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9-trait sets are WAY outclassed by most other sets, let's fix that.
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DuskMarine✭✭✭✭✭
✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game(well, the ones that existed at the time at least) so you are telling me that your grinding gear is worth more than all the effort I put in to become a master crafter? Ridiculous. Lets be honest here...vCoS as an example(substitute whatever dungeon or trial you want in its place, all the same). It was a difficult dungeon the first 4 or 5 times I attempted it...but once I got the mechanics down it was pretty simple...playing the same dungeon/trial with the same mechanics over and over and over again is a test of skill? I don't think so. The only dynamically changing fights in this game are in PvP areas where you are playing against an opponents that adapts to you...so once PvE "skill" is taken out of the equation...there is absolutely no justification for dropped sets to be any better than crafted sets. Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times. In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better". By the way, in regards to this comparison I should specify 9 trait sets should be as good as the best dropped sets...Julianos has always been overpowered for only 6 traits. If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets. Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
no1 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Azurephoenix999 wrote: »Armor Master - 5 piece bonus change: The duration and magnitude of any Armor Ability you use is doubled, AND the Magicka/Stamina cost is halved.
Whooo boy would that break Harness Magicka, though.
A 20k shield that gains you magicka...
Eternal Hunt is fine as is and sees use. I like the suggested Morkuldin change. Twice Born star had it's time in the sun, and probably will again after power creep gets knocked back and/or mundus stone values are adjusted. The cost reduction on Pelinals seems a bit extreme, especially as you could game your stats and use it to become the most efficient mono-stat sustain set in the game (stack max magicka and weapon damage, use magicka skills...)Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub0 -
TheMystid✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Sloads is craftable.......PC EU
Nostalgic StamDk2 -
DuskMarine✭✭✭✭✭
✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Sloads is craftable.......
you cant compare a craftable bug.........thatll eventually get fixed because thats litterally a bug we can make.0 -
Colecovision✭✭✭✭✭
✭White wabbit wrote: »White wabbit wrote: »Stop adding new sets and sort some of the unused sets in the game
1st no need to be so aggressive
2nd op is on about 9 trait sets
3rd I was on about all sets
4th hope you have a good day as you must have got out the bed the wrong side
Are you talking to your self?
This is the second time in a week someone went pee wee herman and thought it was a mic drop moment. All versions of "I know you are, but what am I?" became embarrassingly poor comebacks by 2nd grade at best. It's literally THE bottom of the barrel of all comebacks.
Anyway, the problem is that it's not bind on craft. Crafters put the time in and should get a nice set out of it. But if we can make it for everyone, it's BiS gear on day 1 for anyone with access to zone chat.
Jewelry crafting also hurt our cause. Before, if there was a crafted BiS set, it meant that you needed 1 crafted, 1 group farmed and then a solo weapon. Do it all to get the best. It would have been perfect. Now if there are 2 good sets, then there would be no gear progression. So Im not sure how to make crafting worth while anymore, other than convenience.
Maybe a bind on craft monster set that uses a bind on pickup material that only drops from vet dungeon bosses. I'd really love that and there'd be no qq from the "have to earn it" crowd.
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Numerikuu✭✭✭✭✭
✭A lot of the crafted sets need to be overhauled tbh. They're long overdue some love. While your changes sound nice, they're just a tad op.2 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm not sure where to start.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game
Emphasis on longer. There is no effort in learning traits. None. You just click "start research" once every couple of weeks. You don't even have to play the game. Just log in once a week or so. Time is not a measure of effort.
Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times.
There is a justification. Someone who did 10 000 runs did 10 000 runs in vHRC. You've just stared at seconds tick on a fully automated timer. Doing content is a pretty good reason to give players rewards. At least they mashed some buttons instead of clicking one button once a week.
In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better".
You know that both Julianos and Acuity are crafted sets, right? They are both 6 traits too. And Acuity was nerfed exactly for being too good for a crafted set. No developer in the world wants their players to get all the best stuff without running any content. Mindblowing.
If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets.
