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Honestly Zos... rework cloak
GeorgeBlack
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Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
Edited by GeorgeBlack on March 23, 2018 1:44AM Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
7
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VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Because we don't have enough threads weighing in on Nightblades. Clearly, we needed another one just for your thoughts.
Here's a constructive thread with a pre-existing conversation: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/401555/the-nightblade-nerfs-are-coming-better-let-the-good-ones-negotiate-the-changes/p1
Since you want to discuss cloak, try this one that looks like it fits your topic exactly! https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/401966/should-cloak-be-broken-by-dots/p1Edited by VaranisArano on March 23, 2018 1:14AM15 -
Kel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.5 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your biasEdited by GeorgeBlack on March 23, 2018 1:25AM0 -
Jarryzzt✭✭✭✭If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
I just have to say, this is exactly what happens between Polonius and Hamlet in Gertrude's bedroom...
What. "Ain't you got no culture?"(TM)
To be sure, PVP games where damage does not break stealth do exist (World of Tanks), and this can work quite well. But then spotting/counter-spotting is an integral part of that gameplay, which seems hardly the case as far as ESO is concerned.
Also, too, I demand that in future every single individual NB post in any NB-related thread be doubled as a separate thread in and of itself. Let the galaxy burn the forums drown...3 -
Kel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your bias
What bias? Nightblades do extremely well already. Do they need more tools? No. Do other classes need to lose a slot to have a "find the invisible guy" tool? Also no.
Nightblade already work just fine...no matter what you play.Edited by Kel on March 23, 2018 1:36AM3 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your bias
What bias? Nightblades do extremely well already. Do they need more tools? No. Do other classes need to lose a slot to have a "find the invisible guy" tool? Also no.
Nightblade already work just fine...no matter what you play.
My suggestion would effectively remove the critical vigor heals and the critical bleeds.
This is a fix cloak thread. Not a buff NB thread. Definatly not a troll one, but Im not here to argue about me being a troll or not.
I am amazed at how confused you stand, and how quick you are to type.Edited by GeorgeBlack on March 23, 2018 1:44AM0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your bias
What bias? Nightblades do extremely well already. Do they need more tools? No. Do other classes need to lose a slot to have a "find the invisible guy" tool? Also no.
Nightblade already work just fine...no matter what you play.
My suggestion would effectively remove the critical vigor heals and the critical bleeds.
This is a fix cloak thread. Not a buff NB thread. Definatly not a troll one, but Im not here to argue about me being a troll or not.
Honest advice here. If you seriously want to discuss fixing cloak, changing your thread title to something less click-bait and more serious like "Suggestions for fixing Cloak" or "Balance Nightblades AFTER fixing Cloak" would be a more accurate representation of your subject and less likely to come off like a troll.3 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your bias
What bias? Nightblades do extremely well already. Do they need more tools? No. Do other classes need to lose a slot to have a "find the invisible guy" tool? Also no.
Nightblade already work just fine...no matter what you play.
My suggestion would effectively remove the critical vigor heals and the critical bleeds.
This is a fix cloak thread. Not a buff NB thread. Definatly not a troll one, but Im not here to argue about me being a troll or not.
Honest advice here. If you seriously want to discuss fixing cloak, changing your thread title to something less click-bait and more serious like "Suggestions for fixing Cloak" or "Balance Nightblades AFTER fixing Cloak" would be a more accurate representation of your subject and less likely to come off like a troll.
Honestly I dont care for your forum culture. Free speach within the terms of agreement.0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »VaranisArano wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
It doesnt have to make "sense".
It has to work. The game has to work.
I do not play a NB ffs. I am a stamDK. Look past your bias
What bias? Nightblades do extremely well already. Do they need more tools? No. Do other classes need to lose a slot to have a "find the invisible guy" tool? Also no.
Nightblade already work just fine...no matter what you play.
My suggestion would effectively remove the critical vigor heals and the critical bleeds.
This is a fix cloak thread. Not a buff NB thread. Definatly not a troll one, but Im not here to argue about me being a troll or not.
Honest advice here. If you seriously want to discuss fixing cloak, changing your thread title to something less click-bait and more serious like "Suggestions for fixing Cloak" or "Balance Nightblades AFTER fixing Cloak" would be a more accurate representation of your subject and less likely to come off like a troll.
Honestly I dont care for your forum culture. Free speach within the terms of agreement.
