Would you support earning Crown Items with Gold-to-Crown conversion?
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Stewart1874✭✭✭✭✭I'm all for it. Too much content is locked behind a paywall.PS4 - Europe - Aldmeri Dominion3 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Stewart1874 wrote: »I'm all for it. Too much content is locked behind a paywall.
Heaven forbid you have to pay crowns for DLC.2 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just sale for gold. I don’t follow why gold to crowns is a thought-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5011 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »Just sale for gold. I don’t follow why gold to crowns is a thought
Because the expectation is that people will go "Hey, WTS crown store mount for Gold, whisper offer"
And other people are like, "Dude, how can you make sure you don't get scammed? You can't!"
And then some people say "ZOS, you should make sure people don't get scammed!"
But so far ZOS is all radio silence, so as far as we know, ZOS doesn't give a fart if people get scammed, since they should have been using the system to give other people gifts not trades.5 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭The way I see it...- Crowns to Gold limits scamming and abuse
- Crowns to gold improve revenue for ZeniMax
- Improve revenue means better content.
- Without a system like this scams-for-gifts will be commonplace.
3 -
Saucy_Jack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭What you're failing to account for is that these systems have been implemented in hundreds of games and the result is always people gifting for gold with some people using it as intended.
Yes, but I suppose my point is that while people are worried that ESO won't be able to adequately police the "inevitable" gift scams that will come from this system, ESO is in no way responsible for policing such scams, as they are the result of people using the system for something it wasn't intended for - some might even say "explicitly wasn't intended for" given that the term "gifting" means that it's not supposed to be a two-way trade transaction.
I mean, sure, people can and in all likelihood will use the system for "cash-for-CS-items" purposes, but if they do, and get scammed, frankly I'd be all for ESO being absolutely silent in terms of responding to complaints. There's a reason why people buy things from reputable stores instead of buying things from "some guy's trunk".
Edited by Saucy_Jack on May 18, 2018 1:50AMALL HAIL SNUGGLORR THE MAGNIFICENT, KING OF THE RNG AND NIRN'S ONE TRUE GOD! Also, become a Scrub-scriber! SJ Scrubs: Playing games badly to make you feel better about yourself.5 -
Sheezabeast✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think Zos should create a Costume shop! They could stock it with clothing or maybe hair styles, heck even some tattoos. And make it all buyable with gold. They could rotate the stock. It would be a solution to the problem of there being a big disparity between the few in game costumes and mounts compared to the ones from the cash shop. It would work as a gold sink, and would give people in game an incentive to save gold to buy the items.Grand Master Crafter, Beta baby who grew with the game. PC/NA. @Sheezabeast if you have crafting needs!0 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭Saucy_Jack wrote: »What you're failing to account for is that these systems have been implemented in hundreds of games and the result is always people gifting for gold with some people using it as intended.
Yes, but I suppose my point is that while people are worried that ESO won't be able to adequately police the "inevitable" gift scams that will come from this system, ESO is in no way responsible for policing such scams, as they are the result of people using the system for something it wasn't intended for - some might even say "explicitly wasn't intended for" given that the term "gifting" means that it's not supposed to be a two-way trade transaction.
I mean, sure, people can and in all likelihood will use the system for "cash-for-CS-items" purposes, but if they do, and get scammed, frankly I'd be all for ESO being absolutely silent in terms of responding to complaints. There's a reason why people buy things from reputable stores instead of buying things from "some guy's trunk".
There is a greater possibility of damage from the gift-for-scams scenario. Imagine for a second the "gifter" went first and was never paid gold. He might be inclined to initiate a chargeback if his scam wasn't reversed. This creates a lot more problems.0 -
Saucy_Jack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think that would get shut down pretty quick though; what would be the reason for the chargeback?
Conversation 1:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but I bought them as a gift!"
"Did you give that item or items away?"
"Yes."
"Ok, we're done here."
Conversation 2:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but when I tried to trade someone the stuff for gold, he never sent the gold!"
"Not the intended purpose of the system, and not our problem. Ok, we're done here."
I'm not sure what other possible conversations people who attempting a chargeback would use?ALL HAIL SNUGGLORR THE MAGNIFICENT, KING OF THE RNG AND NIRN'S ONE TRUE GOD! Also, become a Scrub-scriber! SJ Scrubs: Playing games badly to make you feel better about yourself.5 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Saucy_Jack wrote: »What you're failing to account for is that these systems have been implemented in hundreds of games and the result is always people gifting for gold with some people using it as intended.
