Instead of a topic asking about your build, perhaps look to the plethora of guides available

SmellyUnlimited · May 2018

This thread is littered with a never-ending stream of “PvP healer build help,” “My Stamblade,” and “Diary of a Dragonknight.”

Help yourself first. Alcast, Woehler, Giliamtherogue, Liofa, any many others have excellent guides put together for your best possible build. And when you get more mastery of your character, you can work some things around to more closely match your style of play.

This isn’t a criticism, but meant to be informative. You’ll find countless YouTube videos of top theorycrafters going over builds, nuanced aspects of the class, rotations, etc.

IF after doing your own homework, you still have questions, then the forum is an excellent tool. But respect your fellow gamer and try to inform yourself before putting it to the collective to do that work for you.

Jimmy_The_Fixer · May 2018

I agree, sort of. The best way to find good builds is via YouTube and premade guides, that's for sure. And that's especially true for pve.

But having the collective help someone with a build isn't really a burden on the collective. People like theorycrafting and talking about builds, and if some noob gets a better idea of the sets available to his class, all the better.

Edit: People probably shouldn't make a new post about a particular class+role if there's already a similar post about that same class+role on the front page.

VaranisArano · May 2018

The builds online are excellent, assuming you know the basics.

When players have questions here, I often find myself talking about the basics here and the "why" behind build choices.

Things like:
You probably want to go all stam or all magicka because it makes your abilities hit harder, unless you are building a tank or a hybrid.
You probably want to mix aoe skills with direct damage, so stam players often use Endless Hail while Magicka use Wall of Elements.
You want to use a food/drink buff because those stats are super helpful.
Why certain armor sets are well suited to certain roles.

I often see new players getting overwhelmed by builds they find online, so coming here and asking the community is a good way for them to get the "why you build this way" behind the builds they see online.

SmellyUnlimited · May 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

The builds online are excellent, assuming you know the basics.

When players have questions here, I often find myself talking about the basics here and the "why" behind build choices.

Things like:
You probably want to go all stam or all magicka because it makes your abilities hit harder, unless you are building a tank or a hybrid.
You probably want to mix aoe skills with direct damage, so stam players often use Endless Hail while Magicka use Wall of Elements.
You want to use a food/drink buff because those stats are super helpful.
Why certain armor sets are well suited to certain roles.

I often see new players getting overwhelmed by builds they find online, so coming here and asking the community is a good way for them to get the "why you build this way" behind the builds they see online.

Those I can understand, but I very rarely see a post by someone that new to the game. It’s more along the lines of “what’s BiS for stam DK??,” or “What’s a good Nightblade gank build for PvP?”

Nelson_Rebel · May 2018

The game shifts dramatically every patch

Most players in the game are unaware of those people and look to the ACTUAL game site (shocker) to get up-to-date information.

I fail to see how that's an issue. And I've played ESO since launch

SmellyUnlimited · May 2018

Then

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

The game shifts dramatically every patch

Most players in the game are unaware of those people and look to the ACTUAL game site (shocker) to get up-to-date information.

I fail to see how that's an issue. And I've played ESO since launch

Then we should lead them to discover those changes firsthand. Many players might not even know to go to the PTS forum notes for upcoming patch changes.

Give a man a fish, he eats for a day. Teach him the best spots and 200 insect parts, and he’ll sell perfect roe for life

Zeromaz · May 2018

Love this post. Good stuff... its the same stuff over and over again. The problem is people want to forego the trial and error... they want it handed to them now, now, now. Thats why the most popular ESO videos are build videos. You hardly ever see just some good ol fashion pvp slaughter videos get a lot of views

DoctorESO · May 2018

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

This thread is littered with a never-ending stream of “PvP healer build help,” “My Stamblade,” and “Diary of a Dragonknight.”

Help yourself first. Alcast, Woehler, Giliamtherogue, Liofa, any many others have excellent guides put together for your best possible build. And when you get more mastery of your character, you can work some things around to more closely match your style of play.

This isn’t a criticism, but meant to be informative. You’ll find countless YouTube videos of top theorycrafters going over builds, nuanced aspects of the class, rotations, etc.

IF after doing your own homework, you still have questions, then the forum is an excellent tool. But respect your fellow gamer and try to inform yourself before putting it to the collective to do that work for you.