Talk about unnecessary grinding. So any new player is welcomed with a giant sign "You will not get the best gear for the next several years! No matter how much you play! Have fun!"?Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
Someone said anything about being better? It's just a logical thing that you get all the best gear for completting actual content. Not just waiting for a year.0 -
xeNNNNN✭✭✭✭✭
✭Armor master should still increase your health by 5% if you have an armor ability slotted otherwise its not worth imo. Not since the change to how many peices are required too use each armor ability.
and it is a tank set after all.Edited by xeNNNNN on June 12, 2018 10:25PMAh, e-communities - the "pinnacle" of the internet............yeah, right.0 -
Drummerx04✭✭✭✭✭
✭Azurephoenix999 wrote: »The crafted sets that require 9-traits to craft sound cool in principle, but there are almost always way better alternatives for almost every single one of them. Example: Armor Master 5 piece bonus requires that you slot an Armor ability and use it to get the bonus resistance, and it only lasts 10 seconds. Fortified Brass offers SLIGHTLY less resistance for its 5 piece bonus, but it's a passive buff that is active all the time.
Below are my suggestions for how to make each of the 9-trait sets more appealing.
Eternal Hunt - 5 piece bonus change: If the rune successfully damages an enemy, 2x the Stamina cost of the Roll Dodge that placed it is refunded.
That would be broken beyond belief. That's basically infinite stamina while 1vXing and perma dodging.
Edited by Drummerx04 on June 12, 2018 10:33PMPC/NA - Nightfighters, Raid Leader and Officer
Lilith Arujo - DC sorc tank/dps/healer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, Gryphon Heart, Grand Warlord
Lilith Tortorici - DC templar trials healer
Notable Completions:
vAS (72k), vMoL HM (160k), vAA HM (135k), vHRC HM, vSO HM (141k), vHoF HM (168k), vCR+3(129k), vDSA 45k, vMA 591k
Original Addons:
Lilith's Group Manager
Lilith's Lazy Hacks - Auto Recharge/Repair
Bot Scanner 2000
Lilith's Command History
Maintained Addons:
Kill Counter0 -
redshirt_49✭✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
Nobody is talking about that. The sets as they are just aren't very good at all. Given how long it takes to research all those traits, it is being argued that those sets should be more in line with the sets that come before it.
And the buffs suggested would hardly knock the trial sets off their pedestal.
In addition to that the whole point of farming sets is to get the set that suits your playstyle, if of course you only grab your builds off of what some competitive player considers "BiS" then that's on you.
You can have a perfectly viable trial build using nothing but crafted sets and overland sets already. Buffing these underperforming sets would not change a thing about the feasability of farmed trial sets.0 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Don't know about thw others but TBS would go back to being the set in every build like a long time ago0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game(well, the ones that existed at the time at least) so you are telling me that your grinding gear is worth more than all the effort I put in to become a master crafter? Ridiculous. Lets be honest here...vCoS as an example(substitute whatever dungeon or trial you want in its place, all the same). It was a difficult dungeon the first 4 or 5 times I attempted it...but once I got the mechanics down it was pretty simple...playing the same dungeon/trial with the same mechanics over and over and over again is a test of skill? I don't think so. The only dynamically changing fights in this game are in PvP areas where you are playing against an opponents that adapts to you...so once PvE "skill" is taken out of the equation...there is absolutely no justification for dropped sets to be any better than crafted sets. Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times. In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better". By the way, in regards to this comparison I should specify 9 trait sets should be as good as the best dropped sets...Julianos has always been overpowered for only 6 traits. If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets. Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
And literal afk'ing to get researching done was so tough.They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd1 -
DuskMarine✭✭✭✭✭
✭redshirt_49 wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
Nobody is talking about that. The sets as they are just aren't very good at all. Given how long it takes to research all those traits, it is being argued that those sets should be more in line with the sets that come before it.
And the buffs suggested would hardly knock the trial sets off their pedestal.
In addition to that the whole point of farming sets is to get the set that suits your playstyle, if of course you only grab your builds off of what some competitive player considers "BiS" then that's on you.
You can have a perfectly viable trial build using nothing but crafted sets and overland sets already. Buffing these underperforming sets would not change a thing about the feasability of farmed trial sets.
if they buffed crafted sets again it would make trials and dungeons irrelevant because we can craft the best gear. so no we dont need it well never need it their fine exactly where their at. you can find setups for them in their current state that work for you good. but dont devalue veterans hard work for those who dont want to put out the effort.0 -
JKorr✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I'm not sure where to start.
:snip:
If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets.
Talk about unnecessary grinding. So any new player is welcomed with a giant sign "You will not get the best gear for the next several years! No matter how much you play! Have fun!"?
Any new player can ask a crafter to make them a set/sets of gear while they are still wearing their coldharbor jammies/equivalent from the other starting areas now. No, it won't be the super duper uber bestest evah bis/fotm latest craze, but it will be decent gear that does let them have fun playing.