Yes, but I suppose my point is that while people are worried that ESO won't be able to adequately police the "inevitable" gift scams that will come from this system, ESO is in no way responsible for policing such scams, as they are the result of people using the system for something it wasn't intended for - some might even say "explicitly wasn't intended for" given that the term "gifting" means that it's not supposed to be a two-way trade transaction.
I mean, sure, people can and in all likelihood will use the system for "cash-for-CS-items" purposes, but if they do, and get scammed, frankly I'd be all for ESO being absolutely silent in terms of responding to complaints. There's a reason why people buy things from reputable stores instead of buying things from "some guy's trunk".
There is a greater possibility of damage from the gift-for-scams scenario. Imagine for a second the "gifter" went first and was never paid gold. He might be inclined to initiate a chargeback if his scam wasn't reversed. This creates a lot more problems.
If he never gets the gold, well, he gave it as a "gift", didnt he?
Just imagine this hypothetical conversation:
"Hello, ZOS rep.
I gifted player XYZ this item in exchange for # gold. I never received the gold. Please take away that gift until they give me the gold.
Thanks."
I mean, what is ZOS really going to say in response?
Unless ZOS actually takes a stance, I'd say my personal response is going to be "Uh, you gave them a gift through a system called Gifting. Do you routinely make people pay for the "gifts" you "give" them?"2 -
AlienatedGoat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭i would nt mind this- but this would encourage for even more gold bot farming.
Would actually discourage it. When people can buy gold direct from ZOS, the market for buying from shady gold sellers.
Works like this when you legalize anything. The black market dries up.Edited by AlienatedGoat on May 18, 2018 4:51PMPC-NA Goat - Bleat Bleat Baaaa3 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭Saucy_Jack wrote: »I think that would get shut down pretty quick though; what would be the reason for the chargeback?
Conversation 1:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but I bought them as a gift!"
"Did you give that item or items away?"
"Yes."
"Ok, we're done here."
Conversation 2:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but when I tried to trade someone the stuff for gold, he never sent the gold!"
"Not the intended purpose of the system, and not our problem. Ok, we're done here."
I'm not sure what other possible conversations people who attempting a chargeback would use?
It depends on the credit card company and there's something called "chargeback fraud".
For example in some cases the card holder will just argue "it wasn't delivered!" and some card companies default to the cardholder on anything digital, etc. It's not as cut and dry as it may seem.
What you're demonstrating in your mock conversations is logical and how it should work, though. However, many times it does not work that way.0 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭VaranisArano wrote: »Saucy_Jack wrote: »What you're failing to account for is that these systems have been implemented in hundreds of games and the result is always people gifting for gold with some people using it as intended.
Yes, but I suppose my point is that while people are worried that ESO won't be able to adequately police the "inevitable" gift scams that will come from this system, ESO is in no way responsible for policing such scams, as they are the result of people using the system for something it wasn't intended for - some might even say "explicitly wasn't intended for" given that the term "gifting" means that it's not supposed to be a two-way trade transaction.
I mean, sure, people can and in all likelihood will use the system for "cash-for-CS-items" purposes, but if they do, and get scammed, frankly I'd be all for ESO being absolutely silent in terms of responding to complaints. There's a reason why people buy things from reputable stores instead of buying things from "some guy's trunk".
There is a greater possibility of damage from the gift-for-scams scenario. Imagine for a second the "gifter" went first and was never paid gold. He might be inclined to initiate a chargeback if his scam wasn't reversed. This creates a lot more problems.
If he never gets the gold, well, he gave it as a "gift", didnt he?
Just imagine this hypothetical conversation:
"Hello, ZOS rep.
I gifted player XYZ this item in exchange for # gold. I never received the gold. Please take away that gift until they give me the gold.
Thanks."
I mean, what is ZOS really going to say in response?
Unless ZOS actually takes a stance, I'd say my personal response is going to be "Uh, you gave them a gift through a system called Gifting. Do you routinely make people pay for the "gifts" you "give" them?"
They would likely just go to their card provider not ZOS.1 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Saucy_Jack wrote: »I think that would get shut down pretty quick though; what would be the reason for the chargeback?
Conversation 1:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but I bought them as a gift!"
"Did you give that item or items away?"
"Yes."
"Ok, we're done here."
Conversation 2:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but when I tried to trade someone the stuff for gold, he never sent the gold!"
"Not the intended purpose of the system, and not our problem. Ok, we're done here."
I'm not sure what other possible conversations people who attempting a chargeback would use?