"Rock Star" Build - Easy Solo & Group Gameplay, Very Affordable, Works for All Classes

Tasear · May 2018

Besides not letting go of alcast Sorc healer build, it's a point to discover your own path.

Sure skill adviser needs some tunning, but game's success runs on exploring. People should ask questions and learn. It's also a nice break from usual doom and gloom.

witchdoctor · May 2018

Tasear wrote: »

It's also a nice break from usual doom and gloom.

This.

I'd rather see a hundred 'what's BiS' posts then one more 'Crown crate dingos ate my baby' thread.

Joxer61 · May 2018

I agree 100%, and its the first thing I do when looking up stuff. Have found Alcast, Woeler, Liofa and Xynodes builds and sites but sadly most of that is end-game stuff. So I go to the forums to ask the community what they know as many times you can get someone who is doing the same thing or just did or can just share their experience.
Nothing wrong with using this format to ask for help, that's its purpose is it not? If you don't want to answer, don't. I have many posts out there just collecting dust as no one felt the urge to comment. Meh, just move on and keep going I say. But its from these forums that I have found many of the sites, so it is good to ask, maybe just not become repetitive...to which I am guilty.

MerlinPendragon · May 2018

People have fun theory crafting and debating. Forums will always be that way.

gref · May 2018

I learn from the responses to these posts

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2018

„Use third Party sites before you ask the game‘s forum“. - other way around it should be.

Cadbury · May 2018

While I generally agree with the OP, this feels like something you see on Reddit all the time: people complaining that other people ask questions that can be answered by using Google or Reddit's search.

Aknunsus · May 2018

As a player new to the game, possibly one month in now, I can say that finding assistance on class builds is not the easiest thing. Particularly when one first comes to the game's own website and forums to seek help. The forum here sorely needs to be split out for each class. It is a difficult, lengthy and time-consuming process to sort through the thousands of topics here to find answers to specific questions/guides about a class. Often the guides here seem to be outdated, at least for seeking guidance on a stamina templar.

Take note, that I did not post a question on here seeking help, even after finding relatively little helpful information within this forum.

I branched out to searching for third party sites via Google, and I again was faced with little prospects that appeared to be current. Most of your suggested sites, Woehler, Giliamtherogue, and Liofa, did not immediately pop up from my simple search terms: "stamina templar build eso." What did pop up was a paid guide (eso mastery or something), which I refuse to pay for, confident that I could find something free. Eventually I happened on something useful, I think it was Deltias gaming or something... I'd rather not watch several 30 minute youtube videos when I should be able find something written and readable within a few minutes.

If you don't know where to look, eso class guides seem more difficult to come by than other mmos I have played.

Rather than telling people not to come here to ask questions, which is what this forum was specifically designed for, perhaps you can just provide a helpful link to the sites you mentioned to the person seeking help.

(edited to reflect that Alcast actually did show up on my search terms)

Waffennacht · May 2018

I just wish the OPs of threads like that actually participate in the conversation after it's been created

Juju_beans · May 2018

When I first started playing I went to the "Player Guides" subforum to hunt down various builds/gear.
Read enough to figure out what gear I wanted when I hit cp160.
Looked over various rotation posts for my class and settled on something I'm comfortable with (not an end game trial player).
Played around with mundus stones and got combat metrics to study my dps.

That was my approach but not everyone wants to do that.

SmellyUnlimited · May 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

I just wish the OPs of threads like that actually participate in the conversation after it's been created

I’d already responded once, and just now the first time checking the forums for the day. I’ll make sure to send you personalized responses to all your inquiries. Even ones you don’t make.

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

„Use third Party sites before you ask the game‘s forum“. - other way around it should be.

What’s the better response, though? Both forums and non-forum can answer someone’s questions straight away, or you can post and then wait however long to receive an appropriate response (Waffennacht’s toxic drivel above is an example of an “inappropriate response”.). But taking it one step further, I searched the forums for class builds as I would google. And lo and behold. I found a plethora.

My point is that people have put a lot of work into build sites. This has nothing to do with theorycrafting, but rather people looking for “BiS” or a “good VMA build.” I even searched Stamina Nightblade VMA, and again, found quite a few relevant, and recent, posts on various builds.

