with unlimited snare immunity. You'd think that the developers would try promote the use of light/medium over heavy in order to bring out more skillful play. Really feel the flat benefit should be more than .5 seconds. Wearing a generic 5-1-1 gives you 2.5 seconds of snare immunity. 80% of the time you are snared is when you are running away from a sweaty group and they are spamming snares on you because they know how tiny the window is for immunity. I really do feel it should be increased upwards of 100%. 1 second per piece of medium seems reasonable. IMO regardless, between the 2 skills, you'd think that if you're wearing medium and susceptible to taking a lot of damage you could at least get snare immunity for the duration of forward momentum over shuffle. The immunity time for both skills should be swapped if i'm being totally honest, does anyone else feel the same way?
Not even to mention that for whatever reason may it be lag or whatever but you can cast shuffle and immediately have a snare applied. Not sure if it's a bug, broken, lag or a combination of all 3.
Cheers,
Shuffle was used for Major Evasion so that tanking can be maximized. Snare purge was an icing on the cake as Shuffle actually allowed HA builds to stand their ground well due to passive dodge chance. Whole different reason than running FM on HA.Imperials, the one and true masters of all mortal races of Tamriel0 -
Sure, it gave dodge chance but you were already in heavy armour so the damage mitigation was not what you were looking for lolDC - Every class - 900cp0
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Gnozo✭✭✭✭✭
✭But now its a trade off.
Going heavy means you use forward momentum for snare removal. So you dont have the burst heal from Rally. But you are tanky
Medium allows you run shuffle for snare removal and acces to burst heal with really but you are squishy.
I think its in a good point atm.2 -
BlackLabel✭✭✭Shuffle needs a longer snare immunity. At least 5 seconds for wearing 5 pieces. No one likes to spam shuffle every couple seconds when it is so expensive0
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Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Titaniiumite wrote: »Sure, it gave dodge chance but you were already in heavy armour so the damage mitigation was not what you were looking for lol
Major Evasion is hella strong on heavy armor, but that's not the biggest reason it was over-performing... It's that free dodging let's you perma-block much easier because you avoid so many stamina block costs.1 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭But now its a trade off.
Going heavy means you use forward momentum for snare removal. So you dont have the burst heal from Rally. But you are tanky
Medium allows you run shuffle for snare removal and acces to burst heal with really but you are squishy.
I think its in a good point atm.
You still need to run FM in medium. Shuffle is too expensive to use every 3 seconds.1 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Titaniiumite wrote: »In a world where the developers and most of the understanding player base wants there to be less tank builds in cyro ie. less heavy armour. Since you cant run shuffle in heavy anymore, why is it viable to run heavy w/forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave but now they are even more tankier with unlimited snare immunity. You'd think that the developers would try promote the use of light/medium over heavy in order to bring out more skillful play. Really feel the flat benefit should be more than .5 seconds. Wearing a generic 5-1-1 gives you 2.5 seconds of snare immunity. 80% of the time you are snared is when you are running away from a sweaty group and they are spamming snares on you because they know how tiny the window is for immunity. I really do feel it should be increased upwards of 100%. 1 second per piece of medium seems reasonable. IMO regardless, between the 2 skills, you'd think that if you're wearing medium and susceptible to taking a lot of damage you could at least get snare immunity for the duration of forward momentum over shuffle. The immunity time for both skills should be swapped if i'm being totally honest, does anyone else feel the same way?
Not even to mention that for whatever reason may it be lag or whatever but you can cast shuffle and immediately have a snare applied. Not sure if it's a bug, broken, lag or a combination of all 3.
Cheers,
They will probably read your post and either decide to nerf forward momentum or do nothing at all, and nobody will profit as a result.
Shuffle costs almost 5k and barely gives any snare immunity for such an expensive ability. Shuffle is the problem in this picture, not forward momentum, as for using FM you sacrifice Rally, the only burst heal most stamina classes will get.Edited by Ragnarock41 on July 11, 2018 7:50PM1 -
RajinPVP✭✭✭“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.2 -
Extinct_Solo_Player✭✭✭✭✭since when is snare removal making you more tanky? Sounds to me you don't have a clue what you are talking about. You act as if its one tamriel black rose meta still or something. Snare immunity gives you mobility not tankiness. WIth heavy armor there are actual trade offs as no burst heal etc so i don't know what you mean about skillful play because medium armor being too squishy is just an over used excuse when you can run passive dodge chance, more recovery, a burst heal, more movement speed, reduction in stamina cost of skills vs what? 25 percent more resources from heavy attacks and 8 percent healing recieved?Edited by Extinct_Solo_Player on July 11, 2018 8:45PM1 -
Millz✭✭✭Heavys in a good spot, doesn't need touching. Shuffle needs to be 1 sec per medium armor piece and removal of "sneak" passive and replaced with dmg passiveBrenhji
PC NA - 400 cp
(Retired) XBOX NA - 1006 cp
---Say no to standardization---0 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭b4nn3d7337 wrote: »“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.
You mean to tell me that you'd rather have Major Evasion over Major Brutality?
