Cost of Coldharbour House and the exploiters

MLGProPlayer · April 2018

I don't really care as I'm not interested in this house, but it sucks that some people will have to pay 1 million gold for something that others got for free via an exploit.

ZOS was quick to hand out suspensions when people were leveling in IC sewers during the XP bug, but they're silent on this. Nobody should be suspended for taking advantage of this bug, but in the interests of fairness, ZOS can easily rectify the situation by just refunding the purchases.

DoctorESO · April 2018

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

So i couldnt help but notice the cost is extremely high for a home that zenimax gave away for free to people who could login when a messed up update hit a while back, seems odd to rip off the part of your playerbase who did not exploit this and expect them to pay such a high cost. Can zenimax atleast respond to why some people were allowed to keep it at 0 cost?

I know it might not seem fair, but think of it this way:

They got a lucky break. Let them have it. Your time for getting a lucky break will come soon.

WakeYourGhost · April 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

They probably couldnt take it back from people. Crowns have a RL monetary value and constitute a sale. Once you sell something to somebody you cant take it back just because you charged the wrong price... thats your own fault for not checking the price before you offered it for sale.

You can refund the crown and take the item back since it's digital.

Companies cancel orders due to pricing errors all the time.

Here is an example of Lenovo cancelling orders after a pricing glitch: https://globalnews.ca/news/1355313/lenovo-canada-cancels-customer-orders-after-online-pricing-error/

There is a fairly large difference between Canceling a Digital Order because of a Pricing Mistake and taking back a Paid-for item.
That would be a legal nuisance for them if anyone even bothered to try to sue over it. The court costs and lawyer fees would be more than the current cost of the full-priced item itself. In no measure is it worth it for them to not just eat the cost, even if they would or could win a lawsuit related to this issue.

Ultimately, with the "order" already being "fulfilled" by delivery of Digital Merchandise, it's just easier to let the lucky sods have their practically free stuff..

....Honestly, though - It would drive me utterly crazy to have a crown amount that was "xxxx9". Like, seriously, when are you ever going to find a way to spend 9 crowns? rofl.

VaranisArano · April 2018

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

We agree in the TOS not to exploit glitches.

Under what exact context is this a Glitch and not a Pricing Mistake.
It's not like they added in an update, broke the EXP rate of certain enemies, and people exploited that unintended glitch for their own gain.
This is an issue where they made a massive mistake on their side and released something early with improper pricing information.
Not really intended, but also not exactly an "Exploitable Glitch"

Under what context does a handful of people getting a practically free house harm you, me, or anyone else?

This doesn't effect me, or change the fact that I will (With low Priority compared to my other goals) still grind out the Gold Cost for this non-house just because I can.

The forums honestly sometimes seem like a bucket filled with Crabs. The second someone has a chance to get lucky or get something good, another "Crab" will simply grab them and pull them down. Everyone is too busy trying to screw over their fellow players because of some imagined advantage or benefit instead of just doing their own thing.

How is a pricing mistake not a glitch? Just curious.

Also, why should anyone who took advantage of/exploited/benefited from (whatever you want to call it) this "pricing mistake" get to keep their house gained from the mistake?

Shouldn't an honest player want the mistake corrected and not seek to benefit from an exploit/pricing mistake? Especially one that confers an unfair benefit compared other players?

The crabs trying to escape the bucket didn't grab a house super cheap because of pricing mistake and argue that they should get to keep it because ZOS made a pricing mistake. If someone is honest, they should want the mistake corrected and the unfair benefit removed or earned properly,

MLGProPlayer · April 2018

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

They probably couldnt take it back from people. Crowns have a RL monetary value and constitute a sale. Once you sell something to somebody you cant take it back just because you charged the wrong price... thats your own fault for not checking the price before you offered it for sale.

You can refund the crown and take the item back since it's digital.

Companies cancel orders due to pricing errors all the time.

Here is an example of Lenovo cancelling orders after a pricing glitch: https://globalnews.ca/news/1355313/lenovo-canada-cancels-customer-orders-after-online-pricing-error/

There is a fairly large difference between Canceling a Digital Order because of a Pricing Mistake and taking back a Paid-for item.
That would be a legal nuisance for them if anyone even bothered to try to sue over it. The court costs and lawyer fees would be more than the current cost of the full-priced item itself. In no measure is it worth it for them to not just eat the cost, even if they would or could win a lawsuit related to this issue.

