ZOS, an explanation or insight would be appreciated.

Zypheran · May 2018

Every year you guys run crown sales at 40% discount. This year you have made a decision to half this discount to 20%. For many people, this constitutes a huge decrease in crown store value.
Given that this is such a substantial change to your price/value traditions and given that this has attracted such negative reaction from your player base, would you not think it worth explaining the decision behind this abrupt shift in price point?
Any insight would be appreciated.
Yours,
A loyal subscriber.

Jim_Pipp · May 2018

They are doing an experiment while the game is doing well. Will people pay more for the same stuff...

they will add cool stuff to the Crown store soon to make you want crowns... e.g. remember the barbarian outfit data mined ages ago

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

Explanation

Lake · May 2018

The marketing department always experiments with timing and pricing. If this 20% sale goes well for them, the 50% sales will never be seen again.

VaranisArano · May 2018

My very unofficial tinfoil hat explanation: ZOS sees the large number of threads on the forums begging for a crown sale and some marketing exec says, "Hey, guys, they sound pretty desperate for a crown sale. Do you think they are desperate enough for a 20% sale?"

My less tinfoil-hat suspicion is that with Morrowind coming out as a DLC for crowns, they don't want people stocking up in advance and getting Morrowind for effectively half off.

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

My very unofficial tinfoil hat explanation: ZOS sees the large number of threads on the forums begging for a crown sale and some marketing exec says, "Hey, guys, they sound pretty desperate for a crown sale. Do you think they are desperate enough for a 20% sale?"

My less tinfoil-hat suspicion is that with Morrowind coming out as a DLC for crowns, they don't want people stocking up in advance and getting Morrowind for effectively half off.

That's not a tinfoil hat explanation. That's how marketing works. You schedule sales around consumer demand levels. You determine that demand from all sources available to you (including these forums).

Zypheran · May 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Explanation

a) Wikipedia is not a good source for insight
b) it is for the very reasons quoted in that article (i.e. customer sensitivity to price) that I am suggesting that ZOS may want to shed some light on such a substantial impact on their cost/value decisions

Tabbycat · May 2018

I guess it depends on how frequent they are.

Would people prefer 50% off crowns twice a year or 20% off crowns for a limited time every month?

Ley · May 2018

ZOS is a business. Not sure what explanation you need beyond that.

Do you really expect them to come on here and say that they reduced the discount amount compared to previous sales, because they believe it will be more profitable in the long run for them?

Would it make you feel better if they did?

I was a bit disappointed that the crown discount was not what I was expecting. Then I got over it. Maybe next one will be better, maybe not.

It's one thing to express dissatisfaction with the sale and it not meeting your expectations. I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

Zypheran · May 2018

Tabbycat wrote: »

I guess it depends on how frequent they are.

Would people prefer 50% off crowns twice a year or 20% off crowns for a limited time every month?

And if that is to be the case then a simple forthcoming statement from ZOS would alleviate customer negative reaction to a perceived negative impact on cost/value.
Whether what they do is right/wrong, justified or not, I believe they could at least offer us a comment on this decision

Vulsahdaal · May 2018

Tabbycat wrote: »

I guess it depends on how frequent they are.

Would people prefer 50% off crowns twice a year or 20% off crowns for a limited time every month?

Im ok with 50% off twice a year. *shrugs*

Istoppucks · May 2018

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

Zypheran · May 2018

Ley wrote: »

ZOS is a business. Not sure what explanation you need beyond that.

Do you really expect them to come on here and say that they reduced the discount amount compared to previous sales, because they believe it will be more profitable in the long run for them?

Would it make you feel better if they did?

I was a bit disappointed that the crown discount was not what I was expecting. Then I got over it. Maybe next one will be better, maybe not.

It's one thing to express dissatisfaction with the sale and it not meeting your expectations. I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

Actually I do expect an explanation beyond "We are a business". If any other service to which I subscribe made such a substantial change to their pricing structure, I would usually think it would be accompanied by a statement.
Simple example - earlier this year my ISP upped their prices by 6%. The month before it took effect, they contacted their customers to explain why they were increasing their prices.
Whatever way you look at it, changing the traditional sale structure from 40% discount down to 20% constitutes a significant increase in cost to a large segment of players

Zypheran · May 2018

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

This is a price increase. That attracts negative comment

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Explanation

a) Wikipedia is not a good source for insight
b) it is for the very reasons quoted in that article (i.e. customer sensitivity to price) that I am suggesting that ZOS may want to shed some light on such a substantial impact on their cost/value decisions

Wikipedia is a wonderful for insights as long as you follow the citations.