You do you. Click-bait titles get click-bait responses. If you're okay with that *shrugs* you do you.5 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.4 -
Tholian1✭✭✭✭✭
✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
All the threads mentioning NB should just be assumed to be a nerf thread and consolidated all into one.PS4 Pro NA1 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
Your class at the moment is overperforming. Cloak is a tool to escape and gang. Not a tool to receive critical ticks on vigor and deal critical dots on the enemy.
You cant have it all.
Zos should focus on the identity of a class, reinforce those aspects (dmg should not break cloak) and remove any OP byproducts.(critical ticks)0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
Stealth and invisibility are not the same thing.
invisibility is a spell. It has no reliance on how sneaky or quiet you are, or if you get poked with something. Invisibility should not be broken by taking damage (though the damage should still be taken). The only thing that should break or remove invisibility are direct counters such as magelight, expert hunter, flare, and detect potions - those counters should be fixed so they work properly against both stealth and invisibility.
There has never been a problem with cloak, only with the counters not working as they shouldPS4 / NA
M'asad - Khajiit Nightblade - Healer
Pakhet - Khajiit Dragonknight - Tank
Raksha - Khajiit Sorcerer - Stamina DPS
Bastet - Khajiit Templar - Healer
Leonin - Khajiit Warden - Tank0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭eh, if you are cloaked, you are invisible, not in another realm, so AoE damage should still hit you. I guess you could argue it wouldn't break cloak, but you could take damage and be invisible, but personally I don't think it's bad the way it works now.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC1 -
geonsocal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭cloak should work like bound armor - where, it's just toggled on and up 100% of the time...
death itself should not break cloak...
you can't see me
PVP Campaigns Section: Playstation NA and EU (Gray Host) - This Must be the Place3 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
Your class at the moment is overperforming. Cloak is a tool to escape and gang. Not a tool to receive critical ticks on vigor and deal critical dots on the enemy.
You cant have it all.
Zos should focus on the identity of a class, reinforce those aspects (dmg should not break cloak) and remove any OP byproducts.(critical ticks)
Several classes are over performing right now especially in the hands of a good player with certain builds.
Don't worry all have something to worry about come the class balance patch.1 -
Kuramas9tails✭✭✭✭✭
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The identity of the Nightblade IS Critical hits....................GeorgeBlack wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
Your class at the moment is overperforming. Cloak is a tool to escape and gang. Not a tool to receive critical ticks on vigor and deal critical dots on the enemy.
You cant have it all.
Zos should focus on the identity of a class, reinforce those aspects (dmg should not break cloak) and remove any OP byproducts.(critical ticks)
Your friendly neighborhood crazy cat lady of ESO
New PSN name: SundariTheLast. Proud seller in RedEye Empire, PURPLE GANG and Backalley Trading.
AD High Elf Mageblade DPS (General)(Former Empress) -- Stormproof/VMOL, VHOF, VDSA completion
AD Khajiit Mageblade DPS -- Flawless Conquerer
FOR THE QUEEN!
PS4/NA1 -
IV_Deity✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
Then you force people to use pots or slot a certain skill just to find you. It would definitely become the "oh ***, I'm safe now" button. As for empowering, no thanks...there's ambush for that, well, last time I played nightblade at least.DeityTheNoble1 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Do cloak needs rework? Nope. Just some tweaks. Single target abities and dots should never break the cloak. AoE should still be a counter. This would be a major fix for breaking cloak. Then we can talk about balancing it. Maybe make it longer and give it major expedition and root removal but add increasing cost with each cast (simmilar to bolt escape) or lower the cost by a lot but remove all secondary effects (like dot damage suppresion, crits etc.) or do both of this allowing to choose one of the morphs.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.0 -
Azurya✭✭✭✭✭
✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
If you are hiding, and I stab you with my sword, even by accident, 99% of the time you won't be hidden anymore.
What do you mean damage shouldn't break stealth? Even as a game play mechanic, that makes zero sense, as every other class would have to lose a slot just to find one particular class.
Nightblades are already annoying enough as is, no need to give them unbreakable stealth. You already got half the cake...don't be greedy by demanding the entire thing.
he did not say "damage shouldn´t break stealth" he said dmg shouldn´t break cloak!
that is huge difference.
cloak lasts 3 seconds, so what, stealth is more annoying, everyone can do that, and yes it is broken by damage, but cloak... well I can live with it the way it is.2 -
Izaki✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
I think that Cloak is fine the way it is working now with the exception of the DoT suppression. If DoTs are still allowed to tick without breaking cloak, then I'd say Cloak would be pretty balanced.