Ultimately, with the "order" already being "fulfilled" by delivery of Digital Merchandise, it's just easier to let the lucky sods have their practically free stuff..

....Honestly, though - It would drive me utterly crazy to have a crown amount that was "xxxx9". Like, seriously, when are you ever going to find a way to spend 9 crowns? rofl.

You don't legally own anything you buy in ESO.

WakeYourGhost · April 2018

DoctorESO wrote: »

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

So i couldnt help but notice the cost is extremely high for a home that zenimax gave away for free to people who could login when a messed up update hit a while back, seems odd to rip off the part of your playerbase who did not exploit this and expect them to pay such a high cost. Can zenimax atleast respond to why some people were allowed to keep it at 0 cost?

I know it might not seem fair, but think of it this way:

They got a lucky break. Let them have it. Your time for getting a lucky break will come soon.

Seriously - That is just the most logical and human thing I've seen said.
It's not like them getting Lucy hurt anyone else.

VaranisArano wrote: »

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

We agree in the TOS not to exploit glitches.

Under what exact context is this a Glitch and not a Pricing Mistake.
It's not like they added in an update, broke the EXP rate of certain enemies, and people exploited that unintended glitch for their own gain.
This is an issue where they made a massive mistake on their side and released something early with improper pricing information.
Not really intended, but also not exactly an "Exploitable Glitch"

Under what context does a handful of people getting a practically free house harm you, me, or anyone else?

This doesn't effect me, or change the fact that I will (With low Priority compared to my other goals) still grind out the Gold Cost for this non-house just because I can.

The forums honestly sometimes seem like a bucket filled with Crabs. The second someone has a chance to get lucky or get something good, another "Crab" will simply grab them and pull them down. Everyone is too busy trying to screw over their fellow players because of some imagined advantage or benefit instead of just doing their own thing.

How is a pricing mistake not a glitch? Just curious.

Also, why should anyone who took advantage of/exploited/benefited from (whatever you want to call it) this "pricing mistake" get to keep their house gained from the mistake?

Shouldn't an honest player want the mistake corrected and not seek to benefit from an exploit/pricing mistake? Especially one that confers an unfair benefit compared other players?

The crabs trying to escape the bucket didn't grab a house super cheap because of pricing mistake and argue that they should get to keep it because ZOS made a pricing mistake. If someone is honest, they should want the mistake corrected and the unfair benefit removed or earned properly,

Hey, you have no Idea what those Crabs do in their spare time. The Crab may have been trying to get back to it's recently bought house that they snatched at a 98.9% discount.

I think the term Glitch just doesn't actually cover this issue, and neither does exploit.
They've done weird things before - And honestly, 1 crown seems just find a price for a non-house.. Rofl.
Either way, it was a pricing error in the favor of those who saw it - And ultimately not one that harms any other player or really damages ZOS' bottom line.

An Honest Player may want to keep the Deal they just found. An Honest Player may feel that this company owes them something from all the recent goofs ZOS has made and the excessive Crown Store Price Inflation.

Either way, the Benefits to the players who got it are minimal, the damage it does to the game is non-existent, and the point of taking away those houses is.. Well, is there one other than some players feeling bitter that others got lucky?
This thread didn't start until someone saw that the house costs more than they felt it should. That's just pettiness.

I'll eventually get the Free Teleport house myself, but I'm not going to waste my time staying up in bed fuming made that other people got lucky and I didn't.

WakeYourGhost · April 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

They probably couldnt take it back from people. Crowns have a RL monetary value and constitute a sale. Once you sell something to somebody you cant take it back just because you charged the wrong price... thats your own fault for not checking the price before you offered it for sale.

You can refund the crown and take the item back since it's digital.

Companies cancel orders due to pricing errors all the time.

Here is an example of Lenovo cancelling orders after a pricing glitch: https://globalnews.ca/news/1355313/lenovo-canada-cancels-customer-orders-after-online-pricing-error/

There is a fairly large difference between Canceling a Digital Order because of a Pricing Mistake and taking back a Paid-for item.
That would be a legal nuisance for them if anyone even bothered to try to sue over it. The court costs and lawyer fees would be more than the current cost of the full-priced item itself. In no measure is it worth it for them to not just eat the cost, even if they would or could win a lawsuit related to this issue.

Ultimately, with the "order" already being "fulfilled" by delivery of Digital Merchandise, it's just easier to let the lucky sods have their practically free stuff..