FM has more than double the immunity, a superior primary buff, a HoT, and is around 40% cheaper to cast while its primary buff lasts 50% longer.
Yeah Shuffle is overdue for some love.2 -
glavius✭✭✭✭✭b4nn3d7337 wrote: »“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.
You mean to tell me that you'd rather have Major Evasion over Major Brutality?
FM has more than double the immunity, a superior primary buff, a HoT, and is around 40% cheaper to cast while its primary buff lasts 50% longer.
Yeah Shuffle is overdue for some love.
You have major brutality regardless with rally1 -
Strider__Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭b4nn3d7337 wrote: »“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.
You mean to tell me that you'd rather have Major Evasion over Major Brutality?
FM has more than double the immunity, a superior primary buff, a HoT, and is around 40% cheaper to cast while its primary buff lasts 50% longer.
Yeah Shuffle is overdue for some love.
You have major brutality regardless with rally
Unless you use FM like I do because the snare immunity of Shuffle isn't justified by its cost.1 -
RajinPVP✭✭✭b4nn3d7337 wrote: »“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.
You mean to tell me that you'd rather have Major Evasion over Major Brutality?
FM has more than double the immunity, a superior primary buff, a HoT, and is around 40% cheaper to cast while its primary buff lasts 50% longer.
Yeah Shuffle is overdue for some love.
Honestly.. yes! I would rather have major evasion with 3seconds snare and root immunity on heavy armor... but going back to the point... major brutality is particularly not that hard to get for a buff... major evasion on the other hand is not that easy to access unless your medium build or a NB class or using certain sets ... and this is why im against buffing shuffle coz its a 1 skill press that removes snares , gives immunity and a rng dodge chance its a perfect defensive skill.0 -
Exhibit B why 2s on a 4k cost wings isn't close to long enough. 2.5-3.5 isn't long enough o shuffle and it can be unchained too.
Couldn't agree more, which is why when they brought out the snare removal for magdks i was just straight embarrassed that the devs called that acceptable. Now it has immunity? yeah okay 3 seconds or whatever but it's the same case as shuffle it does cost a damn to use for the snare immunity.DC - Every class - 900cp0 -
b4nn3d7337 wrote: »b4nn3d7337 wrote: »“forward momentum which gives more than twice the benefit shuffle ever gave“
Lols seems a troll post to me... you suddenly forgot that it comes with 15 seconds major evasion or what? Look... we all have to make hard choices sometimes .. so if you want longer immunity then you have to use FM.
You mean to tell me that you'd rather have Major Evasion over Major Brutality?
FM has more than double the immunity, a superior primary buff, a HoT, and is around 40% cheaper to cast while its primary buff lasts 50% longer.
Yeah Shuffle is overdue for some love.
Honestly.. yes! I would rather have major evasion with 3seconds snare and root immunity on heavy armor... but going back to the point... major brutality is particularly not that hard to get for a buff... major evasion on the other hand is not that easy to access unless your medium build or a NB class or using certain sets ... and this is why im against buffing shuffle coz its a 1 skill press that removes snares , gives immunity and a rng dodge chance its a perfect defensive skill.
While i totally agree with you, sure its a 1 skill snare removal, but TBH if it didn't have major evasion it would still be in every medium build, if you can't move on a medium build you're gonna be flattened. If you really think we are using shuffle for the dodge chance you're delirious.DC - Every class - 900cp0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭As I posted in another thread, I feel like its just too expensive for the snare removal duration and you're still going to use rally anyway.0 -
The_Brosteen✭✭✭✭✭What I think they should do is increase the frequency of the ticks from forward momentum but decrease the healing so that the total heal over time stays unchanged. Then swap the snare immunity times between shuffle and forward momentum.
To me, thats an easy way to balance it.Edited by The_Brosteen on July 14, 2018 12:39PM1 -
Skullstachio✭✭✭✭✭@Solariken wrote: »Titaniiumite wrote: »Sure, it gave dodge chance but you were already in heavy armour so the damage mitigation was not what you were looking for lol
Major Evasion is hella strong on heavy armor, but that's not the biggest reason it was over-performing... It's that free dodging let's you perma-block much easier because you avoid so many stamina block costs.
It still is if one uses the hist bark armor set, the set that grants major evasion while blocking...If you see me anywhere. Know that I am sitting back with a bag of popcorn, watching as ESO burns the goodwill of its player base with practices that only disrespects the players time like it did to me and many others...
If a game does not respect your time, best thing to do is move on from it and find something else.0 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Alpha-Lupi wrote: »@Solariken wrote: »Titaniiumite wrote: »Sure, it gave dodge chance but you were already in heavy armour so the damage mitigation was not what you were looking for lol
Major Evasion is hella strong on heavy armor, but that's not the biggest reason it was over-performing... It's that free dodging let's you perma-block much easier because you avoid so many stamina block costs.
It still is if one uses the hist bark armor set, the set that grants major evasion while blocking...
At that point you lose an entire 5pc set which could get you better mit/sustain than hist bark.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0