It depends on the credit card company and there's something called "chargeback fraud".
For example in some cases the card holder will just argue "it wasn't delivered!" and some card companies default to the cardholder on anything digital, etc. It's not as cut and dry as it may seem.
What you're demonstrating in your mock conversations is logical and how it should work, though. However, many times it does not work that way.
But the crown store item absolutely was delivered. How else did they gift it?
I get that the credit card company might not recognize that at first glance, but given that the proof of delivery is right there in the complaint, the resolution is pretty obvious at a 2nd look.
Cardholder: "It wasn't delivered"
Company: "ZOS, cardholder says it wasn't delivered."
ZOS: "O RLY? How'd they gift this "not delivered" item on this date? Oops, looks like it was delivered after all..."
But I'm not sure it would make it past ZOS, since the credit cars companies are only involved in buying the crowns and have nothing to do,with what players do with those crowns, i.e. gifting.2 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭VaranisArano wrote: »Saucy_Jack wrote: »I think that would get shut down pretty quick though; what would be the reason for the chargeback?
Conversation 1:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but I bought them as a gift!"
"Did you give that item or items away?"
"Yes."
"Ok, we're done here."
Conversation 2:
"I want a chargeback for my crown purchase!"
"Did you get your crowns?"
"Yes."
"Did you spend your crowns on something from the Crown Store?"
"Yes."
"Did that item or items get credited to your account?"
"Yes, but when I tried to trade someone the stuff for gold, he never sent the gold!"
"Not the intended purpose of the system, and not our problem. Ok, we're done here."
I'm not sure what other possible conversations people who attempting a chargeback would use?
It depends on the credit card company and there's something called "chargeback fraud".
For example in some cases the card holder will just argue "it wasn't delivered!" and some card companies default to the cardholder on anything digital, etc. It's not as cut and dry as it may seem.
What you're demonstrating in your mock conversations is logical and how it should work, though. However, many times it does not work that way.
But the crown store item absolutely was delivered. How else did they gift it?
I get that the credit card company might not recognize that at first glance, but given that the proof of delivery is right there in the complaint, the resolution is pretty obvious at a 2nd look.
Cardholder: "It wasn't delivered"
Company: "ZOS, cardholder says it wasn't delivered."
ZOS: "O RLY? How'd they gift this "not delivered" item on this date? Oops, looks like it was delivered after all..."
But I'm not sure it would make it past ZOS, since the credit cars companies are only involved in buying the crowns and have nothing to do,with what players do with those crowns, i.e. gifting.
I don't want to derail my own thread and I am not trying to argue with you but merchants have to sign agreements with each card company. Some companies are more consumer-siding than others. For example, MasterCard will usually side with the merchant unless strict proof is provided. However, American Express will side with the consumer most of the time. They even advertised for a while that they were "your warranty". There's instances of consumers not having satisfactory warranty assistance with a laptop manufacturer and AMEX just charging it back.
At any rate, its still annoying for a merchant to have to answer chargeback attempts constantly and is only ONE of many problems associated with gift-scamming.0 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭i allways want and need Gold, i pvp all time so i need Gold in ways that are completely easy.
as long as it's allowed by zenimax, ill do what ever for Gold.0 -
wenchmore420b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭For the love of Akatosh!!!
The system is not even released yet.
We have asked since CS was released for a gifting system. ( I wanted it so I could offer cool stuff for guild raffles...).
So..... ZoS gives it to us and we have to start a thread about how exploitable it is, how to exploit the system, debate credit card policies,talk how bad this can be, and gee...... let's do what GW2 did, lets do what WoW did, (and yes, WoW is dying, look who won Game of Year at MMORPG.com and other gaming sites for last 4 years, it's not WoW)...
How about a THANK YOU ZoS!! We have wanted this and now we create problems where there is none.
If "X" buys something and wants to "gift it" in hopes of scamming gold and gets ripped off, GOOD!
ZoS has much better things to do than Police players who try and exploit this system.
Why don't we wait till it is actually live, and hey! Crazy Idea!!! Let's use it the way ZoS intended?
I remember the first Motif that was "Crown Store Only". You could get the motif, craft lots of stuff, decon and sell mats for motif for LOTS gold cause the mats weren't available in game... Exploit for RL Dollars for Crowns to in game Gold?? Hell yes it was! A few did it for a while, and it died out. Same will happen here...
