Rethinking why I subbed to ESO Plus

joneb · April 2018

I have had this game from the start and subbed for a long time then I gave in when I had so many problems with it crashing and losing connection and left for a year and a half. Its the first MMO I have actually returned to after being away so long. I still have had much crashing and disconnection but most recently it has been less frequent.

As I have invested a lot of time in three characters I had bough dlc with my free crowns from the ESO Plus so I was happy for a while to just play free, especially as even then I was crashing a lot. I changed settings very recently and rarely crash in relation to my machines low specs but I'm still disconnecting occasionally too and followed instructions related to that to no avail.. I persevere though and because I needed lots of crafting bag space I opted for ESO Plus for all the benefits. However, on top of the of the crashing, I have this very problematic nuisance of servers down and I am annoyed that not long after buying Morrowind, only interested in the zone though I appreciate the mount. I now find i would have got it free had i waited. Im pretty pissed off.

I just thought you should know ZOS because there will be a lot of people with game issues which may not be the games fault but its compounded with all the rest of the recent developments. I know Im not happy and thinking of with drawing my sub. Eventually I may devote myself to a new game.

TerraDewBerry · April 2018

Incorporating the old expansion into the newer one is a very common MMO thing.. Think of it this way, the people who wait for the older expansion to be added to the new one have to wait to play that for a year. It's old content..

ItsMeToo · April 2018

Customer Service would be a better place to put this thread. PM them with your issues.

drkfrontiers · April 2018

Dear.. [next disgruntled player]

Game companies are in business because they can generate real world money and skills to support their project.
Millions are needed to pay for research, development, and a myriad of other corporate functions needed to run a AAA+ MMO. And I have not been begun to scratch the surface of the cost of infrastructure and equipment to support that.

Game companies, alike any other business in the world offers potential customers "specials" to attract them to purchase their product. EVER business in the known history of mankind, has done this.

Revenue does not magically sprout out of the ether.

So, before you feel as though your insanely passive aggressive threat of "moving-on" has any impact to a company’s bottom line or priorities, here’s the bitter truth.

It does not.

In the boardroom, where they are talking about millions, weighed against your "woe is me", there are literally 1000s of happy, content players.

I ask you - when you go to the store, and you see any item on special, I wonder - do you demand to speak to the manager and say "How dare you! Last week this was not on special and this week it is. So last week I was screwed over, and I'm now leaving your store!!!" If so, I would seek help.

Instead of all the angst, perhaps your time would be better spent to find what makes you happy.

DebianPrime · April 2018

I used to play WOW. I bought into it shortly after Cataclysm. When I purchased it, I got BC and WotLK as part of it for free.

Fast forward a couple yeas, and my Daughter bought in, and started playing, and she got Cataclysm and MoP as part of it when she bought Warlords.

I had to buy those 2 expansions. Was I a bit salty about it, yeah. Do I understand that no one is going to buy into a game where they need to purchase the newest expansion for $40-$60, AND have to pay for multiple previous expansions, yeah, I get that too.

Nature of the game, so to speak.

Lamiai · April 2018

Just started playing again after 11 months away from the game last week, purchased a sub, this is why my friends call me an idiot.

They are right.

danno8 · April 2018

OP, you should contact customer service and see if they can refund you the cost of Morrowind to put towards the new Summerset Isles expansion. I am guessing if it was in the last month or so they may be fine with doing this for you. Most retailers would be.

In regards to crashing and disconnecting it is most likely a problem on your end, but if you open a ticket with customer service they can often dig a bit deeper than the standard FAQ solutions.

SergeantJinx · April 2018

You will get over it.

danno8 · April 2018

drkfrontiers wrote: »

Dear.. [next disgruntled player]

Game companies are in business because they can generate real world money and skills to support their project.
Millions are needed to pay for research, development, and a myriad of other corporate functions needed to run a AAA+ MMO. And I have not been begun to scratch the surface of the cost of infrastructure and equipment to support that.

Game companies, alike any other business in the world offers potential customers "specials" to attract them to purchase their product. EVER business in the known history of mankind, has done this.

Revenue does not magically sprout out of the ether.

So, before you feel as though your insanely passive aggressive threat of "moving-on" has any impact to a company’s bottom line or priorities, here’s the bitter truth.

It does not.

In the boardroom, where they are talking about millions, weighed against your "woe is me", there are literally 1000s of happy, content players.

I ask you - when you go to the store, and you see any item on special, I wonder - do you demand to speak to the manager and say "How dare you! Last week this was not on special and this week it is. So last week I was screwed over, and I'm now leaving your store!!!" If so, I would seek help.

Instead of all the angst, perhaps your time would be better spent to find what makes you happy.

Actually most stores have a 30 days price guarantee. If it goes on sale within that time they will refund you the difference. Even online retailers do this now. It's good business practice.