And why would a company share its pricing strategy with its customers? This information is for management/shareholders only, for obvious reasons.

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

This is a price increase. That attracts negative comment

21,000 crowns:
Regular price: $180
Price today: $144

14,000 crowns:
Regular price: $130
Price today: $104

Looks like a discount to me.

*All prices in CAD since that's my currency.

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

Tabbycat wrote: »

I guess it depends on how frequent they are.

Would people prefer 50% off crowns twice a year or 20% off crowns for a limited time every month?

And if that is to be the case then a simple forthcoming statement from ZOS would alleviate customer negative reaction to a perceived negative impact on cost/value.
Whether what they do is right/wrong, justified or not, I believe they could at least offer us a comment on this decision

There is a reason why they don't announce crown sales, and it's not hard to figure out:

They want as many people as possible to buy them at full price.

No company is transparent about their pricing strategy. Otherwise, it wouldn't be much of a strategy.

Zypheran · May 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

This is a price increase. That attracts negative comment

21,000 crowns:
Regular price: $180
Price today: $144

14,000 crowns:
Regular price: $150
Price today: $104

Looks like a discount to me.

*All prices in CAD since that's my currency.

To be fair, you're around here long enough to appreciate that this is a significant change to the normal discount structure. People stock up on crowns during sales so a decrease in the discount is effectively a price increase.

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

This is a price increase. That attracts negative comment

21,000 crowns:
Regular price: $180
Price today: $144

14,000 crowns:
Regular price: $150
Price today: $104

Looks like a discount to me.

*All prices in CAD since that's my currency.

To be fair, you're around here long enough to appreciate that this is a significant change to the normal discount structure. People stock up on crowns during sales so a decrease in the discount is effectively a price increase.

But a company isn't obligated to maintain the same discount structure forever. If they feel they can make more money by doing a 20% discount, then that's their decision.

If it turns out they made less than they thought, of course they'll go back to bigger discounts. They might still be planning to do a bigger discount down the line anyway and are just doing this to try and maximize sales of the upcoming houses and mounts.

Zypheran · May 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

This is a price increase. That attracts negative comment

21,000 crowns:
Regular price: $180
Price today: $144

14,000 crowns:
Regular price: $150
Price today: $104

Looks like a discount to me.

*All prices in CAD since that's my currency.

To be fair, you're around here long enough to appreciate that this is a significant change to the normal discount structure. People stock up on crowns during sales so a decrease in the discount is effectively a price increase.

But a company isn't obligated to maintain the same discount structure forever. If they feel they can make more money by doing a 20% discount, then that's their decision.

If it turns out they made less than they thought, of course they'll go back to bigger discounts. They might still be planning to do a bigger discount down the line anyway and are just doing this to try and maximize sales of the upcoming houses and mounts.

Hopefully you're right and this doesn't represent a permanent change to the discount structure

Ley · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

Ley wrote: »

ZOS is a business. Not sure what explanation you need beyond that.

Do you really expect them to come on here and say that they reduced the discount amount compared to previous sales, because they believe it will be more profitable in the long run for them?

Would it make you feel better if they did?

I was a bit disappointed that the crown discount was not what I was expecting. Then I got over it. Maybe next one will be better, maybe not.

It's one thing to express dissatisfaction with the sale and it not meeting your expectations. I'm not sure what the point of this thread is.

Actually I do expect an explanation beyond "We are a business". If any other service to which I subscribe made such a substantial change to their pricing structure, I would usually think it would be accompanied by a statement.
Simple example - earlier this year my ISP upped their prices by 6%. The month before it took effect, they contacted their customers to explain why they were increasing their prices.
Whatever way you look at it, changing the traditional sale structure from 40% discount down to 20% constitutes a significant increase in cost to a large segment of players

Not sure what is so hard to grasp. Businesses are around to make money, they don't have to have a cost increase to try to optimize their marketing strategies. Maybe they did have a cost increase somewhere, maybe an investment didn't pan out, maybe they want to give all their employees raises or a nice Christmas bonus, maybe they're hiring new talent to expand the game, maybe their investors are pressuring them to increase profit. Maybe they decided that instead of having only 2 big sales (on average) a year, they'll start adding a few smaller ones in between. Point is, none of that matter and they don't owe you an explanation for their business decisions.