I've seen many posts here how new players that aren't level 50, have no cp points, and don't have good gear are totally welcomed into groups to go farm the super duper uber bestest evah farmed gear. New players aren't kicked from groups for being new low level players, ever, right? Aren't there tons of posts how great of an experience new players have joining groups to get the dropped gear sets? Aren't they having fun getting kicked out of groups? Oh, wait.
Now, if that comment applied to someone who was making a crafter, then yes. You won't max out a crafter in two weeks, even with ambrosia and pointless skyreach grinding. But you won't get abuse from crafting "elites" for not having teh bestest build/gear/point allocation/dps/rotation/whatever either. A lot of help and support to make your crafter, yes. Abuse and kicked from the group, no.
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STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Azurephoenix999 wrote: »The crafted sets that require 9-traits to craft sound cool in principle, but there are almost always way better alternatives for almost every single one of them. Example: Armor Master 5 piece bonus requires that you slot an Armor ability and use it to get the bonus resistance, and it only lasts 10 seconds. Fortified Brass offers SLIGHTLY less resistance for its 5 piece bonus, but it's a passive buff that is active all the time.
Below are my suggestions for how to make each of the 9-trait sets more appealing.
Twice-Born Star - 5 piece bonus change: You can have two Mundus Stone boons at the same time...AND their effects are increased by 50%.
Armor Master - 5 piece bonus change: The duration and magnitude of any Armor Ability you use is doubled, AND the Magicka/Stamina cost is halved.
Morkuldin - 5 piece bonus change: The chance of summoning the animated weapon is increased to 20% if using a Heavy Attack.
Eternal Hunt - 5 piece bonus change: If the rune successfully damages an enemy, 2x the Stamina cost of the Roll Dodge that placed it is refunded.
Pelinal's Aptitude - 5 piece bonus change: Affects weapon crit and spell crit values as well. Also halves the cost of abilities/spells that are scaled based upon the stats that were raised.
this seems to be based on an underlying principle that number of traits should sync up with set ability for crafted sets - in addition to the traits learned counting for crafting writ rates)
if we follow that logic, then that would mean that pretty much the vast majority of crafted sets should be obsolete as you advance in the traits learned. A six trait set would be markedly and significantly weaker than a 9 trait set of the same focus, 8 traits noticable... etc.
That logic seems flawed not only due to the built-in sunset of most of the crafted sets - certainly all below 7 traits - but also because it takes a one time expenditure (trait learning time) and pays it off with an ongoing repeatable benefit - making more powerful sets for the same cost.
if it is intended for 9 trait sets to be more powerful than six traits sets in a significant and meaningful degree - then 9 trait sets should cost more to make.
All in all we are looking at a more significant redo to make all this happen and i myself have serious doubts about a redo that builds in sunset on the majority of its product.
IMO this plan/premise to tie crafted sets power to traits required sets back crafting quite a bit and would take a lot of rewaork and rejigger to get right - with a net result of even fewer crafted sets being used. Why is that a good thing?
Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."0 -
Sleep724✭✭✭✭✭Morkuldins chance to proc should be increased to 25% on light and heavy attacks like said before or keep the chance the same and let it proc on any melee damage.
Also, there needs to be a class representative on crafted and overland sets.0 -
josiahva✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not sure where to start.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game
Emphasis on longer. There is no effort in learning traits. None. You just click "start research" once every couple of weeks. You don't even have to play the game. Just log in once a week or so. Time is not a measure of effort.
Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times.
There is a justification. Someone who did 10 000 runs did 10 000 runs in vHRC. You've just stared at seconds tick on a fully automated timer. Doing content is a pretty good reason to give players rewards. At least they mashed some buttons instead of clicking one button once a week.
In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better".
You know that both Julianos and Acuity are crafted sets, right? They are both 6 traits too. And Acuity was nerfed exactly for being too good for a crafted set. No developer in the world wants their players to get all the best stuff without running any content. Mindblowing.
If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets.
Talk about unnecessary grinding. So any new player is welcomed with a giant sign "You will not get the best gear for the next several years! No matter how much you play! Have fun!"?Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
Someone said anything about being better? It's just a logical thing that you get all the best gear for completting actual content. Not just waiting for a year.
For some reason I was under the impression Acuity was dropped(I havent even touched the CwC content except for the transmutation station honestly)...but that doesn't invalidate the point. There is no harm in dividing the type of sets as to what their focus is.