....Honestly, though - It would drive me utterly crazy to have a crown amount that was "xxxx9". Like, seriously, when are you ever going to find a way to spend 9 crowns? rofl.

You don't legally own anything you buy in ESO.

Yes, Indeed, I agree that the court case would be tossed out fairly quickly (Unless someone argued that any sale was a contract between seller and buyer and that transferring your money to a digital currency still gave that same expressed contract with purchases made with said digital currency), and it wouldn't end up with anyone getting any significant returns from the case...
Yet, we also live in a world where Lawsuits are easy to file, people are childish and petty enough to get enraged over this and feel they need to take it to courts on the "principle of the matter", and even an hour of work from a Legal Team like ZOS has would cost enough that the company would would have actually Saved Money by offering a physical refund of the cost of that single crown to Every single player who felt upset about someone else getting a cheap house.

Of course, on the flip side, someone attempting to for a Lawsuit over the idea that they themselves didn't get a discounted item in a digital market would never even make it to a court.

That's just assuming they aren't letting them keep these houses out of the kindness of their hearts...
Or, worse yet - They didn't take the houses back already, but managed to satisfy every player who got it by offering them something neat (Like how Warframe tends to handle it when they release something early and for practically free sometimes - Legendary Cores are fair exchanges for that unreleased Mod.)

VaranisArano · April 2018

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

So i couldnt help but notice the cost is extremely high for a home that zenimax gave away for free to people who could login when a messed up update hit a while back, seems odd to rip off the part of your playerbase who did not exploit this and expect them to pay such a high cost. Can zenimax atleast respond to why some people were allowed to keep it at 0 cost?

I know it might not seem fair, but think of it this way:

They got a lucky break. Let them have it. Your time for getting a lucky break will come soon.

Seriously - That is just the most logical and human thing I've seen said.
It's not like them getting Lucy hurt anyone else.

VaranisArano wrote: »

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

We agree in the TOS not to exploit glitches.

Under what exact context is this a Glitch and not a Pricing Mistake.
It's not like they added in an update, broke the EXP rate of certain enemies, and people exploited that unintended glitch for their own gain.
This is an issue where they made a massive mistake on their side and released something early with improper pricing information.
Not really intended, but also not exactly an "Exploitable Glitch"

Under what context does a handful of people getting a practically free house harm you, me, or anyone else?

This doesn't effect me, or change the fact that I will (With low Priority compared to my other goals) still grind out the Gold Cost for this non-house just because I can.

The forums honestly sometimes seem like a bucket filled with Crabs. The second someone has a chance to get lucky or get something good, another "Crab" will simply grab them and pull them down. Everyone is too busy trying to screw over their fellow players because of some imagined advantage or benefit instead of just doing their own thing.

How is a pricing mistake not a glitch? Just curious.

Also, why should anyone who took advantage of/exploited/benefited from (whatever you want to call it) this "pricing mistake" get to keep their house gained from the mistake?

Shouldn't an honest player want the mistake corrected and not seek to benefit from an exploit/pricing mistake? Especially one that confers an unfair benefit compared other players?

The crabs trying to escape the bucket didn't grab a house super cheap because of pricing mistake and argue that they should get to keep it because ZOS made a pricing mistake. If someone is honest, they should want the mistake corrected and the unfair benefit removed or earned properly,

Hey, you have no Idea what those Crabs do in their spare time. The Crab may have been trying to get back to it's recently bought house that they snatched at a 98.9% discount.

I think the term Glitch just doesn't actually cover this issue, and neither does exploit.
They've done weird things before - And honestly, 1 crown seems just find a price for a non-house.. Rofl.
Either way, it was a pricing error in the favor of those who saw it - And ultimately not one that harms any other player or really damages ZOS' bottom line.

An Honest Player may want to keep the Deal they just found. An Honest Player may feel that this company owes them something from all the recent goofs ZOS has made and the excessive Crown Store Price Inflation.

Either way, the Benefits to the players who got it are minimal, the damage it does to the game is non-existent, and the point of taking away those houses is.. Well, is there one other than some players feeling bitter that others got lucky?
This thread didn't start until someone saw that the house costs more than they felt it should. That's just pettiness.

I'll eventually get the Free Teleport house myself, but I'm not going to waste my time staying up in bed fuming made that other people got lucky and I didn't.

