notimetocare wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »Kiralyn2000 wrote: »No, the base game experience (overland, questing, etc) can't be balanced around trial-geared dudes who sleepwalk their way through vet dungeons. It would be bad for the overall playerbase.
no actually itd be better. a game should have a difficulty hurdle in each advancement take dark souls into consideration. you have to overcome each hurdle thrown at you to truly do better you cant have the overland a easy steamroll because casuals say so. there needs to be difficulty advancement somehow implemented cause the game is just way to easy from start to finish(especially if i can grind a giant group of mobs from level 1- my cp in a short time there is something wrong)
50crowns says the vast majority of players would have quit initial ESO before vr10... Because they did.
I very much enjoyed the difficulty, but most people didn't. Id rather have a populated game and pick my challenges where and how I want as I do now
No, I actually stopped playing for a while when I couldn't beat the Manimarco fight in the main questline. I also had problems with the mage's guild last quest when you reclaim the island. If there were 2 elites, I was dead. This was back when I was a newbie. Now, when I start a new character, I breeze through the fights now.
You have to remember, this game is not balanced around CP720 players fully golded in trial gear. It's balanced for the new player that's just starting.
You want hard content? craft some CP90 gear and go kill things. That should provide a challenge.
Schattenfluegel wrote: »Back to the roots :>No, I actually stopped playing for a while when I couldn't beat the Manimarco fight in the main questline. I also had problems with the mage's guild last quest when you reclaim the island. If there were 2 elites, I was dead. This was back when I was a newbie. Now, when I start a new character, I breeze through the fights now.
You have to remember, this game is not balanced around CP720 players fully golded in trial gear. It's balanced for the new player that's just starting.
You want hard content? craft some CP90 gear and go kill things. That should provide a challenge.
Have you ever seen this game on his releasetimes...on 2014 (or Beta 2013)? This was hard, today...all the challenge on the Open World Content and the Mainstory is long gone.
And this was the best Time in Eso...without any Classguides etc. You've had to figured out by yourself, how the game and your class worked. It was very hard, but it was the best way to prepare you for endcontent (craglornraids were released later). And you have to learned more about your class, to play successfull in those days.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***
Schattenfluegel wrote: »Back to the roots :>No, I actually stopped playing for a while when I couldn't beat the Manimarco fight in the main questline. I also had problems with the mage's guild last quest when you reclaim the island. If there were 2 elites, I was dead. This was back when I was a newbie. Now, when I start a new character, I breeze through the fights now.
You have to remember, this game is not balanced around CP720 players fully golded in trial gear. It's balanced for the new player that's just starting.
You want hard content? craft some CP90 gear and go kill things. That should provide a challenge.
Have you ever seen this game on his releasetimes...on 2014 (or Beta 2013)? This was hard, today...all the challenge on the Open World Content and the Mainstory is long gone.
And this was the best Time in Eso...without any Classguides etc. You've had to figured out by yourself, how the game and your class worked. It was very hard, but it was the best way to prepare you for endcontent (craglornraids were released later). And you have to learned more about your class, to play successfull in those days.
and do you know why they kept making it easier? becasue it kept bleeding players. most people, when playing a video game to relax? do NOT want to suffer through it, rather then keep hammering at it, they leave and play something that doesn't punish them as much.
DuskMarine wrote: »Kiralyn2000 wrote: »No, the base game experience (overland, questing, etc) can't be balanced around trial-geared dudes who sleepwalk their way through vet dungeons. It would be bad for the overall playerbase.
no actually itd be better. a game should have a difficulty hurdle in each advancement take dark souls into consideration. you have to overcome each hurdle thrown at you to truly do better you cant have the overland a easy steamroll because casuals say so. there needs to be difficulty advancement somehow implemented cause the game is just way to easy from start to finish(especially if i can grind a giant group of mobs from level 1- my cp in a short time there is something wrong)
But we should have overland be stupid difficult because.... hardcore players say so?