TLDR: Let's not make a mountain out of a mole hill before it is even released. And let's PLEASE stop any thread that starts with "GW2 did this, EvE did that, but in WoW they do........". This is ESO. Go play those others and stop trying to make ESO like those lame games!
Huzzah!!!!!
Drakon Koryn~Oryndill, Rogue~Mage,- CP ~Doesn't matter any more
NA / PC Beta Member since Nov 2013
GM~Conclave-of-Shadows, EP Social Guild, ~Proud member of: The Wandering Merchants, Phoenix Rising, Imperial Trade Union & Celestials of Nirn
Sister Guilds with: Coroner's Report, Children of Skyrim, Sunshine Daydream, Tamriel Fisheries, Knights Arcanum and more
"Not All Who Wander are Lost"
#MOREHOUSINGSLOTS“When the people that can make the company more successful are sales and marketing people, they end up running the companies. The product people get driven out of the decision making forums, and the companies forget what it means to make great products.”
_Steve Jobs (The Lost Interview)3 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »For the love of Akatosh!!!
The system is not even released yet.
We have asked since CS was released for a gifting system. ( I wanted it so I could offer cool stuff for guild raffles...).
So..... ZoS gives it to us and we have to start a thread about how exploitable it is, how to exploit the system, debate credit card policies,talk how bad this can be, and gee...... let's do what GW2 did, lets do what WoW did, (and yes, WoW is dying, look who won Game of Year at MMORPG.com and other gaming sites for last 4 years, it's not WoW)...
How about a THANK YOU ZoS!! We have wanted this and now we create problems where there is none.
If "X" buys something and wants to "gift it" in hopes of scamming gold and gets ripped off, GOOD!
ZoS has much better things to do than Police players who try and exploit this system.
Why don't we wait till it is actually live, and hey! Crazy Idea!!! Let's use it the way ZoS intended?
I remember the first Motif that was "Crown Store Only". You could get the motif, craft lots of stuff, decon and sell mats for motif for LOTS gold cause the mats weren't available in game... Exploit for RL Dollars for Crowns to in game Gold?? Hell yes it was! A few did it for a while, and it died out. Same will happen here...
TLDR: Let's not make a mountain out of a mole hill before it is even released. And let's PLEASE stop any thread that starts with "GW2 did this, EvE did that, but in WoW they do........". This is ESO. Go play those others and stop trying to make ESO like those lame games!
Huzzah!!!!!
These systems have been exploited in many games. It would be different if this was the first implementation of one.
Also, players have asked for clarity on whether or not "gifts-for-gold" was even allowed and we have had no answer.0 -
Beardimus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm a Flat no on any form of Gold to Crown conversion.
Right now with the gift change there is nothing to police the systems are separate. If people chose to make some agreement to use the system and get scammed that's on them.
Personally i think ZOS should just saying hitting for Gold exchange is against the TOS DO NOT DO IT.
Then anyone crying to them they got slammed A won't have a case and B can get banned. There its done.
Using real world cash to exchange for stuff in game isn't healthy. Many other games have seen this detrimental impact. It should stay out of ESO.Xbox One | EU | EP
Beardimus : VR16 Dunmer MagSorc [RIP MagDW 2015-2018]
Emperor of Sotha Sil 02-2018 & Sheogorath 05-2019
1st Emperor of RavenwatchAlts - - for the Lolz
Archimus : Bosmer Thief / Archer / Werewolf
Orcimus : Fat drunk Orc battlefield 1st aider
Scalimus - Argonian Sorc Healer / Pet master
Fighting small scale with : The SAXON Guild
Fighting with [PvP] : The Undaunted Wolves
Trading Guilds : TradersOfNirn | FourSquareTraders
Xbox One | NA | EP
Bëardimus : L43 Dunmer Magsorc / BG
Heals-With-Pets : VR16 Argonian Sorc PvP / BG Healer
Nordimus : VR16 Stamsorc
Beardimus le 13iem : L30 Dunmer Magsorc Icereach3 -
AlienatedGoat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »For the love of Akatosh!!!
The system is not even released yet.
We have asked since CS was released for a gifting system. ( I wanted it so I could offer cool stuff for guild raffles...).
So..... ZoS gives it to us and we have to start a thread about how exploitable it is, how to exploit the system, debate credit card policies,talk how bad this can be, and gee...... let's do what GW2 did, lets do what WoW did, (and yes, WoW is dying, look who won Game of Year at MMORPG.com and other gaming sites for last 4 years, it's not WoW)...
How about a THANK YOU ZoS!! We have wanted this and now we create problems where there is none.