You and I have very different ideas of what honesty means and the responsibility of players who discover a pricing mistake in their favor, so I think this discussion is done. I believe an honest player, upon discovering a pricing mistake in their favor, seeks to have the pricing mistake corrected and thus not to unfairly benefit from it.

I think that ZOS can decide to let players keep it, though I disagree with that decision. I do not agree that those players are entitled to keep it or in any way able to justify the unfairness of it except for this justification I would accept from a player: "ZOS said I could keep it despite the pricing mistake/glitch. Talk to ZOS about it."

Sheezabeast · April 2018

I'm unclear, did Zos actually make a statement about this, and if said buyers for 1 crown, did they get to keep it?

I bought it with no regrets for 1 mil and I honestly feel proud of buying it. And not using Crowns on it.

If people got it for 1 Crown during a Zos oopsie moment, and they get to keep them, I don't care, because buying it with crowns makes all the furnishings in it bound to you. There are lots of gorgeous rocks and shrooms and stuff in the plot of land that you could make money selling if you wanted to. So if people spent 1 Crown, it doesn't bother me. But do you know who deserves to be annoyed? People who payed full price in crowns for it. People who waited for it to be available, not get in on a steal.

DerNachtfalter · April 2018

wow... I didnt buy the cold harbor estate for 1 crown because I thought that was an error...
Now I am feeling frowned upon by ZOS for not exploiting.

JJBoomer · April 2018

No we are not trudging this crap up AGAIN? Seriously?

Gargath · April 2018

Let them keep this sad open space of Coldharbour. It's only good for duels and nothing else.
I wouldn't need such housing even for free, as I don't duel or lead any guild.

ZOS_MattL · April 2018

Hey there,
We have removed several off topic, baiting, or being otherwise inflammatory. Keep all future posts in line with our Community Rules.
Thanks,
Matt

seaef · April 2018

They paid only 1 gold for it?

It's not even worth 1 gold. The exploiters were ripped off.

monktoasty · April 2018

Seems unfair

Varidian · April 2018

well, in theory if a shop mislabels an item and it is scanned as such price, the store is obliged to sell it at the incorrect price otherwise it is false advertisement - and could be called out as a method of leaching higher prices by trickery...

that said, no I do not agree with the whole bought for one crown scandal... but if any of you had that chance... your telling me you would not have grabbed that place for one crown?

personally I think it is a hideous and boring patch of land so I wont be getting it... 1 crown or 1 million gold.

my point is, why cry over spilled milk.
I think the absurd inflation of items in game is more of a rip off...

would you go to Ikea and pay 6500 for a kitchen table lol

Delphinia · April 2018

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

Varidian · April 2018

Delphinia wrote: »

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

my thoughts exactly

Jayne_Doe · April 2018

Varidian wrote: »

Delphinia wrote: »

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

my thoughts exactly

There is a difference between the exchange of fake gold in a game and real money. Sure, people list stuff for cheaper all the time in guild stores - some don't know what current prices are, or don't care, or just want to make quick sales, or they make a mistake. We don't know, but the pricing of fake items in a game for fake money is not a true comparison to what happened with the CH Estate.

Clearly, the offer of the Estate for 1C was an OBVIOUS mistake. I don't buy it that people actually thought it was some sort of gift from ZOS or that they'd actually sell ANY house for 1C. Consumables cost well more than that. People jumped on it because they knew it was a mistake that would be rectified soon. And let's not bring up the mistake with the Daedric Thrones again, since those are fake items that would have only cost fake money. Plus, IF it were the same, then ZOS would have left the house up at 1C and said - hey, enjoy! But they didn't, because it would have cost them real money. That's the difference as to why ZOS corrected the error rather than offering it as a gift, and why players jumped on it rather than questioning it in guild chat and waiting for some official word from ZOS.

Regardless, if ZOS decided to honor that price for those folks, then that's their decision. Though, if I had bought the estate for 1C and later they told me that it was a mistake and they were refunding me the 1C and taking the house back, I wouldn't have argued or been upset, because I would have already known it was a mistake. But that's just me. If I'm at a restaurant and the waiter forgets to charge me for something, I TELL THEM!. But, I'm sure many here on the forums would just consider it a gift and oh well...it was their mistake. Now, the waiter may decide not to charge me regardless and just eat the cost, but that's their decision - I don't EXPECT it.