Define "better". It's highly subjective
Schattenfluegel wrote: »Schattenfluegel wrote: »Back to the roots :>No, I actually stopped playing for a while when I couldn't beat the Manimarco fight in the main questline. I also had problems with the mage's guild last quest when you reclaim the island. If there were 2 elites, I was dead. This was back when I was a newbie. Now, when I start a new character, I breeze through the fights now.
You have to remember, this game is not balanced around CP720 players fully golded in trial gear. It's balanced for the new player that's just starting.
You want hard content? craft some CP90 gear and go kill things. That should provide a challenge.
Have you ever seen this game on his releasetimes...on 2014 (or Beta 2013)? This was hard, today...all the challenge on the Open World Content and the Mainstory is long gone.
And this was the best Time in Eso...without any Classguides etc. You've had to figured out by yourself, how the game and your class worked. It was very hard, but it was the best way to prepare you for endcontent (craglornraids were released later). And you have to learned more about your class, to play successfull in those days.
and do you know why they kept making it easier? becasue it kept bleeding players. most people, when playing a video game to relax? do NOT want to suffer through it, rather then keep hammering at it, they leave and play something that doesn't punish them as much.
Yeah you mean the Mentality to get more for doing nothing...
bellatrixed wrote: »Here's the massive fallacy in claiming overland content needs to "prep players for endgame":
Endgame for everyone is not raids/vets.
For some people endgame is solo questing
For other people endgame is just playing super casually
For other people endgame is crafting or decorating or socializing
In other words, NO MMO is going to alienate a massive segment of the population and make the game super hard just to cater to a few hardcore players.
The overland content is meant to be easy because it's meant to be experienced by everyone. Period.
bellatrixed wrote: »Here's the massive fallacy in claiming overland content needs to "prep players for endgame":
Endgame for everyone is not raids/vets.
For some people endgame is solo questing
For other people endgame is just playing super casually
For other people endgame is crafting or decorating or socializing
In other words, NO MMO is going to alienate a massive segment of the population and make the game super hard just to cater to a few hardcore players.
The overland content is meant to be easy because it's meant to be experienced by everyone. Period.
Inkfingerps4 wrote: »I haven’t checked this recently, but a while ago only 12% of PS4 players managed to get the “level 50 hero” achievement and I believe that figure was even less on Xbox!
On the basis of that alone I think it increasing the difficulty seems like a bad idea.
bellatrixed wrote: »Here's the massive fallacy in claiming overland content needs to "prep players for endgame":
Endgame for everyone is not raids/vets.
For some people endgame is solo questing
For other people endgame is just playing super casually
For other people endgame is crafting or decorating or socializing
In other words, NO MMO is going to alienate a massive segment of the population and make the game super hard just to cater to a few hardcore players.
The overland content is meant to be easy because it's meant to be experienced by everyone. Period.
Schattenfluegel wrote: »Back to the roots :>No, I actually stopped playing for a while when I couldn't beat the Manimarco fight in the main questline. I also had problems with the mage's guild last quest when you reclaim the island. If there were 2 elites, I was dead. This was back when I was a newbie. Now, when I start a new character, I breeze through the fights now.
You have to remember, this game is not balanced around CP720 players fully golded in trial gear. It's balanced for the new player that's just starting.
You want hard content? craft some CP90 gear and go kill things. That should provide a challenge.
Have you ever seen this game on his releasetimes...on 2014 (or Beta 2013)? This was hard, today...all the challenge on the Open World Content and the Mainstory is long gone.
And this was the best Time in Eso...without any Classguides etc. You've had to figured out by yourself, how the game and your class worked. It was very hard, but it was the best way to prepare you for endcontent (craglornraids were released later). And you have to learned more about your class, to play successfull in those days.
and do you know why they kept making it easier? becasue it kept bleeding players. most people, when playing a video game to relax? do NOT want to suffer through it, rather then keep hammering at it, they leave and play something that doesn't punish them as much.