Anyway, you people keep talking about the "best" sets as if there is such a thing. Alcast(or whatever streamer) may very well achieve 60k+ DPS using a certain set and it will instantly become "BiS" even though others are only hitting 40k with the same setup and due to their playstyle can actually achieve higher DPS using some other set. My only point here is that craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets anywhere in the game because lets be honest. It doesn't require completion of vet trials to get say gold VO jewelry anymore...so all those gold rings and necklaces in my inventory...they don't mean I have completed those trials anymore(though I have) since now blue drops can just be upgraded to gold. All it means now is that I have stepped foot in that trial and looted something...and that requires LESS effort by any scale than crafting. I want to see the whole "I play X content so I can get Y gear" thing just go away. I want to play content with people out of enjoyment of said content...not because they are forced to grind it for some worthless piece of gear, because that is the type of person who will up and leave a group after 2 wipes because its "wasting their time"...that's the type of player who contributes to PvE toxicity.
That being said, I understand these people have to have a carrot dangled in front of them to stay in the game. If gear must be the reward...then I would put it in single player arenas, NOT trials. vMA is a great design(though the weapons are meh these days I guess) because you cant buy a vMA carry...you have to actually be good enough at survival to get the weapons in question without being propped up by 11 other people. In my opinion...of all the gear in the game...ONLY the gear in vMA can truly be called "earned". I enjoy vMA for the same reason I enjoy pugging vet DLC dungeons....because both will make you better as a player and make you less reliant on the group, its really too bad there are dozens of dungeons in the game and only one solo arena, there really needs to be more solo arenas.
People like to pat themselves on the back far too much for PvE content when most of it is just memorization of mechanics. Zaan will heavy attack first, then drop an AoE, followed by fire breath, followed by ads, followed by throwing spellbreaker, followed by another AoE, followed by beaming a group member...rinse and repeat. It doesn't get much more predictable...the fights are static and don't ever change in PvE. I think PvP is much more dynamic, with the fights being unpredictable because you have thinking opponents that change their behavior...but oddly, most "BiS" isn't locked behind actual difficult fights in PvP(though to be fair, PvP is a mixed bag, sometimes being faceroll easy and sometimes being almost impossibly hard, depending on the skill of the opponent)...its locked behind easy static fights in PvE where you have a group to compensate for any mistake you may make.0 -
Knootewoot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Azurephoenix999 wrote: »
Pelinal's Aptitude - 5 piece bonus change: Affects weapon crit and spell crit values as well. Also halves the cost of abilities/spells that are scaled based upon the stats that were raised.
And you highest resource is also taken in account٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶
"I am a nightblade. Blending the disciplines of the stealthy agent and subtle wizard, I move unseen and undetected, foil locks and traps, and teleport to safety when threatened, or strike like a viper from ambush. The College of Illusion hides me and fuddles or pacifies my opponents. The College of Mysticism detects my object, reflects and dispels enemy spells, and makes good my escape. The key to a nightblade's success is avoidance, by spell or by stealth; with these skills, all things are possible."0 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To me, this is one of those arguments that makes great sense on paper, but in reality, it just doesnt matter unless you are a brand new player with no friends. I am not opposed to reworking useless sets, but whether a set is 2 trait or 9 trait makes no difference in terms of ease of access for a good chunk of the player-base.
Also, that version of TBS would be ridiculously OP.Edited by Oreyn_Bearclaw on June 14, 2018 4:54PM0 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game(well, the ones that existed at the time at least) so you are telling me that your grinding gear is worth more than all the effort I put in to become a master crafter? Ridiculous. Lets be honest here...vCoS as an example(substitute whatever dungeon or trial you want in its place, all the same). It was a difficult dungeon the first 4 or 5 times I attempted it...but once I got the mechanics down it was pretty simple...playing the same dungeon/trial with the same mechanics over and over and over again is a test of skill? I don't think so. The only dynamically changing fights in this game are in PvP areas where you are playing against an opponents that adapts to you...so once PvE "skill" is taken out of the equation...there is absolutely no justification for dropped sets to be any better than crafted sets. Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times. In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better". By the way, in regards to this comparison I should specify 9 trait sets should be as good as the best dropped sets...Julianos has always been overpowered for only 6 traits. If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets. Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
And literal afk'ing to get researching done was so tough.
Why should one research all the traits in the first place if the sets are subpar anyway?0 -
Swimguy✭✭✭TBS change- yes, but you CANNOT run divines on any TBS equipment.