In any event, ZOS has made whatever decision they think best for whatever their reasons. I'm guessing there may be some legal reasons involved. It's over and done, and at the end of the day, it is just a digital piece of land, and you can buy it for fake money anyway. Perhaps that's why they decided to let it go, since they weren't expecting huge sales of it because it's not limited time and it is available for gold. I doubt they would have done the same if it were a Crown only house.

ETA: I just had a thought about the argument of it being a sale with real money and thus they could not cancel the sale due to their error. The point of sale in terms of real money is actually when Crowns are purchased, not when the Crowns are exchanged for digital goods in the Crown Store. Now, maybe there are still some laws regarding things like this, but the sale of the Estate for 1C was not a purchase with real money. It was using an in-game currency. Now, the point of having items for large amounts of Crowns is to generate more Crown sales by people buying Crowns to purchase when they don't have enough, or depleting stockpiled Crowns so people will buy more. In this particular case, ZOS still lost out on revenue, because unless a player actually had ZERO Crowns in their account and thus purchased a Crown pack in order to buy the house for 1C, no actual Crowns were purchased and ZOS still lost potential sales. However, players were basically using an in-game currency to purchase something from the Crown Store and no real money transactions actually occurred. ZOS may be within their legal rights to cancel said sales. But, then again, there may still be laws covering such transactions or maybe ZOS decided to let it go as a gesture of goodwill, though admittedly only for the players that bought it for 1C. It's certainly not goodwill to all the players that missed out.

Jaraal · April 2018

xeNNNNN wrote: »

1 million gold isnt exactly much in the grand scheme of things a bit of telvar farming and you can make that easily...

1 million gold isn't much for a nice house, but an empty field?

Delphinia · April 2018

Jayne_Doe wrote: »

Varidian wrote: »

Delphinia wrote: »

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

my thoughts exactly

There is a difference between the exchange of fake gold in a game and real money. Sure, people list stuff for cheaper all the time in guild stores - some don't know what current prices are, or don't care, or just want to make quick sales, or they make a mistake. We don't know, but the pricing of fake items in a game for fake money is not a true comparison to what happened with the CH Estate.

Clearly, the offer of the Estate for 1C was an OBVIOUS mistake. I don't buy it that people actually thought it was some sort of gift from ZOS or that they'd actually sell ANY house for 1C. Consumables cost well more than that. People jumped on it because they knew it was a mistake that would be rectified soon. And let's not bring up the mistake with the Daedric Thrones again, since those are fake items that would have only cost fake money. Plus, IF it were the same, then ZOS would have left the house up at 1C and said - hey, enjoy! But they didn't, because it would have cost them real money. That's the difference as to why ZOS corrected the error rather than offering it as a gift, and why players jumped on it rather than questioning it in guild chat and waiting for some official word from ZOS.

Regardless, if ZOS decided to honor that price for those folks, then that's their decision. Though, if I had bought the estate for 1C and later they told me that it was a mistake and they were refunding me the 1C and taking the house back, I wouldn't have argued or been upset, because I would have already known it was a mistake. But that's just me. If I'm at a restaurant and the waiter forgets to charge me for something, I TELL THEM!. But, I'm sure many here on the forums would just consider it a gift and oh well...it was their mistake. Now, the waiter may decide not to charge me regardless and just eat the cost, but that's their decision - I don't EXPECT it.

In any event, ZOS has made whatever decision they think best for whatever their reasons. I'm guessing there may be some legal reasons involved. It's over and done, and at the end of the day, it is just a digital piece of land, and you can buy it for fake money anyway. Perhaps that's why they decided to let it go, since they weren't expecting huge sales of it because it's not limited time and it is available for gold. I doubt they would have done the same if it were a Crown only house.

ETA: I just had a thought about the argument of it being a sale with real money and thus they could not cancel the sale due to their error. The point of sale in terms of real money is actually when Crowns are purchased, not when the Crowns are exchanged for digital goods in the Crown Store. Now, maybe there are still some laws regarding things like this, but the sale of the Estate for 1C was not a purchase with real money. It was using an in-game currency. Now, the point of having items for large amounts of Crowns is to generate more Crown sales by people buying Crowns to purchase when they don't have enough, or depleting stockpiled Crowns so people will buy more. In this particular case, ZOS still lost out on revenue, because unless a player actually had ZERO Crowns in their account and thus purchased a Crown pack in order to buy the house for 1C, no actual Crowns were purchased and ZOS still lost potential sales. However, players were basically using an in-game currency to purchase something from the Crown Store and no real money transactions actually occurred. ZOS may be within their legal rights to cancel said sales. But, then again, there may still be laws covering such transactions or maybe ZOS decided to let it go as a gesture of goodwill, though admittedly only for the players that bought it for 1C. It's certainly not goodwill to all the players that missed out.