DuskMarine wrote: »Kiralyn2000 wrote: »No, the base game experience (overland, questing, etc) can't be balanced around trial-geared dudes who sleepwalk their way through vet dungeons. It would be bad for the overall playerbase.
no actually itd be better. a game should have a difficulty hurdle in each advancement take dark souls into consideration. you have to overcome each hurdle thrown at you to truly do better you cant have the overland a easy steamroll because casuals say so. there needs to be difficulty advancement somehow implemented cause the game is just way to easy from start to finish(especially if i can grind a giant group of mobs from level 1- my cp in a short time there is something wrong)
But we should have overland be stupid difficult because.... hardcore players say so?
Define "better". It's highly subjective
MehrunesFlagon wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »Kiralyn2000 wrote: »No, the base game experience (overland, questing, etc) can't be balanced around trial-geared dudes who sleepwalk their way through vet dungeons. It would be bad for the overall playerbase.
no actually itd be better. a game should have a difficulty hurdle in each advancement take dark souls into consideration. you have to overcome each hurdle thrown at you to truly do better you cant have the overland a easy steamroll because casuals say so. there needs to be difficulty advancement somehow implemented cause the game is just way to easy from start to finish(especially if i can grind a giant group of mobs from level 1- my cp in a short time there is something wrong)
But we should have overland be stupid difficult because.... hardcore players say so?
Define "better". It's highly subjective
Craglorn is not stupid difficult.
100% it’s ridiculous
Solutions:
NPCs should hit harder
Increase detection radius
Give base game NPCs the latest animations
Delve bosses are abismal compared to release. During the main storyline where you and Sai fight those undead red guard mummies - that’s the standard of power certain bosses should have
Delve bosses are abismal compared to release. During the main storyline where you and Sai fight those undead red guard mummies - that’s the standard of power certain bosses should have
I see people saying delve bosses should be amped up, too.
What happens then?
- Influx of new players with a chapter.
- The new players can't complete the delves.
- The new players leave, frustrated, because the game is an unbalanced mess.
Why do the hardcore realise that the changes they desire would kill the game, it would make the game as dead as Craglorn. As dead as so many other MMOs that went on life support because they tried to appeal to the hardcore.
New players exist.
Don't be so selfish, self-centred, and completely without empathy for new players. It's frankly antisocial. This game isn't just for you. Hardcore players have trials, and that's frankly generous considering how tiny the hardcore demographic actually is compared to casuals.
Yep, same reason I brought up WoW earlier - it became a raging success because it focused on trying to cater to the casual player, while still giving something to the hardcore - the vast majority of the game was casual friendly and could be done solo, while the hardcore had the endgame raids to work on.honestly. people always wonder about run away success of WoW. but its very simple. it was the first MMo at the time that deliberately catered to casuals. it was the first MMO that tried to be more accessible to more people.
there are a lot of people looking back with rose tinted glasses, lamenting the lost days of hardcore wow.. but it was never hardcore.
why do I bring up wow, you ask? becasue nothing better illustrates the point that casuals are THE majority and where the money is.
Won't comment about the better rewards, but an optional difficulty setting would be great. This would give those who want more challenge something, while leaving the game as-is for the rest of us. For instance one thing they could do is make a toggle'able difficulty for all "instanced" content such as Delves, 'instance' part of quest's, etc... since these are already split from overland, having them have an option to go to a harder version for those wanting more difficulty would be good. Also maybe a toggle that adjust's the players personal scaling in overland... that way they can toggle the scaling from normal to/from harder as they want - this wouldn't solve issue's where multiple ppl fight the same mobs... but if it's just them and/or others with the same toggle set.... then they'd get more of a challenge.mind you, I think it IS a good idea to provide an OPTIONAL higher difficulty and give it better rewards (NOT unique rewards, just better, whether its more gold, or useful crafting mats, or gems to spend for crate stuff - something of that sort) but ONLY as optional difficulty. I have been gaming for a long time and games like Dark Souls, etc, the ones with no difficulty selector and unforgiving of errors combat - are in a minority.
Keep in mind; you don't just want the 20 year old college kid with 8 hrs a day to game.
You also want the 30+, 40+, 50++, full-time job, family and a house crowd who have disposable income, but maybe not as much free time.
How would you design your game?