One thing that would be nice for new and old players alike would be the ability to inspect people. Then they can read firsthand the gear setup. The whole “I don’t want to give away my tradesecrets!” nonsense holds no water. Players have no reasonable expectation of privacy as to their equipment, upsides far outweigh the down - seeing what a player use in PvP to be able to 1vX so efficiently, setups for burst, group utility setups, understanding what thay green circle on the ground is after reading the player was using Eternal Hunt, etc.

Forum search can be as good, if not better, than third-party. Most of the top build sites have a post on the forums linking to updated builds and such they’ve put on their third-party site.

This is all headlined under the “Do Yourself a Favor” idea. There’s certainly no punishment for someone using the the forums to ask about builds, but time can be much better spent finding that information out more quickly and testing it. Asking forum questions is inherently less efficient because of a lag time for answers to trickle-in. And yet still, those answers may be from many players who don’t have a very firm grasp on character mechanics themselves.

Don’t trust the man leading you to water, but look to the man whose thirst is quenched.

Joxer61 · May 2018

Not sure I get the reason for your post OP. Forums are used (or abused) for people to find info and comment on the game. What purpose would you have them serve if not that?

Waffennacht · May 2018

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

I just wish the OPs of threads like that actually participate in the conversation after it's been created

I’d already responded once, and just now the first time checking the forums for the day. I’ll make sure to send you personalized responses to all your inquiries. Even ones you don’t make.

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

„Use third Party sites before you ask the game‘s forum“. - other way around it should be.

What’s the better response, though? Both forums and non-forum can answer someone’s questions straight away, or you can post and then wait however long to receive an appropriate response (Waffennacht’s toxic drivel above is an example of an “inappropriate response”.). But taking it one step further, I searched the forums for class builds as I would google. And lo and behold. I found a plethora.

My point is that people have put a lot of work into build sites. This has nothing to do with theorycrafting, but rather people looking for “BiS” or a “good VMA build.” I even searched Stamina Nightblade VMA, and again, found quite a few relevant, and recent, posts on various builds.

One thing that would be nice for new and old players alike would be the ability to inspect people. Then they can read firsthand the gear setup. The whole “I don’t want to give away my tradesecrets!” nonsense holds no water. Players have no reasonable expectation of privacy as to their equipment, upsides far outweigh the down - seeing what a player use in PvP to be able to 1vX so efficiently, setups for burst, group utility setups, understanding what thay green circle on the ground is after reading the player was using Eternal Hunt, etc.

Forum search can be as good, if not better, than third-party. Most of the top build sites have a post on the forums linking to updated builds and such they’ve put on their third-party site.

This is all headlined under the “Do Yourself a Favor” idea. There’s certainly no punishment for someone using the the forums to ask about builds, but time can be much better spent finding that information out more quickly and testing it. Asking forum questions is inherently less efficient because of a lag time for answers to trickle-in. And yet still, those answers may be from many players who don’t have a very firm grasp on character mechanics themselves.

Don’t trust the man leading you to water, but look to the man whose thirst is quenched.

Ugh I meant the threads in which you described...

The ones that ask, "what can I do to improve?" - they do not post after creating the thread.

But God damn, you sure took it personally, and hard

Anotherone773 · May 2018

Or we could look at this another way. If answering questions bothers you, then dont open threads asking for help. See how easy that is?The forums have help sections for a reason. If those sections bother you, simply dont use them. But lets not discourage people from asking questions in C&CM or PHP and then complain about all the bad players that "dont know how to play their character" in general discussion. It seems like we are cutting off our nose in spite of our face.

gnarlyvandal · May 2018

Being told which skills to use without an explanation of why isn’t very helpful, I’ve found the most detailed explanations of this game on this forum more than anywhere else.
If you see one of those posts, how about kindly linking the websites so the OP can go through them? Until recently I only knew of alcast and deltias

Joxer61 · May 2018

gnarlyvandal wrote: »

Being told which skills to use without an explanation of why isn’t very helpful, I’ve found the most detailed explanations of this game on this forum more than anywhere else.
If you see one of those posts, how about kindly linking the websites so the OP can go through them? Until recently I only knew of alcast and deltias

And Deltia has quit, like a year ago, so there is that. So yea, what the above folks have said, just don't go there, simples.

Brutusmax1mus · May 2018

It's easier to make a thread and get information that's current. Many threads in the search feature are WAY to out of date, which leads to necros.

Got a question, ask it. People who aren't bothered will help. Why bother making a thread about being bothered about people posing questions.