Interesting points. I agree with being honest. I also agree if they had chosen to refund the 1 crown to those who received the land, I would have understood that as well. No, it is definitely not just you.

I too let someone know when I've been under charged. A few years ago, I drove all the way home, looked at my receipt and realized I wasn't charged for one item. I went back up and paid for that item.

I know there are other honest people out there as well, even though it may seem like everyone in the entire world (everyone but yourself) is just looking for "Money for Nothing" just to quote Dire Straits.

I also wouldn't assume to know what everyone is thinking or what their intentions are.

For all we know, some people may have noticed the house was for sale, bought it without even looking at the price.
Some may have looked, but thought it was intentional (I won't bring up the thrones

).
Given the game's history, maybe not the most logical, but still who knows? Only the people who work for ZOS know what they intend. While we can make educated guesses, we still don't know for sure until it is confirmed.

It's possible some people DID report the sale and purchase AFTER it was confirmed by ZOS that it was not intentional.
(Actually, I know someone who did report it after the realization that it was not intended).

Again, I try not to assume ... you know what they say

Anyway, good points. I think ZOS might know a little bit more about what they can and can't should and shouldn't do and it seems they've already made their decision. So, it's probably time to stop beating a dead horse.

Varidian · April 2018

Jayne_Doe wrote: »

Varidian wrote: »

Delphinia wrote: »

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

my thoughts exactly

There is a difference between the exchange of fake gold in a game and real money. Sure, people list stuff for cheaper all the time in guild stores - some don't know what current prices are, or don't care, or just want to make quick sales, or they make a mistake. We don't know, but the pricing of fake items in a game for fake money is not a true comparison to what happened with the CH Estate.

Clearly, the offer of the Estate for 1C was an OBVIOUS mistake. I don't buy it that people actually thought it was some sort of gift from ZOS or that they'd actually sell ANY house for 1C. Consumables cost well more than that. People jumped on it because they knew it was a mistake that would be rectified soon. And let's not bring up the mistake with the Daedric Thrones again, since those are fake items that would have only cost fake money. Plus, IF it were the same, then ZOS would have left the house up at 1C and said - hey, enjoy! But they didn't, because it would have cost them real money. That's the difference as to why ZOS corrected the error rather than offering it as a gift, and why players jumped on it rather than questioning it in guild chat and waiting for some official word from ZOS.

Regardless, if ZOS decided to honor that price for those folks, then that's their decision. Though, if I had bought the estate for 1C and later they told me that it was a mistake and they were refunding me the 1C and taking the house back, I wouldn't have argued or been upset, because I would have already known it was a mistake. But that's just me. If I'm at a restaurant and the waiter forgets to charge me for something, I TELL THEM!. But, I'm sure many here on the forums would just consider it a gift and oh well...it was their mistake. Now, the waiter may decide not to charge me regardless and just eat the cost, but that's their decision - I don't EXPECT it.

Well first of all I do not expect free stuff, on this game or in real life. Everything I own in my house (real life house) I have worked hard and paid for, so lets get that one straight before you take shots at me...harmless or not.

My point is, if you purchase something at a labelled price the seller is obliged to sell it at the agreed price. that's not opinion that's law. something you seemed to have glossed over when you took the time to write this very long reply. Yes I also tell cashiers they missed something because honesty is a moral currency. you reap what you sow

imagine if you were quoted to have a carpet fitted for £100. your happy. that's fine. it gets fitted.

Tell me, when they come knocking at your door five days later telling you "Sorry but It was incorrect. its actually £720... pay me right now or I am coming in there and ripping the whole lot up and leaving with it..."

you would be on the phone to trading standards before he could even crack a smile. my point is nothing to do with being dishonest or malicious in any way. it is simple; Mistake or not Zos have advertised an item for 1 crown. players have taken the initiative and accepted that agreement, as such that agreement can not be reversed. by publishing that item at its displayed price they have signed sealed and delivered it to the crown store for consumer consumption.

it is not a solid matter item you can hold. it is not an asset you can claim ownership of. the player has invested real capital into digital capital, in order to obtain items and intellect that are the copyrighted property of Zos. can they take items away from you? yes. they own that "item" outright and we as players have utterly no control over that. would that encourage players to buy crowns? no...

so will they be refunding players who lost out - no there is no obligation
will they reclaim the houses and refund 1 crown - no that's awful for business.