And frankly, NBs are the only class that is properly built and balanced at the moment, both in PvP and in PvE. So although it demands much more work and thought, it would be a much smarter and healthier thing for the game to just take example from NBs and built up the other classes in a similar fashion.
NBs are always going to be annoying in PvP since they have Cloak and Shadow Image and pretty huge burst. Its just that right now, they are not only annoying but also the most powerful class by far in Cyrodiil.@ Izaki #PCEU
#FrenchKiss #GoneFor2YearsAndMyGuildDoesn'tRaidAnymore
#MoreDPSthanYou
#Stamblade0 -
GeorgeBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »Damage should no break cloak. No matter what type
Cloak should not supress DoT, AoE, anyDMG.
Cloak should EMPOWER the next attack. Not provide bugged crit bonus.
Rework cloak. Then look to balance NB.
PS the only way to break cloak should be anti invisibility tools.
Then you force people to use pots or slot a certain skill just to find you. It would definitely become the "oh ***, I'm safe now" button. As for empowering, no thanks...there's ambush for that, well, last time I played nightblade at least.
Someone wants to get critical heals while cloaked.
Admit it0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
Your class at the moment is overperforming. Cloak is a tool to escape and gang. Not a tool to receive critical ticks on vigor and deal critical dots on the enemy.
You cant have it all.
Zos should focus on the identity of a class, reinforce those aspects (dmg should not break cloak) and remove any OP byproducts.(critical ticks)
Several classes are over performing right now especially in the hands of a good player with certain builds.
Don't worry all have something to worry about come the class balance patch.
Any class is going to overperform in the hands of a good player with a certain build.
Because its not the class. Its the player.
Nerf the class, the player remains. And thus people will always complain about certain classes overperforming in the hands of good players with certain builds, rinse repeat, ad nauseum.2 -
Maryal✭✭✭✭✭
✭You should have been in Cyrodiil before IC came out. You don't know what real OP is .. if you did, you would realize that NBs are not OP. Annoying? Yes. Challenging? Yes. Require you to be alert and on guard? Yes. Smash you like a bug if you become lax, inattentive, or over-confident? Probably.
The game provides little content that helps prepare players to face real challenges. Many of the changes in the game from One Tamriel forward dummied down what little challenging pve content there was .. Craiglorn was dummied down, Dungeons were dummied down, etc. (I'm not talking about vet hard-mode content). Then there was the whole proc set explosion ... all you had to do was wear it, it didn't require you to 'think.' Then there was the explosion of zergs in pvp ... something that resulted in a more 'mechanical' way of approaching pvp.
So now we have a large part of our pvp player base unprepared for meaningful pvp. They don't want to invest the energy or the time it takes to figure out how they (as individuals) can overcome whatever challenge is before them (which includes much trial and error), nor do they wish to invest the time it takes to hone their own skills, reaction time, etc. They want someone else to provide a simple one-size-fits-all answer, and if that doesn't work right away they opt for an even simpler solution: cry 'OP' and 'nerf' ad nauseam.
Edited by Maryal on March 23, 2018 3:28PM4 -
Baconlad✭✭✭✭✭
✭Leave cloak alone. I'd rather have the players playing the game than ragequitting because they have to actually try to defend on their toons0 -
magictucktuck✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »again guys, this is a nerf nightblade thread by people who hate nightblades.
please stop making these threads.
Your class at the moment is overperforming. Cloak is a tool to escape and gang. Not a tool to receive critical ticks on vigor and deal critical dots on the enemy.
You cant have it all.
Zos should focus on the identity of a class, reinforce those aspects (dmg should not break cloak) and remove any OP byproducts.(critical ticks)
We dont, if you have 1 dot going when you go in cloak it ends on its first tick so no heal crits no damage crit on your next attack. the only thing its good at is if you have not engaged in combat yet and someone tried to gank you and you go invis and then your heal tics crit.
so if anything non NBs should be asking for cloak to stay the same. if you fix it my incap from stealth mid combat will crit every time, ill only lose my healing when i dont even need it lolEdited by magictucktuck on March 23, 2018 9:31PM0 -
ofSunhold✭✭✭✭✭Every time they've touched cloak - every time - it's been broken for at least three months.
It's fine. Leave it.Classes that don't need any class ability nerfs: Nightblades, Dragonknights, Sorcs, Templars, Wardens.1 -
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