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The Nightblade Nerfs are coming, better let the good ones negotiate the changes
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Fang_of_Lorkhaj✭✭✭✭Wait could this mean.... No... PVE will have to pay for PvP again. *insert dramatic twist noise*
This game will never be balanced until PVE and PvP are 2 separate entities2 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Fang_of_Lorkhaj wrote: »Wait could this mean.... No... PVE will have to pay for PvP again. *insert dramatic twist noise*
This game will never be balanced until PVE and PvP are 2 separate entities
Nightblades are overtuned in PvE as well (both stamina and magicka) so this isn't a PvP vs PvE issue.
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Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Fang_of_Lorkhaj wrote: »Wait could this mean.... No... PVE will have to pay for PvP again. *insert dramatic twist noise*
This game will never be balanced until PVE and PvP are 2 separate entities
One could argue if the high major slayer uptime the cheap NB ultimates allow with sets like Master Architect and War Machine is really intended...Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
DuckNoodles✭✭✭Lol! Nbs are way to easy to kill!
But with all seriousness, Nbs are very easy to fight, aslong as u survive there first initial burst.. you can kill them easy.
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Araxyte✭✭✭✭I don't mind fighting nightblades, but the one thing that gets on my nerves is their ability to decide if and when they want to just drop out of a fight and walk away... Too many times I have almost won a fair fight , only for them to just cower into stealth and leave.| All classes | PC EU |1 -
cazlonb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Seraphayel wrote: »Nightblades were very, very unpopular (or better: underperforming) during ESOs first years.
No, the class was not underperforming. Stamina builds were and people somehow conflated a generic dual wield+bow stamina build with the Nightblade class.Seraphayel wrote: »Instead of nerfing NB I would prefer buffing the other classes.
Because more power creep is exactly what the game needs, right ? I'd rather see builds with identifiable strengths and weaknesses.0 -
Discord_Days✭✭✭I was just complaining about how extremely powerful nightblades are in PvP and how much utility they have - and then I find this thread! Glad I'm far from the only one who sees this problem
Edited by Discord_Days on March 21, 2018 9:54AM1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Negotiate?
This is ZOS, they dont want your feedback and they certainly have no interest in *negotiation*.
You'll take what's on offer or you pack your bags.
I'd like to be proven wrong but as we pull closer to the next round of PTS testing, I predict the same old song and dance. Ballance changes at least some people disagree with, they argue their case passionately with good points, and either get no response, a response being told to shut up or the thread's geting locked, or minor edits, and then it ships to live.
Possibly even further nerfs without PTS warning in the patch notes.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on March 21, 2018 10:09AM1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Negotiate?
This is ZOS, they dont want your feedback and they certainly have no interest in *negotiation*.
You'll take what's on offer or you pack your bags.
Zos listens to Feedback, they surely don't bring anything to the game that people demand on the forums but if they get good Feedback they actually listen to it.
When people are just talking crap all day or make ridiculous proposals nothing changes or worse they think of something on their ownEdited by BohnT on March 21, 2018 10:14AM0 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ParaNostram wrote: »Nightblades are honestly mostly fine, they could use a small nerf maybe but for the most part they're fine.
It's the freakin' stamina wardens that need put in check.
NBs are easily matched to wardens when it comes to variety of class skills and utility and damage skills. In fact they’re far above wardens when it comes to class damage skills and NBs have far better evasion while wardens have better tanking skills. I’ve played both in stamina as well as a mag NB. Warden damage and burst combo is sluggish compared to stamblade and to get major defile you need to run SB and then you sacrifice a lot of burst. And if you run 2H you have to rely on dizzy swing which sucks agaisnt better players. Stamina wardens are also easily matched by Mag DKs 1v1 especially considering the power of healing ward and the resto ult and their ability to permablock making it hard to cc and burst them down. So stamina wardens aren’t really that OP.0 -
Getern✭✭✭I want u to post a video how u are winning fight in "medium armor" stamina NB against "decent" magica DK. Then u can start calling for nerfs.4 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ParaNostram wrote: »Nightblades are honestly mostly fine, they could use a small nerf maybe but for the most part they're fine.
It's the freakin' stamina wardens that need put in check.
NBs are easily matched to wardens when it comes to variety of class skills and utility and damage skills. In fact they’re far above wardens when it comes to class damage skills and NBs have far better evasion while wardens have better tanking skills. I’ve played both in stamina as well as a mag NB. Warden damage and burst combo is sluggish compared to stamblade and to get major defile you need to run SB and then you sacrifice a lot of burst. And if you run 2H you have to rely on dizzy swing which sucks agaisnt better players. Stamina wardens are also easily matched by Mag DKs 1v1 especially considering the power of healing ward and the resto ult and their ability to permablock making it hard to cc and burst them down. So stamina wardens aren’t really that OP.