Armor master. I think making the 5piece give all the resistance the set gives and replace the roughly 3k spell/physical with anything but weapon/spell damage/crit would be a good change.
Morkuldin- summons a warrior that uses the same weapon you triggered the buff with: Archer-attacks do moderate damage slows for 30% for 2 seconds
2h melee: heavy attacks every 8 seconds deal 8k ea.
dw: deals 2k every 5 seconds bleeds enemy for 7k over 10 seconds (bleed doesnt stack)
s/b: Warrior intercepts 50% of projectiles up to 25k damage for 10 seconds. when expired user is granted 20 ultimate based on amount absorbed 20 seconds CD.
staves: idk dont use staves
(these numbers are random and what I think would be balanced right off the top off my head I am NOT doing any calculations or math on my day off)
eternal hunt: should just set enemies caught in run off balance OR slow them after breaking free.
pelenials- no, pelenials is fine atm but maybe add a health bonus on top of 5 piece
I want gladiators to be changed a bit. Maybe add oblivion damage instead under 25%. replace the crit with stam/magicka bonus
also ashen grip. reduce cooldown to 1 second or increase damage.
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Aesthier✭✭✭✭✭How about we just remove the requirement for the 9th trait completely from the game.
It is a much simpler fix and to be honest it is obvious that ZoS does not want any crafted gear as BiS anyway.
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DanteYoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
You do realise this attitude is what helping to ruin the games future right, and also helping to destroy balance..
Customers should be able to get their characters maxed through all content in the game not just dungeons for the elites..Edited by DanteYoda on June 15, 2018 1:20AM1 -
Lylith✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »no........crafted sets are not meant to overpower farmables sorry!! that would take out the whole point of farming for stuff. so NOPE!!!! we dont need them upgraded at all their fine where they are.
I disagree with this whole attitude. Craftable sets should be just as good as dropped sets...neither better than the other, just different, with the crafted sets focus being base stat boosts and the dropped sets focus being special effects(Julianos vs Acuity as a perfect example). It takes a long time to master crafting and 9 trait sets should be as good as anything that drops, if you are playing content to farm sets I don't even know what to say...I play content because I enjoy it, not to farm a given set...if I get it, great, if not I am not worried about it, I will get it another day...in the meantime obviously I don't actually need it to play the game. There is this whole diseased thinking in this game that content is all about gear...I don't know why anyone plays this game if their sole motivation is to grind for gear since gear alone really does not make that much difference...10% difference? Big deal, who cares? Because you want to be on the leaderboards? I don't understand the mentality of the grind-for-gear people.
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Because I didnt put in the time on my master crafter right? Far more time than running a dungeon half a dozen different times(or trial) to get a full set of something...(remember, these days transmutation stones will ensure you get all the pieces you need for a full set within 10 runs) it took me FAR LONGER to become a master crafter than it did to finish every dungeon and trial in the game(well, the ones that existed at the time at least) so you are telling me that your grinding gear is worth more than all the effort I put in to become a master crafter? Ridiculous. Lets be honest here...vCoS as an example(substitute whatever dungeon or trial you want in its place, all the same). It was a difficult dungeon the first 4 or 5 times I attempted it...but once I got the mechanics down it was pretty simple...playing the same dungeon/trial with the same mechanics over and over and over again is a test of skill? I don't think so. The only dynamically changing fights in this game are in PvP areas where you are playing against an opponents that adapts to you...so once PvE "skill" is taken out of the equation...there is absolutely no justification for dropped sets to be any better than crafted sets. Take The Warrior in vHRC as an example here....once you have beat him once, you are fully capable of beating him 10,000 times if you choose...but its no justification for having access to better gear than others simply because you mashed buttons in a particular order at just the right times. In my view the differences in gear should be the focus...Julianos vs Mechanical Acuity...you want the special effect, go grind for mechanical acuity, you want the base stats, go craft Julianos. Will you do more damage with Acuity? possibly, but the difference isnt clear enough anymore to call it "better". By the way, in regards to this comparison I should specify 9 trait sets should be as good as the best dropped sets...Julianos has always been overpowered for only 6 traits. If you wanted to make it more exclusive to make yourself feel better about endless hours grinding, add a 10th trait that takes 6 months to research and can only be accessed by those who have had all other traits researched for at least a year...then make 10 trait sets for your top-tier crafted sets. Grinding content endlessly doesn't make you better than a master crafter, it just makes you different.
some good points.
additionally, which dropped set requires the same amount of time required to become a 9 trait crafter?