If "X" buys something and wants to "gift it" in hopes of scamming gold and gets ripped off, GOOD!
ZoS has much better things to do than Police players who try and exploit this system.
Why don't we wait till it is actually live, and hey! Crazy Idea!!! Let's use it the way ZoS intended?
I remember the first Motif that was "Crown Store Only". You could get the motif, craft lots of stuff, decon and sell mats for motif for LOTS gold cause the mats weren't available in game... Exploit for RL Dollars for Crowns to in game Gold?? Hell yes it was! A few did it for a while, and it died out. Same will happen here...
TLDR: Let's not make a mountain out of a mole hill before it is even released. And let's PLEASE stop any thread that starts with "GW2 did this, EvE did that, but in WoW they do........". This is ESO. Go play those others and stop trying to make ESO like those lame games!
Huzzah!!!!!
If you want all that, go make your own thread. Expecting others to express your sentiments for you is unrealistic.PC-NA Goat - Bleat Bleat Baaaa0 -
kwisatz✭✭✭✭NO.
Give in-game gold a legal monetary value and this game will become an insane Korean style farm fest.
Gold and crowns should stay where they belong and not be blended: in-game the first, cash shop the other. Period.4 -
sylviermoone✭✭✭✭✭Interestingly, ZOS has already made a ruling on a similar case. A few years ago, people would donate items like game time cards, base game codes and rare pet codes to Guild Leaders for use as auction items and/or raffle prizes. ZOS decided this practice was against TOS, and sent warning mails and even handed out temporary bans for some. Some less scrupulous GM's would report other GM'S for this a day or so before bids closed as a way to grief them, since a banned GM wouldn't be able to log on and ensure that their guild got a kiosk that week. This was back when most GM's dropped their full bid for the week in the seconds before bids closed in order to not get bid-spied.
Anyway, ZOS's reasoning for disallowing this was that this practice is technically gold selling. When you exchange an item that has real world monetary value for in game currency, you are participating in an act of gold selling and violating TOS according to their own interpretation of the TOS.
I do think that for clarity's sake, ZOS should officially announce that they view crown item-to-gold trades in this light, as gold selling and a violation of TOS. If they do not, they should remove the restriction that would cause a GM to get a warning or temp ban for auctioning or raffling crown store items. Either way, it is incredibly important that ZOS is consistent in how it interprets its own TOS.
*edit: punctuationEdited by sylviermoone on May 18, 2018 7:53AMCo-GM, Angry Unicorn Traders: PC/NA
"Official" Master Merchant Tech Support
and Differently Geared AF
@sylviermoone1 -
Knowledge✭✭✭✭✭
✭sylviermoone wrote: »Interestingly, ZOS has already made a ruling on a similar case. A few years ago, people would donate items like game time cards, base game codes and rare pet codes to Guild Leaders for use as auction items and/or raffle prizes. ZOS decided this practice was against TOS, and sent warning mails and even handed out temporary bans for some. Some less scrupulous GM's would report other GM'S for this a day or so before bids closed as a way to grief them, since a banned GM wouldn't be able to log on and ensure that their guild got a kiosk that week. This was back when most GM's dropped their full bid for the week in the seconds before bids closed in order to not get bid-spied.
Anyway, ZOS's reasoning for disallowing this was that this practice is technically gold selling. When you exchange an item that has real world monetary value for in game currency, you are participating in an act of gold selling and violating TOS according to their own interpretation of the TOS.
I do think that for clarity's sake, ZOS should officially announce that they view crown item-to-gold trades in this light, as gold selling and a violation of TOS. If they do not, they should remove the restriction that would cause a GM to get a warning or temp ban for auctioning or raffling crown store items. Either way, it is incredibly important that ZOS is consistent in how it interprets its own TOS.
*edit: punctuation
There have been several lengthy threads regarding gifts-for-gold with no official announcement. At this juncture, gifting will be made live without any clarity on whether or not "gifts-for-gold" will be allowed. Perhaps it will be difficult to police or maybe ZOS is willing to allow it going forward.
If this is the case, I advocate for a gold-to-crown system.0 -
Zorgon_The_Revenged✭✭✭✭✭The way I see it...- Crowns to Gold limits scamming and abuse
- Crowns to gold improve revenue for ZeniMax
- Improve revenue means better content.
- Without a system like this scams-for-gifts will be commonplace.
A gold to crowns system would be interesting, but a crowns to gold system is a completely different thing.....the way I see it.0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CS items for Gold are a botter‘s dream come true.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1