Lol @Waffennacht being "toxic"

SmellyUnlimited · May 2018

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

It's easier to make a thread and get information that's current. Many threads in the search feature are WAY to out of date, which leads to necros.

Got a question, ask it. People who aren't bothered will help. Why bother making a thread about being bothered about people posing questions.

Lol @Waffennacht being "toxic"

Quite a difference between being bothered by something, and trying to problem-solve. Taken in the aggregate, if anything I want these players with the abundance of questions to seek out answers instead of being spoon-fed them. Why? Because I’ve read a lot of those posts, and the information they are getting in response is wrong. Not only misinformation, but given so casually, as if the person giving it hasn’t a clue how incorrect it is. Which leads back to player sites; there is a vast WEALTH of info on these sites, and I’ve yet to come across replies to any of those threads that match even a 1/10th of th information provided (in fact, when the answers are correct, they’re taken almost whole hog from those theorycrafter sites).

What’s the point of the number of relevant, class/skill guides on YouTube and player sites? Why have them at all if no one uses them? I’m trying to parse out how the Information Age has made people somehow less inquisitive, or less likely to use the vast tools at their disposal.

@Waffennacht
I apologize. I misread your post and lashed out. You made a good point; I’ve looked now at the threads on the front page for build help, and only a single one of them the OP actually responded.

Waffennacht · May 2018

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

It's easier to make a thread and get information that's current. Many threads in the search feature are WAY to out of date, which leads to necros.

Got a question, ask it. People who aren't bothered will help. Why bother making a thread about being bothered about people posing questions.

Lol @Waffennacht being "toxic"

Quite a difference between being bothered by something, and trying to problem-solve. Taken in the aggregate, if anything I want these players with the abundance of questions to seek out answers instead of being spoon-fed them. Why? Because I’ve read a lot of those posts, and the information they are getting in response is wrong. Not only misinformation, but given so casually, as if the person giving it hasn’t a clue how incorrect it is. Which leads back to player sites; there is a vast WEALTH of info on these sites, and I’ve yet to come across replies to any of those threads that match even a 1/10th of th information provided (in fact, when the answers are correct, they’re taken almost whole hog from those theorycrafter sites).

What’s the point of the number of relevant, class/skill guides on YouTube and player sites? Why have them at all if no one uses them? I’m trying to parse out how the Information Age has made people somehow less inquisitive, or less likely to use the vast tools at their disposal.

@Waffennacht
I apologize. I misread your post and lashed out. You made a good point; I’ve looked now at the threads on the front page for build help, and only a single one of them the OP actually responded.

No problem, and I can see how it could be taken that way

Too many times someone posts "help me! My X can't beat anything!" - then when we ask to hear what sets, race, Mundus etc there's no response. Then there's like 5 more responses about what people run, then the thread dies.

For websites I use wiki - but I am very suspect if they are correct, I usually then cross reference @alcast 's website. Outside of that here and tamrielfoundry I don't use much

Minyassa · May 2018

ESO forum is always up to date. I spent a few thousand gold retooling a toon based on a really great site I found, only to find out the hard way that it was WAY old (there were no actual dates on it to go by) and the info was no longer relevant.

Ozstryker · May 2018

A while back I was looking for a specific nugget of info, couldn't really find a streamer that went that technical, but.... I found a discussion on the forums regarding the topic I was researching..
The problem was, while it was a very good thread it still didn't quite resolve my issue! So, I elaborated in said thread and hoped someone might know where I was going... .... Every reply was along the lines of "nice necro noob"...helpful no?

My point is if u have a question, ask it! If you can be helpful, then do! But don't whinge cos someone reached out, yeah the answer may be there somewhere hidden away on the internet but seriously if u don't like it... scroll on

Saturnana · May 2018

All these flavours, and you chose to be salty.

SmellyUnlimited wrote: »

Help yourself first

^ But in all seriousness, I agree with this. (:
Though I also recognize that some very new players may not yet know of the sources you mentioned. And even then people may fear that those builds can be outdated, so they'd like to poll the community on what is a good/viable option for them right now.

In the end, I try to help the genuinely clueless newbies where I can (not to say that that's often, since I'm only an average player that doesn't know all too much about BiS gear xD), and try to ignore the people that seem to create threads out of lazy convenience.