WaterBearer · April 2018

Jayne_Doe wrote: »

Varidian wrote: »

Delphinia wrote: »

One day I listed an item that was worth quite a bit of gold.

I placed it up on my guild store and it sold very quickly.

When I opened my mail to retrieve my profit, I realized I had missed adding a digit to the selling price.

In this case, sure, I could have asked the buyer to either trade the item back and be reimbursed, or just pay the difference.. but, that's not how I do things. It was my oversight.

That person was under no obligation to ask me prior to buying my item whether that was the correct price, nor was he under any obligation to send it back. It was my listing at the price I listed it at, regardless if my "intentions" were to price it higher.

However, I also felt no obligation to list that same item in the future at that lower price. That player just got a good deal and no exploits were used. 'Twas just good luck.

my thoughts exactly

There is a difference between the exchange of fake gold in a game and real money. Sure, people list stuff for cheaper all the time in guild stores - some don't know what current prices are, or don't care, or just want to make quick sales, or they make a mistake. We don't know, but the pricing of fake items in a game for fake money is not a true comparison to what happened with the CH Estate.

Clearly, the offer of the Estate for 1C was an OBVIOUS mistake. I don't buy it that people actually thought it was some sort of gift from ZOS or that they'd actually sell ANY house for 1C. Consumables cost well more than that. People jumped on it because they knew it was a mistake that would be rectified soon. And let's not bring up the mistake with the Daedric Thrones again, since those are fake items that would have only cost fake money. Plus, IF it were the same, then ZOS would have left the house up at 1C and said - hey, enjoy! But they didn't, because it would have cost them real money. That's the difference as to why ZOS corrected the error rather than offering it as a gift, and why players jumped on it rather than questioning it in guild chat and waiting for some official word from ZOS.

Regardless, if ZOS decided to honor that price for those folks, then that's their decision. Though, if I had bought the estate for 1C and later they told me that it was a mistake and they were refunding me the 1C and taking the house back, I wouldn't have argued or been upset, because I would have already known it was a mistake. But that's just me. If I'm at a restaurant and the waiter forgets to charge me for something, I TELL THEM!. But, I'm sure many here on the forums would just consider it a gift and oh well...it was their mistake. Now, the waiter may decide not to charge me regardless and just eat the cost, but that's their decision - I don't EXPECT it.

In any event, ZOS has made whatever decision they think best for whatever their reasons. I'm guessing there may be some legal reasons involved. It's over and done, and at the end of the day, it is just a digital piece of land, and you can buy it for fake money anyway. Perhaps that's why they decided to let it go, since they weren't expecting huge sales of it because it's not limited time and it is available for gold. I doubt they would have done the same if it were a Crown only house.

ETA: I just had a thought about the argument of it being a sale with real money and thus they could not cancel the sale due to their error. The point of sale in terms of real money is actually when Crowns are purchased, not when the Crowns are exchanged for digital goods in the Crown Store. Now, maybe there are still some laws regarding things like this, but the sale of the Estate for 1C was not a purchase with real money. It was using an in-game currency. Now, the point of having items for large amounts of Crowns is to generate more Crown sales by people buying Crowns to purchase when they don't have enough, or depleting stockpiled Crowns so people will buy more. In this particular case, ZOS still lost out on revenue, because unless a player actually had ZERO Crowns in their account and thus purchased a Crown pack in order to buy the house for 1C, no actual Crowns were purchased and ZOS still lost potential sales. However, players were basically using an in-game currency to purchase something from the Crown Store and no real money transactions actually occurred. ZOS may be within their legal rights to cancel said sales. But, then again, there may still be laws covering such transactions or maybe ZOS decided to let it go as a gesture of goodwill, though admittedly only for the players that bought it for 1C. It's certainly not goodwill to all the players that missed out.