Stamina warden is op.
Shimmering makes them invulnerable for ranged builds and gives them one of the strongest buffs in the game.
They have almost any buff in the game and have a rather easy to land burst rota that can be used very often due to the high ultigen. They have godlike sustain even with 0 regen my stamwarden can fight longer than my other classes can and if they want they can become immortal in 1v1 with trees and healing.
They are just like nbs, completely packed with strong buffs, easy burst and lots of survivability0 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I want u to post a video how u are winning fight in "medium armor" stamina NB against "decent" magica DK. Then u can start calling for nerfs.
So you want a non duel spec vs a duel spec? But i guess @Subversus can surely link some clips where he reks magdks1 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Negotiate?
This is ZOS, they dont want your feedback and they certainly have no interest in *negotiation*.
You'll take what's on offer or you pack your bags.
Zos listens to Feedback, they surely don't bring anything to the game that people demand on the forums but if they get good Feedback they actually listen to it.
When people are just talking crap all day or make ridiculous proposals nothing changes or worse they think of something on their own
Nah.
Sustain changes. All I have to say. People went into hour long, polite video's of why they thought it'd be bad for the game (Everything they predicted came to pass) and were ignored. Bracing changes, wrath changes.
The cycle never ends. Your deluding yourself if you think you will be different. And even more if you think that somehow you are more qualified to negotiate changes than anyone else. You'll get changes you disagree with, when you voice that, you'll be told the same thing we got told: "Git gud or leave."
The cycle never ends. The wheel remains unbroken. Even now, the first act begins to form, optimism leading up to the inevitable crushing of hope. If ZOS wants something, ZOS will make it happen. Your feedback is a polite afterthought. Get used to that.Edited by Doctordarkspawn on March 21, 2018 10:30AM1 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Nightblades I don’t see as hardcore OP. Honestly they just need a few small tweaks.
Cloak itself isn’t OP it’s just it’s counters suck royally. Radiant Light, Expert Hunter, and Flare are useless. You would have extend the detect radius on mage light and expert hunter as well as adding 2 more seconds to the invisibility and stealth suppression for them to actually be a viable counter.
Right now Cloak only has two counters. Detect Pots and Piercing Mark. Mark is the best Cloak counter in the game...too bad it’s exclusive to nightblades
Just move Piercing Mark to the Alliance War skill line and give Nightblades a standard heal in that line so they are not forced to run two handed if they play Stam and leave everything else about nightblades alone
Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
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Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak2 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Nightblades I don’t see as hardcore OP. Honestly they just need a few small tweaks.
Cloak itself isn’t OP it’s just it’s counters suck royally. Radiant Light, Expert Hunter, and Flare are useless. You would have extend the detect radius on mage light and expert hunter as well as adding 2 more seconds to the invisibility and stealth suppression for them to actually be a viable counter.
Right now Cloak only has two counters. Detect Pots and Piercing Mark. Mark is the best Cloak counter in the game...too bad it’s exclusive to nightblades
Just move Piercing Mark to the Alliance War skill line and give Nightblades a standard heal in that line so they are not forced to run two handed if they play Stam and leave everything else about nightblades alone
Giving mark to everyone is too much imo. When playing as a nb (mag or stam regardless) you immediately feel the extra pressure from everyone once you're marked.
The duration is just too long and it just completely removes cloak from the game.
It would be like giving everyone a skill that works like shieldbreaker. Magsorcs would go extinct in 2 days.
I'd like to see either some mobility hinderance while you are in cloak (you move at normal sneak speed and vamp doesn't make that faster but snares don't affect you while cloaked) so AoEs are a better counter or increase the range of mage light but reduce the time it stops nbs from cloaking again to 2 seconds.1 -
Ectheliontnacil✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Cloak should stop the rolldodge cooldown timer. So unless a stamblade can perma cloak, it will have to take a couple hits eventually.2 -
Hand_Bacon✭✭✭✭✭About 30% of all nightblade threads constitute 40% of all nerf threads.
Exactly 100% of them have unverifiable statistics somewhere to support their position.
#AlmostGood@ESO7 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Hand_Bacon wrote: »About 30% of all nightblade threads constitute 40% of all nerf threads.