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Fherrit✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »
heres the thing droppables are meant for people willing to put in the time(you can always go through on normal as well btw) but they will always be stronger than craftable because what would be the point to farming if i could craft something as strong if not stronger than a farmable. that logic makes no sense thus is why it is what it is. craftables are suppose to be for beginners not endgame players who have farmed themselves to death for the sets they rightfully earned. a person shouldnt be able to craft one better than that. it again would take out the whole point of dungeons and trials.
Oh FFS the thinking that crafted items should be inferior to dropped item is 2004 WoW indoctrination and desperately needs to be buried in the deep dark hole it deserves to be right along with the raiding is everything mentality. Granted I may not agree with the OP's exact solutions, butI do agree with the spirit of his post. You however, with respect, are so so wrong.
RE: Beginner Gear, you mean "X of the Trainee"? But lets assume you want more variety than that, then what ZOS should've done is tune delves/dolmens and other overland content to drop "tokens" which you turn in at a zone vendor for zone specific gear and buy whatever is appropriate for your class/role/level.
Lets talk time investment. Perhaps you don't understand just how much time and effort it takes to become a 9 trait crafter? Assuming you log in each day at the right time and hit the research button it takes 363 days and 3 hours without ESO+, 10% less with ESO+ to get 9 traits before JC was implemented. Also there is the endless farming/refining of mats that you have to do constantly to get the upgrade materials. Granted you're not dependent on 3 other people pushing buttons alongside you but I assure you, it's quite a time sink and is actually an ongoing time sink as those very upgrade mats are just as readily used to upgrade dungeon drops, produce food/potions which also requires farming. Believing that farming dungeons is any more time consuming then constantly dismounting and tapping a resource is shockingly ignorant.
Also, if farming dungeons drops was such a grand joy why did we get the ability to alter the traits on a item? Isn't that what one is supposed to farm endlessly for, the ideal trait? But that got obnoxiously old didn't it? If you stood by your position about crafting you should also advocate getting rid of retraiting, as that maintains the policy of endless item farming from dungeons.
RE: "The hard work of farming drops" Lets not buy into this false sense of achievement here, I have quite a few fellow guildmates who run trials on normal with friends/guildmembers and obtain full sets in 4 runs or less by trading, upgrade them to gold and only farm for gold jewelry. The notion of drops being anything remotely resembling "hard work" is far from the reality of it (hard work is filling sandbags during a hurricane or working black friday at Best Buy..pressing keys? not-so-much). I'm not claiming it's snooze fest easy, or is anything less than eye gouging frustrating when the RNG gods *** on you, just that the sense of difficulty to acquire is inflated.
Now to rag on you less here's the thing: The goal isn't to make crafted more or less powerful, it's to make them diffferent and equallas viable as someone who is willing to run the same instance repeatedly. In fact, the dropped dungeons sets need a retune as well IMO, so many worthless sets in the game now that should have their item code yanked. And ideally, crafted and dungeon items should offer up great synergies that you can't get with just crafted or just dungeon drops.
So to wrap up, I may not agree with the exact solutions of the OP, but I do agree with the spirit of his post, and FWIW, I'd like to see the dropped item library get cleaned up and get a tune up to current game state.3 -
mocap✭✭✭✭✭
✭i use TBS on my healer loooong time and would be glad if devs get rid of stamina bonus or combine it with magicka. As for 50% increase i think will be better to add new mundus stones like:
- add X spell power to class abilities;
- reduce class abilities cost (or any ability cost);
- increase weapon/armor/jewerly enchant effectiveness by X%;
- increase monster set second bonus effectiveness by X%;
- increase your damage by X%;
- increase block effectiveness and recude block cost;
- increase whatever the hell by X%;0 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭All those sounds fine except for enteral hunt which is plenty good already. TBS is a really cool set and I really want it to work, but it’s just not worth it. I agree that doing a mag/stam and then spell and wpn damge would be a good change.
But tbh a lot of crafted sets need work and especially with jewelry crafting it would be nice if there were more than a small handful of viable sets. As is basically hundings, Julianos, and shacklebreaker are regularly used and useful. Then there’s a couple of niche uses like alchemist or pelinels, but that’s pretty much it. But that just goes to show that we need more solid sets and not this wonky, situational fifth traits that most crafted sets have.0