That last point is really good, actually. Theoretically the only purchases one can make with irl money, besides the initial game purchase, is for a form of in-game currency. We could calculate exactly how much each crown is worth irl money, but the fact of the matter is that the only actual transaction that your irl $ is buying is crowns, not crown items themselves. So you're effectively agreeing to the transaction of real $ for in-game currency. You can't then expand that initial crown purchase to include the items that you can then buy once you have that in-game currency. They're separate transactions so crown store items really can't be bought for irl $, they're bought with an in-game currency that you bought for irl $. And while I can see why people would conflate the two (transactions of irl $ for crowns & transactions of crowns for crown store items), they're technically not one in the same. You could argue that the items you buy with crowns are essentially a reflection of actual $ spent and thus they should be subject to the same rules real $ is when concerning pricing mistakes, refunds, and treating a consumer base fairly, but realistically I think that logic wouldn't put things in your favor (at least legally). Regardless of the fact that crown store item transactions aren't actually using real $ there's also the fact that this was an under-sale (for a price that was lower than what was intended by ZOS) and irl when that happens the company is obligated to not contest the sales done when at the mistaken price. Now, if they overcharged people, real $ or not, I think that would be a whole different story.

I'm of course bummed that I wasn't one of the people who got to take advantage of this pricing mistake, but I think that placing a moral reasoning on why people shouldn't be allowed to keep their purchases is a bit silly (because they didn't tell ZOS that they priced something wrong? So it's like a punishment? THAT is what wouldn't be fair.) Like, especially with all the other stuff we grief over when it comes to crowns/crown store pricing in the forums, I'd say it's refreshing that I'm finally able to see someone get a good deal out of it even if it wasn't me. I wouldn't even really call it unfair actually bc the people that were lucky enough to get it for 1 crown had no unfair advantage in order to get it. They just happened to be logged on at the right time, which is no one's fault. It's just unlucky for the rest of us.

Varidian · April 2018

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disintegr8 · April 2018

I resent having to pay 1 million gold for an empty block of land...because of this I now down to my last 10 million in the bank!!!.

Only kidding, I can make a million a week if I wanted and I bought it for the same reason I have bought every other house in the game - because I can. I was not aware of the Crown shop 'exploit' but don't care.

Capt_Morgan · April 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Zypheran wrote: »

They probably couldnt take it back from people. Crowns have a RL monetary value and constitute a sale. Once you sell something to somebody you cant take it back just because you charged the wrong price... thats your own fault for not checking the price before you offered it for sale.

You can refund the crown and take the item back since it's digital.

Companies cancel orders due to pricing errors all the time.

Here is an example of Lenovo cancelling orders after a pricing glitch: https://globalnews.ca/news/1355313/lenovo-canada-cancels-customer-orders-after-online-pricing-error/

Curious though, canceling an "ORDER" which has not been shipped and issuing a refund and forcibly taking back an item already in the customer's possession are two different things entirely. Then again anything purchased in eso is retained on company servers and all that we as customers are doing is "licensing" the use of Zenimax property so Idk if different laws will apply. Definitely see how both sides could argue their point and can see the pros and cons though I do think my first point has better merit. I know I would definitely be looking into getting a lawyer if I bought say a car for 12gs drove it home then the salesman showed up at my house and just hopped in and drove it back to the dealership and told me I'd have to pay 15gs if I wanted it back because it was "mislabeled."

NupidStoob · April 2018

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

So i couldnt help but notice the cost is extremely high for a home that zenimax gave away for free to people who could login when a messed up update hit a while back, seems odd to rip off the part of your playerbase who did not exploit this and expect them to pay such a high cost. Can zenimax atleast respond to why some people were allowed to keep it at 0 cost?

So many issues of what you are saying. You posted no proof (nor did anyone else in this thread) that people actually got to keep their house. Zenimax had no intent to give the house away for free yet your wording implies it. It was simply a mistake on their part which they corrected.

This seems like just another "I want stuff for free thread". Really not sure were that sense of entitlement comes from. In the time you wasted coming to the forums crying you could've already made a huge portion of the money to get the house. Everyone who ever has invested some time into making money in this game says the same: "It's easy".

Mureel · April 2018

Decided I just don't care enough to get involved anymore - *steps out of thread*

Mureel · April 2018

JJBoomer wrote: »

No we are not trudging this crap up AGAIN? Seriously?

Dredging. Trudging is a form of walking.

fastolfv_ESO · April 2018

what proof is necessary at this point that people got to keep the houses? i have people in my guild who decorated them and showed em off b4 this event hit but i do no exactly have a timestamped video to appease anyone who doesnt believe me. Zenimax's silence should be good enough at this point or hell just ask around im sure you will get an answer fairly quickly