Exactly 100% of them have unverifiable statistics somewhere to support their position.
I already mentioned how i got to these numbers.
Kill Counter stats
Death Recaps
Daily observation of primetime pvp varying from Solo to smallscale and leeching at keep fights.
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thedude33✭✭✭✭✭Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »NBs are Rogues. Rogues are always popular in every MMO. Theyre High DPS with quick TTK. The playstyle itself is very popular and should never be the basis for nerfs or ideas of nerfs.
The OP was talking about something completely different. He was talking about rouges and shades and stuff.0 -
Hortator Indoril Nerevar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yea I am not reading this but as a pve only nightblade who is not interested in pvp at all can we please stop ruining pve balance for *** pvp...5 -
Hand_Bacon✭✭✭✭✭
I already mentioned how i got to these numbers.
Kill Counter stats
Death Recaps
Daily observation of primetime pvp varying from Solo to smallscale and leeching at keep fights.
Small sample and like I said, there is no way for us to verify that other than take your word which again, are based on just your experience.Edited by Hand_Bacon on March 21, 2018 1:52PM#AlmostGood@ESO2 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »Yea I am not reading this but as a pve only nightblade who is not interested in pvp at all can we please stop ruining pve balance for *** pvp...
None of the changes in this post would kill nightblades in pve1 -
Hortator Indoril Nerevar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Copy paste a server for just pvp... stop messing around with pvp in turn hitting pve.1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »this against a class that was in a ***-poor place from launch until Morrowind.
Magblade was arguably the strongest 1v1 spec in 1.5
Stamblade was one of the strongest specs in 1.6 and 1.7
2.2 and 2.3 were not as kind to NBs - then they got 2.4 with viper velidreth eternal hunt becoming a thing. NB was good again.
Then we had the proccalypse of one tamriel - anyone arguing that nb wasn´t good there?
Homestead wasn´t as nice for NBs - but then we had morrowind and ever since the class hasn´t been terrible.
It´s true NB wasn´t good at release. But the time they were bad in pvp are by now far outweighted by the time they were in a good spot.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 503 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thunderknuckles wrote: ».....To round up the package nightblades have access to some of the greatest passives in the game along with other strong utility skills and due to their defence being able to completely negate any incoming damage they are able to run high damage builds with bad in-fight survivability because they don't have to be in a fight they don't want to be in....
That's simply patently wrong and sounds precisely like you've never, even once, played a night blade....This results in a class that can kill most players in few seconds, while being able to escape reliably when they fail to be successful. Mixed with the low cost of incap and the overall effectiveness of the nightblades toolkit they can continue to engage and disengage at will until they are successful or mess up. With increasing skill level the numbers of times you die because you messed up goes to zero.
More pure rubbish....So we have nightblades, a class that can hunt everyone but doesn't have to fear the other classes. The only natural predator a nightblade has today is ,outside of its own lack of skill, other nightblades.
All this will result in changes to the nightblade class or to say the bad words: Nightblades will be nerfed!
.....
Good grief man, this massive rant of yours is nothing but butthurt misinformation. "But doesn't have to fear the other classes". LOL Yeah, you have never, not ever, played a night blade. You were ganked by one, maybe more, and now you're here making wild and utterly inaccurate claims.
The fun thing is always watching a bad nightblade argue with a good one. I love topics like these.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
ccfeeling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Hortator Indoril Nerevar wrote: »Yea I am not reading this but as a pve only nightblade who is not interested in pvp at all can we please stop ruining pve balance for *** pvp...
None of the changes in this post would kill nightblades in pve
Cloak cannot recast
Ultimate cost increase
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Kikke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is soooo dumb xD The same people that constantly made new posts on "nerf sorc" are now jumping in too whine about "nerf NB" threads? I think we finaly found out who it was that complained soo much on sorcs, eh? xPCleared Trials:
- vAA HM - vHRC HM - vSO HM - vMoL HM - vHoF HM - vAS HM - vCR HM -
"The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step, and a lot of bitching."
-Someone said it, I guess.0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Hand_Bacon wrote: »
I already mentioned how i got to these numbers.
Kill Counter stats
Death Recaps
Daily observation of primetime pvp varying from Solo to smallscale and leeching at keep fights.
Small sample and like I said, there is no way for us to verify that other than take your word which again, are based on just your experience.
Just from killcounter stats i get ~35% NB aswell this patch playing on EP and DC VIVEC EU. EP daytime DC evening/primetime.
NB is the only class that can escape me reliably so numbers might even be a little too low.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500