Look at trends. Players wait for highly predictable sales, stock up on crowns and then don't buy any until the next sale. There are always exceptions to this and players who will buy crowns at full price, but clearly a lot of players hold off until a sale comes around. This means that twice a year (based on trends) they get a spike in revenue and then a drastic decrease until the next spike-worthy event. I'm sure new DLC and expansions also generate spikes. Perhaps this is a way for them to try to generate a more steady, less spikey stream of revenue.

This sale is 20%, them giving you a detailed breakdown of their marketing decision-making process isn't going to change that.

esotoon · May 2018

Zypheran wrote: »

To be fair, you're around here long enough to appreciate that this is a significant change to the normal discount structure. People stock up on crowns during sales so a decrease in the discount is effectively a price increase.

Especialy when combined with the price increase in Crowns last Summer.

This time last year a pack of 5500 cost £23.99 at full price. In today’s 20% off “sale” they cost £23.99.

JJBoomer · May 2018

why do people keep thinking ESO was doomed financially until crown crates and reduced discounts came? Like you know that's literally not true right?

Like?????

madchuska83 · May 2018

They could've just not put them on sale.

MLGProPlayer · May 2018

JJBoomer wrote: »

why do people keep thinking ESO was doomed financially until crown crates and reduced discounts came? Like you know that's literally not true right?

Like?????

The population actually exploded after the switch to B2P. The game was almost dead under the subscription model (it was averaging 500 players on Steam, lol).

heaven13 · May 2018

If limiting their sales to 20% means they're going to actually lower crown prices to more reasonable levels, I'm okay with it. (All ZOS has to do is look at all the "only buy crowns when they're half off" posts to realize how they've devalued their own psuedo currency, thus increasing the prices of their goods to compensate)

If they keep the high prices AND stick to 20% off...well, then I consider that just another step towards alienating customers who want to pay for goods but refuse to be nickel and dimed to death.

IMO, they shouldn't have it both ways (notice I didn't say can't, because I know darn well they can do whatever they want, regardless of the consumer satisfaction/long-term health of their IP)

kargen27 · May 2018

The forum mods were getting tired of seeing auction house threads and nerf skill/class/??? threads and asked if something could be done to give them a short break. They kicked around a few ideas and someone said hey how about a crown sale but don't give them much of a discount. High fives all around and here we are.

Saucy_Jack · May 2018

The discount itself isn't what people are complaining about; it's the aggregation of a) a sharp decrease in crown purchasing power since they were introduced, b) an increase in general crown prices, and c) a sharp decrease in the discount amount compared to earlier discounts.

If crown purchasing power and general pricing had stayed the same and just the discount was shrunk, I don't think there'd be near as much pushback. But when the discount's shrunk IN ADDITION TO crown prices in general going up and people being able to purchase less in the store with the same amount of crowns, then it leads logically to one of two conclusions:

1. ZOS is struggling financially and is trying to eke out dollars any possible way they can in an attempt to stave off bankruptcy. I do not believe this to be the case.

2. Rather than being content with decently lucrative profits, ZOS is being super greedy in an attempt to make LUDICROUS profits. Yes, the purpose of a business is to make money, but ZOS is already doing that, and has historically been able to do that, without the marketing department giving the playerbase the double deuce.

3. I suppose there's actually a third conclusion, and that's investors whining about how x amount of profits isn't ENOUGH profits for their whiny arses to be content. I chalk this up to the modern day investing attitude of "I'm only in this to make a quick buck" and not "I'm investing in this company because I believe in what they're doing and want to see them grow and flourish". Also known as "I'm an entitled prick of an investor" syndrome.

Emma_Overload · May 2018

Istoppucks wrote: »

Last week the tears were about FREE crates this week the discount isnt enough. You cant make this stuff up. Some people will never be happy.

Actually, I would have been happy with the usual discount, like I always am.

But 20%??? No way!

Waffennacht · May 2018

Hey this works here too!

Ackwalan · May 2018

Jim_Pipp wrote: »

They are doing an experiment while the game is doing well. Will people pay more for the same stuff...
they will add cool stuff to the Crown store soon to make you want crowns... e.g. remember the barbarian outfit data mined ages ago

You will be able to gift some of the crown items. ZOS is testing the gold to crown rate of exchange.