Pangnirtung · April 2018

I subbed for a long time, lost interest, unsubbed and stopped playing for a while.

Then I started playing again and after a few months re-subbed.

You might end up doing the same.

When you do quit, realize that you might feel differently in a few months and save yourself the trouble of having to download the game all over again.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2018

So much salt lately.

They are doing things right. Enticing new players is essential for keeping things healthy.

As a vet early adopter, I don’t feel cheated at all. Morrowind is fun and was enjoyed for a year.

Slurg · April 2018

You don’t have to subscribe every month, you know.

Gythral · April 2018

Thinks about cancelling sub - then remembers how much junk is in my bank and crafting bag & how many of the alts would have to return to being mules again

They got my sub money until I cant stand trying to play again...

Juju_beans · April 2018

I've play other MMO's where the sub fee only gives you access to the server and nothing more.

ESO+ is pretty good IMO because I get a whole bunch extra since access to the server is free.

The game is 4 years old..still pretty new compared to other MMO's that have been out there.
All these game issues may just be growing pains if the game is attracting more and more new players.

I do recall the early years of WOW when servers would be down for 1-2 days along with hour long login queues just to get on the server. Some nights the login boss won and you never got to play. But all those issues got solved over time.

ihazzit · April 2018

This game is a non-guaranteed, non-investment purchase and those things and many more are allowable under the TOS. When we purchase the game (and sub) we are agreeing that Zenimax can do anything they want under the TOS which includes the issues you described. They gave you what they said they would under the TOS which sometimes unfortunately includes server problems and their exclusive right to what they want when they want with the pricing.

Not only that, "ZeniMax has no obligation to make available any patches, updates or modifications or correct any errors or defects in the Services." And yet for whatever the reasons may be for downtime, lag, crashing, etc., they put in a noticeable amount of corrective work.

So you made a business decision agreeing to all of that and now some things have taken place on their end that you agreed could take place under the TOS that does not violate the TOS on their end and you are personally upset towards ZOS about it. Lamenting business decisions is fine, those things happen every day, but it's not very constructive to create a conflict and attempt to share it with other people that is entirely based upon personal character flaws because that's what happened here and seems to happen quite a bit on these forums.

joneb · April 2018

Gythral wrote: »

Thinks about cancelling sub - then remembers how much junk is in my bank and crafting bag & how many of the alts would have to return to being mules again

They got my sub money until I cant stand trying to play again...

Like the quoter above you said I don't have to sub every month and also I wasn't going to originally but just wanted to fill craft bags but the other benefits though not necessary are only nice to have.

Rickter · April 2018

joneb wrote: »

Its the first MMO I have actually returned to after being away so long.

This is why you should think long and hard before quitting again. ESO is a very special game and there is nothing else like it.

joneb wrote: »

Eventually I may devote myself to a new game.

good luck, there isnt anything in this genre that is comparable.

joneb · April 2018

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

So much salt lately.

They are doing things right. Enticing new players is essential for keeping things healthy.

As a vet early adopter, I don’t feel cheated at all. Morrowind is fun and was enjoyed for a year.

I got it at discount so there is that but haven't had it long either. All ZOS had to do was put in a disclaimer in small writing with the adverts that it may be available as DLC iafter a year.

joneb · April 2018

Juju_beans wrote: »

I've play other MMO's where the sub fee only gives you access to the server and nothing more.

ESO+ is pretty good IMO because I get a whole bunch extra since access to the server is free.

The game is 4 years old..still pretty new compared to other MMO's that have been out there.
All these game issues may just be growing pains if the game is attracting more and more new players.

I do recall the early years of WOW when servers would be down for 1-2 days along with hour long login queues just to get on the server. Some nights the login boss won and you never got to play. But all those issues got solved over time.

A premium only model is very different from a free to play with premium option. The marketplace is much bigger than any one game now.

DaveMoeDee · April 2018

joneb wrote: »

... my free crowns from the ESO Plus ...

The crowns are not free. You pay $15 a month to get them.

Drachenfier · April 2018

30 days of entertainment for the cost of a two hour movie. And people complain about it.

Personally, I wish the free to play model would die a painful death.

Caliope · April 2018

DebianPrime wrote: »

I used to play WOW. I bought into it shortly after Cataclysm. When I purchased it, I got BC and WotLK as part of it for free.

Fast forward a couple yeas, and my Daughter bought in, and started playing, and she got Cataclysm and MoP as part of it when she bought Warlords.

I had to buy those 2 expansions. Was I a bit salty about it, yeah. Do I understand that no one is going to buy into a game where they need to purchase the newest expansion for $40-$60, AND have to pay for multiple previous expansions, yeah, I get that too.

Nature of the game, so to speak.

hm, I started wow in vanilla, bought every expansion. And not once, not a single time I was 'salty' because new players got the old things for free. that was water down the drain anyway.

I was in ESO from tha start. subbed of course because you had to those days. sub now because they have to pay the staff and I want to play the gae. bought the expansion because I want to see it, quite simple.

And this is not really a criticism of what you said (you're one of the mild critics anyway and very understanding) but an extension. I don't really care if anyone doesn't like company policies or rather their marketing strategies. If they're pissed they can chose to live with it or go. [snip]

[Edited for baiting]

joneb · April 2018

ihazzit wrote: »

This game is a non-guaranteed, non-investment purchase and those things and many more are allowable under the TOS. When we purchase the game (and sub) we are agreeing that Zenimax can do anything they want under the TOS which includes the issues you described. They gave you what they said they would under the TOS which sometimes unfortunately includes server problems and their exclusive right to what they want when they want with the pricing.

Not only that, "ZeniMax has no obligation to make available any patches, updates or modifications or correct any errors or defects in the Services." And yet for whatever the reasons may be for downtime, lag, crashing, etc., they put in a noticeable amount of corrective work.

So you made a business decision agreeing to all of that and now some things have taken place on their end that you agreed could take place under the TOS that does not violate the TOS on their end and you are personally upset towards ZOS about it. Lamenting business decisions is fine, those things happen every day, but it's not very constructive to create a conflict and attempt to share it with other people that is entirely based upon personal character flaws because that's what happened here and seems to happen quite a bit on these forums.

In today business climate ToS often include all sorts of exceptions and rules and just like anything else consumer and legal rights take precedent. Saying that this is not of such importance. Due to the nature of the business if you want to play any game you have to agree to terms and the TOS obviously provide Zenimax the right to do do what they want regards making this free but that doesn't make it ethically right just because they can or that I should accept this.

As for me going in to a business decision. There is too much of a persons life like a business now. This is a game I have had fun from and do not mind paying what I have but I do mind paying more and its just annoying to have to leave something I find enjoyable.

mike_skleinub17_ESO · April 2018

I bought morrowind when I came back about a month ago. Then learn that its included with sommerset. Yeah, I was a little upset but I had JUST bought morrowind. I mean, I'm not happy about it, but whatevs. This is my hobby, one I'm picking back up after a long absence.

Now, if whatever comes after sommerset includes morrowind and sommerset...then we may have an issue

Juju_beans · April 2018

mike_skleinub17_ESO wrote: »

I bought morrowind when I came back about a month ago. Then learn that its included with sommerset. Yeah, I was a little upset but I had JUST bought morrowind. I mean, I'm not happy about it, but whatevs. This is my hobby, one I'm picking back up after a long absence.

Now, if whatever comes after sommerset includes morrowind and sommerset...then we may have an issue

The nature of MMO's is to include all previous expansions in the base when the next expansion comes out.
So more then likely sommerset will eventually be rolled into the base when the next new chapter comes out.

Yedax · April 2018

joneb wrote: »

I appreciate the mount. I now find i would have got it free had i waited.

What mount did people get for free?? I just have the standard horse and the horse that came with Morrowind. I really really want a different mount that is not just another recolored horse!

mike_skleinub17_ESO · April 2018

That's why this games needs season passes. Morrowind, Clockwork and sommeset season 1 or whatever. Games are used to season pass nonsense

Grabmoore · April 2018

danno8 wrote: »

Actually most stores have a 30 days price guarantee. If it goes on sale within that time they will refund you the difference. Even online retailers do this now. It's good business practice.

No, it's not. Just because people want everything for free and hate to pay anything (see US citizens refusing to pay for health care), it can not be fair to ask for a discount on every opportunity.

Companies like Amazon created this myth, however the sellers need to endure every stupid customer complaint, no matter whose fault it is. That's organized crime, if you ask me. Do whatever the customer wants now and for free or get excluded from the market. You pay for what you get at the time you order it. This should be enough. My opinion.

ZOS_Mika · April 2018

We have recently removed several off topic, insulting, and unnecessary comments from this thread. While it is fine to disagree, this discussion needs to remain civil and constructive. Thank you for your understanding.

Sting864 · April 2018

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

joneb wrote: »

... my free crowns from the ESO Plus ...

The crowns are not free. You pay $15 a month to get them.

Fifteen bucks is basically what NON-ESO+ members pay for 1500 Crowns too. But that's all they get... I think the crafting bag of holding ALONE is worth the sub-price... In addition, you get 2x bank space, DLC access, exp. and gold bonuses, and reduced research times... What a bargain...

joneb · April 2018

Pangnirtung wrote: »

I subbed for a long time, lost interest, unsubbed and stopped playing for a while.

Then I started playing again and after a few months re-subbed.

You might end up doing the same.

When you do quit, realize that you might feel differently in a few months and save yourself the trouble of having to download the game all over again.

I've already had to do that in the last 6 months because its not been working well and repair didnt work.